Drew Brees - Hall of Fame?
PowderedH2O
Posts: 2,443 ✭✭
in Sports Talk
Obviously, Drew Brees is not planning to retire anytime soon. But as of now, how close is he to Canton? He's had 4 straight 4000 yard seasons (including a 5000 yard season. only the second NFL QB to do it). Before that he had three 3000 yard seasons. He's a four time Pro Bowler, three time NFC Offensive Player of the Year, three time All-Pro selection, has a lifetime passer rating of 91.1, won the Super Bowl MVP, and led the team that nobody could win with (the Saints) to a Super Bowl title. I'm not trying to compare his accomplishments to Favre, Brady, or Peyton Manning. They are Canton locks. But is Brees there? Is there a better eligible QB in the history of the NFL that is not already in? Maybe Stabler is comparable? Maybe not. What do you think? if his best seasons stopped now, would he be in? If not, how many more seasons like the past four does he need?
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<< <i>We had the Joe Namath discussion a week ago or so. With Brees leading the Saints to the title, I wonder if he might already be in. He certainly has had a better career than Namath. >>
Yet Brees' impact on professional football is but a blip on the radar compared to Namath, no question. And I am a big fan of both, perhaps Brees moreso than Namath.
Yet another clueless statement from a guy who has zero analytical skills when it comes to evaluating the careers of NFL QBs.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>I would put Brees over Marino. Marino had better defenses than Brees did this year.
Yet another clueless statement from a guy who has zero analytical skills when it comes to evaluating the careers of NFL QBs. >>
I stated a fact and gave my opinion.
Now get over it, Hoopster
Yet another clueless statement from a guy who has zero analytical skills when it comes to evaluating the careers of NFL QBs. >>
I stated a fact and gave my opinion.
Now get over it, Hoopster
Both are incorrect. Hoopster? You must be an alt after all, LOL...
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>< I would put Brees over Marino. Marino had better defenses than Brees did this year.
Yet another clueless statement from a guy who has zero analytical skills when it comes to evaluating the careers of NFL QBs. >>
I stated a fact and gave my opinion.
Now get over it, Hoopster
Both are incorrect. Hoopster? You must be an alt after all, LOL... >>
Who's my alt? Everyone on this board knows you, saberman, and hoopster are all the same person.
Yet another clueless statement from a guy who has zero analytical skills when it comes to evaluating the careers of NFL QBs. >>
I stated a fact and gave my opinion.
Now get over it, Hoopster
Both are incorrect. Hoopster? You must be an alt after all, LOL... >>
Who's my alt? Everyone on this board knows you, saberman, and hoopster are all the same person.
LMAO, that is funny! +1 for the ALT! You are so sorely mistaken on such a wide range of topics (including this one) it's comical!
Hint: 8K posts since 2006 vs Clueless Alt who just joined 2 weeks ago...ummm, nevermind, it's too easy making you look like a fool..
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>
<< <i>< I would put Brees over Marino. Marino had better defenses than Brees did this year.
Yet another clueless statement from a guy who has zero analytical skills when it comes to evaluating the careers of NFL QBs. >>
I stated a fact and gave my opinion.
Now get over it, Hoopster
Both are incorrect. Hoopster? You must be an alt after all, LOL... >>
Who's my alt? >>
Once again?
Since it is not worth replying to your moronic sports theories...don't get me wrong, I have fun making you look silly all the time, I have to say that by saying I am an alt of Grote, you are even more senseless than I thought.
I started on this board in 2002 under Skinpinch, changed my email and coulnd't sign on again, so I made a new one called Hoopster. Now I just changed for the heck of it to Saberman.
The only thing that makes sense about you is that you are an alt who makes nonsense points, or you are just some fool that came aboard to cause trouble.
Now go back and digest how Bradshaw's yards per attempt leaped through the ceiling with Swann/Stallworth.
