So what's the safe haven now ?

edmundfitzgerald

Is it cash ?

For me, it's cash and PM's for my spare change.
My retirement money is in a pension fund.

Weiss

Gold.

Weiss

Let me expound.

If someone told you a month ago that the Greek crisis would be getting worse, not better, and that US stocks would slip nearly 1,000 points, but that gold would be stable within ~$50 of its all time high, where would you have stashed your money?

gsa1fan

<< <i>Gold. >>



+1

BBN

<< <i>
My retirement money is in a pension fund. >>



mine is too, but I also opened up an IRA because pensions are becoming unsafe and total garbage.

edmundfitzgerald

<< <i>

mine is too, but I also opened up an IRA because pensions are becoming unsafe and total garbage. >>



Every two weeks $240.00 gets taken out of my pay and put into a pension fund. I would assume that many states
would have big lawsuits if these people realized their pension funds became total garbage.

Justacommeman

When you own gold you become your own Central Bank. I think that's a pretty cool thing.............MJ

BBN

sound just like me. About $250/mo of mine gets put into the system. I agree that if they try to mess with current employees and retirees the govt' workers will have it tied up with years of legal suits. The pension system never became an issue until the lawmakers decided to start borrowing from the pension fund to balance the budget. Are you in IL too?

sbeverly

As quoted by many...

Gold is an asset, that at the same time is not someone else's liability.

BBN

I agree about gold. You own it, no one owes because you own it. My goal is to buy 1/4 oz a month for the next 25 years and then cash in a quarter ounce a month for the rest of my life. My goal of course. May not happen, but at least I'll have a little something there. Part of a diversified plan for my later years.

sumrtym

I'm a big believer in self-directing IRA's, and Roth IRA's if you're young enough.

While many people are still underwater or got wiped out by fraudulent funds, my self-directed stock picks since 2002 are up 45.37%, or an annualized 4.76% return. The S&P 500 return for the same time frame is annualized 2.73%. I tend to be a value over growth guy (yes, I like and respect the Oracle of Omaha) and have a makeup of 82.1% value and 17.6% in growth.

Most will say I'm too conservative for my age, that I should be focusing on growth more. I only do that IF the numbers to me make it a good buy, and I don't trust growth projections that much. The history of the leader of the company, the rest of the management, debt, dividends, all are looked at. For example, I chose a health care company lab because the numbers were good, but also the person who was leading the company had a history of moving from one company to the next every 5-6 years, profitably growing them while there, and orchestrating sales of the company to others to the benefit of the stockholders. That one was no exception.

Others I've chosen because the CEO had a small office, been involved in the industry for years, and operated a small but going company without undue compensation to himself (in New York...imagine that!). At the time, it was paying north of a 10% dividend. Today, it's closer to 3% and the stock is a 71.77% return.

Now, those that love gold will point out that it's had about a 432% increase in the same time period. However, if it's ALL going in gold, that's a big risk to be taking and a pretty high increase compared to everything else during the same time period. I'm still leaning to a strong correction on metals at some point in the next year.

One thing never changes though, it takes money to make money and if you have a lot even small percentages translate to large amounts. Just no matter what you do, diversify!

BBN

<< <i>I'm a big believer in self-directing IRA's, and Roth IRA's if you're young enough.

While many people are still underwater or got wiped out by fraudulent funds, my self-directed stock picks since 2002 are up 45.37%, or an annualized 4.76% return. The S&P 500 return for the same time frame is annualized 2.73%. I tend to be a value over growth guy (yes, I like and respect the Oracle of Omaha) and have a makeup of 82.1% value and 17.6% in growth.

Most will say I'm too conservative for my age, that I should be focusing on growth more. I only do that IF the numbers to me make it a good buy, and I don't trust growth projections that much. The history of the leader of the company, the rest of the management, debt, dividends, all are looked at. For example, I chose a health care company lab because the numbers were good, but also the person who was leading the company had a history of moving from one company to the next every 5-6 years, profitably growing them while there, and orchestrating sales of the company to others to the benefit of the stockholders. That one was no exception.

