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Whats going on with proof gold?
calleocho
Posts: 1,569 ✭✭
lately i have noticed some fairly nice offers to buy proof AGE gold and proof ASE.
I remember buying them for a small premium over regular gold bullion ...maybe 15% or so over spot, I also recall ASE proof for maybe 30-32 bucks at best.
Now i see dealers buying proof eagle for 1600 each and proof ASE for 40 bucks??
whats going on?
I remember buying them for a small premium over regular gold bullion ...maybe 15% or so over spot, I also recall ASE proof for maybe 30-32 bucks at best.
Now i see dealers buying proof eagle for 1600 each and proof ASE for 40 bucks??
whats going on?
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Groucho Marx
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Groucho Marx
Regular gold eagles do not.
<< <i>They qualify for IRA accounts.
Regular gold eagles do not. >>
Thats as stupid as it gets.
Regular gold eagles do not.
When was this changed? As far as I know, they've always been ok in IRAs.
Are you sure that this isn't simply an industry-wide promotion by the tv gold pushers?
I knew it would happen.
I always thought buying proof bullion was not the best way to spend my money, but the 4 piece gold set was selling for less than 2 grand a little while ago and now they are buying them for 3K plus.??
They are also paying more for the box and the COA than a proof with a 70 PCGS...weird.
Groucho Marx
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>yellow kid...
I always thought buying proof bullion was not the best way to spend my money, but the 4 piece gold set was selling for less than 2 grand a little while ago and now they are buying them for 3K plus.??
They are also paying more for the box and the COA than a proof with a 70 PCGS...weird. >>
Gold is hot now, good time to sell them and maybe put the diffference in bullion or gold stocks, I just don't see them holding their value, the premium I'm talking about, for the long haul.
<< <i>
<< <i>They qualify for IRA accounts.
Regular gold eagles do not. >>
Thats as stupid as it gets. >>
To the bureaucratic mind, a Proof gold coin in original government packaging is completely fungible. One is as good as another. AND, it has a CERTIFICATE OF AUTHENTICITY from the U.S. Mint!
Now, imagine that you put in 20 nice, shiny BU one ounce gold eagles in the original mint tube, but when you request your gold back you get 20 scratched up coins in greasy PVC flips. And, the color of one of them is a little bit off. Is it genuine?
Houston, do we have a problem?????
I am sure that when whomever drew up the rules for putting gold eagles into an IRA did so he or she never foresaw the demand for such gold, or the ridiculous premiums that the Proof gold would command. However, them's the rules, and the Mint's idiotic decision to not make Proof Gold Eagles this year has only poured gasoline on the fire.
TD
<< <i>They qualify for IRA accounts.
Regular gold eagles do not. >>
Not true. US Code on IRAs does not differentiate between proofs and bullion when contributing to an IRA. Collectables are not allowed in IRA's except for certain coins.
Per US Code Title 26, Subtitle A, Chapter 1, Subchapter D, Part I, Subpart A, Section 408 (m) (3):
(3) Exception for certain coins and bullion
For purposes of this subsection, the term “collectible” shall not include—
(A) any coin which is—
(i) a gold coin described in paragraph (7), (8), (9), or (10) of section 5112 (a) of title 31, United States Code,
(ii) a silver coin described in section 5112 (e) of title 31, United States Code,
(iii) a platinum coin described in section 5112 (k) of title 31, United States Code, or
(iv) a coin issued under the laws of any State, or
(B) any gold, silver, platinum, or palladium bullion of a fineness equal to or exceeding the minimum fineness that a contract market (as described in section 7 of the Commodity Exchange Act, 7 U.S.C. 7) [2] requires for metals which may be delivered in satisfaction of a regulated futures contract,
if such bullion is in the physical possession of a trustee described under subsection (a) of this section.
US Code Title 31, Section 5112 (a) paragraphs (7), (8), (9), (10) and (11):
(7) A fifty dollar gold coin that is 32.7 millimeters in diameter, weighs 33.931 grams, and contains one troy ounce of fine gold.
(8) A twenty-five dollar gold coin that is 27.0 millimeters in diameter, weighs 16.966 grams, and contains one-half troy ounce of fine gold.
(9) A ten dollar gold coin that is 22.0 millimeters in diameter, weighs 8.483 grams, and contains one-fourth troy ounce of fine gold.
(10) A five dollar gold coin that is 16.5 millimeters in diameter, weighs 3.393 grams, and contains one-tenth troy ounce of fine gold.
(11) A $50 gold coin that is of an appropriate size and thickness, as determined by the Secretary, weighs 1 ounce, and contains 99.99 percent pure gold.
Again, no distinction between proof or bullion. The problem encountered with bullion IRA's is the individual has to purchase the bullion from a third party bullion dealer who is willing to transfer to the IRA custodian WITHOUT the individual ever taking custody of the bullion. Most major bullion dealers (who are willing to jump through the hoops with an IRA transfer) don't normally deal in proofs. The IRS does not allow the individual to personally hand over coins for the IRA.
More info on gold IRA:
Coinlink
Reason I avoid a gold IRA is this: My money is tied up long term with handling/storage fees. Not a problem as long as gold is appreciating. In the event gold looses value and I want out, it becomes a very, very, big hassel with tax penalty consequences.
Why not just buy and sell mining stocks and SOUND ETFs via an IRA account with an on-line broker? I can buy and sell all I want with no tax reporting involved. Tax reporting is done only on withdrawals from the account.
Edited to add: Proof prices have been skyrocketing on ebay. I speculate it is just speculation!
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