Registry #1 1991 Topps Desert Shield being sold
Dialj
Posts: 1,636 ✭✭
WOW, I cannot believe this set is up for sell. This has to be one of the hardest modern sets to complete in this grade or any high grade for that matter. I can only wish that my set could ever come close to being compared to this one. I wonder what the final sell price will be? I was there back in 1991, when the cards were being ripped up and thrown in burn barrells. Here is Mile High link.
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"A full mind is an empty bat." Ty Cobb
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
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"Live everyday, don't throw it away"
$50k is a good estimate. I love this set.
Ebay Store:
Probstein123
phone: 973 747 6304
email: rickprobstein1@gmail.com
Probstein123 is actively accepting CONSIGNMENTS !!
Justin
Retired - Eddie Mathews Master Registry Set (96.36%) Rank 1
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
<< <i>I'm gonna try and win !! >>
How high are you bidding?
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I'm gonna try and win !! >>
How high are you bidding? >>
My guess is $75,000.
I checked out VCP and checked out the average prices for all 1991 Topps Desert Shield PSA 10s ever sold. VCP has data for 372 of them, and by my math it comes out to $33900 for the 372 10s. This averages to $91.13 per card. If this happens to be anywhere consistent for the entire set (realizing that 4SCs is currently asking $6k for the 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD #333 CHIPPER JONES RC PSA 10 B1086317) then you'd be talking about $72174 for an entire PSA 10 set. This set is about 100 cards short of that kind of perfection (as it has about 100 9s) but it also has about 46 1 of 1s and 80 pop 2 10s.
It looks like a great opportunity for someone to break up and resell (Probstein I'm looking at you) if they can win it for $50k. I'd guess that if they wanted to win it to keep it someone would have to bid $100k. So based on all this guess work with relatively little research I'll predict a sale price of $75k. >>
I agree. There is a lot of interest in completing this set. If Rick or someone else could get this and break it up, there is money to be had. That's assuming current prices hold up. Also, many of the top players in this set are actually veterans who brought home stashes of cards with them and thus had a great start to the set before having to shell out $. James would know better than I, but it seems that many of the top 5/10 sets are Vets. It seems to me that interest in this set is still broadening and many of the new buyers that have entered the market in the past 5 yrs (myself included) are still far from completion. Another audience for this set is team set collectors. Many teams already have active team set DS registries that have pushed prices from some teams much higher than others.
Always buying Bobby Cox inserts. PM me.
He said many of the guys had no interest what so ever in the cards and threw them out overseas. He said he remembers sending them home to his folks. He plans to check and see if they still have them.
I explained to him that these cards are quite valuable and he was very interested to see if he does indeed have them.
After this conversation I am convinced these are more rare then people think.
These are a home run long term because these are much more scare then people realize and there are a ton of stars in the set.
I'm not saying they aren't scarce, but they also aren't impossible to find. There are still some boxes and packs out there in nearly untouched condition, as well as complete sets from people who built them in the early 90s.
Lee
Always buying Bobby Cox inserts. PM me.
<< <i>A good deal of them were intercepted before they ever made it overseas. Upon news of their release everybody in the hobby knew they'd be valuable, including some Topps employees who made sure to pad their wallets. I remember seeing a lot of these at card shows within a week of them supposedly being sent overseas. Then within a few months the counterfeits started hitting the market.
Lee >>
Agreed. However, I haven't seen a counterfeit in a PSA case......yet.
Always buying Bobby Cox inserts. PM me.
Oops, I meant $125.00. Will that hold?
The potential for $ to made on breaking up the set is probably huge; especially on the low pop. Currently there are quiet a few PSA 10s on ebay right now, but most are high pops. As a vet, of course I would rather see the set kept together.
Mike, you bring up a good point about not seeing counterfeits in cases. The fakes ones are really easy to see. The bottom of the shield are a dead give away.
I am excited to see new interest in this set and can't wait to see the final bid.
James
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
<< <i>I'll go $150,000 and have Probstein sell it for me >>
remember .30 X 792
sorry too soon?
Agreed, a full set is very cool. There was a resurgence in this set a few years ago and the registry buyers started to go wild.
The real question in terms of value is how much was the #1 set holder contributing to the hammer prices. For example, if say a Tony Gwynn PSA 10 sells for $250 with this guy winning it, and the 2nd or 3rd bids are $245 and $150, it's only going to sell for $155 next time unless there are new bidders in the fold. Not to say this will happen every time, but usually when the biggest gun bows out of the registry race then low pop values tend to plummet. There was a time when pop 1 Nolan Ryan's from the 1990s sold for $300+ regardless of what set they were from, but now that the top guys have stopped buying you'd be lucky to get $100. I'm not saying there's no way you would squeeze $70k out of the set, but when you eliminate the strongest buyer across the board then you can't really use VCP as a gauge of what the cards will bring.