Others I've chosen because the CEO had a small office, been involved in the industry for years, and operated a small but going company without undue compensation to himself (in New York...imagine that!). At the time, it was paying north of a 10% dividend. Today, it's closer to 3% and the stock is a 71.77% return.

Now, those that love gold will point out that it's had about a 432% increase in the same time period. However, if it's ALL going in gold, that's a big risk to be taking and a pretty high increase compared to everything else during the same time period. I'm still leaning to a strong correction on metals at some point in the next year.

One thing never changes though, it takes money to make money and if you have a lot even small percentages translate to large amounts. Just no matter what you do, diversify! >>




Great post. I do diversify. Pension, IRA, gold.

Wolf359

<< <i>When you own gold you become your own Central Bank. I think that's a pretty cool thing.............MJ >>



I like that. Can I print my own money too?

ocon4008

The US Dollar is "Private" Money Derived from Private Credit.

Scroll down a little; great read.

derryb

VXX

KUCH

<< <i>sound just like me. About $250/mo of mine gets put into the system. I agree that if they try to mess with current employees and retirees the govt' workers will have it tied up with years of legal suits. The pension system never became an issue until the lawmakers decided to start borrowing from the pension fund to balance the budget. Are you in IL too? >>




Sounds like Greece to me?

gecko109

$600/month goes right into my pension. Thats a full 9.125% of my base salary. I would estimate that the average worker in this country puts away no more than 3-5% (if even that much) of their gross each year into retirement accounts, let alone over 9% like I do. Im so sick and tired of reading in the papers what a "burden" the public employye pension systems have become to taxpayers. If everyone in this nation put away 9% of their gross each and every paycheck from age 23, they would ALL be financially able to retire in their mid 50's with a respectable amount of income....just like a public employee on a pension system. But J6P would rather take 3 family vacations a year, remodel their bathroom and kitchen, and get a new car every 4 years than save for retirement.....and thats not my problem.

jmski52

Not everyone will agree with this. In early 2008, I started closing my retirement accounts and taking the proceeds to buy "regular" AGEs, 90% silver, ASEs, Gold Buffs, 4-coin Burnished AGE sets, and 4-coin Plat sets. I did this with my IRA, my SEP/IRA and my Roth IRA. I also had my fiancee' take her state retirement and her other retirement money out of the state-run program and put her money into metals as well.

We paid the 10% early withdrawal penalties and the higher tax rates on the gains in those withdrawals. We got absolutely killed in penalties and taxes, make no mistake about that.

Let me say this clearly - I am glad we did it. We didn't suffer the stock market downdraft during the Lehman meltdown, and we aren't hurting now, either.

We have no money in the stock market now, either directly or indirectly. This administration is hostile to any investors & savers, whether they be teachers, nurses, salesmen, doctors, corporate managers, small business owners or laborers, i.e., people who actually work for a living. I don't see that changing anytime soon. I think that if you belong to a certain group of middle class Americans, you are a target much like a herd of buffalo. The herd is thinning.

In my humble opinion, there will be actual damage to our welfare from higher taxes, which are certainly coming as sure as the sun rises in the sky. Add to that a falling stock market. If the stock market doesn't fall, it's only because it's being pumped with imaginary dollars in a constant shell game that generates no wealth or productivity. Either way, precious metals are the only way to go, being not only safer but having more potential for gain.

Cohodk, I know you think that deflation is the order of the day. If I didn't have an ongoing income, I probably would have kept more cash aside for the next year or two, but I did keep some cash aside as a cushion in the event of serious deflation. That's just good money management.

Oh, my returns? My net worth has easily more than tripled, and since 1998, I've pretty much repeatedly knocked the ball out of the park with precious metals, and even Mint Bullion products. Some of it is luck, and some is following up on my assessments of what I see happening around me in the world.

One day, there may be occasion to get back into stocks, and maybe even bonds, or land, or real estate - but now is not the time. However, those things tend to make you more visible and I don't relish being on the hit list for the looters in big government. Besides, we aren't yet anywhere near the bottom and it will be at least 2 1/2 years before we can even begin to heal. Sorry, but that's how I see it.

