There's a new Grader of Death in town...

Big80s

I just got back the worst submission results I've seen since my first few submissions to PSA. I know there are many theories on these boards regarding being able to ID a particular grader through the Cert #, but if any of those theories are true - beware of Grader #194. He's a bad man.

bking

I don't buy the 3-digit prefix = grader theory, but my most recent subs (all prefixed 194) WERE odd. I got some great grades here and there. but many were low based on how much scrutiny I put into this sub, and odder still I didn't get ANY half point grades in spite of my centering fetish.

WalterSobchak

<< <i>.......and odder still I didn't get ANY half point grades in spite of my centering fetish. >>

Big80s

bking - if it makes you feel any better - I got a bunch of half grades from this submission. Unfornately they were in the form of 3.5's and 4.5's. I don't know that I've ever felt physically ill when seeing sub results for the first time - but this time I definitely wanted to barf.

ThoseBackPages

what cards are we talking?

bking

<< <i>what cards are we talking? >>



Mine were 1965-1971. I'm hoping his were older than that, or else those grades would REALLY, REALLY suck.

Big80s

Sports cards.

ThoseBackPages

<< <i>Sports cards. >>



T-206's?

Big80s

My cards varied from '49 Bowman baseball to '71 baseball. As well as some '56 Topps Football.

The Grader really hated my '49 Bowmans and my '56 Topps Football in particular. It was a bloodbath.

tigerdean

I have to ask. When was this sub received by PSA??????????

Big80s

Received: 10/24/11
Popped: 10/27/11

On a positive note - it was a quick turnaround.

Big80s

I should also add - I had a single card submission pop on Monday (same 3-number prefix as this new sub), and the grade was so bad I called PSA and paid for an immediate review before they had a chance to mail it out.

itzagoner

ah. double espressos being served this week. impairs the vision when you shake.

blurry cards automatically drop two grades. sorry.

tigerdean

Yes, Imagine that. Our group sub was received several days earlier and still has not popped. Can you say SUCK???????????

Big80s

<< <i>ah. double espressos being served this week. impairs the vision when you shake.

blurry cards automatically drop two grades. sorry. >>



This would explain a lot. These espressos are going to cost me a boatload in review fees!

uyu906

What happened with the immediate review? Did the grade improve?



<< <i>I should also add - I had a single card submission pop on Monday (same 3-number prefix as this new sub), and the grade was so bad I called PSA and paid for an immediate review before they had a chance to mail it out. >>

Big80s

I'm still waiting on the immediate review. They have to treat it as a brand new submission (without charging for new shipping fees).

But the card received a PSA 5, and should be a 7 or 8. It's a big card for me, so I was more than happy to pay for a second opinion.

ThoseBackPages

<< <i>I'm still waiting on the immediate review. They have to treat it as a brand new submission (without charging for new shipping fees).

But the card received a PSA 5, and should be a 7 or 8. It's a big card for me, so I was more than happy to pay for a second opinion. >>



sounds like a missed wrinkle

handyman

Post the results if you can.

OAKESY25

i BET YOU IT WAS PRINTED ON BAD PAPER.. and when you look at it in the light it looks like wrinkles

Big80s

<< <i>

sounds like a missed wrinkle >>



Here's the card that I asked to be immediately reviewed...



I definitely didn't see a wrinkle or a reason for it to be a PSA 5.

handyman

is that a dent to the left of his head?

fiveniner

If you were to use the first 3 nimbers of the certification then 194 is so inconsistent with his or her grading as my 51 bowman football left me quite shocked at some of the grades.I just recieved my 57 topps football back and on each box there is a # 45505 and the certification #s start with 194 however I have to admit the grading was much more consistent with maybe a few that I would question.Going in I knew that I would get several OC's and ST's in which I did but the cards otherwise were of high gloss and sharp corners.I am one that can not stand more than a bit of corner ware at best.

Big80s

<< <i>is that a dent to the left of his head? >>



It's not a dent, but it is a spot on the card. It's the only real flaw I could find, other than the centering on the reverse. Not that it matters to the grader, but the card is 100 years old.

Indy78

From what I've seen, the first three numbers are specific to a period of time not a specific grader. The first three numbers of the certs switched from the 180's to the 190's about 3-4 weeks ago after having been in the 180's since about the beginning of this year. Looking back further, during the summer and fall of 2010, the first three numbers were.....you guessed it..... in the 170's.

I've been submitting 75 mini's every few months for close to two years now. What I've observed is that during the time period when the certs were in the 170's, I was getting PSA 8's regularly on 75 mini's with borderline PSA 7/8 centering. During the time period when the certs were in the 180's (January through September 2011), I couldn't consistently get an 8 on a 75 mini with borderline 7/8 centering. Then all of sudden, when the certs on the mini's changed to the 190's a few weeks back, I'm back to regularly getting 8's on borderline cards (i.e., back to more reasonable/less stringent grading). In addition, all of sudden, I'm seeing 75 mini's on eBay with borderline 7/8 centering getting 8's; they all have certs with the first 3 numbers in the 190's.

Based on these observations, I'm guessing that they rotate the types of cards assigned to the graders on a schedule consistent with the first three digits of the cert, probably to prevent burnout and build their expertise with different cards for a period of time for accuracy/efficiency. It's just a WAG, but whoever was consistently grading 75 mini's when the certs were in the 180's is probably not grading them now and is assigned to a different issue. The so called "grader(s) of death" seem to me to have moved away from the mini's to different card types.

handyman

the non dent spot seems to show up on the back as well .
Not trying to say your card is bad. Just trying to find what they might have thought made this a 5 I guess.

swartz1

Nice card...

handyman

:From what I've seen, the first three numbers are specific to a period of time not a specific grader. The first three numbers of the certs switched from the 180's to the 190's about 3-4 weeks ago after having been in the 180's since about the beginning of this year. Looking back further, during the summer and fall of 2010, the first three numbers were.....you guessed it..... in the 170's.

