Just to play Devil's Advocate here...but how is this any different than a dealer tapping the guy at the next table on the shoulder and trading for a spare piece of OGP and then handing it right to the buyer along with the coin in question?
Would anyone have a problem with this? Does this not happen every day?
And this is an even more ridiculous issue for eBay to dredge up because the modern Mint COAs are not even individually numbered...so what's unique about them in the first place?
<< <i>Just to play Devil's Advocate here...but how is this any different than a dealer tapping the guy at the next table on the shoulder and trading for a spare piece of OGP and then handing it right to the buyer along with the coin in question?
Would anyone have a problem with this? Does this not happen every day?
And this is an even more ridiculous issue for eBay to dredge up because the modern Mint COAs are not even individually numbered...so what's unique about them in the first place?
Not sure why numbered COA's make that much of a difference over non-numbered. After all the coins do not have any numbers on them to match. I for one am happy that Ebay is trying to reduce fraud in their system. Their action may not be as effective as it might seem but they are trying. I am sure anyone wanting to sell these can find some way to do it. I know; maybe John could have his own web site and sell them there. So there ya go. We shouldn't beat up Ebay too much for trying to do the right thing.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
So you think no fraud goes on out there with COA's? THis is not COA's but here is a listing from a site that sells proof/mint set envelopes (OGP). THey say it is to replace that tattered old envelope you have but do you think that someone might use one of these on an open set so they can sell as never opened/sealed and get more money? I think so. I think the Chinese would love all of these COA's for future use.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
My nephew is all for me quitting eBay. I'm almost convinced he's right. Laura quit long ago and it sure didn't hurt her or the way she conducts business.
<<So you think no fraud goes on out there with COA's? THis is not COA's but here is a listing from a site that sells proof/mint set envelopes.>>
Speaker as a past purchaser, those envelopes are an excellent product! However, if somebody wants to take it to the level of fraud...that's another thing entirely.
<< <i>My nephew is all for me quitting eBay. I'm almost convinced he's right.
Over this? or something else? If it is over this then you might be sending mixed messages. If we say we want Ebay to stop Chinese fakes and thenl pull our business on other anti-fraud measures just because it hurts OUR bottom line a bit then what message are we sending?
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>What if someone started buying up genuine COA's of a bunch of different types of US Mint coins and started counterfeiting their own coins and placing the COA's with them and selling them as genuine Mint products with genuine Mint COA's? I see a big problem with that. This is maybe what ebay sees. >>
Because counterfeiting coins is easy enough, but printing fake COA certificates is well beyond the capabilities of most people, I presume?
Am I the only person who finds the entire "remove it from the OGP and slab it"...but yet I want "everything to still appear as it was originally issued by the Mnt," tendencies of collectors today to be more than a bit insane?!?
The only reason there is so much OGP floating around is because of third party grading! You can't have it both ways, kids!
And as for counterfeiting...I would think that printing up fake COAs would be much, much easier than actually creating fake coins. And has anyone encountered a fake COA for a modern coin...ever? Hell...even the numbered GSA cards should be pretty straightforward to fake using today's printing technology...yet I haven't heard about that happening either.
Me thinks eBay is shooting a gnat with a shotgun...in their usual heavy-handed way!
<< <i>Am I the only person who finds the entire "remove it from the OGP and slab it"...but yet I want "everything to still appear as it was originally issued by the Mnt," tendencies of collectors today to be more than a bit insane?!?
The only reason there is so much OGP floating around is because of third party grading! You can't have it both ways, kids!
And as for counterfeiting...I would think that printing up fake COAs would be much, much easier than actually creating fake coins. And has anyone encountered a fake COA for a modern coin...ever? Hell...even the numbered GSA cards should be pretty straightforward to fake using today's printing technology...yet I haven't heard about that happening either.
Me thinks eBay is shooting a gnat with a shotgun...in their usual heavy-handed way! >>
They may be overreacting but I appreciate the spirit of what they are doing. Maybe someone who really cares about this can contact a representatives and walk them through the "proper" thinking as they see it. I still think an enterprising fraudster from Bejing would prefer real OGP versus printing etc if he could get them at a good price. I also thing that if Ebay is to be consistent in their thinking they should not allow ANY empty OGP to be sold, not just coa's.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
Lots of GSA boxes are listed all the time. Why single out your listings? Maybe they don't like the fact you get customers from them and then they end up finding your website and buy coins there?