<< <i>
Now go back and digest how Bradshaw's yards per attempt leaped through the ceiling with Swann/Stallworth. >>
Chemistry between both the QB and receivers.
Decent qb's and decent receivers have had developed great chemistry over the years.
They develop a great chemistry, thus spend more time together in practice because they sense something big,
and thus greatness is achieved.
It's a combination of effort, and both parties getting on board.
I can give you many examples of good qb's and receivers achieving greatness due to practice and effort.
Bradshaw isn't the only one who falls into this category. Phil Simms, Doug Williams, and a few others fit this mold.
But actually, Bradshaw already had established his level of ability for FIVE years as a starter. His yards per attempt was in the 6.1 range, and his QB rating in the 60 range. SO we know what he was like without them, and it wasn't very impressive.
Then when those two Hall of Fame acrobatic speedy receivers became starters, his yards per attempt JUMPED to the 8.0 range, and QB rating in the 80 range.
We also know that when Bradshaw's backup came in with those guys, the scrub backup went 6-0 and averaged 8.9 yards per attempt, and had a higher rating than Bradshaw. How did he do that without the time to build chemistry???? Because those two receivers were awesome and made the QB look better than he really was!!
So when dolling out the credit for 'winning' Bradshaw should get no more than half the credit for that passing game, and in reality, by watching those games and knowing the above info, he should be betting more like 40% of that credit for the passing game...
and that isn't even taking into account the offensive lines credit for allowing those deep passes to occur!!! Or the RB's credit!! Get the point?
And that is just for the offense!
He gets zero credit for winning for what the defense did.
Yet, Bradshaw gets almost ALL the credit for a Super Bowl ring???
Can it be spelled out any more clear?
And as far as Brees and the HOF. He is a lock. Before the game many including so called experts were proclaiming Manning the best ever. Brees outplayed him, therefore Brees is truly the best ever.
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Ralph
But he does not need a Super Bowl victory to prove that, because again, that is a measurement of his team.
Remember, without a 12th man in the huddle he is not even there. Without Minnesota turning the ball over all the time, he isn't there.
So how would that make him any better or worse of a QB because of those things occuring?
P.S. I am not an alt. I was originally Skinpinch, changed to Hoopster, and now am Saberman. Since I do not ever post under those other two ID's, I am not an alt, this is simply my new ID with no hiding...unlike these morons that I have been beating to death.
<< <i>So how would that make him any better or worse of a QB because of those things occuring? >>
Because he never would have been able to play in the next game
If a lot of what is involved in winning is luck or randomness, a lot of what elevates players status is randomness or luck. We can remove most of it, but we can't remove what actually happened on the field. And what happened on the field in Miami last week was a pretty good performance from Drew Brees. Still behind Manning, Favre and Brady, no doubt. But now has a very good chance to move ahead of Warner and McNabb, if he hasn't already. That is getting very close to Hall-of-Fame level
<< <i>
We also know that when Bradshaw's backup came in with those guys, the scrub backup went 6-0 and averaged 8.9 yards per attempt, and had a higher rating than Bradshaw. How did he do that without the time to build chemistry???? Because those two receivers were awesome and made the QB look better than he really was!!
? >>
Saberman, you are a person who thinks he knows a lot about numbers, but you may not know much about game strategy and chemistry.
The Steelers defense in 1976 was #1 in the league, but do you know they let up 110 points in their first 5 games (1-4).
When Kruczek came in, the defense let up 28 points in the last 9 games (9-0).
That 22 points per game in the first five, and 3 points per game in the last 9. The whole Steeler team stunk in the first five
games, so to say that Kruczek was as good as Bradshaw in 1976 is crazy, because the whole Steelers team stunk in the first five games.
When Kruczek came in, the team woke up. It was a great move by Chuck Knoll. It had nothing to do with Kruczek having equal ability
to Bradshaw (you make yourself look silly trying to imply this). It had to do with the team finally getting their butts in gear to play
better quality football.
in the NFL as many times as he did, and to come up big in those games, ranks him right up there with the greatest QB's of all time.
