Dateless Buffalo
stumpy041486
Posts: 63
Hey
I have quiet a few dateless buffalo nickels. I was wondering what is the best way to bring out the date? Can vinegar be used? Is the any harm in doing this?
I have quiet a few dateless buffalo nickels. I was wondering what is the best way to bring out the date? Can vinegar be used? Is the any harm in doing this?
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"Dateless Buffalo"
(c) 2010 Dentuck Conglomerate Enterprises Unlimited, Ltd
some varietys can be determined w/o the date like 1916/1916
but others are difficult like 1918/7-D which can still be worth a couple hundred with acid treatment
You can use Nic-a-Date to bring out the date, but before you do be sure to determine it's not a Type I with a mintmark. I think Type I D's and S's that have been "Nic-a-Date'd" are worth less
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
You might also want to check the number of legs.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
<< <i>the harm is that the coin becomes worth much less than without acid treatment
some varietys can be determined w/o the date like 1916/1916
but others are difficult like 1918/7-D which can still be worth a couple hundred with acid treatment >>
How can this be, a dateless buff is pretty much a 5 cent coin unless it's something on the reverse that sets it apart (3 leg or such). At least nic-a-date can tell you if it's a 14/3 or 18/7 or something like that.
www.brunkauctions.com
<< <i>Soaking in vinegar (a mild acid) for several days may bring out the date but it will be very weak. I have, in the past, used a mixture of roughly equal parts of bleach and vinegar, which works nearly as well as nic-a-date but you must watch the fumes from this mixture-it's very pungent. >>
Adding an acid to bleach doesn't strike me as very smart if you want to live long.
...dateless buffs. so many out there. does anyone know of any markers to look out for on the, for example,
18 over 17 nickel? these are worth a few bucks and it would be great to know the determining markers if unable
to see the date. the nic-a-date takes a lot of money away from one of these and could keep the TPG's from slabbing
them also.
As far as the nic-a-date yeah it pretty much ruins the coin...the dark area never goes away...
K
"Adding an acid to bleach doesn't strike me as very smart if you want to live long."
First discovered it back in 1963 or '64. Don't make a habit of it and always used adequate ventilation. Still kickin'.
<< <i>I remember quite a while ago a member posted some pics where he incorporated dateless buffs into some tile work he did using them as a border...it was pretty neat.
As far as the nic-a-date yeah it pretty much ruins the coin...the dark area never goes away...
K >>
I'm not condoning this at all but I've seen some people apply the Nic-a-date over the entire obverse of the coin. I assume the concept is that you won't notice the discoloration as much if it's not concentrated in just one spot.
Sean Reynolds
P.S.: there are actually two years which can be easily identified even without a date, the 1913 type I by the reverse and the 1921 by the obverse.
"Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
<< <i>
"Dateless Buffalo"
(c) 2010 Dentuck Conglomerate Enterprises Unlimited, Ltd >>
Pretty funny
<< <i>
P.S.: there are actually two years which can be easily identified even without a date, the 1913 type I by the reverse and the 1921 by the obverse. >>
Besides those two years, you can spot all coins 1915 and before- the ones that have the most potential for being worth more. Just look at the strength of "Liberty", on the coins from 1913 to 1915 "LIberty" will be very faint in the lower grades, while on coins 1916 and thereafter it is still usually quite bold. I believe they did some rework on the Hub in 1916 that accounted for this. For finding the 1918/17-D I usually look at the mint mark location and style on the reverse- only one mintmark location was used- the top of the D is slightly below and after the "E" in five cents. Also the mint mark is tilted, the bottom kicks over to the right. There's an obverse die break on some coins on jaw near braid, but on well worn coins I've never had any luck in finding it. I think one 1917 D mint mark position is pretty close to the 18/17 so you will waste a few nickels at times. Knowing the shapes of the mint marks helps as well- they changed over the years and it can help you eliminate the coins from the 1920's. For spotting the 1921, just look at the hair detail above the braid. I don't think you will ever have to worry about finding a dateless 37-D 3 legger. You can also look for two feather indians- the tiny third feather tip by neck is missing, some of the early mint marked coins are quite rare as a two feather and their are collectors of these out there. Over the years I've found one dateless 1916/1916, probably a dozen 18/17-D, couple dozen at least 13-S type2's-all that I have nic-a-dated. I did however have to search thousands, and I mean thousands of dateless coins. One other thing to remember is too make sure to neutralize the nic-a-date afterwards, rinse with water, dip in baking soda etc.., there are several techniques to do this- might be what some are confusing with above remedies. The vinegar method works best I've found after the date has been raised with nic-a-date, it helps to even out the tone of the coin making the etched area less pronounced- a few days. a week or longer sometimes can help the appearance.
<< <i>...dateless buffs. so many out there. does anyone know of any markers to look out for on the, for example,
18 over 17 nickel? these are worth a few bucks and it would be great to know the determining markers if unable
to see the date. the nic-a-date takes a lot of money away from one of these and could keep the TPG's from slabbing
them also. >>
Some times the braid on the Indians Hair will show a large die crack on the 18/17 even on lower grade coins.
coin. what do they look for? i guess they wouldn't share the "secret" authentic markers. don't want to go against
the TPG code.
<< <i>I have, in the past, used a mixture of roughly equal parts of bleach and vinegar, which works nearly as well as nic-a-date but you must watch the fumes from this mixture-it's very pungent. >>
At least you're not combining the whitening power of bleach with the cleaning power of ammonia!
60 years into this hobby and I'm still working on my Lincoln set!
Playing around with coins is not a good enough reason to take that kind of risk.
From wikipedia:
Chlorine is a toxic gas that irritates the respiratory system. Because it is heavier than air, it tends to accumulate at the bottom of poorly ventilated spaces. Chlorine gas is a strong oxidizer, which may react with flammable materials.
Chlorine is detectable in concentrations of as low as 0.2 ppm. Coughing and vomiting may occur at 30 ppm and lung damage at 60 ppm. About 1000 ppm can be fatal after a few deep breaths of the gas. Breathing lower concentrations can aggravate the respiratory system, and exposure to the gas can irritate the eyes. The toxicity of chlorine comes from its oxidizing power. When chlorine is inhaled at concentrations above 30 ppm, it begins to react with water and cells, which change it into hydrochloric acid (HCl) and hypochlorous acid (HClO).
Do you understand that? 30 parts per million causes irritation. 60 parts per million causes lung damage. Get up to a mere 1 part per thousand, and you can die.
NEVER MIX ACIDS WITH BLEACH.