"... I rarely sell coins from my collection. I simply thought that a B&M was a natural place to go to do some streamlining. They coins weren't dogs as some have implied, they were mostly pc66, I have upgraded my collection and just wanted to put these back out there.....
I have not tried elect[r]onic medium since I do not have the equipment to photograph the coins which is essential for online selling.
My experience was eye-opening, shocking, and discouraging.
If/when I decide to sell my 14th place Registry Set of Washington Quarters I will put a lot more thought into how I accomplish that transaction."
When you buy a coin, you should have an exit strategy in mind---how would you sell the coin to maximize your return (minimize your loss). Many types of coins are not nearly as liquid as collectors would like to think. The dealer recognized this was the case with your quarters, and presumed that he would have to wholesale them to another dealer rather than quickly sell them at retail to another collector, hence the low offer. Spend some time learning about the mechanics of the coin market---it's in your financial interest to do this if you intend to continue buying collector coins.
It is entirely possible to buy nice collector coins, only to wind up with a financial loss because of unfortunate market timing or a poor choice of sales venue (auction vs. local B&M vs. specialty dealer vs.....).
Member: EAC, NBS, C4, CWTS, ANA
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
Yup, Yup, Yup that is the way it is but when you find a good dealer you need to keep him or her around for a long time. I go to one dealer once a week and I took him 5 notes to look at and ask what he will pay for them and he said $30 for the lot. I told him thank you gave them to my girl she posted them on the bay and sold all 5 for $135 I'm happy she got the $$$ then him now i know why he is alway broke.
This is exactly why collectors should try to sell a few coins from their collections from time to time to see where they are. This thread is the poster child for it. Better to know early in the game then at the end what the resell for some coins is.
At the end of the day that dealer didn't really want the deal and was happy you refused his offer. The offer was made to be refused.
My guess is that you would do a lot better on the BST anyways.
MJ
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Agree with Justacommeman - buying and selling is the best way to learn how the game is played.
If you don't like selling to the local B&M, at least maintain the buying relationship for the occasional nice coin they might offer you or for the occasional cherry pick.
"My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko, Big Moose, Cardinal.
OP high grade Washington Quarters are not fast sellers and unless you are dealing with top pop kind of stuff, it really sits. Back in late 2010 I bought a near complete set 32-64 in MS65-67 missing a handful of keys. Outside of the top pop coins and some of the better semi-keys, most of the coins sat selling a piece here or there. Even now over a year later we still have a handful of pieces. Most of them sold at Bid levels, some even lower. Until you have the guts to put money where your mouth is, never complain about a reasonable offer from a shop. They pay for that privilege.
At the end of the day that dealer didn't really want the deal and was happy you refused his offer. The offer was made to be refused.
Bingo. If someone presses me for an offer on something I have little to no interest in owning for whatever reason, they'll get an offer that reflects my lack of interest.
I lose patience with the "he sold some of them to me" argument, as if that makes him obligated somehow to buy them back at your numbers. His local market might have changed, his inventory might have changed, heck, for all anyone knows maybe you were his primary customer for these pieces and he now faces having to inventory them for some time before being able to move them. Another thing to consider is that at this time of year B&Ms get a lot of things offered to them (lots of people liquidating various things- pre tax time, holiday bills hitting the mailbox, etc)... this all places a strain on cash flow so he's likely going to be more selective about what he's buying. I know we are. In short, he's not going to want to pay end of the road money for it unless he can flip it quickly- and from reading the story it's fairly evident he isn't a Washington Quarter specialty dealer- so there's your answer imo.
I had a situation not unlike this not so long ago with a customer who bought a couple of foreign pieces from us about a year/year and a half ago... he wanted to liquidate so even though I had a fair amount of them in stock after a recent purchase, he'd been a good repeat customer so I quoted him what I considered a fair number based on current market and what I figured I could now sell the items for (and at a profit to him, I might add.) He got all bent, went off on me about how he bought them from me, whined some more about how he looked at sites X, Y, and Z on the internet and they should be worth $XX more than my ripoff offer. I pointed to the tray that was easily half full of the same coins and offered him his choice at a goodly amount less than what he thought he should have gotten for his two pieces. He whined some more about how he bought them from me and how that should count for something. I replied "It DOES count for something...if you hadn't bought them from me I'd have likely not even made you an offer- because I have a dozen of them here already that I'm not selling".
Sometimes people need to realize that NO is a perfectly acceptable answer to a question... and not to take it personally. JMHO
@ Telephoto...Amen! The fact that he bought them from you earns him the right to a respectable offer that he is under no obligation to accept. You gave him that.
Times change. Markets change. The economy changes.
