<< <i>I think that the era these players played in is a difference also. Sure 500 homers is alot back in the 50's, but now, after a few good years you half way there. So, I think that in the coming years, we will see players who have 500 homers who will not be in the hall. Canseco being one if he does happen to get to 500 which I highly doubt.
Boggs played in a hitters park. What did he do after Fenway? I have no idea, but I know his stats went down.
I remeber a quote from Willie Mays when Canseco got 40/40. He said, "If stealing bases was a big deal, hell, you would have had plenty 40/40 guys back in my day."
And trying to compare Canseco to Ripken is a disgrace.
danandkat-Look at cal's stats from the past 5 years. He shoulda retired in 96-97, when people still respected him as a ball player, not a "good guy". Of course Boggs stats went down, but when your batting .280-.342 while also getting closer to a geratric care facility, that shows grit. Cal was healthy for many years, after he ended the streak, he was out alot the following years. Now, yeah its nice to play for the same crappy team for 21 years. But that doesn't earn him any respect from me, he stayed with an organization that concetrated on its past, rather then its future(IE:Trading Willie Harris, the next Roberto Alomar). I like stats, that it what counts on making a ballplayer great, not how many games in a row he played or how many all star games he went to.
<< <i>danandkat-Look at cal's stats from the past 5 years. He shoulda retired in 96-97, when people still respected him as a ball player, not a "good guy". Of course Boggs stats went down, but when your batting .280-.342 while also getting closer to a geratric care facility, that shows grit. Cal was healthy for many years, after he ended the streak, he was out alot the following years. Now, yeah its nice to play for the same crappy team for 21 years. But that doesn't earn him any respect from me, he stayed with an organization that concetrated on its past, rather then its future(IE:Trading Willie Harris, the next Roberto Alomar). I like stats, that it what counts on making a ballplayer great, not how many games in a row he played or how many all star games he went to. >>
You know Boggs gotta be good for a Yankee fan to take up for a Red Sox great.
Yanksfan....Willie Harris...where he at now? lol......so Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??hmmmmm...and for the rest....whats your point??
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
Auto.....as I asked....get what the average shortstop did during Ripkens days and compare those to what Canseco did during his run and compare those.
Boggs vs. Ripken I did not start...if you wish I am game.......and what you said about Canseco vs. Ripken is truly sad.
Now that we on to the Yanks....hehehe........lets look at what Yogi Berra did. Or Rizzouto. are they famer material???...or Munson who is now getting a push to get in.....or Mattingly who seems to be getting the same push.
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
<< <i>Auto.....as I asked....get what the average shortstop did during Ripkens days and compare those to what Canseco did during his run and compare those.
Boggs vs. Ripken I did not start...if you wish I am game.......and what you said about Canseco vs. Ripken is truly sad.
Now that we on to the Yanks....hehehe........lets look at what Yogi Berra did. Or Rizzouto. are they famer material???...or Munson who is now getting a push to get in.....or Mattingly who seems to be getting the same push. >>
Hahahaha. He definately has a grudge against Rizzuto. Did Rizzuto spit in your kool-aid or something?
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game. Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays. Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average.
Please separate what Boggs did during his days in Boston, that is my argument. No need to construe the stats my friend. >>
Doesn't matter.. it's still better than what Ripken has done. He didn't do as well away from Boston, but still averaged over .300 which means there are no excuses. Boggs is definately 1st ballot. You also have to put into consideration that he was younger with Boston and even at the end of his career, still hitting .300. Wasn't Ripken like 0-36 near the end of his last season?
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game. Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays. Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average. >>
Typical Yankee fan response.
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference.
Please separate what Boggs did during his days in Boston, that is my argument. No need to construe the stats my friend. >>
Doesn't matter.. it's still better than what Ripken has done. He didn't do as well away from Boston, but still averaged over .300 which means there are no excuses. Boggs is definately 1st ballot. You also have to put into consideration that he was younger with Boston and even at the end of his career, still hitting .300. Wasn't Ripken like 0-36 near the end of his last season? >>
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference.
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game. Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays. Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average. >>
Typical Yankee fan response. >>
What do you mean by that. Just that he had zero, zip, nada, zilch of a chance at a title with Boston?
Sorry if I don't respect old washed up ballplayers that hold down minor leaguers who would help the organization.