BBN

<< <i>sound just like me. About $250/mo of mine gets put into the system. I agree that if they try to mess with current employees and retirees the govt' workers will have it tied up with years of legal suits. The pension system never became an issue until the lawmakers decided to start borrowing from the pension fund to balance the budget. Are you in IL too? >>





Whoops, I meant $250/check. $500/mo.

Flatwoods

<< <i>

<< <i>

mine is too, but I also opened up an IRA because pensions are becoming unsafe and total garbage. >>



Every two weeks $240.00 gets taken out of my pay and put into a pension fund. I would assume that many states
would have big lawsuits if these people realized their pension funds became total garbage. >>



My dad paid into a pension fund for nearly 40 years.
The company sold out and the pension fund became liquid assetts.
He has to rely on Social Security and is still working at age 71.
There are laws against this now but don't think it can't happen.
If the owner of the pension fund goes under and claims the money is gone, who is going to cover you?

DrBuster

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

mine is too, but I also opened up an IRA because pensions are becoming unsafe and total garbage. >>



Every two weeks $240.00 gets taken out of my pay and put into a pension fund. I would assume that many states
would have big lawsuits if these people realized their pension funds became total garbage. >>



My dad paid into a pension fund for nearly 40 years.
The company sold out and the pension fund became liquid assetts.
He has to rely on Social Security and is still working at age 71.
There are laws against this now but don't think it can't happen.
If the owner of the pension fund goes under and claims the money is gone, who is going to cover you? >>



If you're union type folks, the government is quietly going to have everybody cover your pension liabilities.

http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Investing/CompanyFocus/up-next-a-huge-pension-bailout.aspx

There's other articles, just google 'union pension bailout' and see what some congressmen are proposing to take care of some union voters - up to 160+billion on the taxpayer hook coming. up-next-a-huge-pension-bailout

gecko109

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

mine is too, but I also opened up an IRA because pensions are becoming unsafe and total garbage. >>



Every two weeks $240.00 gets taken out of my pay and put into a pension fund. I would assume that many states
would have big lawsuits if these people realized their pension funds became total garbage. >>



My dad paid into a pension fund for nearly 40 years.
The company sold out and the pension fund became liquid assetts.
He has to rely on Social Security and is still working at age 71.
There are laws against this now but don't think it can't happen.
If the owner of the pension fund goes under and claims the money is gone, who is going to cover you? >>




Pension funds from the private sector are a completely different animal than government backed pension funds. Government pensions are protected and guaranteed by law (the Illinois Constitution in my case), whereas there are no such guarantees in the private sector. However, as the old saying goes...you cant squeeze blood from a stone. So if in 2025, when I retire and start collecting my RIGHTFUL pension (see my above post to understand what I mean), and the state of Illinois is bankrupt, I have no clue as to where the money will come from.

mhammerman

Comrade Ski, you have done well. You rode the up line for PM with some purposeful purchases of modern mint issues. I did the same in a sense, I cashed out a retirement account that suffered a 40% loss from the market and took I the hickie and it was a good thing for me. I too have spent a fair amount of funds on modern mint pm purchases and have realized considerable good fortune with those purchases with the stunner being the value of the fract buffs.

Speaking of buffs, I agree that the half of the populace with positive AGIs and particularly those public savings accounts like IRA's 401K's, are part of a herd that is being moved into the shearing pens. This gov is starving for cash and anyone that has any cash out where it can be seen will get sheared with increasing frequency and for higher amounts. It seems that the only place to keep cash is in a personal checking/savings account with no more than 10k in it. What ever the causes, we have created a gov that takes from the income producers and gives it to what ever the mood of the day requires such as wall street bankers, european bail outs, hyperextended unemployment benefits, and a plague of other big dollar money sucking programs that yield no national benefit.

