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Pre-1933 Silver? Where is this coming from?
Greeniejr
Posts: 1,321 ✭✭✭
In the last few we have had a significant influx of people (all African American and I say this not as a racist poke but as a context where it may be coming from) coming in to the store asking for pre-1933 silver, specifically silver dollars. Typically when there is a new trend, like asking for pre-33 gold, we asked what the origin of the idea was. More often than not people would give us the answer and the logic they are using (whether logical or not). With the silver we ask and people are getting really offended, defensive, and scramble to give us answers that are clearly either fed to them or a scramble to protect something. The typical response is that because they are purer silver or better silver than anything else available. Can anyone give me any insight to why people are suddenly going for pre-1933 silver, why people are getting so defensive, and where this is all coming from?
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Comments
TD
How many half-truths and misleading info can you find here?
All you have to do is tell the uniformed to search the internet for "1933 gold seizure" and you have them eating out of your hand.
--Severian the Lame
<< <i>Has to be rumors the gullible are hearing and believing based on the 1933 gold confiscation act.
How many half-truths and misleading info can you find here?
All you have to do is tell the uniformed to search the internet for "1933 gold seizure" and you have them eating out of your hand. >>
The pre-1933 gold idea we know, understand, and though we think it is a bit out there, we can accept with some backwards logic. Never has the "confiscation" had anything to do with silver.
FDR's Executive Order
Another confiscation possible? Who knows, but here's your answer if they come for it: ""Gold? What gold? Oh, yeah, I was talking to a fellow in the Burger King a few years ago when my wife was sick and I needed money. I sold him the gold, and even remember his name. Sold it at a loss, by the way."
Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else. - Bastiat
you will have to bump up the price on these by 10-20% so you do not run out
<< <i>Its simple, and one shouldnt have to put people down to explain it. Anything having to do with progressives, and by extension, FDR, people are running from. >>
Putting people down? Sometimes people have reasons for thing which when explained may not be logical to me but I can respect the reason. We have a group of people who buy gold bars from us but will not purchase the Pamp Suisse because of the Fortuna Design. Their reason, it is an allegorical figure of a deity and they are religious Christians. Is that my way? no. Does it make sense that it could offend someone's religious inclinations, definitely. But if they did not say anything or were evasive, we would have never known.
This doesnt apply to US coinage i know , i would like to know why anyone would only want pre 33.
The tradition of “hard money savings” was strong ion the post-Civil War south, and particularly so among freed slaves. Blank farmers and sharecroppers regularly sequestered small amounts of silver coin as protection against crop failure and to avoid paying all their income to the landowners. Sometimes these holdings were divided and subdivided among family members, and in other instances they remained intact as emergency funds.
In times of economic stress, money was used for necessities, and in times of plenty, the savings were replenished as much as possible. The possession and control of such family funds was usually the responsibility of the family matriarch. Existence of the money was also a family secret shared only by a few. This protected it from theft and provided clear responsibility for access to and use of the money.
I can understand someone bring a hoard of silver coins into a shop to sell, and becoming very offended at any questions, especially if the sell was an older African-American woman. As for buying pre-1933 silver, this sounds like a chain-letter or pulpit-rumor type of distortion. Sell them a bunch of Peace dollars and be glad for the honest sale.
Regarding the diatribe about gold confiscation, it is not relevant to the OP’s question except that someone is using “1933” to confuse people. As for FDR and silver, the President refused to devalue the standard silver dollar although Congress had given him that authority. He used the Thomas Amendment to buy American-mined silver at approximately 20-cents per ounce over the world market price. The permitted business to reopen closed mines and kept several western state economies going. (The subsidy was the brain child of Senator Key Pittman, D-NV.)
Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else. - Bastiat
<< <i>The post concerning gold confiscation in 1933 was provided to the original question because the OP was looking for possible explanations for a demand on pre-1933 precious metal coins. >>
Could it be as simple as that ? Mere confusion and lumping Silver in with Gold ? Its easy enough for the inexperienced id imagine , PM's are PM's , if gold was confiscated its easy enough to believe silver would have been too.
Speaking of confusion , i think the word "confiscated" in regards the occurance in 1933 might be harsh , im no expert on what happened but loosely believe from what ive read it didnt affect the average man who may have had X amount of gold.People were allowed to have that certain amount , it was more geared towards those hoarding it.Please do feel free to correct me , its how i understood it worked.
When people are buying and can't tell you why it is time to get out of dodge and dump the metals.
When people are buying and can't tell you why it is time to get out of dodge and dump the metals. >>
I buy PM's here and there when I can, and I can tell you why. I dont trust anyone or anything anymore. Up to and including our govt. I dont trust the dollar, nor do I trust my bank. When the govt took gold in the past, they left collector stuff alone. If Im buying PM's, thats the stuff I want, period. If thats foolish, Im uite ok with that.