Years ago when I was agressively collecting Honduras I bid $4,000 on a very rare piece on eBay, and didn't get it. The second underbidder dropped out at $1,000 or so.
I no longer collect Honduras. What is that coin worth today if the winner's collection comes on the market?
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
I took a PCGS 1961 PR69 Cameo Washington Qtr to a coin show about a year ago to get a feel for the market and I basically got: "Nice coin, I'd just hold on to it". I believe this is a top pop coin and it still gets no love. I did not "force" any offers from the dealers.
Normally I would probably agree with the OP here, but after reading all the comments, I agree with most of them. The dealer was probably just being nice by giving out any offer at all. He was probably aware that the customer (OP) new the greysheet prices, so made an offer just out of courtesy when in his head he was probably thinking (crap, I really don't want these!). That's pretty common in any resale business.
On the other end, the OP would have probably been just as upset and offended if the dealer said "No, I really don't want these crappy things...they won't sell". Seems like the dealer picked the lesser of two evils.
In my experience and opinion the $350 offer on the group was on the low side, but that is often the compromise that is made for ease of sale and timeliness of good, secure payment. The dealer likely had no retail client base for the coins and knew they would move slowly so he had little reason to inventory the coins. An MS65 or MS66 WQ is generic as the day is long if white and not of a much better date (1932-D, 1932-S, 1934-D, 1935-D, 1936-D, 1936-S or 1937-S). These coins can languish and saok up opportunity costs in terms of dealer liquidity. Certainly, this small group would put no one out of business, but if you keep buying group after group to please client after client then you might find yourself in a bad place. He could alternatively have blown them out to wholesale clients, but this strategy also necessitates low sales prices on the dealer's end so he had to protect himself. Many of your goals (no consignment, quick payment, payment in good funds, no return allowed, no packaging, no shipping fees, no photography required, no listing on the internet, no credit card fees, no special trip to the post office and a consumated sale at your time convenience) are not consistent with the highest sales price. Might the dealer have handled this differently? Certainly, but I would just chalk this one up as a learning experience.
<< <i>At the end of the day that dealer didn't really want the deal and was happy you refused his offer. The offer was made to be refused.
Bingo. If someone presses me for an offer on something I have little to no interest in owning for whatever reason, they'll get an offer that reflects my lack of interest.
I lose patience with the "he sold some of them to me" argument, as if that makes him obligated somehow to buy them back at your numbers. His local market might have changed, his inventory might have changed, heck, for all anyone knows maybe you were his primary customer for these pieces and he now faces having to inventory them for some time before being able to move them. Another thing to consider is that at this time of year B&Ms get a lot of things offered to them (lots of people liquidating various things- pre tax time, holiday bills hitting the mailbox, etc)... this all places a strain on cash flow so he's likely going to be more selective about what he's buying. I know we are. In short, he's not going to want to pay end of the road money for it unless he can flip it quickly- and from reading the story it's fairly evident he isn't a Washington Quarter specialty dealer- so there's your answer imo.
I had a situation not unlike this not so long ago with a customer who bought a couple of foreign pieces from us about a year/year and a half ago... he wanted to liquidate so even though I had a fair amount of them in stock after a recent purchase, he'd been a good repeat customer so I quoted him what I considered a fair number based on current market and what I figured I could now sell the items for (and at a profit to him, I might add.) He got all bent, went off on me about how he bought them from me, whined some more about how he looked at sites X, Y, and Z on the internet and they should be worth $XX more than my ripoff offer. I pointed to the tray that was easily half full of the same coins and offered him his choice at a goodly amount less than what he thought he should have gotten for his two pieces. He whined some more about how he bought them from me and how that should count for something. I replied "It DOES count for something...if you hadn't bought them from me I'd have likely not even made you an offer- because I have a dozen of them here already that I'm not selling".
Sometimes people need to realize that NO is a perfectly acceptable answer to a question... and not to take it personally. JMHO >>
Telephoto, this is a good post IMO. You provided some good insight. This is the type of info I expected, but rarely got, with my OP. I only take issue with one thing. I DID NOT force an offer. Frankly, I would have appreciated an explanation as to why his offer was lower than I expected, or that he had no interest in the coins. That would also have been an education for me. I am not a dealer, I am a consumer. Also, I do not feel that simply because I buy something from someone that they are then obligated to buy it back. My gripe is that the dealer did not enlighten me. He was not OBLIGATED to tell me anything, but if he valued my business a simple explanation of his offer would have gone a LONG WAY!
Again, Thanks for the great post.
What we've got here is failure to communicate.....