Some guys have better stats, but Terry was a big game player. Some guys look pretty like Favre and Manning. Terry looked downright
ugly sometimes, but when the game was on the line, I'd rather have Terry then Favre and Manning. Now only if all these guys
could be like Joe Montana, who was not only pretty, but also came through in the clutch.
Ding, ding, we have a winner!
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
This coming from the guy who said the Saints didn't have a prayer after falling behind 10-0 in the first quarter, LOL!!
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
That's fact, Jack! That's what he said alright.
<< <i>Saberman, you are a person who thinks he knows a lot about numbers, but you may not know much about game strategy and chemistry.
This coming from the guy who said the Saints didn't have a prayer after falling behind 10-0 in the first quarter, LOL!!
Cant handle someone disagreeing with your other alter ego?
<< <i>Brees is pretty darn good, and it is evident that he is THE big reason why his offense is good, unlike Bradshaw.
>>
Most ignorant post of 2010.
Bradshaw was tough and a great leader. Great leaders make other players around them play better.
This coming from the guy who said the Saints didn't have a prayer after falling behind 10-0 in the first quarter, LOL!! >>
Cant handle someone disagreeing with your other alter ego?
The only alt on here is you, having "joined" the forum in January 2010, LOL!
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>< Saberman, you are a person who thinks he knows a lot about numbers, but you may not know much about game strategy and chemistry.
This coming from the guy who said the Saints didn't have a prayer after falling behind 10-0 in the first quarter, LOL!! >>
Cant handle someone disagreeing with your other alter ego?
The only alt on here is you, having "joined" the forum in January 2010, LOL! >>
Yea so? I'm new to psa. Everyone on this board were once new members.
Blacklabelsociety- First-You are 100% wrong thnking Grote15 is an Alt. Secondly- I believe you are Axtell.
<< <i>Let me jump into the Fray here.
Blacklabelsociety- First-You are 100% wrong thnking Grote15 is an Alt. Secondly- I believe you are Axtell. >>
No you are wrong. Ask carol if i have more than one username if you dont believe me. Grote15 and sabermans posts are almost identical and are always agreeing with each other.
Blacklabelsociety- First-You are 100% wrong thnking Grote15 is an Alt. Secondly- I believe you are Axtell. >>
No you are wrong. Ask carol if i have more than one username if you dont believe me. Grote15 and sabermans posts are almost identical and are always agreeing with each other.
Lots of people agree that Bradshaw is overrated. And Saberman/Hoopster spends a lot more time than I do on analyzing stats and theories when it comes to sports, so you are, once again, wrong, as anyone else who's been here will attest. You say you "joined" in January 2010, yet you seem awfully familiar with these boards and who the mods are, MUCH more so than a true newbie. I call BS. You know you are an ALT and the ONLY reason you are suggesting such hogwash that Hoopster and I are the same person is to deflect attention from yourself. Typical behavior from a fraud.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i> Let me jump into the Fray here.
Blacklabelsociety- First-You are 100% wrong thnking Grote15 is an Alt. Secondly- I believe you are Axtell. >>
No you are wrong. Ask carol if i have more than one username if you dont believe me. Grote15 and sabermans posts are almost identical and are always agreeing with each other.
Lots of people agree that Bradshaw is overrated. And Saberman/Hoopster spends a lot more time than I do on analyzing stats and theories when it comes to sports, so you are, once again, wrong, as anyone else who's been here will attest. You say you "joined" in January 2010, yet you seem awfully familiar with these boards and who the mods are, MUCH more so than a true newbie. I call BS. You know you are an ALT and the ONLY reason you are suggesting such hogwash that Hoopster and I are the same person is to deflect attention from yourself. Typical behavior from a fraud. >>
I dont have anything to hide. You accuse me of being an alt, but have nothing to back it up. If you're not hoopster, than tell us what state you live in so the mods can clarify if your ip address is the same as hoopster?