What concerns me is the apparent hostility.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>I'm guessing that the motivational source of this silver rush doesn't know that FDR's Order had nothing to do with silver, and that there is no difference between 1933 silver and 1935 silver.
What concerns me is the apparent hostility. >>
The hostility does not bother me. If I am buying something in a store, and someone asks me why I am buying it, the real answer is that it is none of your business (whether it is a shirt, a loaf of bread, or a silver dollar). Some people are more glib or tactful in coming up with an answer.
What concerns me is the apparent hostility.>>
I would think its fear more than anything. People dont think under pressure for the most part and when you add fear, they become hostile. Add in some questioning and it fuels their concerns regardless of what they are. They may not be coin collectors, or even people that further educate themselves when they hear things like the govt took gold in the 30's but they left old coins alone.
and gold coins can be recalled by a simple executive order to protect our currency. However, coins prior to
1933 cannot be recalled and are excluded. Perhaps this is the explanation?
bob
PS: I don't have that email or proof one way or another.
I would think its fear more than anything. People dont think under pressure for the most part and when you add fear, they become hostile. Add in some questioning and it fuels their concerns regardless of what they are.
There's no doubt that fear plays a part, and it's probably a very rational fear. Hostility however, always concerns me.
I knew it would happen.
I am very happy to sell the coins that people want.
I firmly believe in numismatics as the world's greatest hobby, but recognize that this is a luxury and without collectors, we can all spend/melt our collections/inventories.
eBaystore
and gold coins can be recalled by a simple executive order to protect our currency. However, coins prior to
1933 cannot be recalled and are excluded.
Possibly. Your comment is the gist of a confused and distorted "article" found on the web at: Here
Greeniejr: Sorry for the confusion. I got sidetracked and almost missed the train station.
https://acoinshop.com/ —-> https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else. - Bastiat
<< <i>I believe it to be tied to a political email running around for the past few years. It said that modern silver
and gold coins can be recalled by a simple executive order to protect our currency. However, coins prior to
1933 cannot be recalled and are excluded.
Possibly. Your comment is the gist of a confused and distorted "article" found on the web at: Here
Greeniejr: Sorry for the confusion. I got sidetracked and almost missed the train station. >>
I think you've got it. A crappy article written by somebody who doesn't know what he is talking about, but because it's on the internet it must be true.
I googled the author of the article, and it seems like he writes lots of articles about all sorts of topics, none numismatic as far as I went into the search results.
TD
<< <i>Background:
The tradition of “hard money savings” was strong ion the post-Civil War south, and particularly so among freed slaves. Blank farmers and sharecroppers regularly sequestered small amounts of silver coin as protection against crop failure and to avoid paying all their income to the landowners. Sometimes these holdings were divided and subdivided among family members, and in other instances they remained intact as emergency funds.
In times of economic stress, money was used for necessities, and in times of plenty, the savings were replenished as much as possible. The possession and control of such family funds was usually the responsibility of the family matriarch. Existence of the money was also a family secret shared only by a few. This protected it from theft and provided clear responsibility for access to and use of the money.
I can understand someone bring a hoard of silver coins into a shop to sell, and becoming very offended at any questions, especially if the sell was an older African-American woman. As for buying pre-1933 silver, this sounds like a chain-letter or pulpit-rumor type of distortion. Sell them a bunch of Peace dollars and be glad for the honest sale.
Regarding the diatribe about gold confiscation, it is not relevant to the OP’s question except that someone is using “1933” to confuse people. As for FDR and silver, the President refused to devalue the standard silver dollar although Congress had given him that authority. He used the Thomas Amendment to buy American-mined silver at approximately 20-cents per ounce over the world market price. The permitted business to reopen closed mines and kept several western state economies going. (The subsidy was the brain child of Senator Key Pittman, D-NV.) >>
This was an excellent, well reasoned answer.Thank you for sharing.
Please visit my website Millcitynumismatics.com
Wow. Almost every assertion in that whole article is screwed up!
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>Almost every assertion in that whole article is screwed up! >>
Not hardly. They say that some coins were made before 1933, and some were made after. That part is true!
http://www.articlesnatch.com/Article/Why-Pre-1933-Gold-And-Silver-Coins-Have-Outperformed-Modern-Bullions/875349
If you weren't aware of this, there are two different segments to gold and silver coins - those that were made before 1933 and those that were made after 1933. Why is this significant? Well, any of the pre-1933 gold and silver coins that you might encounter are going to be rare coins. They have been labeled this because they were not produced much and they in turn hold more value than their modern predecessors. Their rarity isn't the only thing that makes these coins more valuable though. In fact, there are several factors that have gone into the performance levels of the bullion versus the rare coin. Let's take a look at just a few.
