Numismatic Cancer: "Counterfeit collector coins from China show up in Port Angeles, WA"

Goldbully

Counterfeit collector coins from China show up in Port Angeles

Counterfeit collector coins from China show up in Port Angeles

By Rob Ollikainen
Peninsula Daily News

PORT ANGELES -- Authorities are warning businesses and individuals who want to buy and collect old coins to be on the lookout for counterfeit U.S. coins.

On Feb. 3, a Port Angeles business paid a person about $20 each for more than 20 counterfeit U.S. Morgan silver dollars that were supposedly from a century ago.

Port Angeles police would not identify the business or provide more details because of the ongoing investigation.

Police Officer Duane Benedict said "it's absolutely amazing" how easy it is to buy similar coins on the Internet.

"China is making these things by the thousands," Benedict said.

"We want to make sure that the public is aware that these things are available on the Internet."

Several of the fake coins that were sold to the Port Angeles business would have been worth more than $1,500 had they been real, Benedict said.

All were in good condition, he added.

Port Angeles police advise the public to be suspicious if someone has a large quantity of valuable-looking coins.

Police said the counterfeits look very real and, if not checked properly, can easily pass as legal tender.

A strong magnet will detect small amounts of iron in counterfeit U.S. coins.

"If the coin has even a little bit of attraction to the magnet, then it is a fake," Benedict said.

Canada uses steel coins, so the magnet test won't work on them, he said.

"Use caution if someone brings in a lot of coins to buy something, and look them over carefully," Benedict said in a statement.

"There are many different types of coins out there that are collectable for whatever reason, and they have to be represented as a replica or a representative of some event.

"They cannot be used or represented as legal tender."

PDN Link

edited to add: Put Russ on the case.....he works in the Kent, WA area!!!

MsMorrisine

how strong is strong?

dsessom

I'm no professional numismatist and not an expert on detecting counterfiets but those are screaming "FAKE". The reeding is wrong, the date looks odd, and the finish is off (they look cast). There are some good Chinese fakes, but those aren't.

messydesk

Third coin from the left has a CC on it. If that was a handful of fake BU 89-CCs, then saying $1500 a coin is off by an order of magnitude. Good that this made mainstream news. Hopefully something bad and high profile happens to the importer. I'm under the impression that the business wasn't soliciting the seller for counterfeits, but that the seller approached the business.

roadrunner

From some of the fake Morgans posted here, that date logotype is pretty darn decent. The real clue is that perfect looking untoned Morgans usually don't show up in quantity, especially the same date, and especially 1889-cc's. These aren't the distorted looking pieces of junk that I typically see coming out of China. But then again looking at an image upside down is not optimum.

roadrunner

tjc2120

Does not matter - they are round and shiney and would pass to most anyone who collects old things and is not current on numismatic topics.

Glad to see this is in mainstream news. Should be screaming in the headlines same as if boatloads of fake $100 FRNs were coming into Port Angeles.

LindeDad

Reading the article I got the impression the pawn shop bought the CC Morgan's for bullion price then realized they got taken with fakes.

Res

So this "business" paid 20 bucks each for "$1500" coins. Now that's a rip.

I guess I should add - Or would have been.

airplanenut

<< <i>So this "business" paid 20 bucks each for "$1500" coins. Now that's a rip.

I guess I should add - Or would have been. >>

That's what I was thinking... while I don't condone these counterfeits by any stretch, if the buyer was in fact a dealer of any sort, this result is karma.

I wonder if the coins just happened to show up in Port Angeles, or if there's a suspected smuggling route (likely from Canada) there. For anyone who doesn't know the geography, Port Angeles is a quick ferry ride from Vancouver Island, BC, and lies as the northernmost part of the Olympic Peninsula. I can attest to its having a nice little airport, too

messydesk

<< <i>Reading the article I got the impression the pawn shop bought the CC Morgan's for bullion price then realized they got taken with fakes. >>


If that's the case, then karma just ripped the pawn shop owner (assuming the business referred to in the article is indeed a pawn shop) a new one.

johnny9434

it never ceases

MsMorrisine

who's to say the dealer didn't know what they were doing buying counterfeits???

LanLord

Those would make awesome poker chips!

Unknown

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leothelyon

"We want to make sure that the public is aware that these things are available on the Internet."

Whoever bought those "things" (now, if that doesn't ring a bell ) likely tried to sell them to someone who recognized they were no good.


Leo

mrearlygold

I spoke with a corporate investigator for Citi today on unrelated subject who told me she would rather deal with Russia or even Nigeria when it comes to scams. That the chinese government offers NO ASSISTANCE whatsoever when it comes to fraud etc.

coindeuce

If I believed reporter Ollikainen's claim that Canadian coins were made of steel, I might just deserve buying some of the Chinese fakes. Steel ??? BWAHAHAHAHAHA!

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GrumpyEd

<< <i><< So this "business" paid 20 bucks each for "$1500" coins. Now that's a rip. >>



Sounds like they paid $400 for 20 of them thinking they were BU 1889 CC worth $30K (even at the ridiculous price of $1500).
And they're calling the news at being out the $400?