Blacklabelsociety- First-You are 100% wrong thnking Grote15 is an Alt. Secondly- I believe you are Axtell. >>
No you are wrong. Ask carol if i have more than one username if you dont believe me. Grote15 and sabermans posts are almost identical and are always agreeing with each other.
Lots of people agree that Bradshaw is overrated. And Saberman/Hoopster spends a lot more time than I do on analyzing stats and theories when it comes to sports, so you are, once again, wrong, as anyone else who's been here will attest. You say you "joined" in January 2010, yet you seem awfully familiar with these boards and who the mods are, MUCH more so than a true newbie. I call BS. You know you are an ALT and the ONLY reason you are suggesting such hogwash that Hoopster and I are the same person is to deflect attention from yourself. Typical behavior from a fraud. >>
I dont have anything to hide. You accuse me of being an alt, but have nothing to back it up. If you're not hoopster, than tell us what state you live in so the mods can clarify if your ip address is the same as hoopster?
Ive been here since 2006, you've been here (in this latest incarnation at least) since um, 2 weeks ago. And you're calling me an ALT? LOL, comical. Here's a newsflash: no one here believes you, and with good reason, troll.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i> Let me jump into the Fray here.
Blacklabelsociety- First-You are 100% wrong thnking Grote15 is an Alt. Secondly- I believe you are Axtell. >>
No you are wrong. Ask carol if i have more than one username if you dont believe me. Grote15 and sabermans posts are almost identical and are always agreeing with each other.
Lots of people agree that Bradshaw is overrated. And Saberman/Hoopster spends a lot more time than I do on analyzing stats and theories when it comes to sports, so you are, once again, wrong, as anyone else who's been here will attest. You say you "joined" in January 2010, yet you seem awfully familiar with these boards and who the mods are, MUCH more so than a true newbie. I call BS. You know you are an ALT and the ONLY reason you are suggesting such hogwash that Hoopster and I are the same person is to deflect attention from yourself. Typical behavior from a fraud. >>
I dont have anything to hide. You accuse me of being an alt, but have nothing to back it up. If you're not hoopster, than tell us what state you live in so the mods can clarify if your ip address is the same as hoopster?
Ive been here since 2006, you've been here (in this latest incarnation at least) since um, 2 weeks ago. And you're calling me an ALT? LOL, comical. Here's a newsflash: no one here believes you, and with good reason, troll. >>
Like i said, lets both ask the mods to see whos telling the truth?
<< Let me jump into the Fray here.
Blacklabelsociety- First-You are 100% wrong thnking Grote15 is an Alt. Secondly- I believe you are Axtell. >>
No you are wrong. Ask carol if i have more than one username if you dont believe me. Grote15 and sabermans posts are almost identical and are always agreeing with each other.
Lots of people agree that Bradshaw is overrated. And Saberman/Hoopster spends a lot more time than I do on analyzing stats and theories when it comes to sports, so you are, once again, wrong, as anyone else who's been here will attest. You say you "joined" in January 2010, yet you seem awfully familiar with these boards and who the mods are, MUCH more so than a true newbie. I call BS. You know you are an ALT and the ONLY reason you are suggesting such hogwash that Hoopster and I are the same person is to deflect attention from yourself. Typical behavior from a fraud. >>
I dont have anything to hide. You accuse me of being an alt, but have nothing to back it up. If you're not hoopster, than tell us what state you live in so the mods can clarify if your ip address is the same as hoopster?
Ive been here since 2006, you've been here (in this latest incarnation at least) since um, 2 weeks ago. And you're calling me an ALT? LOL, comical. Here's a newsflash: no one here believes you, and with good reason, troll. >>
Like i said, lets both ask the mods to see whos telling the truth?