On Munson/Mattingly-You watch, they will both get in. Mattingly shoulda gotten in atleast by 2nd ballot. His #'s were nearly identical to Puckett. Munson was a great overall player.
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game. Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays. Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average. >>
Typical Yankee fan response. >>
What do you mean by that. Just that he had zero, zip, nada, zilch of a chance at a title with Boston?
Sorry if I don't respect old washed up ballplayers that hold down minor leaguers who would help the organization.
On Munson/Mattingly-You watch, they will both get in. Mattingly shoulda gotten in atleast by 2nd ballot. His #'s were nearly identical to Puckett. Munson was a great overall player.
But back onto the Boggs Vs. Ripken... >>
What I mean is that it seems as if most Yank fans think the baseball world revovles around the Yanks. When in fact it doesn't.
Mattingly does not deserve to go..what did he do in his career? Munson might have been a great one, we will never know. Puckett got a ring....maybe Mattingly should have went to the Twins to get one.
And if you wish...back to Boggs vs. Rip.
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
About KP and the ring, he and his team earned it. So, Mattingly doesn't have a ring, that doesn't prove anything. Puckett has a ring. What does that prove, he had a team around him that also contributed into getting that ring. I do believe that most happenings in baseball do revolve around the NY Yankees. When does a super star free agent come up and the Yankees aren't in the running. Who are great Franchises/Dynasties compared to? You guessed it, the Yankees.
What did Puckett do extrodanarily differently than Mattingly did in his career?
Back to the Boggs Vs. Ripken, why do you think old cal is better? It can't be b/c of the stats
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game. Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays. Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average. >>
Typical Yankee fan response. >>
What do you mean by that. Just that he had zero, zip, nada, zilch of a chance at a title with Boston?
Sorry if I don't respect old washed up ballplayers that hold down minor leaguers who would help the organization.
On Munson/Mattingly-You watch, they will both get in. Mattingly shoulda gotten in atleast by 2nd ballot. His #'s were nearly identical to Puckett. Munson was a great overall player.
But back onto the Boggs Vs. Ripken... >>
What I mean is that it seems as if most Yank fans think the baseball world revovles around the Yanks. When in fact it doesn't.
Mattingly does not deserve to go..what did he do in his career? Munson might have been a great one, we will never know. Puckett got a ring....maybe Mattingly should have went to the Twins to get one.
And if you wish...back to Boggs vs. Rip. >>
Rings are not as big of an accomplishment as they use to be. Owners now buy those rings (Florida Marlins, then ditched everyone afterwards. San Francisco 49ers the year they signed Deion Sanders and a bunch of other high budget players, then dropped them afterwards, and Houston Rockets when they signed Clyde Drexler). I don't watch hockey, but I dunno if one of the teams there have done it.
Yankee.....this free agent era of baseball is not baseball. It does not matter where a free agent wants to go...who cares. Players go where the $$$ is bottom line. But if you wish...why didn't they sign Bonds this year? Why didn't they go after Juan Gone instead of having VanderWal in right? A-Rod....why didn't he go to your Yanks, he could have moved to third?? Why did Manny go to the Sox and not the Yanks? Need I go on.
So Boggs going to the Yanks has nothing to do with anything either. So why did you bring up that he left the red sox so he could win a ring? And the point of Joe Giardi leaving because of a hat. You make no sense and remind me of a blinded yankee fan.
but back to Boggs vs. Ripken.
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
My friend Auto....still waiting for an answer to this.....
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference.
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
Category=Leader G= DM AB= KP, leads by 241 R=KP, leads by 64 H=KP, leads by 151 2b=DM 3b=KP, leads by 37 HR=DM RBI=DM BB=DM SO=KP, leads by 521 SB=KP, leads by 120 CS=KP, leads by leads by 67 BA=KP, leads by .011
Not a big difference AT ALL. So to say that Mattingly shouldn't be in the Hall is an uneduacated statement
The Yankees were serious contenders for all of those free agents except for Bonds b/c he is old. The reason Giradi left is b/c Steiny told him NOT to where the hat, he wore it. He didn't play in a Yanks uniform the next season. Giradi actually had an interview about it after he left the Yanks. As you could see, I said that the Yanks were in the running. We were supposed to get Jaunzo. Oh well.
Manny-Offered more money by the sox's. Yanks didn't want to go that high for him Arod-To expensive and they already have a Franchise player in Jeter.
