<< <i>Ruh-roh. I've gone through about 150 more cards and this is the best of the bunch. Absolutely no stars, and the centering is wildly off. These cards are the best of that group......that's it. A little worried about the integrity of this box, boys.
I guess you should have dusted for finger prints before you got started huh?
Well fellas, that's about it. I got a nice Seaver and a few others, but zero Aarons, zero Winfields, zero Schmidts, one Ryan, and zero Roses. Collation looked weird......anyone with vending knowledge do some cards go in one direction and others go in the other direction? Cause that's how these were. And, many of the cards that were spot on centered had fish eyes. Hmmm. Plus, just about every traded card in the set appeared twice.
This was fun, but this is exactly why I don't open (or own) much of this stuff. I don't trust it.
I'll post the remaining scans tomorrow.
Ron Burgundy
Buying Vintage, all sports. Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
Nothing wrong with quoting. Removes the possibility that someone might think you are replying to something else.
Collecting PSA graded Steve Young, Marcus Allen, Bret Saberhagen and 1980s Topps Cards. Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
I've never seen a '74 vending box with that sort of packing composite. They've either been all smooth (rare) or the standard narrow/wide pattern (much more common). I would've been leery as soon as I lifted the lid.
Unofficial count is 69 out of 500 cards (I presume there were 500, maybe I should check that too) that would grade 8 or better. Not 9, 8. 14%. Dunno if that is the norm with 70's vending or not.
Again, I'm a bit of a novice at older unopened......but I did note the collation pattern of this box compared with the few other vending boxes looked way different. The others have the curl throughout.
Ron Burgundy
Buying Vintage, all sports. Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
I think you did okay with a couple nice cards early on at least, especially considering I'm virtually certain that box was picked through.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
This is a box that Ron gave me a price on and I accepted but he wouldn't sell it to me because he didn't know for sure if it was good or not. Glad Ron is a seller with integrity. Like Bill said, I think you could tell that the cards had been out of the box before by the way they looked in the box. Compare that to the way the '78 box and the '83 case I just busted all looked like.
In your photo scan RON---TOP..going down 1st 3 inches looked flipped as soon as i saw the scan. Then continuing down to the 7-9 inch point.. has been shuffled, and most definitely the bottom 1 inch. I personally opened alot of vending in the mid 70's and it ALWAYS had that 1/4 inch pattern. I'm no expert..i would send this scan to bbce for their opine....
<< <i>Well fellas, that's about it. I got a nice Seaver and a few others, but zero Aarons, zero Winfields, zero Schmidts, one Ryan, and zero Roses. Collation looked weird......anyone with vending knowledge do some cards go in one direction and others go in the other direction? Cause that's how these were. And, many of the cards that were spot on centered had fish eyes. Hmmm. Plus, just about every traded card in the set appeared twice.
This was fun, but this is exactly why I don't open (or own) much of this stuff. I don't trust it.
I'll post the remaining scans tomorrow. >>
Ron, this is a 1990 vending box that I have that I pulled from a case many years ago and you'll note the cards all going in the same direction.....I'm in no ways an expert on these but one would think that they would have been all facing the same direction.....tough luck if it was tampered with but at least you did get some nice cards. take care al.
Yes, the box came from Felicia. It was part of a deal I did when I purchased her '55 Topps set. Two '74 vending boxes (that's why I opened one, to have one left......so much for that).
I looked at the other '74 box this morning. It looks similar, maybe not quite as weird. Should I scan it as well to get opinions?
The box wasn't horrible, I'll throw up a scan of the Seaver I got and some other nice cards. But it sure feels like it was picked thru at some point, judging by the board's opinions of the collation, the absence of most stars, etc.
Ron Burgundy
Buying Vintage, all sports. Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
Geez, you would think the scumbag who picked through it and then had the scammer's gall to offer it to someone else as an original unopened box, would have at least had the brains to place the cards back in the right direction - a scammer and a dumb scammer at that.
Yes, the box came from Felicia. It was part of a deal I did when I purchased her '55 Topps set. Two '74 vending boxes (that's why I opened one, to have one left......so much for that).
