So... I attended a presentation on New England cellar holes...

pcgs69

And, yes, it was the best hour of my life.

I figured it would be a good opportunity to get some tips on tracking down some cellar holes and be able to detect them.

Before I walked in, I had a slight nagging voice in my brain that kept saying, "it's going to be presented by an archaeologist-type."

Putting those worst fears behind, I go in. The lady had some collateral spread on one of the tables. Turns out they started a project to log all of the cellar holes in her town in her town. One of the notebooks showed a little bit of what they put down, like GPS coordinates (WOO HOO!), but on their "rules" sheet, one said something along the lines of, "we ensure that not a single thing is taken from the site, no digging, and everything is put back exactly where it was found."

"OH NO, WHAT DID I GET MYSELF INTO???"

Everyone filed in and eventually the presentation began. I had to wipe the drool with all the cellar hole images she showed, and all in her town.

I wanted to ask some questions at the end, but held off as I didn't want to exude ulterior motives. I pictured everyone in the crowd (whose average age was about 127), chasing me down with pitch forks if they found out what a horrible person I was for being a metal detectorist.

So, my main question that's left is... what's the best way you guys find maps of old properties in your area - that contain cellar holes?

ricko

I use the local library for old maps of the area. Also someone from another forum sent me maps via email from Sanborn. Cheers, RickO

AUandAG

Okay, I'll bite. What the heck is a cellar hole??? Where's the house?

Is it another word for basement? Don't have such critters here in Vegas, never seen one
yet. What would you find in a cellar?

bob

mrguby

old property,s are listed in town hall archives. however cellar holes are not. most often there filled in. or removed, unless there deep wooded and hard to reach. then you can find a few. find the wooded areas with old driveways,or trails thats how you usually come across celar holes. once used for cold storage not basements.

johnny9434

<< <i>old property,s are listed in town hall archives. however cellar holes are not. most often there filled in. or removed, unless there deep wooded and hard to reach. then you can find a few. find the wooded areas with old driveways,or trails thats how you usually come across celar holes. once used for cold storage not basements. >>

exactly

ricko

We have many old cellar holes here in the mountains.... and old coppers are the prime finds around cellar holes. All of New England seems to have a proliferation of these as well. A lot of MD'rs on the Friendly Metal Detecting Forum in Conn. And MA hunt these almost exclusively. Cheers, RickO

pcgs69

<< <i>Okay, I'll bite. What the heck is a cellar hole??? Where's the house?

Is it another word for basement? Don't have such critters here in Vegas, never seen one
yet. What would you find in a cellar?

bob >>



It's what's left of the house after it's gone. It's a sign for metal detectorists that says, "hey buddy, someone lived here 150 or 200 years ago. Come see what they dropped"

I found this image online of a cellar hole.

ricko

They are prime MD areas if you can find them.... especially for old coppers...and occasionally other good stuff, like medals or other coins. Cheers, RickO

JamesMurray

<< <i>old property,s are listed in town hall archives. however cellar holes are not. most often there filled in. or removed, unless there deep wooded and hard to reach. then you can find a few. find the wooded areas with old driveways,or trails thats how you usually come across celar holes. once used for cold storage not basements. >>



We have one on the property,it was pretty much lost in the woods and overgrown.




And here it is today : ) A new roof and she's ready to rock n roll again

OldEastside

Wow, thats pretty cool, I learned something today.

Steve

ricko

JamesMurray... did you MD it? Inside and out, as well as the walls?? Cheers, RickO

JamesMurray

No , i havnt Ricko , it was a huge job clearing the trees and brush to get in at it. Interesting i thought how mrguby describes them and my pics , one supports the other perfectly.The old driveway and the wooded area.
The detector i have Ricko isnt any good for Pa soil , anything of any age is deep , real deep. I was getting memorial cents and jeffersons up to 7 and 8 inches down on open spaces so anything real old is out of reach of my old MD.
Theres the quandry , do i spend 3-500 clams on a new detector for coins that probably arent there or just use the money to buy the coins as i have been doing up to now.
Ill admit though it looks much more tempting now than when it was under the bushes and difficult to get at.I'm here in Pa for the long haul so i'll get that great deal on a detector one of these days and theres a few interesting bits and bobs on the land , there's an old well , 200 year old barn , the civil war must have mrched right past the front door as did the revolution.Ive learned recently that this town was the oldest known Indian town in the area if not the state.So it goes back a ways.