<< <i>In my experience and opinion the $350 offer on the group was on the low side, but that is often the compromise that is made for ease of sale and timeliness of good, secure payment. The dealer likely had no retail client base for the coins and knew they would move slowly so he had little reason to inventory the coins. An MS65 or MS66 WQ is generic as the day is long if white and not of a much better date (1932-D, 1932-S, 1934-D, 1935-D, 1936-D, 1936-S or 1937-S). These coins can languish and saok up opportunity costs in terms of dealer liquidity. Certainly, this small group would put no one out of business, but if you keep buying group after group to please client after client then you might find yourself in a bad place. He could alternatively have blown them out to wholesale clients, but this strategy also necessitates low sales prices on the dealer's end so he had to protect himself. Many of your goals (no consignment, quick payment, payment in good funds, no return allowed, no packaging, no shipping fees, no photography required, no listing on the internet, no credit card fees, no special trip to the post office and a consumated sale at your time convenience) are not consistent with the highest sales price. Might the dealer have handled this differently? Certainly, but I would just chalk this one up as a learning experience. >>
Excellent info here too! Thanks Tom.....
Maybe if you get past the kneejerk reactions of many, you can get to some great posts with lots of great insight and info! That is what I am learning from this thread anyway!
What we've got here is failure to communicate.....
Comments
I rarely sell coins from my collection. I simply thought that a B&M was a natural place to go to do some streamlining. They coins weren't dogs as some have implied, they were mostly pc66, I have upgraded my collection and just wanted to put these back out there.....
I have not tried elect[r]onic medium since I do not have the equipment to photograph the coins which is essential for online selling.
My experience was eye-opening, shocking, and discouraging.
If/when I decide to sell my 14th place Registry Set of Washington Quarters I will put a lot more thought into how I accomplish that transaction."
When you buy a coin, you should have an exit strategy in mind---how would you sell the coin to maximize your return (minimize your loss). Many types of coins are not nearly as liquid as collectors would like to think. The dealer recognized this was the case with your quarters, and presumed that he would have to wholesale them to another dealer rather than quickly sell them at retail to another collector, hence the low offer. Spend some time learning about the mechanics of the coin market---it's in your financial interest to do this if you intend to continue buying collector coins.
It is entirely possible to buy nice collector coins, only to wind up with a financial loss because of unfortunate market timing or a poor choice of sales venue (auction vs. local B&M vs. specialty dealer vs.....).
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
I think a lot of posters to this thread really need a
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
Hoard the keys.
At the end of the day that dealer didn't really want the deal and was happy you refused his offer. The offer was made to be refused.
My guess is that you would do a lot better on the BST anyways.
MJ
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Why did you whiz it??
Sorry - couldn't resist.
Agree with Justacommeman - buying and selling is the best way to learn how the game is played.
If you don't like selling to the local B&M, at least maintain the buying relationship for the occasional nice coin they might offer you or for the occasional cherry pick.
Bingo. If someone presses me for an offer on something I have little to no interest in owning for whatever reason, they'll get an offer that reflects my lack of interest.
I lose patience with the "he sold some of them to me" argument, as if that makes him obligated somehow to buy them back at your numbers. His local market might have changed, his inventory might have changed, heck, for all anyone knows maybe you were his primary customer for these pieces and he now faces having to inventory them for some time before being able to move them.
Another thing to consider is that at this time of year B&Ms get a lot of things offered to them (lots of people liquidating various things- pre tax time, holiday bills hitting the mailbox, etc)... this all places a strain on cash flow so he's likely going to be more selective about what he's buying. I know we are. In short, he's not going to want to pay end of the road money for it unless he can flip it quickly- and from reading the story it's fairly evident he isn't a Washington Quarter specialty dealer- so there's your answer imo.
I had a situation not unlike this not so long ago with a customer who bought a couple of foreign pieces from us about a year/year and a half ago... he wanted to liquidate so even though I had a fair amount of them in stock after a recent purchase, he'd been a good repeat customer so I quoted him what I considered a fair number based on current market and what I figured I could now sell the items for (and at a profit to him, I might add.) He got all bent, went off on me about how he bought them from me, whined some more about how he looked at sites X, Y, and Z on the internet and they should be worth $XX more than my ripoff offer. I pointed to the tray that was easily half full of the same coins and offered him his choice at a goodly amount less than what he thought he should have gotten for his two pieces. He whined some more about how he bought them from me and how that should count for something. I replied "It DOES count for something...if you hadn't bought them from me I'd have likely not even made you an offer- because I have a dozen of them here already that I'm not selling".
Sometimes people need to realize that NO is a perfectly acceptable answer to a question... and not to take it personally. JMHO
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
Times change. Markets change. The economy changes.
Years ago when I was agressively collecting Honduras I bid $4,000 on a very rare piece on eBay, and didn't get it. The second underbidder dropped out at $1,000 or so.