I looked at the other '74 box this morning. It looks similar, maybe not quite as weird. Should I scan it as well to get opinions?
The box wasn't horrible, I'll throw up a scan of the Seaver I got and some other nice cards. But it sure feels like it was picked thru at some point, judging by the board's opinions of the collation, the absence of most stars, etc. >>
You had mentioned about talking to Steve to see if the box was legit a while back. Did you show it to him? If so, I'd be interested in his opinion. To me the collation also doesn't look right. Sorry the results were less than you hoped for.
<< <i>Yes, the box came from a man posing as a woman named Felicia. It was part of a deal I did when I purchased his '55 Topps set. Two '74 vending boxes (that's why I opened one, to have one left......so much for that). >>
I took the box to the National with me to get Steve's opinion, but never had time to find him. May take the other one to Chicago to see what he thinks.
Ron Burgundy
Buying Vintage, all sports. Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
<< <i>Geez, you would think the scumbag who picked through it and then had the scammer's gall to offer it to someone else as an original unopened box, would have at least had the brains to place the cards back in the right direction - a scammer and a dumb scammer at that. >>
Steve that is impossible to do.
Once cards are removed one can never get that sequence look back.
Even if you put all the cards back the way you took them out.
<< <i>I'm surprised you pulled the Ryan. It looks like someone knew the collation and cherry picked the Winfields and Schmidts. >>
All depends on when it was searched. The star power cards he pulled (Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, Bench, Yaz) weren't exactly the sought after cards in the mid to late 80's
<< <i>I'm surprised you pulled the Ryan. It looks like someone knew the collation and cherry picked the Winfields and Schmidts. >>
All depends on when it was searched. The star power cards he pulled (Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, Bench, Yaz) weren't exactly the sought after cards in the mid to late 80's >>
True. Without reviewing what was pulled, the absence of the likes of the Aarons, Yount, Brett, Dave Parker, Munson and Schmidt would be an indication of the era in which it were searched. This list would change as time went on and Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, et al became as desirable.
If I were searching modern unopened boxes, I would leave nm/mt star cards and pull all the mint+ stuff. The real money is in the 10's and leaving the star cards leaves some doubt in the victim's mind. I don't think the Ryan being there means anything. Sounds to me like the box was searched post-grading, though I admit I really don't know how many 9's a 74 vending box should yield. But if I read his comments right, this box didn't yield any.
I've only busted 80's vending boxes, but I've also never seen a collation like that.
<< <i>I'm surprised you pulled the Ryan. It looks like someone knew the collation and cherry picked the Winfields and Schmidts. >>
All depends on when it was searched. The star power cards he pulled (Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, Bench, Yaz) weren't exactly the sought after cards in the mid to late 80's >>
True. Without reviewing what was pulled, the absence of the likes of the Aarons, Yount, Brett, Dave Parker, Munson and Schmidt would be an indication of the era in which it were searched. This list would change as time went on and Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, et al became as desirable. >>
Does not suprise me one bit that there were no Younts or Bretts pulled.
it is entirely possible that a dealer pulled out the cards he wanted based on knowledge of the sequence and then just shoved the rest of the cards back in the box without even inspecting all of them...this kind of practice was typical before gem mint commons and set building turned vending into a gold mine.....it's also entirely possible that after the required cards were pulled, the rest never saw the light of day again until Burgundy opened the box.....what may have been an innocent grab at the time turned into a bummer for him....as for the runs of cards terribly cut, miscut, misprinted, oversized, undersized, etc.....all of that is common to vending boxes as well.....i've opened some Golden Egg boxes, but i've also seen quite a few turds.
Am petty sure Felicia bought a full case of 74's at some point, as she sold me a few thousand 74 vending cards a while back - all sorted numerically.
Looks to me like she may have been looking for a specific card or two - and half searched RB's box(es). The cards in my vending lot were all 6-8ish like these. Centering was worse than average as I recall.
She was certainly upright in all of her dealings with me (extremely), and all of the 76 vending boxes she sold from the two cases she bought (to me and a few others here).
The pattern looks to be going both ways in those old photobuckets too - either the case wasn't as fresh as she thought or they were somehow stuffed differently in late '74?