The safe havens of today are not the safe havens of the boomer model where people fatten up their 401's, casually investing in stocks and equities, buy some CD's, keep new cars in the drive and keep the house updated, send the kids to college and live happily ever after until retirement when the get the Winnebago and enjoy 20 years of free willie. Those that bought into the boomer model too late are suffering from job loss, foreclosure, reposession of assets, kids/grandkids living at home past 20, no health insurance and a list of other problems. The boomer model is dead and it is way past time for folk to get a new game. Now, the sharper folk are in cash and PM and have replaced the 401's and stock plans with buying metal and stashing buks into very liquid, non penalizable accounts. Got too much cash, buy some nice realestate...the good stuff is always worth good money now and ever after and if you're not producing income with the land, you get the appreciation in value from increased demand, you pay some local property taxes and that's it. Many working boomers will venture no further into investment accounts other than Roths.

So, 80% of stock trades are by machine programs now, the individual investor is an anomalie and is vulnerable to triggers that even good investment strategies and hours of homework can't overcome. With out the institutional funds to feed the machines, the market would shrivel up to something that would represent the real valuation of assets and then people could venture into the waters again but this is not that time. Just two weeks ago, the pundits were cheering for a 12000 DOW 30, now, they hope it doesn't go below 9...how ya gonna play dat one? Fortunately, the gov is still working on the great fleecing using the boomer model but if the boomers would just abandon the old model and get with modern times, then the fleecing would end.

JMHO
DYOD
Got Cash?
Got Gold?
Doo Dah

Flatwoods

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

mine is too, but I also opened up an IRA because pensions are becoming unsafe and total garbage. >>



Every two weeks $240.00 gets taken out of my pay and put into a pension fund. I would assume that many states
would have big lawsuits if these people realized their pension funds became total garbage. >>



My dad paid into a pension fund for nearly 40 years.
The company sold out and the pension fund became liquid assetts.
He has to rely on Social Security and is still working at age 71.
There are laws against this now but don't think it can't happen.
If the owner of the pension fund goes under and claims the money is gone, who is going to cover you? >>




Pension funds from the private sector are a completely different animal than government backed pension funds. Government pensions are protected and guaranteed by law (the Illinois Constitution in my case), whereas there are no such guarantees in the private sector. However, as the old saying goes...you cant squeeze blood from a stone. So if in 2025, when I retire and start collecting my RIGHTFUL pension (see my above post to understand what I mean), and the state of Illinois is bankrupt, I have no clue as to where the money will come from. >>





My state pension is covered by "law" as well. It was disclosed last year that if everyone eligible for state pension retired, there would be a huge shortfall. I haven't heard of that situation being corrected yet. I'm sure it's going to get worse.
The news this week is the state is going to cancel insurance for hundreds of thousands of retirees. Great!

guitarwes

One safe haven is being out of debt. (probably the biggest for me)
Another is growth stock MFs.
Another is diverse metals.

clouisejewelers

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

mine is too, but I also opened up an IRA because pensions are becoming unsafe and total garbage. >>



Every two weeks $240.00 gets taken out of my pay and put into a pension fund. I would assume that many states
would have big lawsuits if these people realized their pension funds became total garbage. >>



My dad paid into a pension fund for nearly 40 years.
The company sold out and the pension fund became liquid assetts.
He has to rely on Social Security and is still working at age 71.
There are laws against this now but don't think it can't happen.
If the owner of the pension fund goes under and claims the money is gone, who is going to cover you? >>




Pension funds from the private sector are a completely different animal than government backed pension funds. Government pensions are protected and guaranteed by law (the Illinois Constitution in my case), whereas there are no such guarantees in the private sector. However, as the old saying goes...you cant squeeze blood from a stone. So if in 2025, when I retire and start collecting my RIGHTFUL pension (see my above post to understand what I mean), and the state of Illinois is bankrupt, I have no clue as to where the money will come from. >>



Gecko, I have no doubt you and all other government workers will get your full pension. I also have no doubt private pensions will be bailed out as well by the PBGC or some future as yet unnamed agency. The political fallout and legal ramifications of failing to deliver on pension obligations is too much for any politician to bear. The real question is where will the money come from? Production and taxation just won't cover it, not even close. That's why we all are buying and stacking PMs(well, not cohodk). You will receive exactly the amount promised, but in devalued dollars.