<< <i>And has anyone encountered a fake COA for a modern coin...ever? >>
I imagine the answer is a resounding yes and that eBay has heard many complaints. Fake COAs and genuine COAs paired with counterfeits are specifically mentioned in 2 eBay guides for buying Chinese panda coins.
This is why it may be useful to explain why the situation may be different for US coins. An eBay guide explaining why the COAs for US coins are sometimes regularly mix and matched could be helpful.
<< <i>What if someone started buying up genuine COA's of a bunch of different types of US Mint coins and started counterfeiting their own coins and placing the COA's with them and selling them as genuine Mint products with genuine Mint COA's? I see a big problem with that. This is maybe what ebay sees.
>>
Because counterfeiting coins is easy enough, but printing fake COA certificates is well beyond the capabilities of most people, I presume? >>
Easier to make counterfeit coins than to print out fake C.O.A's ? That's stretching things a bit.
<< <i>What if someone started buying up genuine COA's of a bunch of different types of US Mint coins and started counterfeiting their own coins and placing the COA's with them and selling them as genuine Mint products with genuine Mint COA's? I see a big problem with that. This is maybe what ebay sees.
>>
Because counterfeiting coins is easy enough, but printing fake COA certificates is well beyond the capabilities of most people, I presume? >>
Easier to make counterfeit coins than to print out fake C.O.A's ? That's stretching things a bit. >>
It may be easier for someone who is just acquiring counterfeit coins to pair them up with genuine COAs than to make ones that appear real. In the autograph area, for some, it may also be much easier to add a counterfeit signature to an item than to create a genuine-appearing COA.
Regardless of whether it's easy or not, genuine COAs have apparently been paired with counterfeit coins and placed for sale on eBay enough times that there are eBay guide warnings. It's probably a good policy for Chinese coins and many other goods like the autographs mentioned. A special exception may be useful for US moderns.
However, another thing to consider is the disposition of buyers. COAs are very important for modern Chinese coins. The buyers of the same coins may be very likely to also buy raw US gold coins. Having stand-alone COAs for sale may put these buyers at more risk than say buyers that rely on TPGs.
If fake coins get paired with genuine C.O.A's , why should there be any exceptions ? It's a moot question because obviously there are no exceptions.I find it odd people blast ebay no matter what they do.If they are cleaning up thier act we should be pleased , but not this time because it affects a dealer ? Gimme a break
I guess people haven't checked out ailibaba lately. Anyone up for some fakey Star Spangleds? Its completely false to assume moderns are not being counterfeited, in fact there may be some in circulation already and people don't even know it.
So, on the subject of it being sleazy - I have to disagree with this. There has always been a market in packaging (look at the Pan Pac frames etc. that bring big money). Some people would prefer a coin in the original packaging rather than in a slab... even though I would prefer it in a slab for many reasons.
I've been in a situation where packaging got damaged en route to me, so I've replaced it for the consignor (on the secondary market).
Some certs from Chinese coins sell for big money.
Please note: there are many fake certificates out there. I searched through 1000 silver eagles recently (proofs) and there were at least 15-20 fake certificates in there... crudely fake at that. If you are buying OGP, buy from reputable sources only.
<< <i>I guess people haven't checked out ailibaba lately. Anyone up for some fakey Star Spangleds? Its completely false to assume moderns are not being counterfeited, in fact there may be some in circulation already and people don't even know it. >>
It's important to remain blinkered to that in order to speculate that fraud doesn't happen and that selling C.O.A's doesnt in the least give the scammers huge boost.
