Dealer Evaluated My Coin Collection
Mowgli
Posts: 1,219 ✭
I had a dealer look over my coin collection last night and today to see what he thought of it.
I have never sold a coin or had anyone really look at my coins in 15 years - I was nervous.
There were between 25-30 Dansco albums.
Maybe everyone already knows what I am about to say and I was the last to know but
I'd like to share what I learned; your opinions will vary.
Franklins bought in the album from say JS - are not all MS 63s or UNCs. Both mine and my father's sets of these have all the key dates in AU. A lesson learned. This lesson was reinforced when I found my Dansco short set of Walkers were also scattered with AUs - the same Mr. JS - a more expensive lesson.
No one cares how nice your Roosevelt Dansco dimes are - and mine were taken one by one from mint sets. You cannot sell these at bid.
Average unc Kennedy halves, Eisenhower dollars, Jefferson nickels (and these are nice ) - are not going to bring more than bid.
I realize that registry coins for these denominations might bring monster money but only to other registry builders, my dealer says most of his dealer-friends are amazed at what some of these go for but do not want to play in that area.
I was disappointed that some of my Lincolns had turned over the past 20 years which made me question the wisdom of keeping MS copper in an album. Since only a few developed spots I have to assume that something was on those coins that I never saw when I bought them.
Messed-with seated coinage in VF-AU is not that unusual and tolerated more than I would have thought (not that everyone does)
Having used old standards to buy coins pays off in today's market where it is much harder to buys MS 63 four diamond IHC or full horn XF-AU Buffalos.
Lastly, working with a knowledgeable dealer seems to result in acquiring more accurately graded and problem free coins - none of these sets had any problems coins.
Some of what I learned was painful but not terribly expensive. I got enough positive feedback on most of my sets to make me believe that even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while.
I have never sold a coin or had anyone really look at my coins in 15 years - I was nervous.
There were between 25-30 Dansco albums.
Maybe everyone already knows what I am about to say and I was the last to know but
I'd like to share what I learned; your opinions will vary.
Franklins bought in the album from say JS - are not all MS 63s or UNCs. Both mine and my father's sets of these have all the key dates in AU. A lesson learned. This lesson was reinforced when I found my Dansco short set of Walkers were also scattered with AUs - the same Mr. JS - a more expensive lesson.
No one cares how nice your Roosevelt Dansco dimes are - and mine were taken one by one from mint sets. You cannot sell these at bid.
Average unc Kennedy halves, Eisenhower dollars, Jefferson nickels (and these are nice ) - are not going to bring more than bid.
I realize that registry coins for these denominations might bring monster money but only to other registry builders, my dealer says most of his dealer-friends are amazed at what some of these go for but do not want to play in that area.
I was disappointed that some of my Lincolns had turned over the past 20 years which made me question the wisdom of keeping MS copper in an album. Since only a few developed spots I have to assume that something was on those coins that I never saw when I bought them.
Messed-with seated coinage in VF-AU is not that unusual and tolerated more than I would have thought (not that everyone does)
Having used old standards to buy coins pays off in today's market where it is much harder to buys MS 63 four diamond IHC or full horn XF-AU Buffalos.
Lastly, working with a knowledgeable dealer seems to result in acquiring more accurately graded and problem free coins - none of these sets had any problems coins.
Some of what I learned was painful but not terribly expensive. I got enough positive feedback on most of my sets to make me believe that even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while.
In the land of the blind the one-eyed man is king.
0
Comments
Many collectors do nothing but buy for a long time. When they realize what the market will pay they often either get disillusioned or disgusted. I had gotten c cky thinking I was good but got creamed on a few raw coins early on. All I'm saying is it was good to learn that lesson early on.
The enjoyment of putting these sets together has bin left out in lue of value.
- Marcus Tullius Cicero, 106-43 BC
If it were my collection and if I still enjoyed it, I would continue to work on it over time, upgrading the coins that still need upgrading and I would be proud of how it looks. I wouldn't get crazy about overpaying for the upgrades, but I'd still do it simply for the enjoyment. If all the collections that are similar to yours get sold off for nominal amounts over time, your collection will start to rise to the top. Things change.
Here's a thought. If you are not being forced to sell, keep what you like, be much more discriminating, and from now on - if you are looking to profit, collect modern bullion coins directly from the Mint. At least they will track bullion and many of them gather up nice premiums in the process.
After my childhood collection was stolen during a move, I decided to focus on the investment aspects of collecting modern bullion and it has been rewarding. But, if I had been able to keep my old collection (which was similar to yours) I would have taken the advice that I just mentioned.
I knew it would happen.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I ordered a few Walkers & Peace dollars from them several years back.