What I'm trying to say is, whenever a superstar free agent comes up, 9 times out of 10, they look for an offer from the Yanks.
BTW-If helton avg. .340 for the next 7-8 yrs, he will be considered one of the top hitters. MLB teams do play away games. Just a FYI
<< <i>The Yankees were serious contenders for all of those free agents except for Bonds b/c he is old. The reason Giradi left is b/c Steiny told him NOT to where the hat, he wore it. He didn't play in a Yanks uniform the next season. Giradi actually had an interview about it after he left the Yanks. As you could see, I said that the Yanks were in the running. We were supposed to get Jaunzo. Oh well.
Manny-Offered more money by the sox's. Yanks didn't want to go that high for him Arod-To expensive and they already have a Franchise player in Jeter.
What I'm trying to say is, whenever a superstar free agent comes up, 9 times out of 10, they look for an offer from the Yanks.
BTW-If helton avg. .340 for the next 7-8 yrs, he will be considered one of the top hitters. MLB teams do play away games. Just a FYI >>
helton will not due to the fact he played half his games at Coors. If Mays, Musial, Schmidt played half their games at Coors 1000 homers in a career would have been done.
I could care less about Giardi and his hat....big deal. Once again, this free agent era of baseball is not baseball. Big deal the Yanks are in the running for free agents.
What's next...Paul O'Neill for the hall of fame? What about Brousis...he left the A's to get a ring...he should be in the Hall too......buwhhahahahahaha
Still waiting for Autos answer......guess I will have to wait til tomorrow as I am off to bed.
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
lets not jump on my man mattingly he will make it becouse he deserves it he wasnt done playing ball he couldnt play anymore becouse of back spasims thats why his last years #s were so low he had time left he just had a serious injury
oh and as for boggs playing in a hitters park does that mean that all of TED WILLIAMS accomplishments are nothing becouse he played in that same "hitters park" ??
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Earlier regarding Ripken, you said that the Hall is not a popularity contest. But then when you say no I don't like Brosuis, is that not a popularity contest?
And for the comment about Ted Williams...remember he missed his prime years due to the war. One more reason to totally give respect to the man. Could you see A-Rod....Jeter....Nomar...Bonds or anybody in todays game missing their prime years to serve the country?
And Auto my friend....still waitng for an answer....hehe
Thanks Dan & Kat
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
Earlier regarding Ripken, you said that the Hall is not a popularity contest. But then when you say no I don't like Brosuis, is that not a popularity contest?
And for the comment about Ted Williams...remember he missed his prime years due to the war. One more reason to totally give respect to the man. Could you see A-Rod....Jeter....Nomar...Bonds or anybody in todays game missing their prime years to serve the country?
And Auto my friend....still waitng for an answer....hehe
Thanks Dan & Kat >>
Umm, what's the question? If you referring to Boggs w/ Boston, I've already answered that question. Even after he left Boston, he was older and near the end of his career.. YET still hit over .300 with Yankees and Tampa Bay (.307 to be exact). Now, he hit over .300 15 of his 17 seasons. Hit .292 with Yankees once and .280 with Tampa Bay once. He states suppose to get worst near the end of his career, but .300+ is still above average. And you act as if they only play home games. What about on the road? I guess all games were at Fenway, right?
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference.
SF Giants from the 60's & 70's in PSA6-9. dwdominguez@hotmail.com
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions." -- Roddy Piper
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference. >>
Let's break this down. When Todd Helton was doing the .400 race, he was hitting .362 on the road ('nuff said). Next question. And if you want to get very technical about it, most Negro Leaguers was not allowed to play baseball back then and when they did, they were older players. So, if you reduce your competition, of course you will look like a great.
You tell me.. tired of being the one posting all the stats. Helton is consistent every year. And yo uhave to make contact with the ball to get a possible hit. Also, Helton was in the race to break the most doubles in a season record.
Comments
<< <i>I think that the era these players played in is a difference also. Sure 500 homers is alot back in the 50's, but now, after a few good years you half way there. So, I think that in the coming years, we will see players who have 500 homers who will not be in the hall. Canseco being one if he does happen to get to 500 which I highly doubt.
Boggs played in a hitters park. What did he do after Fenway? I have no idea, but I know his stats went down.
I remeber a quote from Willie Mays when Canseco got 40/40. He said, "If stealing bases was a big deal, hell, you would have had plenty 40/40 guys back in my day."