Lee
<< <i>As a vet, of course I would rather see the set kept together.
Agreed, a full set is very cool. There was a resurgence in this set a few years ago and the registry buyers started to go wild.
The real question in terms of value is how much was the #1 set holder contributing to the hammer prices. For example, if say a Tony Gwynn PSA 10 sells for $250 with this guy winning it, and the 2nd or 3rd bids are $245 and $150, it's only going to sell for $155 next time unless there are new bidders in the fold. Not to say this will happen every time, but usually when the biggest gun bows out of the registry race then low pop values tend to plummet. There was a time when pop 1 Nolan Ryan's from the 1990s sold for $300+ regardless of what set they were from, but now that the top guys have stopped buying you'd be lucky to get $100. I'm not saying there's no way you would squeeze $70k out of the set, but when you eliminate the strongest buyer across the board then you can't really use VCP as a gauge of what the cards will bring.
Lee >>
Very good point Lee. I was thinking the same thing. That being said, I'm a buyer at $37,500
I completely agree with your thoughts. I only mention the potential based on the number of 10s in the set that are 1/1 and other low pops. Some of the cards in the set do not have PSA 10 and the possibility of them showing would be low. I would also mention as an example, that unlike the other 1990's Nolan Ryans in PSA 10 selling for more money then than now; the ratio of possibilities of a DS Ryans to other cards in the 1990s would really be hard to compare because of the limited amount of total DS Ryans that could be submitted.
James
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
<< <i>As a vet, of course I would rather see the set kept together.
Agreed, a full set is very cool. There was a resurgence in this set a few years ago and the registry buyers started to go wild.
The real question in terms of value is how much was the #1 set holder contributing to the hammer prices. For example, if say a Tony Gwynn PSA 10 sells for $250 with this guy winning it, and the 2nd or 3rd bids are $245 and $150, it's only going to sell for $155 next time unless there are new bidders in the fold. Not to say this will happen every time, but usually when the biggest gun bows out of the registry race then low pop values tend to plummet. There was a time when pop 1 Nolan Ryan's from the 1990s sold for $300+ regardless of what set they were from, but now that the top guys have stopped buying you'd be lucky to get $100. I'm not saying there's no way you would squeeze $70k out of the set, but when you eliminate the strongest buyer across the board then you can't really use VCP as a gauge of what the cards will bring.
Lee >>
It's at $27K right now, which is just about the point at which I think most dealers would bow out. People who follow this set know that Mark WAS the market for the low pops; nobody else paid a fraction of what he was willing to pay. If I was going to put together a bid for this set I'd figure out the market price for the stars, call it $30 a piece for the PSA 10 commons, and that would be my ceiling.
In fact, it could be quite the opposite. Look at the sets on the registry right now. If I'm the #2 collector over the last few years, there is no way I'm paying up for low pop 10's because the #1 set is practically uncatchable. However, if the #1 set is removed, then look whats left. I'd argue that sets #2 through #6 all instantly become contendors for having the best set. Now when low pop 10's come to market, you have 5 buyers all within spitting distance of "best set" who are willing to bid the items up. Getting to #1 is now a reality for a very broad group of contendors (Carolina Collection through For My Son Gehrig). What these 5 would pay is the question you should try to answer before bidding on the set for sale now.
Also, whether it is evident on the registry or not, don't underestimate the # of people who are trying to put this set together, but have just started in the last few years. There will be a steady stream of buyers for 9s, and 10s over the next 5 years, just based on who's already started. This newer, broader group, like me, doesn't intend on building the "best" set, but just wants to complete A set, which should support prices on 9s.
Always buying Bobby Cox inserts. PM me.
<< <i>As a vet, of course I would rather see the set kept together.
Agreed, a full set is very cool. There was a resurgence in this set a few years ago and the registry buyers started to go wild.
The real question in terms of value is how much was the #1 set holder contributing to the hammer prices. For example, if say a Tony Gwynn PSA 10 sells for $250 with this guy winning it, and the 2nd or 3rd bids are $245 and $150, it's only going to sell for $155 next time unless there are new bidders in the fold. Not to say this will happen every time, but usually when the biggest gun bows out of the registry race then low pop values tend to plummet. There was a time when pop 1 Nolan Ryan's from the 1990s sold for $300+ regardless of what set they were from, but now that the top guys have stopped buying you'd be lucky to get $100. I'm not saying there's no way you would squeeze $70k out of the set, but when you eliminate the strongest buyer across the board then you can't really use VCP as a gauge of what the cards will bring.
