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JeffersonFrogJeffersonFrog Posts: 1,085 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited July 15, 2018 10:41AM in U.S. Coin Forum
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If we were all the same, the world would be an incredibly boring place.

Tommy

Comments

  • OnlyGoldIsMoneyOnlyGoldIsMoney Posts: 3,423 ✭✭✭✭✭
    When I collected Jefferson 1950-1964 proofs I calculated the average grade of all NGC graded Jefferson proofs.

    NGC's average grade was 0.9 points higher than the comparable PCGS population of Jefferson proofs.
    NO END IN SIGHT LIB $2.50'S CAC ONLY
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
  • WhitWhit Posts: 349 ✭✭✭
    In my experience, your equation holds true for mint-state Lincolns, Roosevelts, and Washingtons as well.
    (I don't play the crossover game. Just side-by-side comparisons....)

    Whit
    Whit
  • goldengolden Posts: 9,995 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Only buy PCGS to start and there is no problem.
  • mkman123mkman123 Posts: 6,849 ✭✭✭✭
    Perhaps pcgs doesn't want to cross ngc coins and wants them to look bad?
    What if you cracked the coins out and submitted raw?
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    Many members on this forum that now it cannot fit in my signature. Please ask for entire list.
  • illini420illini420 Posts: 11,466 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I just went 4 for 4 on a crossover of NGC coins to PCGS. All 4 were Lincoln Cents in NGC holders and was sending to PCGS for crossover and variety attribution. I said to cross at any grade and all 4 crossed at the same grade.

    I've had very good success when I say cross at any grade, but have done quite poorly when I say to cross the coin at the same grade or better... perhaps that makes a difference?

    Michael Kittle Rare Coins --- 1908-S Indian Head Cent Grading Set --- No. 1 1909 Mint Set --- Kittlecoins on Facebook --- Long Beach Table 448

  • astroratastrorat Posts: 9,221 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>When I collected Jefferson 1950-1964 proofs I calculated the average grade of all NGC graded Jefferson proofs.

    NGC's average grade was 0.9 points higher than the comparable PCGS population of Jefferson proofs. >>

    That is an interesting analysis.
    Numismatist Ordinaire
    See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
  • renomedphysrenomedphys Posts: 3,820 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yes to all of this, but there is always the lingering possibility that you will find one that bucks the trend. In all honesty, this has only happened twice to me. Once with a 1919-s Lincoln that was NGC64RB, and cracked out went 64RD at PCGS. I think I made $1800 on that coin. The other was a 1914 proof Lincoln in an NGC 66BN holder that eventually went 66+BN at PCGS. Took three trips to the big house to make that happen, and did cross in the holder.

    Now, in case you're wondering, I do have some tales of woe to balance the scales. Not for this post, though.

    Empty Nest Collection

  • DennisHDennisH Posts: 14,010 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Tommy, Tommy, Tommy...
    Even though we've talked about this for years, you still bash your head into the wall?

    It's time to find a new windmill to tilt at.
    When in doubt, don't.
  • scoobydeuxscoobydeux Posts: 498 ✭✭


    << <i>All four NGC-67 Jeffs: DNC (1939 R40, 1940, 1948-S and 1987)

    I am now officially 2 for 21 in the NGC to PCGS crossover game. 16 crack-outs - 1 cross. 5 crossovers - 1 cross.

    Interesting to note that of the 16 NGC NFS crack-outs, 3 came back FS (2 one point less, 1 two points less).

    One day I'll learn. >>



    The same is true of CBHs. In princilple, I won't buy a N graded CBH for any more than "grade minus 1 money," and even this is with trepidation as some will come back as "no grades."

    But then, there are always extenuating circumstances. image
    "Discipline is never an end in itself, only a means to an end."
  • EagleguyEagleguy Posts: 2,264 ✭✭✭✭✭
    When I crossed my 1939 doubled Monticello Jefferson it crossed at P64, down from a N65. My 3-legged buffalo, crossed at P50, down from N55. My 1909-S VDB cent came back the same grade. So I guess I'll agree with you 67% of the time image

    JH
    JH

    Proof Buffalo Registry Set
    Capped Bust Quarters Registry Set
    Proof Walking Liberty Halves Registry Set
  • leothelyonleothelyon Posts: 8,489 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ngc has a slew of Jefferson nickels in their MS67 holders.

