First off, he turns 47 in November and has 5.22 ERA this year, I don't know what team would want a pitcher that old with declining skills to give him a chance at 300 wins. He would need another 43 wins to get there, which at his current pace would require 3 more seasons with at least 14 wins in each including Age 49...
Anyhow, if by some crazy fluke Moyer got in the Hall, he'd have to immediately be the least impressive HoFer in history. Only 3 seasons with more than 15 wins, only 1 season with more than 150 Ks.
I think he was implying Kaat and John with 280+ The reason was, by that time Kaat was a LH specialist and John just got too old. I think he was almost 47 when he finally did hang them up.
In any event Moyer will not be the first guy not in the hall with 250+ wins.
<< <i>Still think he belongs if players like Puckett who retired early due to injury are allowed in. >>
Prior to his surgery, Tommy John had more than 15 wins only once in 12 years, and that was 16 wins in 1973. In the 14 years after his surgery, he posted 4 really good years in a row with 20, 17, 21, 22 wins, but after that he never passed 15 wins again.
Puckett was among the elite of his era for his whole career. John was a good pitcher in an era of great pitchers.
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Anyhow, if by some crazy fluke Moyer got in the Hall, he'd have to immediately be the least impressive HoFer in history. Only 3 seasons with more than 15 wins, only 1 season with more than 150 Ks.
He will easily be forgettable to most fans.
<< <i>All Star games are voted upon by fans (only 25 votes per session) >>
Only for position players. The Managers pick the pitchers.
Anyways, Moyer has to get in line behind these 2 guys:
1) Bert Blylven (287-250, 4970 ip, 3.31 era, 1.198 whip, 3701 so, 60 shutouts)
2) Jim Kaat (283-237, 4530.1 ip, 3.45 era, 1.259 whip, 2461 so, 31 shutouts)
3) Jaime Moyer (257-194, 3876 ip, 4.22 era, 1.326 whip, 2322 so, 9 shutouts)
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
<< <i>please, Bruce Sutter is in and never started a game in his life. Moyer is in >>
Did you really just type that? Most relievers don't start games. Sutter had a short career but was dominate when he was playing.
<< please, Bruce Sutter is in and never started a game in his life. Moyer is in >>
And we debate with this guy.
Steve
Steve
<< <i>He also would be behind Tommy John in the list above. >>
Thanks for reminding me about Tommy John. I also remembered Jack Morris...
250+ win guys who have NOT been voted into the Hall of Fame (but did appear on ballots) who Moyer needs to get in line behind:
1) Bert Blylven (287-250, 4970 ip, 3.31 era, 1.198 whip, 3701 so, 60 shutouts)
2) Tommy John (288-231, 4710.1 ip, 3.34 era, 1.283 whip, 2245 so, 46 shutouts)
3) Jim Kaat (283-237, 4530.1 ip, 3.45 era, 1.259 whip, 2461 so, 31 shutouts)
4) Jack Morris (254-186, 3824 ip, 3.90 era, 1.296 whip, 2478 so, 28 shutouts)
...
x) Jaime Moyer (257-194, 3876 ip, 4.22 era, 1.326 whip, 2322 so, 9 shutouts)
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
Good catch on who chooses pitchers btw
Steve
<< <i>Pedro with 50+ less wins belongs in before Moyer. >>
I intentionally went with guys who have already been on Hall of Fame ballots and haven't gotten in.
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
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<< <i><< please, Bruce Sutter is in and never started a game in his life. Moyer is in >>
And we debate with this guy.
Steve >>
LOL...My thoughts exactly Steve
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<< <i>No Morris No Moyer, sorry. Wonder why none of those guys hung on another season to try and get 300? >>
Tough to get 46 wins in one season.
just got too old. I think he was almost 47 when he finally did hang them up.
In any event Moyer will not be the first guy not in the hall with 250+ wins.
Steve
<< <i>Still think he belongs if players like Puckett who retired early due to injury are allowed in. >>
Prior to his surgery, Tommy John had more than 15 wins only once in 12 years, and that was 16 wins in 1973.
In the 14 years after his surgery, he posted 4 really good years in a row with 20, 17, 21, 22 wins, but after that he never passed 15 wins again.
Puckett was among the elite of his era for his whole career. John was a good pitcher in an era of great pitchers.
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
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