Lee >>
Lee - you are wrong. Just because a Tony Gwynn PSA 10 sold for $250 doesnt mean its only going to sell for $155 next time unless there are new bidders next time. When it sold for $250 the first time, who sold it? If it wasnt Probstein then the price isnt what it should have been. When I buy this set and get Probstein to sell it for me, that Gwynn that sold for $250 will now sell for more than double that.
Dodgers collection scans | Brett Butler registry | 1978 Dodgers - straight 9s, homie
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
Over the last few years, I think it's possible that many of the best raw Desert Shield cards have been graded. There are more I'm sure, but the supply is certainly limited. For a set that only started out with around 6,000 - 6,500 cards of each player, and many thousands known to have been destroyed, how much great stuff can be left? Even of what is left, much of it isn't gradeable, and most certainly would not achieve PSA 10 status. There is no doubt in my mind this set is way undervalued. Those I know who have unopened boxes, none seem to have no desire to open any of it up.
The other unique thing about this set is that it is known by a lot of collectors, and admired by both veterans and collectors. Myself and other veterans I know have a real emotional attachment to the cards, which few sets ever produced really have. The funny thing is the Vets don't have the same love the for the actual "War" cards that were produced by Topps and Pacific. I did put a set of both together just because it recognized the war. I understand the difference in the amout of product produced, but still they don't seem to be as collected.
I wonder what the possibility of someone buying the set and keeping it in tact are. I know the break down and resell of the set is probably the smarter thing to do. Plus it would more than likely take a while to recoup the initial cost, but I it seems a guarantee that there is profit to be made. It has be possibility of even being the #1 set of each of the team sets. I keep seeing them being added to the registry by PSA. I am not sure if all the teams have been added yet, but it has to be close.
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
I know I want a Saberhagen PSA 10, but won't go over $75, as 9's are hard to sell around $7, and there are enough 10's for the nicer DS sets to have one, plus me and the other Saberhagen collector. Yet I have tried several times unsuccessfully to get one in that price range. I have the 1991 Topps regular, mini and OPC in PSA 10, so it would be really nice to upgrade my DS 9, however $100+ seems a little high. At that price I should buy 10 9's and resubmit them (?).
Seems like the low pops and 30-40 other cards in the set should go for a lot more then Saberhagen.
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
<< <i>I know I want a Saberhagen PSA 10, but won't go over $75, as 9's are hard to sell around $7, and there are enough 10's for the nicer DS sets to have one, plus me and the other Saberhagen collector. Yet I have tried several times unsuccessfully to get one in that price range. I have the 1991 Topps regular, mini and OPC in PSA 10, so it would be really nice to upgrade my DS 9, however $100+ seems a little high. At that price I should buy 10 9's and resubmit them (?).
Seems like the low pops and 30-40 other cards in the set should go for a lot more then Saberhagen. >>
Speaking of Saberhagen, that's the only PSA 10 I've ever popped in 1991 Topps Desert Shield. I think it sold for about $50. I had cracked two packs (from ebay) and these were the best of's. This was from one of my poppages back in 2005:
1 31106801 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 3 CARLTON FISK Card
1 31106802 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 6 NOLAN RYAN Card
1 31106803 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 35 GREG MADDUX Card
1 31106804 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 114 LANCE DICKSON Card
1 31106805 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 170 CARLTON FISK Card
1 31106806 GEM MINT 10 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 280 BRET SABERHAGEN Card
1 31106807 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 352 FRANK WHITE Card
1 31106808 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 580 DAVE STEWART Card
1 31106809 MINT 9 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 639 FRANK ROBINSON Card
1 31106810 MINT 9 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 730 BARRY LARKIN Card
1 31106811 NEAR MINT-MINT 8 1991 TOPPS DESERT SHIELD 760 BENNY SANTIAGO Card
He is likely a good price marker for a mid-level star I imagine. Although a tab undervalued in general I think, mind you I live and grew up in Kansas, but is there another 2 time Cy Young common?
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
MG - yes the DS wax packs were packed in the same boxes as the regular 1991 Topps.
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
That is the reason there are so many of the checklists graded. Submitters where sending them in as DS even though there is no difference and calling them DS checklist. That is also a reason for the listing of checklists with the true regular issue errors on them. Even though PSA has graded some DS player cards with error labels, I have never seen a true one. I have two McGwires graded. One says .618 and the other says 618. They are both the same, just PSA listed one as an error. The same is true with the others graded.
