What is today's reality regarding 90% silver coins and the melting of same?

SanctionII

With the continued rise in the spot price of silver, the line between what 90% silver coins are "bullion value" items worth only the value of their silver and what 90% silver coins still have "numismatic value" above the value of their silver keeps changing. More 90% silver coins are on the "bullion" side of the line and less are on the "numismatic value" side of the line.

What is really happening in today's market? As yo see it, where is the line currently located?

For example, are any heavily worn Seated Liberty or earlier coins on the "bullion value" side of the line and thus being melted? Same question for Barber coins and other more recent series of 90% silver coins. I assume that in my area of interest, Cameo and DCAM Proof and SMS Coins from 1950-1970, some of the more common Cameos coins that are out there (i.e. 1963 and 1964 dimes, quarters and halves) may be on the bullion value side of the line; while DCAM examples of these same coins are still on the "numismatic value" side of the line.

Also, are any slabbed 90% silver coins being cracked out and tossed on junk silver bags headed for smelters (or if not smelters, then into the "river of silver" that just flows from one buyer to another in an endless stream that never makes it to a smelter?

llafoe

I've always wondered how many are actually making it to the smelter. I suspect the "river of silver" rivals the Mississippi River at the moment.

mrdq

I know for a fact that in only ONE city in the midwest a coin dealer has sent a few HUNDRED THOUSAND face value to the smelter. All of it xf and below. He doesn't send off seated stuff (yet) unless it's G / AG. I'm guessing there's been literally tons melted that was formerly in shoeboxes and mini collections / hoards. I've melted 2k face myself.

ModCrewman

I'd have a hard time thinking any slabbed silver is getting cracked to head to the melting pot. With half dollars worth $14...you'd have had to buy those coins VERY cheaply in order to be worth more out of the plastic than in...I'd think the same would hold true of silver dollars whose melt is currently just over $30 each...though you could see it happening more quickly for those.

TheBigB

I have been offered barber halves as 90% recently. When the gap between 90 and numismatic gets close they go in the 90 bucket, it's just easier that way. I assume 90% is still desirable enough not to melt.

cladking

<< <i>With the continued rise in the spot price of silver, the line between what 90% silver coins are "bullion value" items worth only the value of their silver and what 90% silver coins still have "numismatic value" above the value of their silver keeps changing. More 90% silver coins are on the "bullion" side of the line and less are on the "numismatic value" side of the line.

What is really happening in today's market? As yo see it, where is the line currently located?

For example, are any heavily worn Seated Liberty or earlier coins on the "bullion value" side of the line and thus being melted? Same question for Barber coins and other more recent series of 90% silver coins. I assume that in my area of interest, Cameo and DCAM Proof and SMS Coins from 1950-1970, some of the more common Cameos coins that are out there (i.e. 1963 and 1964 dimes, quarters and halves) may be on the bullion value side of the line; while DCAM examples of these same coins are still on the "numismatic value" side of the line.

Also, are any slabbed 90% silver coins being cracked out and tossed on junk silver bags headed for smelters (or if not smelters, then into the "river of silver" that just flows from one buyer to another in an endless stream that never makes it to a smelter? >>




People should have been trading out of heavily worn barbers a long time ago for AU '64
half dollars and the like. Everything worth less than about $42 per ounce is headed to
the melting pot and the only thing that can stop it is silver prices to come down. A lot of
"junk" is going to get melted over the next few years and if the price of silver continues
up then ever nicer stuff will hit the pot. This is an opportunity for longs to get out of junk
and trade up for nicer coins.

The kind of stuff that tends to accumulate in dealer inventory is the first stuff getting de-
stroyed. This means common Franklin Mint, low grade "collector" coins like VG 1928 quar-
ters, proof and mint sets, and modern commems. Some of this material will be destroyed
in large percentages because only small percentages are in collections.

Pay attention to what's getting shipped out as bullion and try to save the best of it. Fu-
ture collectors are depending on us. We already let them down with moderns so try to
at least save some of the better old coins.

SanctionII

Does anyone have any idea about what has happened, is happening, or is likely to happen with the silver coins in 1950-1964 proof sets and in with the silver coins in 1947-1964 mint sets [ungraded and sitting in OGP or aftermarket holders]?

I wonder how many raw 90% silver Cameo proofs were melted or otherwise lost [i.e. cut out and dumped into buckets of 90% silver where they were ruined] in 1979-80; and how many of these coins are being lost now?

paladin

I suspect a lot of the "art silver" will be disappearing. Really a shame, too, as some of it is exquisitely done.

questor54

<< <i>I suspect a lot of the "art silver" will be disappearing. Really a shame, too, as some of it is exquisitely done. >>



Too true. I just sold a couple of hundred ounces of 'art bars' etc. going back to the 1970s, for melt. I have more, but I don't think the rise is over yet.

291fifth

<< <i>I suspect a lot of the "art silver" will be disappearing. Really a shame, too, as some of it is exquisitely done. >>



Unfortunately, the secondary market for this type of material just never developed. The melting pot beckons.

cladking

<< <i>Does anyone have any idea about what has happened, is happening, or is likely to happen with the silver coins in 1950-1964 proof sets and in with the silver coins in 1947-1964 mint sets [ungraded and sitting in OGP or aftermarket holders]?