The scary thing is that the same coins could have been in fake slabs and every coin could be used to scam someone out of a few $K.

rld14

Awww... someone paid just over 80% of melt for Unc 89-CCs and they turned out to be fakes....

ProofArtworkonCircs

<<If I believed reporter Ollikainen's claim that Canadian coins were made of steel, I might just deserve buying some of the Chinese fakes. Steel ??? BWAHAHAHAHAHA! >>

Most modern circulation strike Canadian coins are made of steel.

GrumpyEd

<< <i>Most modern circulation strike Canadian coins are made of steel. >>



97-99 cents were zinc plated copper. They started using copper plated steel in 2000 but you can find some made of zinc after that. It wasn't a clean transition.

CaptHenway

ttt

mkman123

This is scary!! To the public they look shiny and real, so many people are going to get taken that its scary for the hobby!

HalfStrike

At least they only got taken for $20 each, but this is the tip of the iceberg. Some of the fake bars they have are even better.

GrumpyEd

They updated the article. The fakes were different dates. They also say the name of the pawnshop:

updated the article

TonedRarities

So glad I don't buy blast white coins.

drfish

I agree with the karma comments- if those coins had been real the pawn shop would have been stealing from the seller.Unethical business owner swindles unsuspecting customer out of tens of thousands of dollars-Would that make the newspaper headline?

mbogoman

Looks like some of them slipped through the cracks and have made it to Ebay. Seller is from Kent, WA...

http://cgi.ebay.com/1889-CC-MORGAN-DOLLAR-KEY-DATE-/110647696497?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item19c31ddc71

jmski52

The Port Angeles police? It's being dumped on the local police? Where are the FBI? The Secret Service? Where the hell is Hillary Clinton, our Secretary of State on this? Isn't it about time that China gets called on it?

Goldbully

<< <i>Looks like some of them slipped through the cracks and have made it to Ebay. Seller is from Kent, WA...

http://cgi.ebay.com/1889-CC-MORGAN-DOLLAR-KEY-DATE-/110647696497?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item19c31ddc71 >>



You scared me when you said Kent, Washington....I immediately thought of Russ!!!

coinguy1

<< <i>

<< <i>Looks like some of them slipped through the cracks and have made it to Ebay. Seller is from Kent, WA...

http://cgi.ebay.com/1889-CC-MORGAN-DOLLAR-KEY-DATE-/110647696497?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item19c31ddc71 >>



You scared me when you said Kent, Washington....I immediately thought of Russ!!! >>

I contacted the seller ( not Russ ) and told him his coin was counterfeit. He took the news well, ended the listing and is going to have the coin checked out with a local dealer.

LouisCamp

Once eBay was the golden child for coins.

Now, it's great for Chinese knockoffs (as long as D. Carr didn't make them).

Ebay has caused this, they should be charged to fix it.

Lou

RedTiger

<< <i>Once eBay was the golden child for coins.

Now, it's great for Chinese knockoffs (as long as D. Carr didn't make them).

Ebay has caused this, they should be charged to fix it.

Lou >>



Ebay is a lost cause, at least in the U. S. The seven year long Tiffany vs. Ebay lawsuit over fake Tiffany items being sold, ended with a verdict that was a clear victory for Ebay. The bottom line conclusion is that Ebay doesn't care about authenticity, as long as there is traffic, as long as they get their fees. That's why I am cutting way back on Ebay, I'd advise every other coin collector who asks, to do the same. Traffic and sales are language Ebay understands. The rest is noise to them.

As for the Feds getting involved, coins are a tiny lima bean, not even a small potato, in the counterfeiting problem. Luxury goods, movies, software are where the big money goes. Mighty Microsoft, with all the lawyers and politicians that money can buy, can't make much of a dent. How can a few coin dealers and collectors?

Goldbully

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>Looks like some of them slipped through the cracks and have made it to Ebay. Seller is from Kent, WA...

http://cgi.ebay.com/1889-CC-MORGAN-DOLLAR-KEY-DATE-/110647696497?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item19c31ddc71 >>



You scared me when you said Kent, Washington....I immediately thought of Russ!!! >>

I contacted the seller ( not Russ ) and told him his coin was counterfeit. He took the news well, ended the listing and is going to have the coin checked out with a local dealer. >>



You're a good numismatic samaritan, coinguy1!!
Now, for us under-educated folk, please tell me what diagnostics are incorrect on this 1889-CC compared to the genuine examples.
When I look at it, it appears to look unnatural, Miss Liberty looks puffy and the rim looks wrong.

Obiwancanoli

<< <i>Looks like some of them slipped through the cracks and have made it to Ebay. Seller is from Kent, WA...

http://cgi.ebay.com/1889-CC-MORGAN-DOLLAR-KEY-DATE-/110647696497?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item19c31ddc71 >>



I sent a message and a link to the article to the seller...

"Dear allwayslost13,

You might want to have a look at this...

http://www.peninsuladailynews.com/article/20110210/news/302109985/counterfeit-collector-coins-from-china-show-up-in-port-angeles"

Here's his reply...

"I am doing just that and I removed the listing thank you.
Best wishes, Veda


- allwayslost13"

Goldbully

Check out the video!!

Swampboy

Jeremy got it right.
The buyer's karma got him.

1893-S for $20.