<< <i>I guess people haven't checked out ailibaba lately. Anyone up for some fakey Star Spangleds? Its completely false to assume moderns are not being counterfeited, in fact there may be some in circulation already and people don't even know it. >>
It's important to remain blinkered to that in order to speculate that fraud doesn't happen and that selling C.O.A's doesnt in the least give the scammers huge boost. >>
Maybe PCGS should certify/slab the COAs! (Apologies if someone suggested this on the thread already)
Not to be disagreeable or anything (but I will), but is eBay also requiring new/used car parts, computer components, shoes/clothing and leather goods (also widely counterfeited) to be certified as genuine?
If the answer is no, then I think we have a double standard here...and slabbing those other items isn't an option!
And, as a car guy, I will add this question: So is eBay now going to forbid the sale of new/used/replica components from classic cars...because you might replace a mirror, trim or mechanical part in an effort to "deceive a future buyer"? I'm thinking the answer is a resounding "NO"!
<< <i>Not to be disagreeable or anything, but is eBay also requiring new/used car parts, computer components, shoes/clothing and leather goods (also widely counterfeited) to be certified as genuine?
If the answer is no, then I think we have a double standard here...and slabbing those items isn't an option! >>
I don't think Ebay disputes the C.O.A's are genuine , they require an item to accompany the C.O.A , whats that got to do with car parts and fake designer gear ?
1) Greed? Give me a break. So far this venture has lost five figures in four full months of operation. It's a long term proposition and benefits those that want the product for legitimate purposes. Not a great way to get rich quick. >>
Just curious how you lose money on OGP, isn't the cost basically zero to you? What with the acquistion and grading costs being built into the graded coin stock the leftover OGP is just gravy.
<<I don't think Ebay disputes the C.O.A's are genuine , they require an item to accompany the C.O.A , whats that got to do with car parts and fake designer gear ? >>
My point is this...it now looks like eBay is trying to get into the mind of people and prevent "bad behavior"...probably because now that they've shoved the use of Paypal down everyone's throat, they're financially on the hook for making good on shenanigans thanks to their buyer's protection policy...and it's eating into their profit margin.
Mark my words, within 5 years, eBay may ban the sale of all coins...period...end of story. And this will also be a $$$ decision.
I'm auctioning ideas on eBay. Please PM me yours. I'll be starting the bidding at $.99 Those of you who do not believe these ideas are original will be given the telephone number of all those who gave me the idea in the first place. Is this legal ? Someone get back to me soon. I don't want my 300 auctions cancelled over some "legality". After all... these are YOUR ideas on the auction block.
P.S. I applied for a patent on this idea, so don't get any ideas.
I fail to se the issue here. A lot of folks are critical of ebay in this instance, and I am on their side. For PR reasons alone, if I ran ebay no one would be able to sell a coa without the underlying article, period. The fact that numismatic COAs trade in other venues is not relevant to ebay choosing how to police their marketplace. Whywould they want to further sully their image as a place that assists counterfeiters of any goods.
John- you keep asking if anyone is aware of a specific issue of a crook using US Mint COAs. I do not. I am also fairly sure that ebay neither knows nor cares. They set a bigger policy issue and are applying it universally. It is their site, and they set the rules.
... I just purchased over 250 Chester Arthur presidential dollars from the U.S. Mint without a COA. Oh no, what am I to do ? I even paid a premium for them. Maybe a giveaway ?
You may say that in jest but I wonder if it would be helpfull if the Mint would make a coa with a removable encoded magnetic strip on it that PCGS could incorporate into the holder. At least on the higher dollar coins.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>... I just purchased over 250 Chester Arthur presidential dollars from the U.S. Mint without a COA. Oh no, what am I to do ? I even paid a premium for them. Maybe a giveaway ? >>
change medicines is my advice for anyone buying those as to what to do with um...put some number #2 hooks and feathers on um...post aq picture of the 20lb large mouth you caught using um...
everything in life is but merely on loan to us by our appreciation....lose your appreciation and see
1) Greed? Give me a break. So far this venture has lost five figures in four full months of operation. It's a long term proposition and benefits those that want the product for legitimate purposes. Not a great way to get rich quick. >>
Just curious how you lose money on OGP, isn't the cost basically zero to you? What with the acquistion and grading costs being built into the graded coin stock the leftover OGP is just gravy. >>
Id also love to know how one loses tens of thousands of dollars over 4 months ? There was no problem prior to now so how is it possible ?
