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rheddenrhedden Posts: 6,632 ✭✭✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum
I just bit on an ebay BIN listing for this beautiful, Unc.-looking 1847 half, which cost me $356 including shipping. The seller is located in the Philipines, so I took a risk with the shipping. The seller looks legit, but I do worry about the package getting lost in transit. How do you think I'll make out? Will the coin be a hairlined POS? Will I even get it? Will it be a MS64 bought for AU53 money? Will it be a deceptive Chinese fake from a genius counterfeiter who knows how to fake carbon spots? The last time I took a gamble like this, I got an Unc. 1872 quarter with original skin for $250; I have a good feeling about this one too. AU58's fetch about $600 to $800, while lower Unc. grades seem to be around $1,100, so I will make out great if I get it and it's not hairlined or messed with. Seller says 3 to 4 weeks for Registered mail, so we will have to wait a bit to find out.


Link to ebay auction


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Comments

  • Billet7Billet7 Posts: 4,923 ✭✭✭
    Looks like a good gamble!
  • bosco5041bosco5041 Posts: 1,303 ✭
    No guts no glory. Will the spots come off with conservation at NCS?
  • DoubleEagle59DoubleEagle59 Posts: 8,377 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I think you're going to do great.

    MS64!!
    "Gold is money, and nothing else" (JP Morgan, 1912)

    "“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)

    "I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
  • commoncents05commoncents05 Posts: 10,096 ✭✭✭
    Surfaces look flat and lackluster. I'm going to guess Unc Details, Cleaned/Altered Surfaces.

    -Paul
    Many Quality coins for sale at http://www.CommonCentsRareCoins.com
  • Billet7Billet7 Posts: 4,923 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Surfaces look flat and lackluster. I'm going to guess Unc Details, Cleaned/Altered Surfaces.

    -Paul >>



    Sadly, even if that's true, I'll bet a quick dip will put it into an MS holder. I'm not a fan of dipping.
  • relicsncoinsrelicsncoins Posts: 8,106 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The surfaces and strike look proof or PL to me.
    Need a Barber Half with ANACS photo certificate. If you have one for sale please PM me. Current Ebay auctions
  • chipper10chipper10 Posts: 326
    My vote is that you'll be happy with the purchase. If I'd have seen it first you would not be getting it in the mail in 3 or 4 weeks.image
  • STONESTONE Posts: 15,275 ✭
    My vote is -> Where is the rim?

    I saw this coin, saw where it was coming from and didnt feel good about it
  • NewParadigmNewParadigm Posts: 1,322
    From Philippines. Questionable, but without conclusion.
  • LindeDadLindeDad Posts: 18,766 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Too many red flags for me. I'll stick with letting a couple of pros look at mine before putting that kind of money in the pot.

    image
    My Current project....https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/mysetregistry/album/160794
  • Billet7Billet7 Posts: 4,923 ✭✭✭
    Not my series...so I can't tell you if it's genuine or not...but if it's counterfeit we're all in a LOT of trouble. That's more than just very well done!
  • rheddenrhedden Posts: 6,632 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The possibility of "filed rim" or "ex-jewelry" is indeed troubling. The rim is thinner than any other 1847 half I have seen in the Heritage archives or elsewhere. If the coin has a smooth edge when I get it, it's going back, obviously. Wouldn't that be a shame?
  • 123cents123cents Posts: 7,178 ✭✭✭
    I have seen a couple of PCGS graded 1847 halves with rims like yours. I would be more concerned about the surfaces. Anyway, if it doesn't look right in hand, use the 7 day return privilege the seller offers.
    image
  • relicsncoinsrelicsncoins Posts: 8,106 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What about a spark erosion counterfiet?
    Need a Barber Half with ANACS photo certificate. If you have one for sale please PM me. Current Ebay auctions
  • rheddenrhedden Posts: 6,632 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What about a spark erosion counterfeit?

    That would suck. Something about the surfaces and the imperfections tells me it's authentic, though. Looks to be a late die state that was polished to the point of being prooflike, judging by the thin stars and thin reverse lettering. That might also explain the thin rim, come to think of it. The small contact marks under light toning, the carbon spots, and the overall appearance of the piece lead me to believe that if it's fake, it's a very old fake that was die-struck.