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
I have been putting together a raw set for about 15 years now...still over 500 cards short, but am curious for future knowledge? And if there is no difference, then why would any of the checklists be labelled as a DS checklist?
Topps did not print the gold shield on the standard 1991 Topps Regular Issue checklist list, they just simply included them in the DS packs. That allows anyone to submit checklist to PSA and call them DS and PSA will add DS to the label. This is also the reason that the DS checklist can also be found with errors.
PM me with a list of what you need for your raw set and I will see what I can do to help you.
On a different note, with just one day remaining is there a REAL chance it will make 50K??? If not, someone should call 911. If the winner breaks the set up, I will definately be looking to upgrade some of the cards in my set.
James
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
To be honest, no direction, but...
1966-69 Topps EX+
1975 minis NrMt Kelloggs PSA 9
All Topps Heritage-Master Sets
<< <i>Not to be unpatriotic, but is it possible that these cards made it through the factory via the backdoor? >>
Limited print run is limited print run... I'm sure some of these ended up in employee's trunks, but a majority likely ended up in non-collector's hands which were subsequently thrown away. I'm far from being an expert with this set, but these cards will only go up in value as the years pass by. Especially in mint condition.
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
I did my best to stay off this thread until the auction at Mile High was over, but now I need to step in and respond to the jmmiller777 post. For anyone to say this set is overpriced at $35,500 clearly has never attempted to put it together themselves, and it is somewhat demeaning to the collectors I have worked with over the years who have had the patience and stamina to attempt a fully graded set. The only reason this set exists in such high grade is because of the efforts of many incredible collectors and friends working with me over the years to get it to where it’s at. Anyone claiming the set is overpriced should attempt to do it themselves, and then I could respect their opinion to say it’s overpriced. With nearly all the star and semi-star cards in the set graded as 10, and 120 pop 1 and pop 2 10's (and many cards in the set not having a 10 graded) I think you would quickly realize how rare and difficult many of these cards are to find, and the supply of new cards to grade is not getting any bigger.
In addition to the abuse most of these cards endured while overseas, Topps was not known for their high quality card stock, cutting, and printing processes in 1991, so just because you find a card with great edges and corners doesn’t mean it’s centered or printed well enough to make 10. I am sure there will be more PSA 10’s graded in the future, but the supply of gradable cards at this high level is dwindling quickly. I know, because I have been looking for years for cards to improve this set. I have opened many boxes and packs, and to be honest, no one knows more about Desert Shield cards than I do. I’m not saying this in an arrogant way at all, but when you own the top set of anything, you know a lot about it.
If people fully understood the subtle nuances and details of each of the 792 cards in the Desert Shield set (the same way people know all the nuances of all the cards in the 1952 Topps set) collectors would soon realize how rare and valuable many of these cards are. For example, try going out and finding a PSA 10 #638 Mike MacFarlane. Not a superstar, but a terribly cut card and incredibly rare even in PSA 9 (pop 4). The set at Mile High has the only 10 ever graded, and there is a very good chance it will be the only one. There are many cards like MacFarlane in the set. Clearly, other great sets have rare cards like this as well, but few have the limited supply of cards and the history that this set does.
For the true collectors out there (the ones who love collecting cards that are really rare and have a fantastic history) this set is it. Based on the effort that went into putting this set together, I sincerely doubt there will be another one like it again. If there is anything I can do to help other collectors out there with their sets, please let me know! I really enjoy talking about this set, and I would be happy to help in any way I can. Thanks to everyone for all your help over the years to make this set what it is. It could not have been done without you! As you can imagine, it has been a very difficult decision to let this set go, and it will be greatly missed once it's gone.
Congrats on an unbelievable set. I wish you well with your sale. I've looked at this set a few times, and the article in SMR was awesome too.
BTW...
Paul.
Later, Paul.
Welcome to the board!
James
Currently collecting 1934 Butterfinger, 1969 Nabisco, 1991 Topps Desert Shield (in PSA 9 or 10), and 1990 Donruss Learning Series (in PSA 10).
Such a sweet collection. I always admire guys that go pretty hard for a set and have the focus to complete in a high grade. And you are right, the knowledge you gain over the years is one of the best parts of collecting a set.
I have 3 cards I am looking for in this set. Did you have additional cards in addition to your set for sale?
#7
#398
#740
I tried to PM you but I think it is turned off.
Thanks,
Mike
My #2 Ranked Michael Jordan PSA Basic Set