<< <i>Maybe PCGS should certify/slab the COAs! - Ian >>
You may say that in jest but I wonder if it would be helpfull if the Mint would make a coa with a removable encoded magnetic strip on it that PCGS could incorporate into the holder. At least on the higher dollar coins. >>
No, not in jest.
Some COAs will end up being worth a lot of money. And I think they are collectible.
<< <i>Maybe PCGS should certify/slab the COAs! - Ian >>
You may say that in jest but I wonder if it would be helpfull if the Mint would make a coa with a removable encoded magnetic strip on it that PCGS could incorporate into the holder. At least on the higher dollar coins. >>
No, not in jest.
Some COAs will end up being worth a lot of money. And I think they are collectible.
- Ian >>
To each his own but I wouldn't give up your day job.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
This seller is selling Mercanti Letters - No coins, no box. Will the Chinese buy it and sell it with their fake PCGS 25th annie coins and fake lacquer box (which was made there anyway, right)?
2011 25th Anniversary Silver Eagle Set PCGS John M. Mercanti Letter Item condition: --
Time left: 5d 20h (Apr 23, 201208:33:59 PDT)
Quantity: 9 available / 1 soldPlease enter a quantity of $quantity$ or less Please enter a quantity of 1 Purchases are limited to 0 per buyer Please enter a quantity of $quantity$ or less Please enter a lower number Please enter quantity of 1 or more
1) Greed? Give me a break. So far this venture has lost five figures in four full months of operation. It's a long term proposition and benefits those that want the product for legitimate purposes. Not a great way to get rich quick. >>
Just curious how you lose money on OGP, isn't the cost basically zero to you? What with the acquistion and grading costs being built into the graded coin stock the leftover OGP is just gravy. >>
Id also love to know how one loses tens of thousands of dollars over 4 months ? There was no problem prior to now so how is it possible ? >>
The loss so far was to be expected I was merely pointing it out to demonstrate that it isn't greed driven or a get rich quick scheme it's a longer term investment. There are start up costs, staff costs, equipment costs, marketing costs, and all the normal expenses associated with opening and running a business (rent, utilities, website, etc) I think most would understand these points without me having to spell them out, but there you go.
John
John Maben
Pegasus Coin and Jewelry (Brick and Mortar)
ANA LM, PNG, APMD, FUN, Etc
800-381-2646
<< <i>GSA CC COAs and empty boxes are routinely sold on ebay and have been for years. >>
If they get reported, they get nuked. That's what just happened to John. Some loser reported his listings. eBay doesn't go looking for this stuff. Instead they rely on an army of rats who have nothing better to do with their time.
Russ, NCNE >>
Thank you sir . . . Exactly what I was thinking.
HH
Need the following OBW rolls to complete my 46-64 Roosevelt roll set: 1947-P & D; 1948-D; 1949-P & S; 1950-D & S; and 1952-S. Any help locating any of these OBW rolls would be gratefully appreciated!
1) Greed? Give me a break. So far this venture has lost five figures in four full months of operation. It's a long term proposition and benefits those that want the product for legitimate purposes. Not a great way to get rich quick. >>
Just curious how you lose money on OGP, isn't the cost basically zero to you? What with the acquistion and grading costs being built into the graded coin stock the leftover OGP is just gravy. >>
Id also love to know how one loses tens of thousands of dollars over 4 months ? There was no problem prior to now so how is it possible ? >>
The loss so far was to be expected I was merely pointing it out to demonstrate that it isn't greed driven or a get rich quick scheme it's a longer term investment. There are start up costs, staff costs, equipment costs, marketing costs, and all the normal expenses associated with opening and running a business (rent, utilities, website, etc) I think most would understand these points without me having to spell them out, but there you go.
John >>
So in fact the C.O.A venture cost you zero as pointed out , these other costs are normal running costs you'd have anyway for any business.
<< <i>I'm auctioning ideas on eBay. Please PM me yours. I'll be starting the bidding at $.99 Those of you who do not believe these ideas are original will be given the telephone number of all those who gave me the idea in the first place. Is this legal ? Someone get back to me soon. I don't want my 300 auctions cancelled over some "legality". After all... these are YOUR ideas on the auction block.