renman95

<< <i>When you own gold you become your own Central Bank. I think that's a pretty cool thing.............MJ >>



I like that MJ. Now I wish I had a printing press to print some "Comrade Currency" backed by 90% junk silver, silver bars, AGE's, APE's, ASE's, 2008-W Buffalo set, Liberty Spouses, US gold type set, 7070, etc., etc. I would denominate them as Liberty's and have my kids design them. I could do this with no oversight of the federal government.

jmski52

Pension funds from the private sector are a completely different animal than government backed pension funds. Government pensions are protected and guaranteed by law (the Illinois Constitution in my case), whereas there are no such guarantees in the private sector. However, as the old saying goes...you cant squeeze blood from a stone. So if in 2025, when I retire and start collecting my RIGHTFUL pension (see my above post to understand what I mean), and the state of Illinois is bankrupt, I have no clue as to where the money will come from.

Gecko, you were promised your pension by the government of Illinois, so where should it come from? Who elected the government of Illinois? When a government mismanages its own affairs in a way that is unsustainable, who should take it in the shorts when things don't work out?

If it were up to me, the entitlements would end for people who have never done anything to contribute to society, the corruption would be prosecuted to its very sources, and guns would be legal in Chicago and the rest of Illinois. It wouldn't fix everything, but it would be a start.

The biggest source of peoples' problems in Illinois is the government itself.

jmski52

<<When you own gold you become your own Central Bank. I think that's a pretty cool thing.............MJ >>

I like that MJ. Now I wish I had a printing press to print some "Comrade Currency" backed by 90% junk silver, silver bars, AGE's, APE's, ASE's, 2008-W Buffalo set, Liberty Spouses, US gold type set, 7070, etc., etc.

You are now entering Galt's Gulch, comrades.

yellowkid

Recent events in the world of finance shouldn't have much to do with how your resources are allotted. You should have a game plan and stick to it, whatever it is.

yellowkid

<< <i>$600/month goes right into my pension. Thats a full 9.125% of my base salary. I would estimate that the average worker in this country puts away no more than 3-5% (if even that much) of their gross each year into retirement accounts, let alone over 9% like I do. Im so sick and tired of reading in the papers what a "burden" the public employye pension systems have become to taxpayers. If everyone in this nation put away 9% of their gross each and every paycheck from age 23, they would ALL be financially able to retire in their mid 50's with a respectable amount of income....just like a public employee on a pension system. But J6P would rather take 3 family vacations a year, remodel their bathroom and kitchen, and get a new car every 4 years than save for retirement.....and thats not my problem. >>



Are you a firefighter?

yellowkid

What would happen if everyone put all their retirement assets into PM's?

yellowkid

<< <i>

<< <i>$600/month goes right into my pension. Thats a full 9.125% of my base salary. I would estimate that the average worker in this country puts away no more than 3-5% (if even that much) of their gross each year into retirement accounts, let alone over 9% like I do. Im so sick and tired of reading in the papers what a "burden" the public employye pension systems have become to taxpayers. If everyone in this nation put away 9% of their gross each and every paycheck from age 23, they would ALL be financially able to retire in their mid 50's with a respectable amount of income....just like a public employee on a pension system. But J6P would rather take 3 family vacations a year, remodel their bathroom and kitchen, and get a new car every 4 years than save for retirement.....and thats not my problem. >>



Are you a firefighter? >>



I'm sorry, I confused you with Gecko who I believe is.

mhammerman

"What would happen if everyone put all their retirement assets into PM's?"

Then we would back on the gold standard?

jmski52

<<"What would happen if everyone put all their retirement assets into PM's?">>

This actually should be its own thread:

1) Then we would back on the gold standard?

2) Then the practice of accounting would be reduced to the math.

3) Governments wouldn't be able to fund wars without the general agreement of the people. Funding for controversial public spending programs could be compared to other spending priorities simply by comparing the numbers.

4) Taxes would be levied in accordance with the most pressing public need in order of priority.

5) Compensation would necessarily reflect a person's value to his or her company/organization and to society as a whole.

6) Politicians could be held accountable for their spending because phantom accounting practices would be illegal.