And trying to compare Canseco to Ripken is a disgrace.
Thanks
Dan & Kat >>
It wasn't the park.
1993 (NY Yankees) - .302
1994 (NY Yankees) - .342
1995 (NY Yankees) - .324
1996 (NY Yankees) - .311
1997 (NY Yankees) - .292
1998 (Tampa Bay) - .280
1999 (Tampa Bay) - .301
which is still a .307 batting average after Red Sox.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
Seems to me they all went way way way down.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>Wheres the at-bats and hits at? >>
1993 (NY Yankees) - .302 (560 at-bats, 169 hits)
1994 (NY Yankees) - .342 (366 at-bats, 125 hits)
1995 (NY Yankees) - .324 (460 at-bats, 149 hits)
1996 (NY Yankees) - .311 (501 at-bats, 156 hits)
1997 (NY Yankees) - .292 (353 at-bats, 103 hits)
1998 (Tampa Bay) - .280 (435 at-bats, 122 hits)
1999 (Tampa Bay) - .301 (292 at-bats, 88 hits) - Retired
And remember Boggs went 17 seasons vs. Ripkens 21.
Ripken 603 doubles vs. Boggs 578. But Boggs had 61 triples vs Ripkens 44.
Boggs career stats
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>Pales in comparsion to his Boston days huh?? >>
Still a lot better than Ripkens stats. Look at Ripken's batting averages his last 7 seasons vs. Boggs. hmmm
<< <i>danandkat-Look at cal's stats from the past 5 years. He shoulda retired in 96-97, when people still respected him as a ball player, not a "good guy". Of course Boggs stats went down, but when your batting .280-.342 while also getting closer to a geratric care facility, that shows grit. Cal was healthy for many years, after he ended the streak, he was out alot the following years. Now, yeah its nice to play for the same crappy team for 21 years. But that doesn't earn him any respect from me, he stayed with an organization that concetrated on its past, rather then its future(IE:Trading Willie Harris, the next Roberto Alomar). I like stats, that it what counts on making a ballplayer great, not how many games in a row he played or how many all star games he went to. >>
You know Boggs gotta be good for a Yankee fan to take up for a Red Sox great.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
Boggs vs. Ripken I did not start...if you wish I am game.......and what you said about Canseco vs. Ripken is truly sad.
Now that we on to the Yanks....hehehe........lets look at what Yogi Berra did. Or Rizzouto. are they famer material???...or Munson who is now getting a push to get in.....or Mattingly who seems to be getting the same push.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>
<< <i>Wheres the at-bats and hits at? >>
1993 (NY Yankees) - .302 (560 at-bats, 169 hits)
1994 (NY Yankees) - .342 (366 at-bats, 125 hits)
1995 (NY Yankees) - .324 (460 at-bats, 149 hits)
1996 (NY Yankees) - .311 (501 at-bats, 156 hits)
1997 (NY Yankees) - .292 (353 at-bats, 103 hits)
1998 (Tampa Bay) - .280 (435 at-bats, 122 hits)
1999 (Tampa Bay) - .301 (292 at-bats, 88 hits) - Retired
And remember Boggs went 17 seasons vs. Ripkens 21.
Ripken 603 doubles vs. Boggs 578. But Boggs had 61 triples vs Ripkens 44.
Boggs career stats >>
Please separate what Boggs did during his days in Boston, that is my argument. No need to construe the stats my friend.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>Auto.....as I asked....get what the average shortstop did during Ripkens days and compare those to what Canseco did during his run and compare those.
Boggs vs. Ripken I did not start...if you wish I am game.......and what you said about Canseco vs. Ripken is truly sad.
Now that we on to the Yanks....hehehe........lets look at what Yogi Berra did. Or Rizzouto. are they famer material???...or Munson who is now getting a push to get in.....or Mattingly who seems to be getting the same push. >>
Hahahaha. He definately has a grudge against Rizzuto.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game.
Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays.
Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Wheres the at-bats and hits at? >>
1993 (NY Yankees) - .302 (560 at-bats, 169 hits)
1994 (NY Yankees) - .342 (366 at-bats, 125 hits)
1995 (NY Yankees) - .324 (460 at-bats, 149 hits)
1996 (NY Yankees) - .311 (501 at-bats, 156 hits)
1997 (NY Yankees) - .292 (353 at-bats, 103 hits)
1998 (Tampa Bay) - .280 (435 at-bats, 122 hits)
1999 (Tampa Bay) - .301 (292 at-bats, 88 hits) - Retired
And remember Boggs went 17 seasons vs. Ripkens 21.