P.S. I applied for a patent on this idea, so don't get any ideas. >>
Heres an idea, seal the coins in a CertaCard like PAMP does. Put numbers, autographs, coa verbiage whatever they want on the card. Seems most want their coins entombed in plastic anyway so lets just cut to the chase.
Comments
Would anyone have a problem with this? Does this not happen every day?
And this is an even more ridiculous issue for eBay to dredge up because the modern Mint COAs are not even individually numbered...so what's unique about them in the first place?
...and remember...1891-CC GSA numbered card...PM me!
<< <i>Just to play Devil's Advocate here...but how is this any different than a dealer tapping the guy at the next table on the shoulder and trading for a spare piece of OGP and then handing it right to the buyer along with the coin in question?
Would anyone have a problem with this? Does this not happen every day?
And this is an even more ridiculous issue for eBay to dredge up because the modern Mint COAs are not even individually numbered...so what's unique about them in the first place?
...and remember...1891-CC GSA numbered card...PM me! >>
Not sure why numbered COA's make that much of a difference over non-numbered. After all the coins do not have any numbers on them to match. I for one am happy that Ebay is trying to reduce fraud in their system. Their action may not be as effective as it might seem but they are trying. I am sure anyone wanting to sell these can find some way to do it. I know; maybe John could have his own web site and sell them there. So there ya go.
So you think no fraud goes on out there with COA's? THis is not COA's but here is a listing from a site that sells proof/mint set envelopes (OGP). THey say it is to replace that tattered old envelope you have
https://acoinshop.com/ —-> https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
Speaker as a past purchaser, those envelopes are an excellent product! However, if somebody wants to take it to the level of fraud...that's another thing entirely.
<< <i>My nephew is all for me quitting eBay. I'm almost convinced he's right.
Over this? or something else? If it is over this then you might be sending mixed messages. If we say we want Ebay to stop Chinese fakes and thenl pull our business on other anti-fraud measures just because it hurts OUR bottom line a bit then what message are we sending?
<< <i>What if someone started buying up genuine COA's of a bunch of different types of US Mint coins and started counterfeiting their own coins and placing the COA's with them and selling them as genuine Mint products with genuine Mint COA's? I see a big problem with that. This is maybe what ebay sees. >>
Because counterfeiting coins is easy enough, but printing fake COA certificates is well beyond the capabilities of most people, I presume?
The only reason there is so much OGP floating around is because of third party grading! You can't have it both ways, kids!
And as for counterfeiting...I would think that printing up fake COAs would be much, much easier than actually creating fake coins. And has anyone encountered a fake COA for a modern coin...ever? Hell...even the numbered GSA cards should be pretty straightforward to fake using today's printing technology...yet I haven't heard about that happening either.
Me thinks eBay is shooting a gnat with a shotgun...in their usual heavy-handed way!
<< <i>Am I the only person who finds the entire "remove it from the OGP and slab it"...but yet I want "everything to still appear as it was originally issued by the Mnt," tendencies of collectors today to be more than a bit insane?!?
The only reason there is so much OGP floating around is because of third party grading! You can't have it both ways, kids!
And as for counterfeiting...I would think that printing up fake COAs would be much, much easier than actually creating fake coins. And has anyone encountered a fake COA for a modern coin...ever? Hell...even the numbered GSA cards should be pretty straightforward to fake using today's printing technology...yet I haven't heard about that happening either.
Me thinks eBay is shooting a gnat with a shotgun...in their usual heavy-handed way! >>
They may be overreacting but I appreciate the spirit of what they are doing. Maybe someone who really cares about this can contact a representatives and walk them through the "proper" thinking as they see it. I still think an enterprising fraudster from Bejing would prefer real OGP versus printing etc if he could get them at a good price. I also thing that if Ebay is to be consistent in their thinking they should not allow ANY empty OGP to be sold, not just coa's.
<< <i>And has anyone encountered a fake COA for a modern coin...ever? >>
I imagine the answer is a resounding yes and that eBay has heard many complaints. Fake COAs and genuine COAs paired with counterfeits are specifically mentioned in 2 eBay guides for buying Chinese panda coins.
