peyton: not the best qb in the past 30 years
PSACollector
Posts: 43
in Sports Talk
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<< <i>I know it's a team sport, but I think now Manning is just another Brett Favre. Amazing QB, but not the best ever (unless he wins like 2 or 3 more Super Bowls, which is possible, but unlikely). >>
Yep. Plenty of years left so he will have more opportunities. He played a great game tonight but his 4th quarter mistake cost his team the game.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>i'd take Joe Montana over anybody, ever. >>
I completely agree. Joe would have put that team on his back and made it happen. The "best ever" doesn't lose the big game. I don't care how good the 49ers were, Montana put them on his back on NUMEROUS occasions and pulled out, on his own, important games they should have lost.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>No question, Montana was the greatest QB I ever saw, and is arguably the best of all time. >>
But like Bradshaw, Montana had the fortune to play on one of the best teams ever?
<< <i>If he had the '70s Steelers D out there with him tonight, he'd have won easily. Oh, wait, that's Bradshaw who had that luxury, I'm sorry. Hard to fault a guy who played a terrific game but whose defense was like swiss cheese. >>
saints had one of the worst defenses in the NFL. 26th best. Manning didnt come up with the big plays when his team needed it. The Colts defense played pretty well against the best offense in the NFL.
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<< <i>No question, Montana was the greatest QB I ever saw, and is arguably the best of all time. >>
But like Bradshaw, Montana had the fortune to play on one of the best teams ever? >>
Yep... it was the 49ers defense that threw that TD to Dwight Clark in the back of the endzone to win the Super Bowl. Most of the all-time great players played on great teams... kind of makes sense.
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<< <i>No question, Montana was the greatest QB I ever saw, and is arguably the best of all time. >>
But like Bradshaw, Montana had the fortune to play on one of the best teams ever? >>
Yep... it was the 49ers defense that threw that TD to Dwight Clark in the back of the endzone to win the Super Bowl. Most of the all-time great players played on great teams... kind of makes sense. >>
Yes i know and i agree with you. I was being sarcastic because that guy doesnt give Bradshaw any credit for the big plays he made.
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<< <i>No question, Montana was the greatest QB I ever saw, and is arguably the best of all time. >>
But like Bradshaw, Montana had the fortune to play on one of the best teams ever? >>
Yep... it was the 49ers defense that threw that TD to Dwight Clark in the back of the endzone to win the Super Bowl. Most of the all-time great players played on great teams... kind of makes sense. >>
Yes i know and i agree with you. I was being sarcastic because that guy doesnt give Bradshaw any credit for the big plays he made. >>
lol, sorry. I couldn't read the sarcasm. I will never understand why people act like a great player playing on a great team makes him any less great.
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<< <i>No question, Montana was the greatest QB I ever saw, and is arguably the best of all time. >>
But like Bradshaw, Montana had the fortune to play on one of the best teams ever? >>
Yep... it was the 49ers defense that threw that TD to Dwight Clark in the back of the endzone to win the Super Bowl. Most of the all-time great players played on great teams... kind of makes sense. >>
Yes i know and i agree with you. I was being sarcastic because that guy doesnt give Bradshaw any credit for the big plays he made. >>
lol, sorry. I couldn't read the sarcasm. I will never understand why people act like a great player playing on a great team makes him any less great. >>
Concur!
<< No question, Montana was the greatest QB I ever saw, and is arguably the best of all time. >>
But like Bradshaw, Montana had the fortune to play on one of the best teams ever?
If you're going to compare Bradshaw to Montana you either a) know absolutely nothing about football or b) are on crack. LOL..
Edit: it figures that you and SCD agree on this topic...that only validates my point, LOL..
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>Yep... it was the 49ers defense that threw that TD to Dwight Clark in the back of the endzone to win the Super Bowl. Most of the all-time great players played on great teams... kind of makes sense. >>
Not sure who was throwing as Dwight Clark didn't have a single TD in any Super Bowl
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<< <i>Yep... it was the 49ers defense that threw that TD to Dwight Clark in the back of the endzone to win the Super Bowl. Most of the all-time great players played on great teams... kind of makes sense. >>
Not sure who was throwing as Dwight Clark didn't have a single TD in any Super Bowl >>
My fault, I meant the Championship game. Same point.
Not sure who was throwing as Dwight Clark didn't have a single TD in any Super Bowl >>
My fault, I meant the Championship game. Same point.
Yeah, um, ok, if you say so..LOL..
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i> Yep... it was the 49ers defense that threw that TD to Dwight Clark in the back of the endzone to win the Super Bowl. Most of the all-time great players played on great teams... kind of makes sense. >>
Not sure who was throwing as Dwight Clark didn't have a single TD in any Super Bowl >>
My fault, I meant the Championship game. Same point.
Yeah, um, ok, if you say so..LOL.. >>
Not sure what you mean. It is the same point no matter my mistake. Is it really that funny to you?
Not sure who was throwing as Dwight Clark didn't have a single TD in any Super Bowl >>
My fault, I meant the Championship game. Same point.