In leiu of recent events on the boards concerning the Jordan RC clearly pulled from an unopened pack and then graded EOT I am going to hold off openeing the 74 case. I MUST protect my investment. It is clear that something is going on and I have invested a huge amount of money in this case. It will hold its value closed and I wont be concerned with pulling cards only to get the dreaded EOT when the only way to recoup any monies is to get fair grades on my cards. I realize this is a disappointment to you guys as it is for me but please put yourselves in my shoes.
Would you open a case of this magnitude in light of recent events? I will watch closely the outcome of the Jordan and base my decision in openeing it in the future on the resolution of this issue at hand.
I am sorry everybody. But I reached this decision after much debate in my head and will not budge on this right now.
Not trying to stir up anything on this but find the underlined interesting because on the same date (March 11th 2009) the pictures were taken of the opened box.
I went back through the nice cards that I pulled and it's apparent that if these were searched (seems likely) that someone knew what they were doing. The cards that looked very clean, most of them had slight flaws here and there - fisheyes, stray print, an edge issue, or a slightly soft corner. Looks like someone was pulling for low pop 9's and 10's - and stars - and leave the rest. Even the Seaver I pulled that looked like an easy 9 at first glance has print.
No idea what Felicia's role in this may have been. I do know I purchased the boxes fully relying on her reputation here. Looks like I should've researched her previous comments about the 74 vending, but I never thought twice about buying from her. Until now. I do remember hearing that the boxes came from BBCE. I will send this link to Steve Hart for input. As for her '55 set, I sold it. I also got several unopened packs in the deal. Coincidentally, I just submitted those to PSA at the National. That'll be interesting to say the least.
Ron Burgundy
Buying Vintage, all sports. Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
The Jordan EOT situation, that was a pretty lame reason. I remember thinking at the time, what the hell does a Jordan rookie have to do with 74T baseball?
S/he obviously opened the fist box out of the case, quickly decided s/he didn't like the star selection, quality, or both, and put them back in. That's when she decided she wasn't going to open the rest and when she posted her message on the board.
S/he may have even accidentally sold this one as unopened, if it got mixed back in with the rest of the unopened case.
Comments
I'm rootin' for a PSA 9ish card #1
Steve
<< <i>Ruh-roh. I've gone through about 150 more cards and this is the best of the bunch. Absolutely no stars, and the centering is wildly off. These cards are the best of that group......that's it. A little worried about the integrity of this box, boys.
I guess you should have dusted for finger prints before you got started huh?
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." Dr. Seuss
<< <i>so do traded cards normally come in vending boxes? >>
Yes, they did in 1974.
Steve
<< <i>
<< <i>so do traded cards normally come in vending boxes? >>
Yes, they did in 1974 (and also in 1976). It wasn't until the 1981 traded set that Topps went to the separate boxed traded sets.
Steve >>
Sorry.....I "quoted" my post instead of "editing" it
Steve
This was fun, but this is exactly why I don't open (or own) much of this stuff. I don't trust it.
I'll post the remaining scans tomorrow.
Buying Vintage, all sports.
Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
Looking for 1970 MLB Photostamps
- uncut
Positive Transactions - tennesseebanker, Ahmanfan, Donruss, Colebear, CDsNuts, rbdjr1, Downtown1974, yankeeno7, drewsef, mnolan, mrbud60, msassin, RipublicaninMass, AkbarClone, rustywilly, lsutigers1973, julen23 and nam812, plus many others...
1971 Topps vending
Even if it IS a Steve Hart product.
Always buying Bobby Cox inserts. PM me.
Again, I'm a bit of a novice at older unopened......but I did note the collation pattern of this box compared with the few other vending boxes looked way different. The others have the curl throughout.
Buying Vintage, all sports.
Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
Sad but true for vintage "unopened" packs.
"Molon Labe"
<< <i>You've given us some entertainment if nothing else. I'm going to guess, however, you WON'T be bidding on this.
1971 Topps vending
Even if it IS a Steve Hart product. >>
If Steve Hart says its good, then by golly, it must be good.