This is why it may be useful to explain why the situation may be different for US coins. An eBay guide explaining why the COAs for US coins are sometimes regularly mix and matched could be helpful.
<< <i>
<< <i>What if someone started buying up genuine COA's of a bunch of different types of US Mint coins and started counterfeiting their own coins and placing the COA's with them and selling them as genuine Mint products with genuine Mint COA's? I see a big problem with that. This is maybe what ebay sees.
>>
Because counterfeiting coins is easy enough, but printing fake COA certificates is well beyond the capabilities of most people, I presume? >>
Easier to make counterfeit coins than to print out fake C.O.A's ? That's stretching things a bit.
I've seen APMEX selling First Spouse "capsule only" common date as bullion at spot+$XX
In 2009 they were also selling 2008-W Plats as bullion (spot+$XX) that I was lucky to buy some
Order Date: 7/2/2009 Order Status: Order Shipped
4 2008-W (1/4 oz) Platinum Eagles - (Capsule Only) $348.25 $1,393.00
Since then I've been searching for their original OGP to reassemble them without much luck and would be one of the happy OGP buyers
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>What if someone started buying up genuine COA's of a bunch of different types of US Mint coins and started counterfeiting their own coins and placing the COA's with them and selling them as genuine Mint products with genuine Mint COA's? I see a big problem with that. This is maybe what ebay sees.
>>
Because counterfeiting coins is easy enough, but printing fake COA certificates is well beyond the capabilities of most people, I presume? >>
Easier to make counterfeit coins than to print out fake C.O.A's ? That's stretching things a bit. >>
It may be easier for someone who is just acquiring counterfeit coins to pair them up with genuine COAs than to make ones that appear real. In the autograph area, for some, it may also be much easier to add a counterfeit signature to an item than to create a genuine-appearing COA.
Regardless of whether it's easy or not, genuine COAs have apparently been paired with counterfeit coins and placed for sale on eBay enough times that there are eBay guide warnings. It's probably a good policy for Chinese coins and many other goods like the autographs mentioned. A special exception may be useful for US moderns.
However, another thing to consider is the disposition of buyers. COAs are very important for modern Chinese coins. The buyers of the same coins may be very likely to also buy raw US gold coins. Having stand-alone COAs for sale may put these buyers at more risk than say buyers that rely on TPGs.
https://acoinshop.com/ —-> https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
So, on the subject of it being sleazy - I have to disagree with this. There has always been a market in packaging (look at the Pan Pac frames etc. that bring big money). Some people would prefer a coin in the original packaging rather than in a slab... even though I would prefer it in a slab for many reasons.
I've been in a situation where packaging got damaged en route to me, so I've replaced it for the consignor (on the secondary market).
Some certs from Chinese coins sell for big money.
Please note: there are many fake certificates out there. I searched through 1000 silver eagles recently (proofs) and there were at least 15-20 fake certificates in there... crudely fake at that. If you are buying OGP, buy from reputable sources only.
- Ian
Owner/Founder GreatCollections
GreatCollections Coin Auctions - Certified Coin Auctions Every Week - Rare Coins & Coin Values
<< <i>I guess people haven't checked out ailibaba lately. Anyone up for some fakey Star Spangleds? Its completely false to assume moderns are not being counterfeited, in fact there may be some in circulation already and people don't even know it. >>
It's important to remain blinkered to that in order to speculate that fraud doesn't happen and that selling C.O.A's doesnt in the least give the scammers huge boost.
<< <i>
<< <i>I guess people haven't checked out ailibaba lately. Anyone up for some fakey Star Spangleds? Its completely false to assume moderns are not being counterfeited, in fact there may be some in circulation already and people don't even know it. >>
It's important to remain blinkered to that in order to speculate that fraud doesn't happen and that selling C.O.A's doesnt in the least give the scammers huge boost. >>
Maybe PCGS should certify/slab the COAs! (Apologies if someone suggested this on the thread already)
- Ian
Owner/Founder GreatCollections
GreatCollections Coin Auctions - Certified Coin Auctions Every Week - Rare Coins & Coin Values
If the answer is no, then I think we have a double standard here...and slabbing those other items isn't an option!
