1792 Silver-Center Pattern Cent: Frank Stewart's Blank Planchets (Judd 1)

airplanenut

Among all the items in the Frank Stewart collection, this one is among the coolest as far as I'm concerned. A few trial cents were made in 1792 with a silver center. The finished example is designated Judd-1, which you can read more about hereWhen Frank Stewart excavated the First US Mint, he found these, blanks missing the silver center. Both of these examples are a lovely glossy brown and well preserved, save for the museum markings. I photographed the two pieces at the Mint last Friday for a book on the First US Mint being written by our very own Len Augsberger (coinosaurus).

commoncents05

When I opened this thread, I was prompted to give the password to your website!

-Paul

airplanenut

<< <i>When I opened this thread, I was prompted to give the password to your website! >>

Whoops... there are some pictures in the directory that I can't make public. I just moved these so they should show up with no problem.

commoncents05

Yep, it's fixed.

Very cool pieces!

-Paul

Lakesammman

VERY cool - didn't know they existed.

MisterBungle

Question is, if you owned these, would you soak
them in acetone to remove all the gunk, or would
you leave them alone??

~

garrynot

I would leave the gunk and the sticker alone. If that is the real thing, I wouldnt want to mess with it at all.

Lakesammman

Would send them to the coin doctor (NCS) to be sure it's done correctly.

Coinosaurus

I would send them to NCS and get their opinion before proceeding.

Btw, the remnants of red ink represent very old Congress Hall museum catalog numbers. These are no longer used & have been replaced by Independence Hall catalog numbers.

The current labels ("37017," "37018") are from the US Mint, as these pieces are on loan from Independence Hall to the Mint for display. These are probably dissolvable in acetone, the main thing I would be worried about here is the adhesive.

Stewart had very strong offers on these at the time of their discovery but felt they should be preserved as historical artifacts in an institution. They would probably be better known today if he had let one of them go to the collecting public.

determined

<< <i>... I photographed the two pieces at the Mint last Friday for a book on the First US Mint being written by our very own Len Augsberger (coinosaurus). >>



I look forward to reading that book. It sounds very interesting! Please keep us posted coinosaurus.

ricko

Very cool items... those pieces are very unique. Are there any with the silver insert intact? Cheers, RickO

RWB

Actually - they are patterns for Yap Island "money," and rather than a dab of silver in the hole, the locals were planning to use the head of an enemy. Now where did I read that?? – must be true – it was on the web….

crypto79

that's so cool, thanks for sharing

fivecents

That is some VERY copper !

Thanks for sharing the images Jeremy!!!

Coinosaurus

<< <i>Actually - they are patterns for Yap Island "money," and rather than a dab of silver in the hole, the locals were planning to use the head of an enemy. Now where did I read that?? – must be true – it was on the web…. >>



Dentuck - HOLD THE PRESSES! - a complete rewrite is in order. This changes everything we know

shorecoll

I still laugh when I hear about the enterprising eBay scammer who "sold" Littleton's Yap piece from in front of their building.

airplanenut

<< <i>Very cool items... those pieces are very unique. Are there any with the silver insert intact? Cheers, RickO >>

I believe they only exist for the struck patterns. If you look at how crude and uneven the planchet is, I would assume they just put in a silver bead and let the striking flatten and tighten everything, meaning a blank would have a hard time holding the silver.

CoinKing

Jeremy...those are very cool pics. I remember going to Congress Hall years ago to see the Stewart collection and being told it had been mothballed (in violation, I suppose, of the agreement they made with Stewart when he gave them the collection).

Can you describe the edges of these two?

Coinosaurus

One has a plain (but rough) edge, the other has a partially reeded edge (3 or 4 areas of reeding with plain edge in between).

As Jeremy pointed out, they are fairly rough and the strike was probably intended to even things out.

Stewart expressed his intent to Congress Hall that this material would always be on public display, but there was never a formal contract signed by Congress Hall agreeing to do so. Stewart was also using the collection to promote his "Old Mint" electrical supply brand, which was no longer necessary after 1928 when his company was sold to GE and the "Old Mint" brand was obsoleted.

crypto79

Just wanted to re vist this as I thouht it was a good one. Would like to hear about the edges too.

firstmint

According to Stewart, p.164, "Two of the planchets which fell down from the overhead joists (of the smelting house) were of the 1792 silver center cent; the others were of cents and half cents".

Page 119 of the Stewart book displays these two planchets, along with other copper planchets, one half cent being clipped.

There were other interesting planchets found as well during the demolition.