I think you did okay with a couple nice cards early on at least, especially considering I'm virtually certain that box was picked through.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>It was pretty easy to tell from the pic with cards in the box that the cards had been removed before. >>
Yes it was.
Steve
In your photo scan RON---TOP..going down 1st 3 inches looked flipped as soon as i saw the scan. Then continuing down to the 7-9 inch point.. has been shuffled, and most definitely the bottom 1 inch. I personally opened alot of vending in the mid 70's and it ALWAYS had that 1/4 inch pattern. I'm no expert..i would send this scan to bbce for their opine....
<< <i>Well fellas, that's about it. I got a nice Seaver and a few others, but zero Aarons, zero Winfields, zero Schmidts, one Ryan, and zero Roses. Collation looked weird......anyone with vending knowledge do some cards go in one direction and others go in the other direction? Cause that's how these were. And, many of the cards that were spot on centered had fish eyes. Hmmm. Plus, just about every traded card in the set appeared twice.
This was fun, but this is exactly why I don't open (or own) much of this stuff. I don't trust it.
I'll post the remaining scans tomorrow. >>
Ron, this is a 1990 vending box that I have that I pulled from a case many years ago and you'll note the cards all going in the same direction.....I'm in no ways an expert on these but one would think that they would have been all facing the same direction.....tough luck if it was tampered with but at least you did get some nice cards. take care al.
Yes, the box came from Felicia. It was part of a deal I did when I purchased her '55 Topps set. Two '74 vending boxes (that's why I opened one, to have one left......so much for that).
I looked at the other '74 box this morning. It looks similar, maybe not quite as weird. Should I scan it as well to get opinions?
The box wasn't horrible, I'll throw up a scan of the Seaver I got and some other nice cards. But it sure feels like it was picked thru at some point, judging by the board's opinions of the collation, the absence of most stars, etc.
Buying Vintage, all sports.
Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
<< <i>A couple of comments:
Yes, the box came from Felicia. It was part of a deal I did when I purchased her '55 Topps set. Two '74 vending boxes (that's why I opened one, to have one left......so much for that).
I looked at the other '74 box this morning. It looks similar, maybe not quite as weird. Should I scan it as well to get opinions?
The box wasn't horrible, I'll throw up a scan of the Seaver I got and some other nice cards. But it sure feels like it was picked thru at some point, judging by the board's opinions of the collation, the absence of most stars, etc. >>
You had mentioned about talking to Steve to see if the box was legit a while back. Did you show it to him? If so, I'd be interested in his opinion. To me the collation also doesn't look right. Sorry the results were less than you hoped for.
<< <i>Yes, the box came from a man posing as a woman named Felicia. It was part of a deal I did when I purchased his '55 Topps set. Two '74 vending boxes (that's why I opened one, to have one left......so much for that). >>
I fixed it for you.
I'm not saying that this is a bad box, but so many of these "untouched vending box examples" are at least in my mind ..... a complete myth.
Buying Vintage, all sports.
Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
<< <i>Geez, you would think the scumbag who picked through it and then had the scammer's gall to offer it to someone else as an original unopened box, would have at least had the brains to place the cards back in the right direction - a scammer and a dumb scammer at that. >>
Steve that is impossible to do.
Once cards are removed one can never get that sequence look back.
Even if you put all the cards back the way you took them out.
Steve
<< <i>I'm surprised you pulled the Ryan. It looks like someone knew the collation and cherry picked the Winfields and Schmidts. >>
All depends on when it was searched. The star power cards he pulled (Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, Bench, Yaz) weren't exactly the sought after cards in the mid to late 80's
<< <i>
<< <i>I'm surprised you pulled the Ryan. It looks like someone knew the collation and cherry picked the Winfields and Schmidts. >>
All depends on when it was searched. The star power cards he pulled (Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, Bench, Yaz) weren't exactly the sought after cards in the mid to late 80's >>
True. Without reviewing what was pulled, the absence of the likes of the Aarons, Yount, Brett, Dave Parker, Munson and Schmidt would be an indication of the era in which it were searched. This list would change as time went on and Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, et al became as desirable.
