Any audit trail for buying or selling US Gold?
reddwing
Posts: 137 ✭✭
Happy New Year!
i am sure that this has been brought up before. My understanding is that if you pay cash for buying US gold bullion there is no paperwork connected with the transaction. Does the same apply if you decide to sell your US Gold bullion? Will a B&M have to record your name and the size of the transaction?
i am sure that this has been brought up before. My understanding is that if you pay cash for buying US gold bullion there is no paperwork connected with the transaction. Does the same apply if you decide to sell your US Gold bullion? Will a B&M have to record your name and the size of the transaction?
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Many members on this forum that now it cannot fit in my signature. Please ask for entire list.
I would not assume any transaction to be under the radar if any of your personal information is collected or if an account with a financial institution is involved in the transaction.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>I would not assume any transaction to be under the radar if any of your personal information is collected or if an account with a financial institution is involved in the transaction. >>
I really like this advice. The converse is also true; transactions where no personal information is transferred never happened.
Many members on this forum that now it cannot fit in my signature. Please ask for entire list.
<< <i>Derryb, at the post office here where I am at, they asked for personal information when money orders totalling 3k in one transaction was made. Simply easier to go in get a 2000 m.o, walk out and then go out and come back in again and get another one for 1000. >>
Three grand cutoff for MO's.... is SOP for USPS to ask for ID now when Buying.... and any amount on redemption as they put your drivers lic # on all redemptions. Also, USPS has facial recognition cameras. hint hint.
And remember, just asking the question at a financial institution, "What constitutes behaviour that you, Mr. Banker need to report?" is considered to be 'suspicious behaviour' ---- so don't ask the question.
have a happy new year.
As others have said, $3k is it for 1 purchase. So what do you do? Tell the Clerk that you want to do sepreate transactions. Works every time.
Regarding redeeming a postal m.o. at the P.O. of any significant value, that is not going to happen. I've asked for one for $425 to be cashed and they always give me the "I don't have that much in my drawer" line. So I ask if it could be done by having someone get into their "bank" (money available to them on site in the event they need change), and they will not do that either. I've tried at all 3 local P.O.'s and they just wont do it.
I have yet to be able to cash one for more than $250 at any local P.O.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Latest postal money order regulations courtesy of google
1.0 Issuing Money Orders
1.1Availability
Domestic money orders may be purchased from:
a. All post offices, branches, and stations in the United States and its territories and possessions.
b. Money order facilities for members of the U.S. Armed Forces.
c. Rural route carriers and authorized highway contract route carriers. A customer fills out Form 6387 (available from the carrier) and gives it and the payment to the carrier. Unless the customer provides a preaddressed envelope and pays postage and any required fees for mailing, the carrier delivers the money order on the next trip.
1.2Purchase Restrictions
A postal customer may buy multiple money orders at the same time, in the same or differing amounts, subject to these restrictions:
a. The maximum amount of any single money order is $1,000.
b. Without exception, no customer may buy money orders on any 1 day whose total value exceeds $10,000. This daily limit applies regardless of the number of visits made by a customer to one or more postal facilities.
c. Any customer whose daily total of purchased money orders is from $3,000 to $10,000 must also complete Form 8105-A and show identification bearing the purchaser’s photograph, name, and address.
1.3Purchase Method
Money orders must be paid for in one of these ways:
a. In U.S. currency and coins (in any amount).
b. With established traveler’s checks payable in U.S. dollars if the purchase is for at least 50% of the value of the traveler’s checks.
c. With ATM/debit cards at locations approved by USPS Corporate Treasury where the customer’s personal identification number must be entered on a keypad connected to a credit/debit terminal.
1.4Purchaser
The purchaser must complete the money order and customer’s receipt by filling in the names and addresses of the payee and purchaser. Money orders must be made payable to a single identifiable party, which can be the purchaser. The USPS does not guarantee a 100% refund on a stolen money order if the customer’s receipt is not presented with the claim for refund.
1.5Replacement
The USPS replaces without charge a defective money order or one that is spoiled during imprinting or customer completion if the customer returns the negotiable portion of the money order and the matching customer receipt.
2.0 Cashing Money Orders
2.1Validity and Value
Domestic money orders are paid regardless of the time passed since their issue. Money orders are not interest-bearing instruments; they are paid only in the exact amount imprinted up to the authorized maximum amount. USPS records serve as the basis for adjudicating claims for payment of money orders.
2.2Redemption
All U.S. money orders, including military, may be cashed at any U.S. post office or bank. Subject to funds availability, money orders may be cashed by rural carriers.
2.3Identification
When presenting a money order for payment, the customer seeking payment must sign in the presence of a USPS employee. If the customer is not known to the employee, suitable identification can be required. The USPS may refuse payment on any money order when the identity of the customer seeking payment is not proved to the satisfaction of the employee.
2.4Acceptable Signature
The paying post office may accept any signature of the payee, purchaser, or endorsee that is not different from the name shown on the money order, subject to these conditions:
a. A customer who cannot write may sign by using a mark, if a witness (who may not be a USPS employee) is present at the time of cashing.
b. All money orders payable to a business firm, an organization, society, institution, or government agency must be signed in the name of the organization by an authorized representative (who must also sign with his or her own name and organizational title). Evidence of the representative’s authority may be required.
c. If the money order is drawn in favor of an official by name and presented by a successor, the successor must sign accordingly (e.g., “William Jones, treasurer, successor to George Thompson”).
d. Use of a title (e.g., Mrs., M.D.) is not required in signing a money order for payment, whether such title is used on the face of the money order.
e. A stamped signature is an acceptable endorsement on a money order drawn in favor of a firm, corporation, association, society, or individual, when the money order is presented to a bank for payment. A post office accepts a stamped signature only if an agreement is on file specifying the individual responsible for the correctness of such payments.