ricko

Holey Moley man... what a site. I sure hope that MD deal comes along soon... there is bound to be some goodies there. True, you will likely get some finer coins buying them, but the thrill of finding them is incredible. That area sounds so rich in American history that there must be some artifacts and coins to be discovered. I live in a similar historical area here in NYS Catskill Mountains. Best of luck... Cheers, RickO

JamesMurray

Oh ... oh oh oh .. it occurs to me Ricko that you are just the guy to ask about something i found out in that old barn. At first i thought it was a childs cap gun , but it isnt.It's a gun alright but ive never seen one like this before , it looks like a toy.There are marks on it which i think indicate London and i think the V with a crown is Victoria.
Ill get some pics of this and i really would appreciate an expert opinion Ricko,it's in ok condition but i certainly would not attempt to fire it.I believe it to be a .32 perhaps , too small for a .38 and too big for .22 cylinder wise. There may have been a gauge i'm not aware of somewhere in between.
Interestingly enough i also found a S&W lemon squeezer in its original holster out there too but it's in superb condition,even the chrome sparkles , 1897 is the date on that one.I was able to get shells for that and it's surprisingly fun to shoot.

ricko

OK... be glad to help.... Double WOW...if you found that stuff without even an effort, imagine what else is there. Man, get yourself a good MD and go for it...may even be a cache or two there.... You have treasure beneath your feet man...Cheers, RickO

mrpaseo

Holy smokes, I would like to see those pics too

Ray

kiyote

"it's going to be presented by an archaeologist-type.

Archeologist types are not bad people-- a late 1700s cellar hole is a treasure trove of information that extends beyond just a handful of coppers or old buttons you might find. I think the issue that US detectorists have with "archeologist types" are the same issues that archeologists have with metal detectorists; they're (over) stepping into each other's boundaries.

A. You don't want to be told you can't metal detect at a potentially great site.
B. Archeologists don't want to see potential sites compromised by folks taking items and not recording them.

That's why I wish we had a system like the UK did. What if the old lady had said: "Here's a list of cellar holes, just please share what you've found with us, ok? Record what you found and where, how deep, state of preservation, photograph your finds, etc. If you find anything really amazing we have the right to give you full market value for the find and credit you for it. You can see your finds anytime you wish at the local museum where everyone in the area can enjoy the history of what life must have been like back then."

I'm not knocking detectorists at all; I think archeologists have the same passion and zeal for discovery. I just wish things were more like they are in the UK.

goldrush00013

<< <i>"it's going to be presented by an archaeologist-type.

Archeologist types are not bad people-- a late 1700s cellar hole is a treasure trove of information that extends beyond just a handful of coppers or old buttons you might find. I think the issue that US detectorists have with "archeologist types" are the same issues that archeologists have with metal detectorists; they're (over) stepping into each other's boundaries.

A. You don't want to be told you can't metal detect at a potentially great site.
B. Archeologists don't want to see potential sites compromised by folks taking items and not recording them.

That's why I wish we had a system like the UK did. What if the old lady had said: "Here's a list of cellar holes, just please share what you've found with us, ok? Record what you found and where, how deep, state of preservation, photograph your finds, etc. If you find anything really amazing we have the right to give you full market value for the find and credit you for it. You can see your finds anytime you wish at the local museum where everyone in the area can enjoy the history of what life must have been like back then."

I'm not knocking detectorists at all; I think archeologists have the same passion and zeal for discovery. I just wish things were more like they are in the UK. >>




The problem I have with the professionals is after they catalog the finds and tuck them away for no one to see they fail to publish the finds. In the end we learn nothing.

JamesMurray

I apologise it's taken a couple days , when the weathers dry like this there is plenty work to be done. Here we go though , first pic that came to hand is the S&W 1897 Lemon Squeezer , it gets its name because it has no safty catch but rather a device built into the handle which when gripped by an adult it will fire but gripped by a child it will not without excessive effort.I had it inspected at the local gun shop and it passed with flying colors.



This is the one i need help with Ricko , i suspect it's older than the S&W and in fact perhaps the S&W was purchased to replace this one as i found them both together.The S&W is extremely well built and solid , this one as you see is like a kids toy.Theres no safety , no trigger guard , it's probably a dangerous item to have around back in the day.Note the grips , if i'm not mistaken that face is the entity known as "The Green Man" in europe.



Im hoping this pic is clear , it shows a crowned V , it appears to be the only markings whereas the S&W , everypiece is marked with a serial number.



This pic shows how it is loaded , it doesnt appear to break like the S&W does.