I've only busted 80's vending boxes, but I've also never seen a collation like that.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I'm surprised you pulled the Ryan. It looks like someone knew the collation and cherry picked the Winfields and Schmidts. >>
All depends on when it was searched. The star power cards he pulled (Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, Bench, Yaz) weren't exactly the sought after cards in the mid to late 80's >>
True. Without reviewing what was pulled, the absence of the likes of the Aarons, Yount, Brett, Dave Parker, Munson and Schmidt would be an indication of the era in which it were searched. This list would change as time went on and Ryan, Fisk, Seaver, et al became as desirable. >>
Does not suprise me one bit that there were no Younts or Bretts pulled.
just my 2 cents.
MY GOLD TYPE SET https://pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/complete-type-sets/gold-type-set-12-piece-circulation-strikes-1839-1933/publishedset/321940
Looks to me like she may have been looking for a specific card or two - and half searched RB's box(es). The cards in my vending lot were all 6-8ish like these. Centering was worse than average as I recall.
She was certainly upright in all of her dealings with me (extremely), and all of the 76 vending boxes she sold from the two cases she bought (to me and a few others here).
Still a bummer to have 300 or so picked clean.
Bosox1976
<< <i>Am petty sure Felicia bought a full case of 74's at some point >>
Ain't it great to save pictures because here is the case that was in her Photobucket account.
And the box that was opened in this thread.
Jeff
Miscut Museum
My Mess
<< <i>Does not suprise me one bit that there were no Younts or Bretts pulled. >>
lol me either.
The star cards he did pull if anyone noticed was from the first 1/4 of the box the part with the factory sequence intact.
Then he went to that middle section that did not have the sequence and pulled basically zilch.
A few here knew from the get go that the box had been messed with simply by looking at it.
I simply agreed at the time with Grote, not wanting to start any shirt.
Ron if you still need Steve BBCE to look at it simply send him the scan you showed here.
A vending box looks exactly like Al showed earlier.
A few days ago Tommy Corvette showed a good one as well.
Not sure how you did not see it?
As for Felicia I have no idea what her part is in this besides selling it.
For all we know she assumed it was good.
Steve
Good stuff Jeff.
Bosox1976
Page 3 on March 11th 2009
In leiu of recent events on the boards concerning the Jordan RC clearly pulled from an unopened pack and then graded EOT I am going to hold off openeing the 74 case. I MUST protect my investment. It is clear that something is going on and I have invested a huge amount of money in this case.
It will hold its value closed and I wont be concerned with pulling cards only to get the dreaded EOT when the only way to recoup any monies is to get fair grades on my cards. I realize this is a disappointment to you guys as it is for me but please put yourselves in my shoes.
Would you open a case of this magnitude in light of recent events?
I will watch closely the outcome of the Jordan and base my decision in openeing it in the future on the resolution of this issue at hand.
I am sorry everybody. But I reached this decision after much debate in my head and will not budge on this right now.
Not trying to stir up anything on this but find the underlined interesting because on the same date (March 11th 2009) the pictures were taken of the opened box.
Jeff
Miscut Museum
My Mess
Steve
I went back through the nice cards that I pulled and it's apparent that if these were searched (seems likely) that someone knew what they were doing. The cards that looked very clean, most of them had slight flaws here and there - fisheyes, stray print, an edge issue, or a slightly soft corner. Looks like someone was pulling for low pop 9's and 10's - and stars - and leave the rest. Even the Seaver I pulled that looked like an easy 9 at first glance has print.
No idea what Felicia's role in this may have been. I do know I purchased the boxes fully relying on her reputation here. Looks like I should've researched her previous comments about the 74 vending, but I never thought twice about buying from her. Until now. I do remember hearing that the boxes came from BBCE. I will send this link to Steve Hart for input. As for her '55 set, I sold it. I also got several unopened packs in the deal. Coincidentally, I just submitted those to PSA at the National. That'll be interesting to say the least.
Buying Vintage, all sports.
Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
S/he obviously opened the fist box out of the case, quickly decided s/he didn't like the star selection, quality, or both, and put them back in. That's when she decided she wasn't going to open the rest and when she posted her message on the board.
S/he may have even accidentally sold this one as unopened, if it got mixed back in with the rest of the unopened case.