Is this a Cragslist fake HANK AARON rookie card on Ebay??

bobbyw8469

I want to say my "fake" detecting skills are good, but I want a 2nd opinion....is this card one of the Craigslist fakes???

Hank Aaron rookie

fkw

I cant say for sure because of the bad photos.

I usually look at the face and arms of the small image of Aaron, on this card it looks like the fakes. No detail and way too dark.

But I would need to see a scan to be 100% sure.

mcolney1

Wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole.

Low feedback seller
Never sold anything similar
Lengthy description - always a problem - card should speak for itself
Poor picture
Frosted case

Shall I go on...

scashaggy

<< <i>Wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole. >>



That's a tall Polish person.

digicat

Extreme frosting along the upper half of the slab, enough to access both the flip and the card. Compromised holder = no good.

shagrotn77

The card is without a doubt a fake.

ArchStanton

Scumbag seller tammyelder69 tried to rip me off with a fake Clemente rookie. His MO was to buy a PSA graded copy, crack the case, and scan/print a copy to return to the resealed holder. He would then send the original to Beckett for grading and sell both.

He listed his address as Findlay, OH, but he really lives in North Baltimore, OH. It looks like he has friends in Columbus.

WinPitcher

I wonder why the pic of the Aaron is so dark and crappy yet the pics of the starting lineups are crystal clear?

scotgreb

Shagrotn -- can you please elaborate on why you are certain it is a fake? I can see the frosty edges but what else are you seeing (or is that enough?).

I'd like some education on this. Thanks, Scott

itzagoner

just look at the typeset on the flip, don't even bother with the card.

wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong wrong.......scumbag seller, dirty POS, Merry Christmas auction winner, you just got scammed.

i hope this one blows up before it's too late.

stevek

<<< Beautiful Looking Hank Aaron Rookie Great Investment! >>>

What's the prognosis for investment potential of inkjet copies?

Albertdidit

Posted this morning on the auction:

Q: This card is a fake! You know better, not authentic. You are stealing over 1K from an innocent buyer. I have reported this to eBay and will contact law enforcement if you do not pull this auction... Dec-19-10

A: Good Morning, Well you could imagine that I saw your message and was quite shocked by it. I purchased this card sometime ago from a trusted seller so I am not sure if I could ever believe this could possibly be "fake" and be honest I dont even know how anyone can fake a PSA graded card. The whole point of buying/selling PSA graded material is taking comfort in knowing you arent buying something that isnt real. Not really sure what to make of you/your message but you are making a very serious and strong accusation.

Best part..."I dont even know how anyone can fake a PSA graded card"

GoDodgersFan

Some buyer will get burn on this auction.

The holidays brings out the best and worst among people. Sad commentary.

itzagoner

<< <i>Posted this morning on the auction:

Q: This card is a fake! You know better, not authentic. You are stealing over 1K from an innocent buyer. I have reported this to eBay and will contact law enforcement if you do not pull this auction... Dec-19-10

A: Good Morning, Well you could imagine that I saw your message and was quite shocked by it. I purchased this card sometime ago from a trusted seller so I am not sure if I could ever believe this could possibly be "fake" and be honest I dont even know how anyone can fake a PSA graded card. The whole point of buying/selling PSA graded material is taking comfort in knowing you arent buying something that isnt real. Not really sure what to make of you/your message but you are making a very serious and strong accusation.

Best part..."I dont even know how anyone can fake a PSA graded card" >>



this is icing on the proverbial cake, i'm sure the "seller" couldn't wait for an accusation like this so the defense could be posted to the auction and legitimize it for those who don't know any better.....plays right into the scam.....sadly, this will end up with a poor loser in possession of a phony, unless someone comes along and wins the auction and then refuses to pay.....it might be worth the sacrifice to someone with an additional useless account and low feedback to just get NARU'd, let's hope that happens.

bobbyw8469

Is this the same one that someone submitted to the PWCC for their monthly auction? Brent caught it in time, and took it down before the auction ended....

bobbyw8469

Brent pulled this one out of his auction because the case is extremely frosted....but in my opinion, the card on this one looks A WHOLE lot better than the one on Ebay....the colors on the suspect one on Ebay, just don't appear to be even close to being right (notice the hue of the orange).....

itzagoner

linkypoo


take a look at this.....i could be wrong, but the first 3 digits of the serial number are the same.....the number 128 has a stepladder effect as each digit seems to climb a bit higher than the previous one.....it appears to me the the NM 7 which has been created is in no way that created by a PSA labeler, but a swap which included the research and discovery of a similar serial number to use for the grade.

it's just a theory. take a look.