Ripken 603 doubles vs. Boggs 578. But Boggs had 61 triples vs Ripkens 44.
Boggs career stats >>
Please separate what Boggs did during his days in Boston, that is my argument. No need to construe the stats my friend. >>
Doesn't matter.. it's still better than what Ripken has done. He didn't do as well away from Boston, but still averaged over .300 which means there are no excuses. Boggs is definately 1st ballot. You also have to put into consideration that he was younger with Boston and even at the end of his career, still hitting .300. Wasn't Ripken like 0-36 near the end of his last season?
<< <i>Aint it da trut.
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game.
Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays.
Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average. >>
Typical Yankee fan response.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>First time I have brought up Rizzuto.
Excuse me, that was Johnsauc that brought up Rizzuto.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Wheres the at-bats and hits at? >>
1993 (NY Yankees) - .302 (560 at-bats, 169 hits)
1994 (NY Yankees) - .342 (366 at-bats, 125 hits)
1995 (NY Yankees) - .324 (460 at-bats, 149 hits)
1996 (NY Yankees) - .311 (501 at-bats, 156 hits)
1997 (NY Yankees) - .292 (353 at-bats, 103 hits)
1998 (Tampa Bay) - .280 (435 at-bats, 122 hits)
1999 (Tampa Bay) - .301 (292 at-bats, 88 hits) - Retired
And remember Boggs went 17 seasons vs. Ripkens 21.
Ripken 603 doubles vs. Boggs 578. But Boggs had 61 triples vs Ripkens 44.
Boggs career stats >>
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference.
Please separate what Boggs did during his days in Boston, that is my argument. No need to construe the stats my friend. >>
Doesn't matter.. it's still better than what Ripken has done. He didn't do as well away from Boston, but still averaged over .300 which means there are no excuses. Boggs is definately 1st ballot. You also have to put into consideration that he was younger with Boston and even at the end of his career, still hitting .300. Wasn't Ripken like 0-36 near the end of his last season? >>
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>
<< <i>Aint it da trut.
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game.
Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays.
Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average. >>
Typical Yankee fan response. >>
What do you mean by that. Just that he had zero, zip, nada, zilch of a chance at a title with Boston?
Sorry if I don't respect old washed up ballplayers that hold down minor leaguers who would help the organization.
On Munson/Mattingly-You watch, they will both get in. Mattingly shoulda gotten in atleast by 2nd ballot. His #'s were nearly identical to Puckett. Munson was a great overall player.
But back onto the Boggs Vs. Ripken...
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Aint it da trut.
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game.
Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays.
Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average. >>
Typical Yankee fan response. >>
What do you mean by that. Just that he had zero, zip, nada, zilch of a chance at a title with Boston?
Sorry if I don't respect old washed up ballplayers that hold down minor leaguers who would help the organization.
On Munson/Mattingly-You watch, they will both get in. Mattingly shoulda gotten in atleast by 2nd ballot. His #'s were nearly identical to Puckett. Munson was a great overall player.
But back onto the Boggs Vs. Ripken... >>
What I mean is that it seems as if most Yank fans think the baseball world revovles around the Yanks. When in fact it doesn't.
Mattingly does not deserve to go..what did he do in his career?
Munson might have been a great one, we will never know.
Puckett got a ring....maybe Mattingly should have went to the Twins to get one.
And if you wish...back to Boggs vs. Rip.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
What did Puckett do extrodanarily differently than Mattingly did in his career?
Back to the Boggs Vs. Ripken, why do you think old cal is better? It can't be b/c of the stats
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Aint it da trut.
danandkat-They traded him to the ChiSox's for some draft picks I think, saw him play Single A Delmarva Shorebirds(there stadium is in Salisbury) and he has the talent to be the next Alomar, not a power hitter, but GREAT defensively, and also kept a solid enough AVG. to go from Single A to MLB in 1 year.
"So Boggs going to Tampa to get 3000 hits is grit while Cal playing a few extra years is not??"
Cal held down other major league quality players. Boggs knew he had no chance at a ring with the BoSox's so he went to a team he knew had a chance.