One of the biggest reasons that pre-1933 gold and silver coins have outperformed the modern bullion is because they are numismatic coins. This is just a fancy way to say they are valued by the content of their metal, not their face or production value. Although the worth of precious metals does have a tendency to fluctuate, it usually remains on a steady incline. Thus coins that are looked at in terms of their content are better suited for investments than those that are backed by monetary value because money can decline at any time. We've seen that in our recently downtrodden economy.
Another reason that pre-1933 gold and silver coins have fared well is because they are considered to be private coins. That means that the government has no claim over them once they are released to someone else. The modern bullion is subject to gold confiscation, meaning that at any time, the government could reclaim the coins and not compensate for them. There is a sense of security to be found in rare coins that is unmatched by those of the present day, so people choose to invest in the older coins.
In the end, the differences in performance may just come down to production. Millions and millions of gold and silver bullions are produced nowadays, almost to the point that they should be circulated like dollar bills or quarters. While they may seem like a tempting buy because they will be theoretically worth something in the future, the fact is that there are simply too many of them. When you go to buy gold or buy silver, you want something that is going to be a bit unusual because that is the only way it will hold its value. Pre-1933 gold and silver coins do just that.
Read more: http://www.articlesnatch.com/Article/Why-Pre-1933-Gold-And-Silver-Coins-Have-Outperformed-Modern-Bullions/875349#ixzz0gmNItWJd
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution No Derivatives
Cheers, RickO
<< <i>The hostility may stem from the possibility that you may put them on "THE LIST" to have their PMs seized when the time comes if they tell you the "secret". >>
You mean like how the IRS encourages you to claim your safety deposit box rental on your itemized deductions???
<<By Executive Order Of The President of The United States, March 9, 1933.
By virtue of the authority vested in me by Section 5 (b) of the Act of October 6, 1917, as amended by Section 2 of the Act of March 9, 1933, in which Congress declared that a serious emergency exists, I as President, do declare that the national emergency still exists; that the continued private hoarding of gold and silver by subjects of the United States poses a grave threat to the peace, equal justice, and well-being of the United States; and that appropriate measures must be taken immediately to protect the interests of our people.
Therefore, pursuant to the above authority, I hereby proclaim that such gold and silver holdings are prohibited, and that all such coin, bullion or other possessions of gold and silver be tendered within fourteen days to agents of the Government of the United States for compensation at the official price, in the legal tender of the Government.
All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed, pending action in the due course of the law. All sales or purchases or movements of such gold and silver within the borders of the United States and its territories and all foreign exchange transactions or movements of such metals across the border are hereby prohibited.
Your possession of these proscribed metals and/or your maintenance of a safe deposit box to store them is known by the government from bank and insurance records. Therefore, be advised that your vault box must remain sealed, and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the Internal Revenue Service.
By lawful order given this day, the President of the United States.
Franklin Roosevelt – March 9, 1933
>>
<< <i>Background:
The tradition of “hard money savings” was strong ion the post-Civil War south, and particularly so among freed slaves. Blank farmers and sharecroppers regularly sequestered small amounts of silver coin as protection against crop failure and to avoid paying all their income to the landowners. Sometimes these holdings were divided and subdivided among family members, and in other instances they remained intact as emergency funds.
In times of economic stress, money was used for necessities, and in times of plenty, the savings were replenished as much as possible. The possession and control of such family funds was usually the responsibility of the family matriarch. Existence of the money was also a family secret shared only by a few. This protected it from theft and provided clear responsibility for access to and use of the money.
I can understand someone bring a hoard of silver coins into a shop to sell, and becoming very offended at any questions, especially if the sell was an older African-American woman. As for buying pre-1933 silver, this sounds like a chain-letter or pulpit-rumor type of distortion. Sell them a bunch of Peace dollars and be glad for the honest sale.
Regarding the diatribe about gold confiscation, it is not relevant to the OP’s question except that someone is using “1933” to confuse people. As for FDR and silver, the President refused to devalue the standard silver dollar although Congress had given him that authority. He used the Thomas Amendment to buy American-mined silver at approximately 20-cents per ounce over the world market price. The permitted business to reopen closed mines and kept several western state economies going. (The subsidy was the brain child of Senator Key Pittman, D-NV.) >>
You may be right that this is related to something coming from a pulpit. During the Y2K madness we sold literally millions of dollars worth of precious metals to church-related buyers.
TD
<< <i>How old are the people who are asking for the pre-33 silver? Male or female? >>
Men 25-55
<< <i>They have been labeled this because they were not produced much and they in turn hold more value than their modern predecessors. >>
Modern predecessors. Funny.
<< <i>One of the biggest reasons that pre-1933 gold and silver coins have outperformed the modern bullion is because they are numismatic coins. This is just a fancy way to say they are valued by the content of their metal, not their face or production value. >>
So are they numismatic or valued by metal content? Fancy indeed.
I was going to pick the whole article apart, but it's just not worth it. I've already lost 10 IQ points just reading it.
LOL!! Wonderful comment !