bobbyw8469

Oh...looking at the one that was in PWCC auction, it looks authentic, but definitely not a '7'...notice what appears to be a water stain where the "M" on the cap is?? It extends upward between the "t & f" in the word "outfield" and curves inward towards the top......

itzagoner

that PWCC card has nothing to do with this, leave them out of it....study the old PSA 6 from the robmerrill thread and the current "PSA 7"

it's THE SAME GD CARD.

mlbfan2

<< <i>this is icing on the proverbial cake, i'm sure the "seller" couldn't wait for an accusation like this so the defense could be posted to the auction and legitimize it for those who don't know any better.....plays right into the scam. >>



Well, in all fairness, if one of us asked that question and the seller DIDN'T post the question/answer then that would make it look like a scam too.

fkw

These CL fakes have the same Bar Code, plus if you compare the colors of the card... the fakes have the darker areas too dark and the lighter areas too light. Especially look at the small action pose of Aaron, look at the lack of detail of the face and arms, fingers. Also look at the "shadows" and "hair compared to skin tones" of the larger color portrait, way too dark.

itzagoner

so, i guess with regard to the OP's question, the answer would be a resounding YES.

Blacklabelsociety

<< <i>Brent pulled this one out of his auction because the case is extremely frosted....but in my opinion, the card on this one looks A WHOLE lot better than the one on Ebay....the colors on the suspect one on Ebay, just don't appear to be even close to being right (notice the hue of the orange).....

>>



I think this is a good example for some of you on here to take a chill pill. Or maybe some people on message boards just have way too much time on their hands. If this card and the one currently on ebay are fakes then my name is john paul jones. Fakes are not made this good. PWCC listed this 7 as a nm-mint 8 in his description. And i would say he was right. The centering is good and all 4 corners look very SOLID. PWCC might have ended this auction early because, 1) he got a really good offer to end it. or 2) the owner changed their mind. Or some other reason.

Seriously some of you people need to take up another hobby and stop interfering with other peoples business. If someone is scamming on ebay, it is ebay's problem to take care of it.

swartz1

the dead give away is the shadow under the brim of the hat...

swartz1

the dead give away is the shadow under the brim of the hat...

itzagoner

sheesh BLS.

some of us have nothing better to do than watch others make complete fools of themselves.

the card you have presented, UNNECESSARILY, from the PWCC auction has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that a FAKE card is currently being offered on eBay, and the EXACT SAME CARD was presented to this forum several months ago with a different FAKE grade, by a member who has since seemingly disappeared, and it has now been proven by more than one member, currently, that the card in question on eBay is most definitely FAKE.

the problem with depending on eBay to appropriately police their site, is that they don't, so pro-active people here take steps to warn each other against the possibility of taking a wild gamble and making a critical financial error.

there is nothing wrong with that, sorry bro.

twiley

<< <i>the dead give away is the shadow under the brim of the hat... >>

Blacklabelsociety

<< <i>sheesh BLS.

some of us have nothing better to do than watch others make complete fools of themselves.

the card you have presented, UNNECESSARILY, from the PWCC auction has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that a FAKE card is currently being offered on eBay, and the EXACT SAME CARD was presented to this forum several months ago with a different FAKE grade, by a member who has since seemingly disappeared, and it has now been proven by more than one member, currently, that the card in question on eBay is most definitely FAKE.

All you have is pictures to go on, and quite poor quality at that. =0 proof. Now if someone bought the ebay card and sent in to psa or another reputable TPG, and it came back no good, then you have proof.

the problem with depending on eBay to appropriately police their site, is that they don't.

>>



And still their business and their problem. Ebay/paypal has also been known for going against their own TOS, thus ripping/scamming honest sellers.

itzagoner

All you have is pictures to go on, and quite poor quality at that. =0 proof. Now if someone bought the ebay card and sent in to psa or another reputable TPG, and it came back no good, then you have proof.

i'm stifling it, seriously......the FAKE card will never see the inside of a 3rd party grading facility, although by all appearances it seems to have been submitted for a review and got bumped a full grade, as well as a different serial number from the last century.

believe what you want to believe.....many of us know how easily lambs are led to slaughter.

NickM

DaBigHurt was funny, because it was recognizable that he was tongue-in-cheek and his actions were never in defense of blatant scams.

Blacklabelsociety, if he's trying to be funny, is failing miserably. If he's serious, he's an apologist for criminals.

Either way, the board would be better off without him.

Nick

Blacklabelsociety

<< <i>

Either way, the board would be better off without him.

Nick >>



I think losers on message boards who accuse people they dont even know as "criminals", would be better off leaving.