7) Retirement savings and pension plans would have to result from actual savings.

8) If people wanted the good life, they would have to work for it instead of taking it from someone else.

9) Banks wouldn't be able to manipulate the markets with bogus paper.

10) Ethics would make a comeback out of the sheer force of publicity and accountability.

That's just the short list.

KUCH

My 2 cents worth... or rather 1 oz worth:

Private and/or government "protected" pension plans have their own advantages and disadvantages.

Government pensions can be protected, but what happens when the money is gone? And it is. This country is bankrupt, so it's quantitative easing into infinity. The printing presses bring about inflation, higher taxes etc that have no chance in heaven to correct insolvency. Look at Greece my friends..... first the government put limits on how much cash you could withdraw from your bank, then all other purchases had to be done by credit card, now government pensions are being decreased, taxes are going higher.

Private pensions, nah I really don't want to go there.

If someone wants to save, great. If someone wants to go on vacation, great. Everyone has choices. Remember, the bankrupt cities, states and Feds are the ones who have spent your pensions or mismanaged them. It is not the fault of the private sector. The private sector also feeds the system through taxes. Bottom line, GOVERNMENT must stop spending money.

We've been through this before especially in the 70's. We'll get throught this but it is painful and maybe the worst yet to come.

BBN

I would have no problem cashing out my pension and moving it to an IRA as long as the state progressively avg'd in what I would have earned in interest from 1991 until today. I know it would probably be huge. Granted, someone here will tell me IRAs and 401Ks are worthless, but by not putting my $300-500/mo into a 401k I missed out on a huge bull market in the 90s and 2009. Despite bad years right after 9/11 and and 2008-early 2009 it would be worth well into 6 figures. A co worker of mine started in 1994 and put $250/mo into the state employees' 457 program and did this for 6 years. Then in 2000-2001 he dropped back to $150/mo and done this since. His 457 is now worth over $120k. Yes, we had bad years, but the good years more than made up for it. Like I said, give me what I've put in since 1991 plus interest I missed and let me take what I put in now and put it in my 457 and I'll never be a burden. The state took my money and invested it so they obviously made money on it, they just drew too much of it to cover their stupid spending.

One thing I know, please don't blame the employee. We have faithfully paid our obligation forever. We pay the overwhelming majority into it and the state then contributes the rest like any employer contributes to an employee 401k. The state lawmakers are the ones who failed int his process.

Like Gecko said, contribute $500-600/mo into a 401k and one would very well get to retire in their 50s. And as in me and Gecko's case, do you really want men in their mid to late 60s rushing into a fire to save you or guarding convicted murderers and violent criminals?

I'll go back to what I said before. No one owes me a comfortable retirement and I would gladly pull out of the pension program if I am given my contribution and what I would have earned in interest since 1991. I'm leabing state employment within a few years anyway to enter the private sector. State employment has given me no satisfaction at all. I'm starting a degree program from a school in the Chicago area next January so I'll be much more qualified to work in others areas. Willing to move too.

BBN

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>$600/month goes right into my pension. Thats a full 9.125% of my base salary. I would estimate that the average worker in this country puts away no more than 3-5% (if even that much) of their gross each year into retirement accounts, let alone over 9% like I do. Im so sick and tired of reading in the papers what a "burden" the public employye pension systems have become to taxpayers. If everyone in this nation put away 9% of their gross each and every paycheck from age 23, they would ALL be financially able to retire in their mid 50's with a respectable amount of income....just like a public employee on a pension system. But J6P would rather take 3 family vacations a year, remodel their bathroom and kitchen, and get a new car every 4 years than save for retirement.....and thats not my problem. >>



Are you a firefighter? >>



I'm sorry, I confused you with Gecko who I believe is. >>



That is Gecko's post.

yellowkid

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>$600/month goes right into my pension. Thats a full 9.125% of my base salary. I would estimate that the average worker in this country puts away no more than 3-5% (if even that much) of their gross each year into retirement accounts, let alone over 9% like I do. Im so sick and tired of reading in the papers what a "burden" the public employye pension systems have become to taxpayers. If everyone in this nation put away 9% of their gross each and every paycheck from age 23, they would ALL be financially able to retire in their mid 50's with a respectable amount of income....just like a public employee on a pension system. But J6P would rather take 3 family vacations a year, remodel their bathroom and kitchen, and get a new car every 4 years than save for retirement.....and thats not my problem. >>



Are you a firefighter? >>



I'm sorry, I confused you with Gecko who I believe is. >>



That is Gecko's post. >>



What was someone just saying about men in their 60's????