I no longer collect Honduras. What is that coin worth today if the winner's collection comes on the market?
"Nice coin, I'd just hold on to it". I believe this is a top pop coin and it still gets no love. I did not "force" any offers from
the dealers.
The dealer was probably just being nice by giving out any offer at all. He was probably aware that the customer (OP) new the greysheet prices, so made an offer just out of courtesy when in his head he was probably thinking (crap, I really don't want these!). That's pretty common in any resale business.
On the other end, the OP would have probably been just as upset and offended if the dealer said "No, I really don't want these crappy things...they won't sell". Seems like the dealer picked the lesser of two evils.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>At the end of the day that dealer didn't really want the deal and was happy you refused his offer. The offer was made to be refused.
Bingo. If someone presses me for an offer on something I have little to no interest in owning for whatever reason, they'll get an offer that reflects my lack of interest.
I lose patience with the "he sold some of them to me" argument, as if that makes him obligated somehow to buy them back at your numbers. His local market might have changed, his inventory might have changed, heck, for all anyone knows maybe you were his primary customer for these pieces and he now faces having to inventory them for some time before being able to move them.
Another thing to consider is that at this time of year B&Ms get a lot of things offered to them (lots of people liquidating various things- pre tax time, holiday bills hitting the mailbox, etc)... this all places a strain on cash flow so he's likely going to be more selective about what he's buying. I know we are. In short, he's not going to want to pay end of the road money for it unless he can flip it quickly- and from reading the story it's fairly evident he isn't a Washington Quarter specialty dealer- so there's your answer imo.
I had a situation not unlike this not so long ago with a customer who bought a couple of foreign pieces from us about a year/year and a half ago... he wanted to liquidate so even though I had a fair amount of them in stock after a recent purchase, he'd been a good repeat customer so I quoted him what I considered a fair number based on current market and what I figured I could now sell the items for (and at a profit to him, I might add.) He got all bent, went off on me about how he bought them from me, whined some more about how he looked at sites X, Y, and Z on the internet and they should be worth $XX more than my ripoff offer. I pointed to the tray that was easily half full of the same coins and offered him his choice at a goodly amount less than what he thought he should have gotten for his two pieces. He whined some more about how he bought them from me and how that should count for something. I replied "It DOES count for something...if you hadn't bought them from me I'd have likely not even made you an offer- because I have a dozen of them here already that I'm not selling".
Sometimes people need to realize that NO is a perfectly acceptable answer to a question... and not to take it personally. JMHO >>
Telephoto, this is a good post IMO. You provided some good insight. This is the type of info I expected, but rarely got, with my OP. I only take issue with one thing. I DID NOT force an offer. Frankly, I would have appreciated an explanation as to why his offer was lower than I expected, or that he had no interest in the coins. That would also have been an education for me. I am not a dealer, I am a consumer. Also, I do not feel that simply because I buy something from someone that they are then obligated to buy it back. My gripe is that the dealer did not enlighten me. He was not OBLIGATED to tell me anything, but if he valued my business a simple explanation of his offer would have gone a LONG WAY!
Again, Thanks for the great post.
Successful BST xactions w/PCcoins, Drunner, Manofcoins, Rampage, docg, Poppee, RobKool, and MichealDixon.
<< <i>In my experience and opinion the $350 offer on the group was on the low side, but that is often the compromise that is made for ease of sale and timeliness of good, secure payment. The dealer likely had no retail client base for the coins and knew they would move slowly so he had little reason to inventory the coins. An MS65 or MS66 WQ is generic as the day is long if white and not of a much better date (1932-D, 1932-S, 1934-D, 1935-D, 1936-D, 1936-S or 1937-S). These coins can languish and saok up opportunity costs in terms of dealer liquidity. Certainly, this small group would put no one out of business, but if you keep buying group after group to please client after client then you might find yourself in a bad place. He could alternatively have blown them out to wholesale clients, but this strategy also necessitates low sales prices on the dealer's end so he had to protect himself. Many of your goals (no consignment, quick payment, payment in good funds, no return allowed, no packaging, no shipping fees, no photography required, no listing on the internet, no credit card fees, no special trip to the post office and a consumated sale at your time convenience) are not consistent with the highest sales price. Might the dealer have handled this differently? Certainly, but I would just chalk this one up as a learning experience. >>
Excellent info here too! Thanks Tom.....
Maybe if you get past the kneejerk reactions of many, you can get to some great posts with lots of great insight and info! That is what I am learning from this thread anyway!
Successful BST xactions w/PCcoins, Drunner, Manofcoins, Rampage, docg, Poppee, RobKool, and MichealDixon.