2.5More Than One Payee
A money order completed by the purchaser to show more than one firm or person as payee is paid to either payee if the conjunction “or” is used to connect the payees. If no conjunction is used, or if the conjunction “and” is used to connect the payees, then all the listed payees must endorse the money order.
2.6Payment to Another Party
Money orders may be paid to another party under these conditions:
a. Only the payee of a money order may endorse it to any other person or firm. A person with power of attorney may cash money orders for a payee who gave the person that authority. A copy of the power of attorney must be filed at the office of payment. A payee may file a separate written order with the post office authorizing payment to another person. The person must be designated by name as the one to receive payment.
b. When a payee (e.g., an individual or firm) makes an assignment and intends that money orders be paid to the assigned person, the payee must file a copy of a power of attorney or a written order with the USPS. The person who is designated to receive payment must sign the money order and write below the signature the capacity in which he or she acts.
c. A money order may be paid to an executor or court-appointed administrator of the estate of the deceased person who was entitled to payment, provided that a copy of the appointment as executor or administrator is filed with the local postmaster. Such payments are made pursuant to the law of the state in which the deceased was a resident.
d. Money orders are paid to the legal representative of a firm, association, or company that has ceased to exist. Appropriate documents proving legal representation must be provided to the USPS.
e. Money orders are not issued or paid to a ward when declared incompetent by a court. They are paid only to the committee, guardian, or other duly authorized person responsible for the ward. Appropriate proof of authority must be provided to the USPS.
f. A money order payable to a minor may be paid to the father or mother as natural guardian, unless prohibited by court order. Proof of parenthood may be required.
2.7Second Endorsement
A money order with more than one endorsement is invalid, except under 2.5.
2.8COD Parcel
No payment is made when a money order is issued in return for a COD parcel, and is presented by the addressee (purchaser), and the money order is not endorsed by the payee (shipper) or the payee has not authorized payment to the purchaser by written approval.
2.9Payment Inquiry
A purchaser, payee, or endorsee may, at any time, inquire about payment of a domestic money order by completing, signing, and filing Form 6401 and paying the appropriate fee; a separate form and fee are required for each money order. The fee is not required if Form 6401 is filed by a bank, other financial institution, government agency that processes money orders directly with the Federal Reserve Bank, or postal official engaged in official USPS business.
3.0 Federal Reserve System
3.1General
All money orders are forwarded through the Federal Reserve Banking System, to which commercial banks have access. For this standard:
a. Money order means a U.S. Postal Money Order.
b. Federal Reserve Bank means a Federal Reserve Bank or branch thereof that presents a money order for payment by the postmaster general.
c. Presenting bank means a bank that presents a money order to and receives credit for the money order from a Federal Reserve Bank.
d. Reclamation means the action taken by the postmaster general to obtain refund of the amounts of paid money orders.
e. Examination includes examination of money orders for indicia of theft, forged endorsements, forged signatures or initials of issuing employees, raised amounts, and other material defects by electronic methods and visual inspection for defects that cannot be discovered electronically.
f. Stolen money order means a U.S. Postal Money Order stolen from a post office, classified or contract station or branch, or USPS employee before it is officially issued by the post office, classified or contract station or branch, or by a USPS employee discharging his or her official duties.
3.2Payment
The postmaster general has the usual right of a drawee to examine money orders presented for payment by banks through the Federal Reserve System and to refuse payment of money orders, and has a reasonable time after presentation to make each examination. Provisional credit is given to the Federal Reserve Bank when it furnishes the money orders for payment by the postmaster general. Money orders are deemed paid only after examination is completed, subject to the postmaster general’s right to make reclamation under 3.4.
3.3Endorsement
The presenting bank and the endorser of a money order presented for payment are deemed to guarantee to the postmaster general that all prior endorsements are genuine, whether an express guarantee to that effect is placed on the money order. When an endorsement is made by a person other than the payee personally, the presenting bank and the endorser are deemed to guarantee to the postmaster general, in addition to other warranties, that the person who so endorsed had capacity and authority to endorse the money order for the payee.
3.4Reclamation
The postmaster general has the right to demand refund from the presenting bank of the amount of a paid money order if, after payment, the money order is found to be stolen, or to have a forged or unauthorized endorsement, or to contain any material defect or alteration not discovered on examination. Such right includes, but is not limited to, the right to make reclamation of the amount by which a genuine money order with a proper and authorized endorsement has been raised. Such right must be exercised within a reasonable time after the postmaster general discovers that the money order is stolen, bears a forged or unauthorized endorsement, or is otherwise defective. If refund is not made by the presenting bank within 60 days after demand, the postmaster general takes such actions as may be necessary to protect the interests of the United States.
<< <i>PO will cash any USPS money order any where any time. >>
If they have the cash on hand.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
Just about any coin dealer in Southern CAL will gladly take your 5k and sell you what you want. They are very accomodating about taking your money. If you don't want to give them your name, that's OK too.
Now selling is another thing. In CAL, they will most times want your I.D. to satisfy local/state laws on second hand sales. Unless you are known and then things can slide. Over time, you can bet that the selling side will get more involved.
<< <i>
<< <i>PO will cash any USPS money order any where any time. >>
If they have the cash on hand. >>
Probably best to notify them in advance so that they have the money.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>PO will cash any USPS money order any where any time. >>
Yup. Many years ago I broke down in Reno. Broke. Bank wouldn't cash a check. Discovered I had a USPS MO in my wallet ( payable to another party but returned to me). No problem cashing and receiving full value. Took sweetie gambling in celebration and she hit medium-big jackpot. God bless the USPS.