Like I said, everyone here knows you are just trying to avoid the truth like a typical fraud. Your theory is absolutely laughable.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Blacklabelsociety- First-You are 100% wrong thnking Grote15 is an Alt. Secondly- I believe you are Axtell.
Perk, you hit the nail on the head, but Black Label is more concerned with conjuring up elaborate "conspiracy" theories than admitting the obvious..
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>
<< Let me jump into the Fray here.
Blacklabelsociety- First-You are 100% wrong thnking Grote15 is an Alt. Secondly- I believe you are Axtell. >>
No you are wrong. Ask carol if i have more than one username if you dont believe me. Grote15 and sabermans posts are almost identical and are always agreeing with each other.
Lots of people agree that Bradshaw is overrated. And Saberman/Hoopster spends a lot more time than I do on analyzing stats and theories when it comes to sports, so you are, once again, wrong, as anyone else who's been here will attest. You say you "joined" in January 2010, yet you seem awfully familiar with these boards and who the mods are, MUCH more so than a true newbie. I call BS. You know you are an ALT and the ONLY reason you are suggesting such hogwash that Hoopster and I are the same person is to deflect attention from yourself. Typical behavior from a fraud. >>
I dont have anything to hide. You accuse me of being an alt, but have nothing to back it up. If you're not hoopster, than tell us what state you live in so the mods can clarify if your ip address is the same as hoopster?
Ive been here since 2006, you've been here (in this latest incarnation at least) since um, 2 weeks ago. And you're calling me an ALT? LOL, comical. Here's a newsflash: no one here believes you, and with good reason, troll. >>
Like i said, lets both ask the mods to see whos telling the truth?
Like I said, everyone here knows you are just trying to avoid the truth like a typical fraud. Your theory is absolutely laughable. >>
You're the fraud because you keep dodging the question.
The only question here is how long before you get bammed...enjoy the ride while it lasts!
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>You're the fraud because you keep dodging the question.
The only question here is how long before you get bammed...enjoy the ride while it lasts! >>
Is it against the rules to have more than one id? If so, then you should be gone being you have several.
The only question here is how long before you get bammed...enjoy the ride while it lasts! >>
Is it against the rules to have more than one id? If so, then you should be gone being you have several.
Wrong again. But thanks for playing, ALT, er, I mean, Black Label!
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i> Grote15 and sabermans posts are almost identical and are always agreeing with each other. >>
Saberman is more classy then Grote15.
Grote15 and winpitcher are more like each other, both Mets fans, and both show very little class.
But heck, that's 90% of Mets fans, so probably not the same. You know, you've seen one, you've seen em all.
<< Grote15 and sabermans posts are almost identical and are always agreeing with each other. >>
Saberman is more classy then Grote15.
Grote15 and winpitcher are more like each other, both Mets fans, and both show very little class.
But heck, that's 90% of Mets fans, so probably not the same. You know, you've seen one, you've seen em all.
I consider that a compliment coming from you, oh great prognosticator...and the Saints don't have a prayer, LOL!!
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>
I consider that a compliment coming from you, oh great prognosticator.!! >>
A Mets fan that can spell
He must have attended Boston College.
Perk can verify I am who I am. Perk and I exchanged fantasy baseball private messages back a while ago...and before I asked him about some of the ins/outs of visiting Boston.
Blacklabel, since your sports theories are so far wrong, and your information lacking, it is a good idea for you to put the attention to creatinga soap opera.
Hey look, Swann just made ANOTHER leaping catch...saving Bradshaw another INT. LOL.
Edmundfitzgerald, I have no doubt that Bradshaw had good leadership qualities, and was a top 20 QB of all time. And it takes a great arm for Swann/Stallworth to have a chance to catch those balls. But with all the information about the myth of clutch and such, to use the four rings as a reason why he was 'better' than somebody who doesn't have four rings, is just not an accurate barometer.
<< <i>
Blacklabel, since your sports facts are spot on, than i admit mine are ridiculous >>
Agreed, saberman