NickM

Blacklabelsociety, you have no shame.

You've repeatedly shilled for Craigslist fakes, asserting that they may be legit. Remember this thread? Or this one?

You even claimed that FAA Bond Bread fakes were authentic.


Oddly enough, 4 months before you talked up the benefits of buying and selling cards on Craigslist, you urged people not to buy graded cards on Craigslist.



Now in this thread, you argue that outing fakes on eBay is no one's business but eBay's.

It's all of our business, despite your repeated attempts to protect and defend scams.

Just. Go. Away.

Nick

Blacklabelsociety

<< <i>Blacklabelsociety, you have no shame.

You've repeatedly shilled for Craigslist fakes, asserting that they may be legit. Remember this thread? Or this one?

You even claimed that FAA Bond Bread fakes were authentic.
Oddly enough, 4 months before you talked up the benefits of buying and selling cards on Craigslist, you urged people not to buy graded cards on Craigslist.




Nick >>



When you can give any proof then let me know. Hell every psa card out there could be a fake. I dont know? There was also nothing fake about 1947 bond cards. There was a warehouse find in the early 80's of numerous 1947 bond bread cards. They were the square corners.

ps..the raiders suck

bobbyw8469

Some people are trying to educate people are warn others about possible scams. In this case, there is no doubt, it IS a bonafide scam. Your lack of common sense is appalling.

jay0791

Gentleman
Thank you for pointing out the key points to determine a fake 54 AAron.
I do psa cards and have extensive experience...but didn't know some of the info presented here.
Well done.

fkw

<< <i>I think this is a good example for some of you on here to take a chill pill. Or maybe some people on message boards just have way too much time on their hands. If this card and the one currently on ebay are fakes then my name is john paul jones. Fakes are not made this good. PWCC listed this 7 as a nm-mint 8 in his description. And i would say he was right. The centering is good and all 4 corners look very SOLID. PWCC might have ended this auction early because, 1) he got a really good offer to end it. or 2) the owner changed their mind. Or some other reason.

Seriously some of you people need to take up another hobby and stop interfering with other peoples business. If someone is scamming on ebay, it is ebay's problem to take care of it. >>



wtf? are you paying attention BLS?? Or should I call you Mr Jones??
The example you show (scan is above this post) is just an authentic card in a messed up slab, have the owner get it reslabbed, its a nice Authentic card with a bit of a rough cut and a light scratch on the neck. Its a 7.

These fakes are not good and are very easy to spot. I saw the difference in the print quality the first time I really looked at it well (I dont collect common Topps cards). If you go to Net54 I brought up the problem with the print quality contrast (small image is all black, no detail in fingers face etc). quite awhile ago.

This thread is just helping people, no need to chill IMO, even though Im always Chill....... Im in Hawai'i brah

PS FYI BLS........square corner Bond Bread cards in offbrand slabs are all REPRINTS (see my post on Bond Bread cards, should be top of the main paig as i write this)

funny aloha

bobbyw8469

The PWCC card is an authentic card in a compromised slab. If you can't see the frosting all around the edges of that slab, then you are blind as a bat and need to quit collecting PSA graded cards, as you will fall victim to a scam one day. It has staining at the top, so it might have had a qualifier, and was switched out at one time. Not all scams involve fake cards like the horrid one on Ebay right now. Sometimes they just carefully crack the slab, take out the high grade card, and insert an inferior version of an authentic card. Almost like printing money.....

WinPitcher

Ahh yes another day.

stevek

The bottom line is to practice spotting fakes and copies...one way is simply to take a vintage card, and make copies yourself on a high quality inkjet printer, adjust the contrast a bit, and you'll see exactly how copies look. Generally, fine details fill in, blacks get blacker, and colors change their hue...there are other peculiarities as well. Believe it or not, sometimes to the naked eye, a card from a little distance can appear to be better than the original, such as the 85 McGwire fakes.

When scammers print fakes by offset printing, and use color separation, they can produce pretty dam good fakes, so experience is the key, and on an expensive card, if you're not 100% sure, then only buy a card in a PSA slab, without frosted edges of course.

Juggs

Hey guys, if someone doesn't mind, explain "frosted edges" on a PSA holder to me. I could guess, but I'm not sure....

Thanks

bobbyw8469

<< <i>Hey guys, if someone doesn't mind, explain "frosted edges" on a PSA holder to me. I could guess, but I'm not sure.... >>



When a PSA case is cracked and glued back together, the edges of the case will look unusally white from where the sonic-weld got compromised. It will have a "frosted" look instead of a clear look.