And, as a car guy, I will add this question: So is eBay now going to forbid the sale of new/used/replica components from classic cars...because you might replace a mirror, trim or mechanical part in an effort to "deceive a future buyer"? I'm thinking the answer is a resounding "NO"!
<< <i>Not to be disagreeable or anything, but is eBay also requiring new/used car parts, computer components, shoes/clothing and leather goods (also widely counterfeited) to be certified as genuine?
If the answer is no, then I think we have a double standard here...and slabbing those items isn't an option! >>
I don't think Ebay disputes the C.O.A's are genuine , they require an item to accompany the C.O.A , whats that got to do with car parts and fake designer gear ?
<< <i>A few more points to consider:
1) Greed? Give me a break. So far this venture has lost five figures in four full months of operation. It's a long term proposition and benefits those that want the product for legitimate purposes. Not a great way to get rich quick.
>>
Just curious how you lose money on OGP, isn't the cost basically zero to you? What with the acquistion and grading costs being built into the graded coin stock the leftover OGP is just gravy.
My point is this...it now looks like eBay is trying to get into the mind of people and prevent "bad behavior"...probably because now that they've shoved the use of Paypal down everyone's throat, they're financially on the hook for making good on shenanigans thanks to their buyer's protection policy...and it's eating into their profit margin.
Mark my words, within 5 years, eBay may ban the sale of all coins...period...end of story. And this will also be a $$$ decision.
"What's even dumber is the importance that folks place upon a "mass" produced piece of paper that may or may not reflect reality" LOl
Eric
P.S. I applied for a patent on this idea, so don't get any ideas.
https://acoinshop.com/ —-> https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
John- you keep asking if anyone is aware of a specific issue of a crook using US Mint COAs. I do not. I am also fairly sure that ebay neither knows nor cares. They set a bigger policy issue and are applying it universally. It is their site, and they set the rules.
merse
Im still waiting to hear how making counterfeit coins is easier than printing fake C.O.A's ?
For the record RichR , i agree with your assesment , i can see the day coming as well when coins are no longer on ebay.
https://acoinshop.com/ —-> https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
You may say that in jest but I wonder if it would be helpfull if the Mint would make a coa with a removable encoded magnetic strip on it that PCGS could incorporate into the holder. At least on the higher dollar coins.
<< <i>... I just purchased over 250 Chester Arthur presidential dollars from the U.S. Mint without a COA. Oh no, what am I to do ? I even paid a premium for them. Maybe a giveaway ? >>
change medicines is my advice for anyone buying those
as to what to do with um...put some number #2 hooks and feathers on um...post aq picture of the 20lb large mouth you caught using um...
<< <i>
<< <i>A few more points to consider:
1) Greed? Give me a break. So far this venture has lost five figures in four full months of operation. It's a long term proposition and benefits those that want the product for legitimate purposes. Not a great way to get rich quick.
>>
Just curious how you lose money on OGP, isn't the cost basically zero to you? What with the acquistion and grading costs being built into the graded coin stock the leftover OGP is just gravy. >>
Id also love to know how one loses tens of thousands of dollars over 4 months ? There was no problem prior to now so how is it possible ?
<< <i>Maybe PCGS should certify/slab the COAs! - Ian >>
You may say that in jest but I wonder if it would be helpfull if the Mint would make a coa with a removable encoded magnetic strip on it that PCGS could incorporate into the holder. At least on the higher dollar coins. >>
No, not in jest.
Some COAs will end up being worth a lot of money. And I think they are collectible.
- Ian
Owner/Founder GreatCollections
GreatCollections Coin Auctions - Certified Coin Auctions Every Week - Rare Coins & Coin Values
Probably talking about business in general.
<< <i>
<< <i>Maybe PCGS should certify/slab the COAs! - Ian >>
You may say that in jest but I wonder if it would be helpfull if the Mint would make a coa with a removable encoded magnetic strip on it that PCGS could incorporate into the holder. At least on the higher dollar coins. >>
No, not in jest.