HH
1947-P & D; 1948-D; 1949-P & S; 1950-D & S; and 1952-S.
Any help locating any of these OBW rolls would be gratefully appreciated!
<< <i>Thanks for sharing. Your experience reinforces a strongly held opinion of mine: sell some coins.
Many collectors do nothing but buy for a long time. When they realize what the market will pay they often either get disillusioned or disgusted. I had gotten c cky thinking I was good but got creamed on a few raw coins early on. All I'm saying is it was good to learn that lesson early on. >>
I absolutely agree with CW. Occasionally selling some coins will teach you useful lessons about the dealers from whom you bought the coins in the first place, and about changes in the coin market (grading standards, popularity with collectors, etc.). And this exercise will enable you to prune your collection, which helps you to keep some type of focus (if that matters to you).
It's nice to think of coin collecting as simply an enjoyable hobby. However, for many of us collectors, the financial aspects cannot be ignored. Anyone who buys $1,000+ coins should think about getting value when buying, and also about an exit strategy when it comes time to sell. It is possible to collect nice coins and still lose money when selling them, because of a market downturn or a poorly thought-out sales plan.
Collectors need to make an effort to learn important realities about the business end of the hobby, including what dealers look for when buying for stock, pros/cons of various venues for selling coins, how coins are priced, consequences of buying coins in a niche area, etc.
Several dealers have told me that 95+% of coin collectors will lose money because they make too many mistakes (buying overgraded coins, buying problem coins, paying moon money for a coin at an auction, etc.). Clever marketing has been repeatedly used by sellers (telemarketers/dealers/U.S. Mint, etc.) to stampede collectors into making foolish purchases. TPGs have become clever marketers too (registry sets, early release slabs, etc.). Typical B&M dealers don't see many genuinely nice coins from walk-in sellers these days.
Thirty years ago, I went through an experience similar to Mowgli's. It was not merely educational (I was also admonished to buy books and catalogs)-- it fundamentally changed the way I think about coin collecting.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
<< <i>The age of raw coins in albums is over unless you are collecting very ordinary material. My local dealer tells me that demand for "in album" sets of Unc./Proof Kennedy Halves and Ike Dollars is virtually nil. Bid for those sets actually sounds too generous. >>
I agree. Albums are like floppy discs. A relic of decades passed. Slabs just have more excitement factor, even though you cannot access the coin directly, you can still inspect individual coins more in depth than in an album. They just come across more investment like and in this day an age the idea of investment is what excites people. Even if that is not what you are colelcting for. Albums are cumbersome and clumsy and IMO kinda make the coins generic in much the same way a pile of coins might. Dont get me wrong I like raw coins. But I like them in plastic 2x2s or air tights.
Fun coins should go into albums and investment quality coins are best kept in the TPG holders (OMG and copper too).
If you made one statement that rings loudly it’s:
<< <i>Lastly, working with a knowledgeable dealer seems to result in acquiring more accurately graded and problem free coins - none of these sets had any problems coins. >>
i might be one of the few here that has seen the OP's coins in person.......he was nice enough to let me flip through his Dansco's one evening and i must say they are absolute eye candy.......even the one's he might be calling 'problem coins' are very attractive.......AU/MS sliders in about every U.S. series one can imagine
to the OP: you have a collection to be proud of
www.brunkauctions.com
The dealer is a personal friend who spend two days visiting me so his goal was not to screw me out of anything. He just offered to look at my coins and swap coin stories - a most wonderful time. In fact most of my sets he told me to keep because they were nice.
He did point out where to up grade my Walkers and Mercs - which was extremely helpful as my "eye" was not as good when I did these sets.
I concentrated on the negatives (because I'm that way and it was how I used to make a living) but these paled in comparison to the positives I got from this process - finding that many of my sets were nicer than I thought (per this dealer's opinion.
As for plastic - well, some coins will definitely need to be slabbed when it comes time to sell because that's the market. I like my Danscos; the profit is secondary to my collecting habits.
Thanks for your comments
for I'm a modern basher. If you asked he would have shown you the secret handshake too.
Everybody should go through this experience. Indeed, everyone should sell some of his
coins from time to time because otherwise it's not really possible to know if you're paying
too much. It's when you actually go to sell that you learn what coins are worth.
And don't sell any moderns whatsoever to anyone who is "amazed at what some of these
go for" or you'll probably get a fraction of their value. There is some truth to the contention
that raw moderns are hard to sell at a premium, but only some truth and there's no law
that says they can't be sent in for grading.