I've been submitting 75 mini's every few months for close to two years now. What I've observed is that during the time period when the certs were in the 170's, I was getting PSA 8's regularly on 75 mini's with borderline PSA 7/8 centering. During the time period when the certs were in the 180's (January through September 2011), I couldn't consistently get an 8 on a 75 mini with borderline 7/8 centering. Then all of sudden, when the certs on the mini's changed to the 190's a few weeks back, I'm back to regularly getting 8's on borderline cards (i.e., back to more reasonable/less stringent grading). In addition, all of sudden, I'm seeing 75 mini's on eBay with borderline 7/8 centering getting 8's; they all have certs with the first 3 numbers in the 190's.

Based on these observations, I'm guessing that they rotate the types of cards assigned to the graders on a schedule consistent with the first three digits of the cert, probably to prevent burnout and build their expertise with different cards for a period of time for accuracy/efficiency. It's just a WAG, but whoever was consistently grading 75 mini's when the certs were in the 180's is probably not grading them now and is assigned to a different issue. The so called "grader(s) of death" seem to me to have moved away from the mini's to different card types. "

Interesting theory. But every sub I have done never just has one type of issue. It will be Tobacco all the way to today. Sometimes I dont even put them in any order. So I dont see how they could give a specific type card to certain graders. I can see this maybe on service levels to keep some type of control. But what about the bulk subs.

Big80s

<< <i>the non dent spot seems to show up on the back as well .
Not trying to say your card is bad. Just trying to find what they might have thought made this a 5 I guess. >>



I agree w/ your observation, but would a dent drop this card to a PSA 5? I looked it over well, but I've certainly missed flaws before.

Indy78

Interesting theory. But every sub I have done never just has one type of issue. It will be Tobacco all the way to today. Sometimes I dont even put them in any order. So I dont see how they could give a specific type card to certain graders. I can see this maybe on service levels to keep some type of control. But what about the bulk subs.

Yep, good point. I just sub mini's, nothing else, so I'm not sure how it works with multiple issue types. I'd be curious to hear if some who have multiple card issues in one sub notice that certain of the issues are graded more stringently then the others, which could suggest that they split the sub somehow.

I do remember reading on here n occasion that one usually gets a faster turnaround time if they submit just one issue type within their sub, which would suggest, perhaps, that subs with one issue are graded by one grader (and thus turnaround quick) and subs with multiple issues get passed around to different graders assigned to grade just one or two issues within the sub.

Again, I don't have enough data by myself to prove anything, so I'm just throwing this out there to see if collectively, we can come up with some pattern that would help us in choosing which cards to grade and when to grade them to get the best results.

Big80s

<< <i>Interesting theory. But every sub I have done never just has one type of issue. It will be Tobacco all the way to today. Sometimes I dont even put them in any order. So I dont see how they could give a specific type card to certain graders. I can see this maybe on service levels to keep some type of control. But what about the bulk subs.

Yep, good point. I just sub mini's, nothing else, so I'm not sure how it works with multiple issue types. I'd be curious to hear if some who have multiple card issues in one sub notice that certain of the issues are graded more stringently then the others, which could suggest that they split the sub somehow.

I do remember reading on here n occasion that one usually gets a faster turnaround time if they submit just one issue type within their sub, which would suggest, perhaps, that subs with one issue are graded by one grader (and thus turnaround quick) and subs with multiple issues get passed around to different graders assigned to grade just one or two issues within the sub.

Again, I don't have enough data by myself to prove anything, so I'm just throwing this out there to see if collectively, we can come up with some pattern that would help us in choosing which cards to grade and when to grade them to get the best results. >>




This particular sub had several 56 cards, several different years ('49 to '71) and two different spot. But I will say this - the '49 Bowman baseball & the '56 Topps Football were hit the hardest.

handyman

Even if that card doesnt grade higher than a 5 it will still sell for a 6 grade price.

Big80s

<< <i>Even if that card doesnt grade higher than a 5 it will still sell for a 6 grade price. >>



Thank you. I'm still hoping for a 7 on this card. It's so tough to find in this sort of condition.

Sportsamerica

<< <i>

<< <i>the non dent spot seems to show up on the back as well .
Not trying to say your card is bad. Just trying to find what they might have thought made this a 5 I guess. >>



I agree w/ your observation, but would a dent drop this card to a PSA 5? I looked it over well, but I've certainly missed flaws before. >>



Yes dents go to a five right away. (from my subs)

smtjoy

I just got a 40 card tallboy exhibit sub back and it has to be my worst sub in 10 years. Overall, 70% of my grades were lower than expected, 28% were the same and 2% (1 card came in higher). I was real lucky in that the one card that went higher was the best card in the sub. That said the fact that I am having to crack and resubmit 11 cards from it just makes me sick. Most of the cards are for resale so I have little choice but to resubmit. Of the other 21, 8 are for my registry sets and I will just leave the grades as is and the other 12 are not worth the resubmit fees so I will just sell for a loss.

I am part of a group sub that has me damn worried now as well as I have another bunch ready to sub and might just hold off.

Ohh and the prefix on the cards was #195.

I hope others have more luck with their subs.

KbKards

Looks like a wrinkle at bottom right corner of cigar box and hint of it transferred to front. Nice 56's in low grade holders will usually have wrinkles at the center left and right edges on the reverse. You most likely didn't see them because you didn't look.