BBN

<< <i>My 2 cents worth... or rather 1 oz worth:

Private and/or government "protected" pension plans have their own advantages and disadvantages.

Government pensions can be protected, but what happens when the money is gone? And it is. This country is bankrupt, so it's quantitative easing into infinity.

>>



This is what scares me about mine. Pensions are guaranteed by law in IL and would take like a 75-80% majority to change them, but the public is getting fired up in IL about its pension system, and the state employee pension system is pretty much insolvent, so the politicians could eventually cave in to voter pressure to save their own skin and change the laws.

BBN

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>$600/month goes right into my pension. Thats a full 9.125% of my base salary. I would estimate that the average worker in this country puts away no more than 3-5% (if even that much) of their gross each year into retirement accounts, let alone over 9% like I do. Im so sick and tired of reading in the papers what a "burden" the public employye pension systems have become to taxpayers. If everyone in this nation put away 9% of their gross each and every paycheck from age 23, they would ALL be financially able to retire in their mid 50's with a respectable amount of income....just like a public employee on a pension system. But J6P would rather take 3 family vacations a year, remodel their bathroom and kitchen, and get a new car every 4 years than save for retirement.....and thats not my problem. >>



Are you a firefighter? >>



I'm sorry, I confused you with Gecko who I believe is. >>



That is Gecko's post. >>



What was someone just saying about men in their 60's???? >>



Oh, very nice things. Great guys. Very wise.

renman95

<< <i><<When you own gold you become your own Central Bank. I think that's a pretty cool thing.............MJ >>

I like that MJ. Now I wish I had a printing press to print some "Comrade Currency" backed by 90% junk silver, silver bars, AGE's, APE's, ASE's, 2008-W Buffalo set, Liberty Spouses, US gold type set, 7070, etc., etc.

You are now entering Galt's Gulch, comrades. >>



That's not far away from me.

derryb

Pensions and retirement plans are the last remaining glob of money for the Washington/Wall St. theives to go after. Do not be surprised if Washington comes up with some type of legislation to "protect" American workers' retirement plans by requiring them to be invested in "safe" US Treasury bonds. Unless your employer is matching your retirement contributions they best thing you can do is take full control of your retirement account by getting it out of the hands of others and into an account that you and only you can manage. In many cases this requires you to transfer the funds to an IRA that you control.

cohodk

That's why we all are buying and stacking PMs(well, not cohodk

Who said im not buying? I just happen to also sell.

Im not stacking, as that by definition means long term commitment. I am only commited to my family long term. All other assets---PMs, coins, equities, bonds, ect are for dating. When it is time to load the boat on PMs, I will. It just aint time yet.


This "crisis" has show, that the US dollar and US treasuries are safe havens. Just as they have been and wil continue to be, until the US govt is overthrown. Anybody know when that will be?

jmski52

This "crisis" has show, that the US dollar and US treasuries are safe havens. Just as they have been and wil continue to be, until the US govt is overthrown. Anybody know when that will be?

16 months ago

Edited: Actually, the same people are still in charge. We just don't know exactly who they are.

standfor

your health and happiness

derryb

<< <i>This "crisis" has show, that the US dollar and US treasuries are safe havens. Just as they have been and wil continue to be, until the US govt is overthrown. Anybody know when that will be?

16 months ago

Edited: Actually, the same people are still in charge. We just don't know exactly who they are. >>

johnny9434

more gold

mhammerman

more gold

cladking

Whitefish Bay?

Sorry, sorry. Anyone, any state, any entity that doesn't batten
down the hatches just might be sunk.

derryb

Platinum and paladium are sure looking good!