Juggs

<< <i>When a PSA case is cracked and glued back together, the edges of the case will look unusally white from where the sonic-weld got compromised. It will have a "frosted" look instead of a clear look. >>

Nice. Thank you.

It sticks out like sore thumb now.

itzagoner

i reported the auction, hope you did too Bobby, FWIW [eyeroll]......i suppose at this point, i'd encourage anyone reading this who gives 1/2 a carp, to file a report with the fraudster police at eBay.....if we flood them with enough complaints, perhaps they'll get moderately curious within the next 72 hours.

or, we could just keep reading comments being posted by the seller from moron apologists.

ShootyBabitt

This cert # is currently in somebody's registry. My guess is it isn't sam2321samantha's registry.

bobbyw8469

<< <i>reported the auction, hope you did too Bobby, FWIW >>



Of course I did. I don't wish to see someone get scammed for almost 2 dimes.

Blacklabelsociety

Maybe these cards are WIWAG cards?

WIWAG stands for WHEN IT WAS A GAME. For those who dont know.

NickM

Nice try at getting the thread poofed to cover up that you've been exposed as being on the side of the scammers.

The Craigslist fakes (you know, the place where you claimed on this board to have gotten great deals on cards that you subsequently sold off) involve forged flips (with repeatedly copied serial numbers of real cards) and fake cards.

There's no connection to WIWAG.

Your entire presence on this board appears to be an effort to harm PSA - you have sung the virtues of BCCG, argued for buying cards off of Craigslist, defended Craigslist fakes as real (insisting that you can't see a difference), suggested that every graded card may be a fake, and demanded proof of FGA cards being fakes, when not only have multiple hobby experts explained that the cards were fakes, but they were "graded" by a guy who has since been convicted for crimes involving selling fraudulent sports cards and memorabilia items.

"Cumberland County Detective Sergeant Earl Bock told the court during a 2008 preliminary hearing that a machine for re-sealing opened packs and wax sealing material had been found as part of what he called an “assembly line” operation which involved Hooper allegedly removing the valuable cards and replacing them with others."
story

By the way, you never did fulfill your promise on this board to out the name of the eBay buyer who supposedly opened a bogus SNAD case against you and won 49 days after the item was shipped. Is that because you got caught selling a fake?

Nick

Blacklabelsociety

<< <i>Nice try at getting the thread poofed to cover up that you've been exposed as being on the side of the scammers.

OH, I see so first you accuse the ebay seller as being a "criminal" and now you are accusing me of siding with scammers? Whether or not the card the ebay guy is selling is fake, there is no reason to assume he is a criminal judging by his past feedback.

The Craigslist fakes (you know, the place where you claimed on this board to have gotten great deals on cards that you subsequently sold off) involve forged flips (with repeatedly copied serial numbers of real cards) and fake cards.

There's no connection to WIWAG.

And you know this how?

Your entire presence on this board appears to be an effort to harm PSA - you have sung the virtues of BCCG, argued for buying cards off of Craigslist, defended Craigslist fakes as real (insisting that you can't see a difference), suggested that every graded card may be a fake, and demanded proof of FGA cards being fakes, when not only have multiple hobby experts explained that the cards were fakes, but they were "graded" by a guy who has since been convicted for crimes involving selling fraudulent sports cards and memorabilia items.

I am not trying to harm PSA or any other business. That includes someones ebay business, which is non of my business nor yours. HOBBY EXPERTS?? LOL. Yea well i guess its kind of like discussing politics on message boards. Everyones an expert and has all the answers. Yea right.

"Cumberland County Detective Sergeant Earl Bock told the court during a 2008 preliminary hearing that a machine for re-sealing opened packs and wax sealing material had been found as part of what he called an “assembly line” operation which involved Hooper allegedly removing the valuable cards and replacing them with others."
story

This has nothing to do with the ebay card.

By the way, you never did fulfill your promise on this board to out the name of the eBay buyer who supposedly opened a bogus SNAD case against you and won 49 days after the item was shipped. Is that because you got caught selling a fake?

Nick >>



Once again. The buyer on ebay never accussed me of selling a fake. He wanted his money back because he was unhappy with the grade PSA gave it. Which i disagreed, because imo the card was worthy of the grade it got.

cone10

Did anyone contact PSA about this auction? On the coin forum I was told that PCGS wants to see these listings before ebay shuts them down, I'm sure its the same with PSA.

bobbyw8469

I did not contact PSA. I would think Joe Orlando would be the one to contact, but I have never talked to him. I guess I am a small potatoe....

bobbyw8469

This is for Juggs....on the left is a frosted slab....on the right is a normal slab.......hopefully that will help you tell the difference between a compromised slab and a legitimate slab....