<< <i>If you're buying raw coins for your own enjoyment, who cares what anyone says, but if you are spending a lot of money with the idea of someday getting at least a good deal of it back, you can't be buying raw coins. >>
I question the above statement. Wouldn't it depend on what kind of coins were bought, from whom, and what kind of price was paid? Someone paying full boat retail price for slabbed coins from a retail dealer is much more likely to be buried financially than someone buying raw coins at fair wholesale prices from other collectors. If comparing two collectors, both paying full retail, I would guess that the slabbed buyer might get more of a percentage of their money back when they sell, but the slabbed buyer likely will have a bigger dollar loss because they spent much more money.
As for albums being dead--I don't agree. Lots of folks still fill albums. The caveat is that with coins over a certain value, or above a certain grade, raw coins in albums are not the best way to proceed, because handling the coins and album storage makes it more likely that they get impaired or damaged.
Sounds like the story has a happy ending. No problem coins with over a dozen full albums? Wow, that is beyond impressive. Only a small percentage of AU sliders in albums full of uncs? Again, wow, that is way above average.
<< <i>Saying that he and his "dealer-friends are amazed at what some of these go for" is jargon
for I'm a modern basher. If you asked he would have shown you the secret handshake too.
Everybody should go through this experience. Indeed, everyone should sell some of his
coins from time to time because otherwise it's not really possible to know if you're paying
too much. It's when you actually go to sell that you learn what coins are worth.
And don't sell any moderns whatsoever to anyone who is "amazed at what some of these
go for" or you'll probably get a fraction of their value. There is some truth to the contention
that raw moderns are hard to sell at a premium, but only some truth and there's no law
that says they can't be sent in for grading. >>
Well said.
Just to see for myself.
<< <i>I had a dealer look over my coin collection last night and today to see what he thought of it.
I have never sold a coin or had anyone really look at my coins in 15 years - I was nervous.
There were between 25-30 Dansco albums.
Maybe everyone already knows what I am about to say and I was the last to know but
I'd like to share what I learned; your opinions will vary.
Franklins bought in the album from say JS - are not all MS 63s or UNCs. Both mine and my father's sets of these have all the key dates in AU. A lesson learned. This lesson was reinforced when I found my Dansco short set of Walkers were also scattered with AUs - the same Mr. JS - a more expensive lesson.
No one cares how nice your Roosevelt Dansco dimes are - and mine were taken one by one from mint sets. You cannot sell these at bid.
Average unc Kennedy halves, Eisenhower dollars, Jefferson nickels (and these are nice ) - are not going to bring more than bid.
I realize that registry coins for these denominations might bring monster money but only to other registry builders, my dealer says most of his dealer-friends are amazed at what some of these go for but do not want to play in that area.
I was disappointed that some of my Lincolns had turned over the past 20 years which made me question the wisdom of keeping MS copper in an album. Since only a few developed spots I have to assume that something was on those coins that I never saw when I bought them.
Messed-with seated coinage in VF-AU is not that unusual and tolerated more than I would have thought (not that everyone does)
Having used old standards to buy coins pays off in today's market where it is much harder to buys MS 63 four diamond IHC or full horn XF-AU Buffalos.
Lastly, working with a knowledgeable dealer seems to result in acquiring more accurately graded and problem free coins - none of these sets had any problems coins.
Some of what I learned was painful but not terribly expensive. I got enough positive feedback on most of my sets to make me believe that even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while. >>
I had basically the same experience a couple years ago. It really opened my eyes about the importance of acquiring genuine quality instead of common hoarding.
as well as the hunt for nice coins. However, another aspect which
is often overlooked by collectors is the value aspect. When you accumulate
with no plan or guidance, you end up with either a motley assortment of
common coins, or a grouping of expensive coins, that may not be the grade
and value you think they are.
For the collector that brags about never ever selling a coin from their collection,
one may ask how in the world do you every really know what a coin or collection
is worth in the market place. After a collector has been at it for a number of years,
it is not unusual for even an average J6P to have spent 5-10 thousand dollars on
their collection. Only by occasionally selling a coin can you tell the following:
1. Am I collecting the right series of coins
2. Is the source I am getting my coins from giving me an honest grade and price.
3.How dumb we actually are ,in not knowing more about the hobby and the series
we are collecting.
Periodically, all collectors must really take the time to think thru what they collect,
how they collect and what the avenues are to dispose of the collection if needs be.
You could become bored with the series you collect, you might have lost a sizable
amount of money on your collection ,or now edumacated, you see a better way to
manage your collection.
the
A collector that recognizes their deficiencies and takes corrective action ,is no longer
dumb. They are now smart and on their way to a more enjoyable and satisfying experience,
in all of the aspects of a collection.
Camelot