I wonder how many raw 90% silver Cameo proofs were melted or otherwise lost [i.e. cut out and dumped into buckets of 90% silver where they were ruined] in 1979-80; and how many of these coins are being lost now? >>




Things that are already valuable are pretty safe. People aren't going to scrap out very
many truly "unopened" proof sets. They'll simply check them first for varieties and gems.

Most of the singles from old sets are in collections where they are relatively safe at least
in the short term. The stuff being destroyed is the stuff without a home. People bring coins
that have gone up a lot to the coin shop to get the value of the metal and then much of
the money will go to buy coins. But they aren't going to buy junk, they're going to mostly
be buying the orts of coins that are "hot" which means rare and/ or high quality. This will
keep the prices of many collectible coins strong for the current time.

coolest

I think even MS63 common date walkers are now on the melt list

TwoSides2aCoin

There's a bounty on silver. But the real question is : "How many pennies are being "recycled" inside copper tubing" ?
... said that because people come into the shop and ask if I will buy 1959 to 1982 cents. I tell them I will pay 2% more than the Coinstar machine. I hope it's not illegal to recycle sense if that makes any cents.

roadrunner

Art Silver:

My local dealer just got in a rather nice looking 1976 Franklin Mint Bicentennial statehood set in sterling silver. The 50 coins/rounds weighed in at 49.5 oz net of equiv. .999 silver.
But still all going to the melting pot (and the holders and album into the waste basket) as there is no demand for sterling rounds, no matter how nicely done. These were all nice gem cameo proofs with interesting designs. No one cares.

roadrunner

OPA

<< <i>

<< <i>I suspect a lot of the "art silver" will be disappearing. Really a shame, too, as some of it is exquisitely done. >>



Unfortunately, the secondary market for this type of material just never developed. The melting pot beckons. >>



Really? Have you checked eBay for some of the ridiculous prices that they are fetching? Even common bars & 1 oz .999 silver is selling for $3-$4 above spot. Most silver 1 oz Art Bars are now closer to $$7-$10 above spot.

jessewvu

I am thinking about getting a smelter and making some silver bars out of the coins. Should be a lot of fun.

jdimmick

My take:

lots of stuff is going to the smelter:

with the ever increasing prices of bullion, more and more stuff is going for melt, rather than trying to sell it in the store for example:

Most barber halves and more so quarters, even in VG I melt em. Why waste time trying to get an extra buck or so and have them linger in the basket.
barber dimes in fine, now going as well.
Pratically all of the walkers in low grade go excpet for the 16's , 21's, etc Lately I have even been tossing in XF Au later dates , and beleive it or not any cleaned /worn 21-s's, 38-d's etc
Silver proof sets , all of the modern silver except for the 99, and all of the 60-64 sets. I keep 1 back up in the store, the rest gone!
Modern commems by the truckload, unless they list for around 35.00 of more greysheet, they go. Sometimes I will keep a few popular ones just to help fill up the counters.
Earlier commem's BTW, wash carv, columbian , even lately stone mountain in lower grades.

many many more

and if silver does reach 50, I prartically melt the entire store

jdimmick

also I might add:

I am also tossing any common date seated coins lower than g or problem coins in the pot as well.

and to comment on the above, i have broken countless slabs of common grade proof franklin halves, proof wash quarters, AU walkers, etc to melt.

Most all world sterling silver coin and candian 80 melt, I have tossed countless canadian Proof like sets, and rolls to the melt pile

Overdate

If the melting keeps up at the current rate, there will come a time when the supply of 90% silver is pretty much gone. All that will be left is "survivalist" hoards and a diminishing number of old-time collections.

As the price of silver continues rising, collecting silver coins by date and mint mark will become affordable only to the affluent, much like collecting gold coins by date and mint mark is today. For example, an ordinary circulated set of Franklin halves already melts at nearly $500. How many new collectors will buy a set at that price, especially in today's economy?

Type collecting will become the norm for silver, just as it is now for gold.

OPA

<< <i>If the melting keeps up at the current rate, there will come a time when the supply of 90% silver is pretty much gone. All that will be left is "survivalist" hoards and a diminishing number of old-time collections.

As the price of silver continues rising, collecting silver coins by date and mint mark will become affordable only to the affluent, much like collecting gold coins by date and mint mark is today. For example, an ordinary circulated set of Franklin halves already melts at nearly $500. How many new collectors will buy a set at that price, especially in today's economy?

Type collecting will become the norm for silver, just as it is now for gold. >>



The same was said in 1980 when silver hit $50 and tons of 90% silver survived. Only time will tell.

secondrepublic

There is no need to melt 90%... not saying it doesn't happen sometimes... but there's plenty of demand for it (unlike Franklin Mint bars, etc.). More likely is that it comes in the store and is sold right back out.

TwoSides2aCoin

Question : "Why melt silver quarters when one has enough value to purchase 2 gallons of gas ? "

tyler267

Is 40% being melted in large quantities?

Seems like 40% halves are trading at a steep discount to melt, I know they are harder to refine than 90%, but are the refining costs that much higher for 40% vs 90%.

The discount seems odd to me, but I am sure there is a logical reason.