JamesMurray

One more of the Lemon Squeezer

Ahmanfan

Wow! Where exactly did you find them?!

JamesMurray

I found those and other long guns in this old ruined barn. I also found boxes of old 35mm slides that show this area in the 50's which is very cool.This barn was a beautiful thing in its day. Time and neglect seen it ruined.

JamesMurray

pcgs69

wow, if that was inside the barn, imagine all the good stuff in that prime lawn surrounding the barn!

JamesMurray

Ill try and find the pic from the 50's of the barn , i converted the slides to digital. : )

ricko

Those old firearms are amazing....I have seen one similar to the second one, but really do not know what it is. I will try to find it in some of my books and get back to you. Looks to be in fairly good shape for its age. There has got to be a lot of good stuff in that area... you really need to MD it. Cheers, RickO

lordmarcovan

Ain't no cellar holes here in the Low Country. We have to search plowed or cleared areas for surface clues, or get our clues from the lay of the land. High land near a water source is usually good- river bluffs in particular. There are a lot of rivers here (the highways of yesteryear), but what we call a "high bluff" might not be so high by the standards of other geographic areas.

I'll bet that was a pretty fascinating presentation, and I can see why you'd get itchy in your seat and begin to salivate.

Just like I did when I scrolled down to see some of the pictures in this thread.

JamesMurray

<< <i>Those old firearms are amazing....I have seen one similar to the second one, but really do not know what it is. I will try to find it in some of my books and get back to you. Looks to be in fairly good shape for its age. There has got to be a lot of good stuff in that area... you really need to MD it. Cheers, RickO >>



Thanks Ricko , i tried as well to find out more online over time , there hasn't been much information other than what is fairly obvious concerning the crowned V.I tried a .22 shell and a .32 to be sure again what im saying , ones too small,the other too big. Ive never heard of anyting between those like a .30 ?

ricko

There have been .30 caliber pistols and certainly .25 caliber. I will be searching my old firearms books for a match to your find. Cheers, RickO

JamesMurray

Thank you Ricko , i feel really silly now , of course there's a .25 , i don't know how i could forget that. Heres a few of the old slides i convereted , going by clothes and cars in other slides it's sometime in the 50's we think.These show the barn as it was.

pcgs69

Looks like JamesMurray needs some help detecting his land. Who's up for a field trip?

JamesMurray

Other pics show what seem to be large friends & family gatherings,cars from the 50's & 60's parked on the pasture and a volleyball net set up. In the pics nobody is wearing sportswear or anything close to it , just normal everyday clothing..playing volleyball , looks maybe 8 per side or so and still others on the sidelines snacking and bbqing.
Naturally my thoughts are pre 64 silver should be dotted all over this field.

JamesMurray

Heres a good shot of one of the cars , perhaps departing by the looks of it. Can anyone help ID and date it ? I was brought up in Scotland so i don't know the old American cars , some of them but not all.

ricko

Based on the pictures, and what you have already found... MD'ing that land (and the barn) is mandatory. There is much to be found there....Cheers, RickO

ricko

You posted the picture of that Cadillac when I was typing the last response.... not sure of the year, looks like mid 50's. Cheers, RickO

JamesMurray

The weather is up near 60 today so ..i agree Ricko , i'll dig the old bounty hunter out and give it a try in the next day or two , and look at whats available now. I know my brother has one in the UK that cost him big but he finds old hammereds all the time so it wasnt a bad buy for him.I remember back in 09 i won an award in here using that bounty hunter , most coins in a month i think it was..most something but everythings so deep.Ill go about it differently this time , get the bobcat involved. : )

JamesMurray

<< <i>You posted the picture of that Cadillac when I was typing the last response.... not sure of the year, looks like mid 50's. Cheers, RickO >>



A Caddy ? WoW .. Im on it Ricko , thank you and thanks everyone , i think its got the interest back , i knew i'd go back to it sometime , just didnt know when. Thanks all.

Bochiman

James,

That's friggin' cool, dude!

Forum party at James'....bring your MD with you

OldEastside

That looks like a 56 Caddie

Steve

JamesMurray

<< <i>James,

That's friggin' cool, dude!

Forum party at James'....bring your MD with you >>



Let's see now.........how many kegs we gonna need ?

OldEastside

<< <i>

<< <i>James,

That's friggin' cool, dude!

Forum party at James'....bring your MD with you >>



Let's see now.........how many kegs we gonna need ? >>



Wow, Beer, guns and shovels, Sounds Fun, I'm In

Steve