  • drwstr123drwstr123 Posts: 7,049 ✭✭✭✭✭
    My first reaction was 'Chinese counterfeit', but then again I've not been accused of being overly intelligent.
  • GoldenEyeNumismaticsGoldenEyeNumismatics Posts: 13,187 ✭✭✭
    Is doesn't look real to me.
  • ModernCoinModernCoin Posts: 394
    Good luck rhedden image. Obviously everyone here is rooting for you image
  • guitarwesguitarwes Posts: 9,290 ✭✭✭

    Just to make you feel better, you gots bigger cajones than I do at the moment.
    @ Elite CNC Routing & Woodworks on Facebook. Check out my work.
    Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
  • tightbudgettightbudget Posts: 7,299 ✭✭✭
    I think you've struck out. Look at the date; it just doesn't look right.
  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 29,246 ✭✭✭✭✭
    nice looking coin. although i do not like the color of it, jmo
  • SpkrmakrSpkrmakr Posts: 107 ✭✭✭
    What's a nice girl like that doing in the Philippines? I suspect she migrated from China.....Hope I'm wrong and that you did good!
    Spkrmakr
  • MFHMFH Posts: 11,720 ✭✭✭✭

    It doesn't sit right with me either
    the HALF DOLLAR looks odd.

    I just picked up an AU 58...

    HA's images:

    imageimage

    Messydesk's images:

    image


    image
    image
    Mike Hayes
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !

    New Barber Purchases
  • rheddenrhedden Posts: 6,632 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I still think it is a late die state coin with heavy basining of the die. A good example of the effect was the "small stars" 1838 half dime, which has a different appearance than the normal 1838, which has heavier, blocky stars. This piece seems to have the edges of the stars and lettering polished away to some extent. Of course, that could have been part of the counterfeiting process, too, so we shall find out soon enough. image
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,749 ✭✭✭✭✭
    My first impression is Chinese counterfeit.
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • astroratastrorat Posts: 9,221 ✭✭✭✭✭
    It doesn't look right. I hope I am wrong.
    Numismatist Ordinaire
    See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
  • roadrunnerroadrunner Posts: 28,313 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Amazingly sharp strike which you don't normally see on the fakes. Denticles are bold but at the same time sort of pointy and odd looking.

    I'm not normally used to see the edge reeding so sharp and pronounced from both sides. I'd almost think it was a proof from that feature alone.
    Very strange. If the stars are slightly recut like the others shown, probably a positive sign.

    Barbarous Relic No More, LSCC -GoldSeek--shadow stats--SafeHaven--321gold
  • kazkaz Posts: 9,276 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'm really worried about the rims.
  • coolestcoolest Posts: 2,281 ✭✭✭
    Im a long way from an expert but my first thought was FAKE.

    Please let us know.
  • pursuitoflibertypursuitofliberty Posts: 7,309 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I read the responses first, but my take is also that it is a fake

    I couldn't say exactly why ... rims, letters, etc

    I hope I'm wrong, but would sure like to know either way



    “We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”

    Todd - BHNC #242
  • ManorcourtmanManorcourtman Posts: 8,192 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I say counterfeit also.
  • SUMORADASUMORADA Posts: 4,797 ✭

    Wow.....I don't know anything about these, but did you take a close look at the reverse under the shield???????

    image

    image..........

    image......I could not help myself....image
    coins on ebay
  • rheddenrhedden Posts: 6,632 ✭✭✭✭✭
    LOL, made me say "gulp" for a second there. I am a little more concerned about this purchase than I was this morning because I could not find an image of another 1847 half dollar with thin lettering and rims. This might be a case where a little knowledge was a bad thing for me; knowing how late die states can affect the appearance of stars and lettering on Seated coins may have convinced me to buy something that isn't legit. For now, I will still stick with my original opinion that it's a very late die state of a common WB-101 coin that was struck from heavily polished dies, and sweat it out until it arrives.

  • crypto79crypto79 Posts: 8,623 ✭
    Look how the olive branch is close to the wing on the PCGS one and how far it is on yours. Might be a different die but I would be worried.
  • PreTurbPreTurb Posts: 1,195 ✭✭✭
    ack...
  • DavidLawrenceDavidLawrence Posts: 277 ✭✭
    Doesn't look real to me. Sorry.
    John Feigenbaum
  • ManorcourtmanManorcourtman Posts: 8,192 ✭✭✭✭✭
    For sale again! Not a good sign...Same coin pic
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,749 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>For sale again! Not a good sign...Same coin pic >>



    A good sign for the OP. He must have been able to cancel the sale.
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.

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