Playing a few extra years is called hanging on to long, please don't make it try to sound good. Atleast Boggs had not only the smarts, but ability to leave the game with respect for playing the game.
Let's not forget that if Boggs had the opportunity to stay with the Yanks, he would have. He was pushed out of the organization much like Joe Girardi(The cowboy hat thing really pissed off old Steiny). But Boggs is still a coach for the Rays.
Cal hung on for 4-5+ extra years for the records, other than that, he had nothing to contribute by staying. Atleast Boggs did it with a very respectable(If not outstanding) batting average. >>
Typical Yankee fan response. >>
What do you mean by that. Just that he had zero, zip, nada, zilch of a chance at a title with Boston?
Sorry if I don't respect old washed up ballplayers that hold down minor leaguers who would help the organization.
On Munson/Mattingly-You watch, they will both get in. Mattingly shoulda gotten in atleast by 2nd ballot. His #'s were nearly identical to Puckett. Munson was a great overall player.
But back onto the Boggs Vs. Ripken... >>
What I mean is that it seems as if most Yank fans think the baseball world revovles around the Yanks. When in fact it doesn't.
Mattingly does not deserve to go..what did he do in his career?
Munson might have been a great one, we will never know.
Puckett got a ring....maybe Mattingly should have went to the Twins to get one.
And if you wish...back to Boggs vs. Rip. >>
Rings are not as big of an accomplishment as they use to be. Owners now buy those rings (Florida Marlins, then ditched everyone afterwards. San Francisco 49ers the year they signed Deion Sanders and a bunch of other high budget players, then dropped them afterwards, and Houston Rockets when they signed Clyde Drexler). I don't watch hockey, but I dunno if one of the teams there have done it.
G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SO SB CS BA
12 Seasons 1783 7244 1071 2304 414 57 207 1085 450 965 134 76 .318
Mattingly
G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SO SB CS BA
14 Seasons 1785 7003 1007 2153 442 20 222 1099 588 444 14 9 .307
Plus Puckett got a ring.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
So Boggs going to the Yanks has nothing to do with anything either. So why did you bring up that he left the red sox so he could win a ring? And the point of Joe Giardi leaving because of a hat. You make no sense and remind me of a blinded yankee fan.
but back to Boggs vs. Ripken.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
KP=Puckett
Category=Leader
G= DM
AB= KP, leads by 241
R=KP, leads by 64
H=KP, leads by 151
2b=DM
3b=KP, leads by 37
HR=DM
RBI=DM
BB=DM
SO=KP, leads by 521
SB=KP, leads by 120
CS=KP, leads by leads by 67
BA=KP, leads by .011
Not a big difference AT ALL. So to say that Mattingly shouldn't be in the Hall is an uneduacated statement
Add to the fact that Pucketts career was cut short and he still had more good years left in him.
Pucketts last year
Games-137
AB-538
runs-83
hits-169
2b-39
hrs-23
rbi-99
bb-56
BA-.314
mattingly last year
Games-128
AB-458
runs-59
hits-132
2b-32
hrs-7
rbi-49
bb-40
BA-.288
Puckett still more years in him. Mattingly was done. Puckett playing another 4-5 years and he's close to 3000 hits which is an automatic to get in.
But back to Boggs vs. Ripken
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
Manny-Offered more money by the sox's. Yanks didn't want to go that high for him
Arod-To expensive and they already have a Franchise player in Jeter.
What I'm trying to say is, whenever a superstar free agent comes up, 9 times out of 10, they look for an offer from the Yanks.
BTW-If helton avg. .340 for the next 7-8 yrs, he will be considered one of the top hitters. MLB teams do play away games. Just a FYI
<< <i>The Yankees were serious contenders for all of those free agents except for Bonds b/c he is old. The reason Giradi left is b/c Steiny told him NOT to where the hat, he wore it. He didn't play in a Yanks uniform the next season. Giradi actually had an interview about it after he left the Yanks. As you could see, I said that the Yanks were in the running. We were supposed to get Jaunzo. Oh well.
Manny-Offered more money by the sox's. Yanks didn't want to go that high for him
Arod-To expensive and they already have a Franchise player in Jeter.
What I'm trying to say is, whenever a superstar free agent comes up, 9 times out of 10, they look for an offer from the Yanks.
BTW-If helton avg. .340 for the next 7-8 yrs, he will be considered one of the top hitters. MLB teams do play away games. Just a FYI >>
helton will not due to the fact he played half his games at Coors. If Mays, Musial, Schmidt played half their games at Coors 1000 homers in a career would have been done.