    The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!

    My Jefferson Nickel Collection

  • SchatzySchatzy Posts: 169
    I know this isn't a Jefferson but someone got a serious upgrade here!!

    1945-S Standing Liberty Half

    August 2010
    NGC MS66* sold for $1,610
    Link

    February 2011
    PCGS MS67 sold for $37,375
    Link
    Jaime image ~Proof Roosevelt Hoarder~ My Roosevelt Set
  • golfer72golfer72 Posts: 3,588


    << <i>I know this isn't a Jefferson but someone got a serious upgrade here!!

    1945-S Standing Liberty Half

    August 2010
    NGC MS66* sold for $1,610
    [url=http://stacksbowers.com/auctions/AuctionLot.aspx?lotid=77314]Stacks/Bowers[/url]

    February 2011
    PCGS MS67 sold for $37,375
    [url=http://coins.ha.com/c/item.zx?saleNo=1152&lotNo=3839]Heritage[/url] >>

    And whoever bought that coin is dpending on a greater fool coming along. Unreal! image
  • UnknownUnknown
    This content has been removed.
  • SchatzySchatzy Posts: 169


    << <i>Stacks bowers doesn't show the holder so I wonder when ngc graded it. Looks to be a super coin (but just going by pictures). I sure wouldn't want to be the person who auctioned it for $1610. Good detective work Schatzy.
    >>



    It is in a pronged ngc holder so it was graded within 1 year of auctioning it off.
    Jaime image ~Proof Roosevelt Hoarder~ My Roosevelt Set
  • JeffersonFrogJeffersonFrog Posts: 1,085 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 15, 2018 10:40AM
    ...

    If we were all the same, the world would be an incredibly boring place.

    Tommy

  • DennisHDennisH Posts: 14,010 ✭✭✭✭✭
    PCGS changed about two years ago... now they let the graders see the current grade.
    When in doubt, don't.
  • ShamikaShamika Posts: 18,785 ✭✭✭✭
    I'd love to see how PCGS coins would do if cracked out and submitted to NGC. Based on the OP's equation...


    Buyer and seller of vintage coin boards!
  • mkman123mkman123 Posts: 6,849 ✭✭✭✭
    Be interesting to see someone try and cross some PCGS coins and see how NGC thinks, perhaps they may grade them lower or ?
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  • 08HALA2008HALA20 Posts: 3,066 ✭✭✭


    << <i>I am intrigued by the idea that a "cross at any grade" submittal would fair better than a "cross at grade". I would of thought PCGS order processing would cover the NGC grade so as not to bias the outcome. Anyone know how PGCS handles this? >>



    I believe that a "cross at any grade" will result in coin being removed from NGC capsule and graded thus resulting in better results.

    A coin at "cross at a minimum grade" must be graded in NGC capsule and is more difficult to grade and if removed and an issue is found hidden by capsule
    would be a problem for PCGS and thus they they are more critical and only cross when absolutely sure.

    Joe
    EBAY AUCTIONS
  • frnklnlvrfrnklnlvr Posts: 2,750 ✭
    This is one of my better crossover submissions, went 7 for 9. The two 1954s DNC for questionable toning if I remember correctly, 1956 DDO FS-101 crossed at a grade lower. The 1959 DDR MS66 crossing at the same grade surprised me.



    1949-S 50c ANACS MS65 -> PCGS MS65

    1950-D 50c ICG MS64FBL -> PCGS MS64FBL

    1953-S/S 50c RPM FS-501 ANACS MS63 -> PCGS MS63

    1954 50c NGC MS64 DNC

    1954 50c NGC MS65 DNC

    1956 50c Bugs Bunny NGC MS65 -> PCGS MS65

    1956 50c DDO FS-101 ANACS PF66 -> PR65

    1959 50c DDR FS-801 NGC MS66 -> PCGS MS66

    1961-D 50c RPM-001 NGC MS64FBL -> PCGS MS64FBL



    imageimage
    FRANKLINLOVER.COM
    Franklin-Lover's Forum

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