Yeah, um, ok, if you say so..LOL.. >>
Not sure what you mean. It is the same point no matter my mistake. Is it really that funny to you?
My bad, I thought you were agreeing that Bradshaw was even in the same zip code as Montana as a QB all time, sheerly based on rings..
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
The man is an outstanding QB and has been posting numbers several years now.
The Saints played very well as a Team!
NFC Champions
Super Bowl Champions
That's got a nice ring to it.
<< <i> Yep... it was the 49ers defense that threw that TD to Dwight Clark in the back of the endzone to win the Super Bowl. Most of the all-time great players played on great teams... kind of makes sense. >>
Not sure who was throwing as Dwight Clark didn't have a single TD in any Super Bowl >>
My fault, I meant the Championship game. Same point.
Yeah, um, ok, if you say so..LOL.. >>
Not sure what you mean. It is the same point no matter my mistake. Is it really that funny to you?
My bad, I thought you were agreeing that Bradshaw was even in the same zip code as Montana as a QB all time, sheerly based on rings.. >>
I think Joe Montana is the best ever QB, Terry Bradshaw is an all-time great, but no where near the top of the line.
Not sure who was throwing as Dwight Clark didn't have a single TD in any Super Bowl >>
My fault, I meant the Championship game. Same point.
Yeah, um, ok, if you say so..LOL.. >>
Not sure what you mean. It is the same point no matter my mistake. Is it really that funny to you?
My bad, I thought you were agreeing that Bradshaw was even in the same zip code as Montana as a QB all time, sheerly based on rings.. >>
I think Joe Montana is the best ever QB, Terry Bradshaw is an all-time great, but no where near the top of the line.
Agreed.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i> Yep... it was the 49ers defense that threw that TD to Dwight Clark in the back of the endzone to win the Super Bowl. Most of the all-time great players played on great teams... kind of makes sense. >>
Not sure who was throwing as Dwight Clark didn't have a single TD in any Super Bowl >>
My fault, I meant the Championship game. Same point.
Yeah, um, ok, if you say so..LOL.. >>
Not sure what you mean. It is the same point no matter my mistake. Is it really that funny to you?
My bad, I thought you were agreeing that Bradshaw was even in the same zip code as Montana as a QB all time, sheerly based on rings.. >>
In the post-season both Bradshaw and Starr are certainly in the same zip code, but i would rate Montana ahead over-all.
Before Bradshaw had swann/stallworth as starters, his yards per attempt floated around 6.2 for FIVE YEARS. After they became starters it floated around 8.0.
It is no wonder that in the Super Bowl when Bradshaw had big passing numbers, it is when he had them, and they made OUTSTANDING catches and insane amounts of yards and yards per catch.
Looking at the evidence, a detective would conclude it was more them, than Terry, doing the Super Bowl work.
So blacklabel, how are you going to spin that jump in yards per attempt for Bradshaw?
The hilarious thing is this...
Some amateurs have proclaimed Bradshaw a top five QB of all time, and some have said he was the best deep passer of all time. Ask yourself this, if both of those were true, don't you think he would at least make an honest showing in the following measurements, regardless of who his receivers were?
Terry Bradshaw had FIVE seasons as a starter before Swann and Stallworth became starters. How many times did the so called best deep passer in the history of the NFL crack the league's top ten in yards per pass attempt?
From 1970-1974 Terry Bradshaw did not have a single season in the top ten in the league in yards per attempt
From 1970-1974 Terry Bradshaw did not have a single season in the top ten in the league in passer rating.
Enter Swann and Stallworth...
Yards per attempt rank in league, and passer rating rank
1975 ranked 7th & 4th
1977 ranked 1st & 7th
1978 ranked 1st & 2nd
Hmmmm.
Five years in the leauge is plenty long enough to grow and establish oneself. In fact, most elite QB's have established themselves as elite by their second year...and by their fifth year they are already in HOF discussion as an all-time great. But Bradshaw was simply not good enough to do that. It took the merits of other players on his team to vault him into that type of discussion. The credit should be going to his receivers and line, NOT HIM. He was good at throwing jump balls.
Had he truly been a great deep passer, or a great passer in general, don't you think he would have at least showed up ONCE in the top ten in the league in both of those important measures of a QB? Repeat, FIVE YEARS with no top ten finishes, FIVE!
Oh, one might ask what happened in 1976 when he had Swann/Stallworth. Well, Bradshaw was bad in 1976 and his yards per attempt slipped to 6.1. His team went 4-4 with him as a starter with the best weapons in the history of the league. What is startling is that the backup scrub went 6-0 and had a yards per attempt of 8.9!!!
Now it is no wonder that Swann absolutely owned the second Super Bowl, and that Swann and Stallworth both owned the next two. The question always is, which came first, the chicke or the egg?? Based on the above, Bradshaw laid an egg wihtout those two...and those two absolutley carried the passing game, as can be measured by objective analysis like above, and by simply watching them make catches on a consistent basis that only a rare receiver could make.