I could care less about Giardi and his hat....big deal. Once again, this free agent era of baseball is not baseball. Big deal the Yanks are in the running for free agents.
What's next...Paul O'Neill for the hall of fame? What about Brousis...he left the A's to get a ring...he should be in the Hall too......buwhhahahahahaha
Still waiting for Autos answer......guess I will have to wait til tomorrow as I am off to bed.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
Brocius-Never liked the guy. Shoulda stuck to the Raines/Bogg combo.
Baseball Almanac!
or
Baseball Reference!
Gettin a little late here, I will post tomorrow about this never-ending thread....lol
~Austin
I'm back - you better believe it
oh and as for boggs playing in a hitters park does that mean that all of TED WILLIAMS accomplishments are nothing becouse he played in that same "hitters park" ??
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REFS Johnscottanthony,injun01, haliguy, FatKat, autobilia,awaltz,coachvinny, raf12,thematrix31,duncangal, Kenny21, and many more
and seriously folks, lets not bring mattingly into this, because we know he with be HOFer FOR SURE.
Paul O'Neill in the Hall?? Are you kidding me?
Earlier regarding Ripken, you said that the Hall is not a popularity contest. But then when you say no I don't like Brosuis, is that not a popularity contest?
And for the comment about Ted Williams...remember he missed his prime years due to the war. One more reason to totally give respect to the man. Could you see A-Rod....Jeter....Nomar...Bonds or anybody in todays game missing their prime years to serve the country?
And Auto my friend....still waitng for an answer....hehe
Thanks
Dan & Kat
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
But back to Boggs vs. Ripken.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
Boggs Vs. Ripken
Its over, Boggs is a much better player overall. Simple, no way to get around it.
To get elected into the Hall you need to get 75% of the vote. Mr. Mattingly became eligible to get votes in 2001. Here are the results.....
2002 he got 20.34% of the vote
2001 he got 28.16 % of the vote
Not a good trend that his votes are going down kids.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>Why don't you ever give reasons? I could care less about your personal feelings on the players, but why they don't belong.
Boggs Vs. Ripken
Its over, Boggs is a much better player overall. Simple, no way to get around it. >>
Did I not ask Auto seperate Boggs stats at Fenway compared to yankee staduim? Boggs was a product of his environment at Fenway...simple as that.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>Kids
Paul O'Neill in the Hall?? Are you kidding me?
Earlier regarding Ripken, you said that the Hall is not a popularity contest. But then when you say no I don't like Brosuis, is that not a popularity contest?
And for the comment about Ted Williams...remember he missed his prime years due to the war. One more reason to totally give respect to the man. Could you see A-Rod....Jeter....Nomar...Bonds or anybody in todays game missing their prime years to serve the country?
And Auto my friend....still waitng for an answer....hehe
Thanks
Dan & Kat >>
Umm, what's the question? If you referring to Boggs w/ Boston, I've already answered that question. Even after he left Boston, he was older and near the end of his career.. YET still hit over .300 with Yankees and Tampa Bay (.307 to be exact). Now, he hit over .300 15 of his 17 seasons. Hit .292 with Yankees once and .280 with Tampa Bay once. He states suppose to get worst near the end of his career, but .300+ is still above average. And you act as if they only play home games. What about on the road? I guess all games were at Fenway, right?
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>Auto......answer this
So if Todd Helton plays 7-8 more years and averages .340...he a better hitter than Stan Musial or Carew or Brett or Gwynn...give me a break...the ballpark you play in makes a huge difference. >>
Let's break this down. When Todd Helton was doing the .400 race, he was hitting .362 on the road ('nuff said). Next question. And if you want to get very technical about it, most Negro Leaguers was not allowed to play baseball back then and when they did, they were older players. So, if you reduce your competition, of course you will look like a great.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>but .440 at home right >>
Doesn't matter. .362 is still better than majority of the MLB batting average. .362 would definately been in the race for a batting title.
"Just when they think they got all the answers, I change the questions."
-- Roddy Piper
<< <i>And who beat him for the batting title? >>
You tell me.. tired of being the one posting all the stats. Helton is consistent every year. And yo uhave to make contact with the ball to get a possible hit. Also, Helton was in the race to break the most doubles in a season record.