Some COAs will end up being worth a lot of money. And I think they are collectible.
- Ian >>
To each his own but I wouldn't give up your day job.
for those that follow the abbreviation/acronym listings
TTHL
.
joes got a great 1916 buff he's looken for comments on...a purrty thread i swear
joes 1916 buff
<< <i>100 yet??? >>
Don't know, but I'm lovin' it , so far
https://acoinshop.com/ —-> https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
This seller is selling Mercanti Letters - No coins, no box. Will the Chinese buy it and sell it with their fake PCGS 25th annie coins and fake lacquer box (which was made there anyway, right)?
2011 25th Anniversary Silver Eagle Set PCGS John M. Mercanti Letter
Item condition: --
Time left: 5d 20h (Apr 23, 201208:33:59 PDT)
Quantity:
9 available / 1 soldPlease enter a quantity of $quantity$ or less
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Purchases are limited to 0 per buyer
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Price: US $14.99 Buy It NowBuy It NowBuy It Now
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<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>A few more points to consider:
1) Greed? Give me a break. So far this venture has lost five figures in four full months of operation. It's a long term proposition and benefits those that want the product for legitimate purposes. Not a great way to get rich quick.
>>
Just curious how you lose money on OGP, isn't the cost basically zero to you? What with the acquistion and grading costs being built into the graded coin stock the leftover OGP is just gravy. >>
Id also love to know how one loses tens of thousands of dollars over 4 months ? There was no problem prior to now so how is it possible ? >>
The loss so far was to be expected I was merely pointing it out to demonstrate that it isn't greed driven or a get rich quick scheme it's a longer term investment. There are start up costs, staff costs, equipment costs, marketing costs, and all the normal expenses associated with opening and running a business (rent, utilities, website, etc) I think most would understand these points without me having to spell them out, but there you go.
John
John Maben
Pegasus Coin and Jewelry (Brick and Mortar)
ANA LM, PNG, APMD, FUN, Etc
800-381-2646
<< <i>
<< <i>GSA CC COAs and empty boxes are routinely sold on ebay and have been for years. >>
If they get reported, they get nuked. That's what just happened to John. Some loser reported his listings. eBay doesn't go looking for this stuff. Instead they rely on an army of rats who have nothing better to do with their time.
Russ, NCNE >>
Thank you sir . . . Exactly what I was thinking.
HH
1947-P & D; 1948-D; 1949-P & S; 1950-D & S; and 1952-S.
Any help locating any of these OBW rolls would be gratefully appreciated!
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>A few more points to consider:
1) Greed? Give me a break. So far this venture has lost five figures in four full months of operation. It's a long term proposition and benefits those that want the product for legitimate purposes. Not a great way to get rich quick.
>>
Just curious how you lose money on OGP, isn't the cost basically zero to you? What with the acquistion and grading costs being built into the graded coin stock the leftover OGP is just gravy. >>
Id also love to know how one loses tens of thousands of dollars over 4 months ? There was no problem prior to now so how is it possible ? >>
The loss so far was to be expected I was merely pointing it out to demonstrate that it isn't greed driven or a get rich quick scheme it's a longer term investment. There are start up costs, staff costs, equipment costs, marketing costs, and all the normal expenses associated with opening and running a business (rent, utilities, website, etc) I think most would understand these points without me having to spell them out, but there you go.
John >>
So in fact the C.O.A venture cost you zero as pointed out , these other costs are normal running costs you'd have anyway for any business.
<< <i>I'm auctioning ideas on eBay. Please PM me yours. I'll be starting the bidding at $.99 Those of you who do not believe these ideas are original will be given the telephone number of all those who gave me the idea in the first place. Is this legal ? Someone get back to me soon. I don't want my 300 auctions cancelled over some "legality". After all... these are YOUR ideas on the auction block.
P.S. I applied for a patent on this idea, so don't get any ideas. >>
Heres an idea, seal the coins in a CertaCard like PAMP does. Put numbers, autographs, coa verbiage whatever they want on the card. Seems most want their coins entombed in plastic anyway so lets just cut to the chase.
https://acoinshop.com/ —-> https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5