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Star Jordan #101 Value

bbcemporiumbbcemporium Posts: 684 ✭✭✭
in Trading Cards & Memorabilia Forum
Any ideas what a Star Jordan #101 graded 8.5 by GAI would be worth? Scan is shown below

image
Registry Sets

"Common sense is the best distributed commodity in the world, for every man is convinced that he is well supplied with it"
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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Nice card! Where did you get it.

    jordan
    Yours looks like a carbon copy to mine

    I have the entire set and it isnt that easy to sell. The fakes are as good as the real deal. I dont know how GAI can tell the difference between the real ones. I think the jordan graded would bring around 850.00 or so
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    Josephcb09Josephcb09 Posts: 286 ✭✭
    Is that card for sale?

    I have been looking for that exact card.
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    bbcemporiumbbcemporium Posts: 684 ✭✭✭
    Its not mine yet, however someone has offered to sell it to me. I know a GAI sells for around 1600-2000, but not sure what a 8.5 would be worth. Also, what are the chances of crossing it over to a BGS 8 or 8.5? Looks like centering is the only issue. Also, does anyone know if many Star reprints have found their way into GAI slabs?
    Thanks
    Registry Sets

    "Common sense is the best distributed commodity in the world, for every man is convinced that he is well supplied with it"
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    daddymcdaddymc Posts: 3,080 ✭✭✭
    I would be concerned with any card graded by GAI in one of the newer flips like this one. What I have read about this issue echoes what handyman stated in that it's very difficult to discern real Star cards from the fake ones. I suspect that is why PSA stays away from grading these? Beckett stayed away from this issue for years due to the belief that many cards on the market were either counterfeit, or possibly reprinted long after their original runs.

    Currently working on: Kurt Warner PSA 9 or 10

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    ElToroLocoElToroLoco Posts: 914 ✭
    These cards have recently become more visible because Beckett had decided to grade an individual's large Star collection. The collection apparently has bullet proof provenance for being original. However, th problem is what was stated above, it's virtually impossible to tell the diference between an original and a reprint. The reprints in question were thought to be printed from the original printing plates, hence, impossible to tell....this will always impact the value. I'd stick with the Fleer card.
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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    It seems like certain grading companies(not sayinG anyone) seem to think that if nobody knows the difference from the fakes then how will anyone prove they graded a fake card. And can then generate profit from submissions
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    AllenAllen Posts: 7,165 ✭✭✭
    It is not nearly as hard to spot counterfeits as most think. Most of the counterfeiting was done in specific sets. There have been several threads on here over the years regarding them.

    Also BGS is not only grading one collection, they will grade anyone's Star Co. cards and they are accepting submissions. Our friend Steve Taft trained the Beckett staff.
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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    How can you tell?
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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Are their any examples with a pic of a fake next to a real card or anything? Examples?
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    shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,566 ✭✭✭✭
    I guess I'll be the first to actually answer your question. I'd say a GAI 8.5 is worth around $2,500. For all of their shortcomings, I think GAI did a good job grading Star basketball cards because their staff was trained well. The '84 - '85 set was not among those that was reprinted from the original plates. As for the centering on the Jordan, it's fine. If you ever find a dead centered Jordan (or Olajuwon), you've stumbled upon a reprint. Hope this helps.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
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    CDsNutsCDsNuts Posts: 10,092 ✭
    it's virtually impossible to tell the diference between an original and a reprint. The reprints in question were thought to be printed from the original printing plates, hence, impossible to tell....this will always impact the value


    This is a common misconception. There were actually no Star cards reprinted using the original plates. There were however new sets made using printing plates that were created in the 90s by the Star CEO (Levine) for subsets that had never before existed and sold on Shop at Home. The ones I know about are the Arena Bulls set, Miller Lite set, and All Rookie Team set. I think there was also a Magic Johnson set and the 85 Crunch'n Munch. If reprints were made at any time, this card would be a lot more plentiful then it is. I've been collecting 80s basketball since 1989 and I've seen only a handful of this card in person (including going to large shows like the National) without there ever being a spike. If anybody did have the printing plates and could make this card at will, they probably left at least $500k on the table. Not to mention, if Levine did have the plates to reprint htis card, don't you think he would've unloaded a bunch of them on Shop at Home for an easy score like he did with the "never before seen" sets?

    Jordan #101 counterfeits are fairly easy to tell from the real deal as the legit Jordan's are always somewhat OC and the font is not as sharp as it is on the counterfeits. I think there's an article somewhere showing the differences but not sure where it is.
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    nam812nam812 Posts: 10,539 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>This is a common misconception. There were actually no Star cards reprinted using the original plates. There were however new sets made using printing plates that were created in the 90s by the Star CEO (Levine) for subsets that had never before existed and sold on Shop at Home. The ones I know about are the Arena Bulls set, Miller Lite set, and All Rookie Team set. I think there was also a Magic Johnson set and the 85 Crunch'n Munch. If reprints were made at any time, this card would be a lot more plentiful then it is. I've been collecting 80s basketball since 1989 and I've seen only a handful of this card in person (including going to large shows like the National) without there ever being a spike. If anybody did have the printing plates and could make this card at will, they probably left at least $500k on the table. Not to mention, if Levine did have the plates to reprint htis card, don't you think he would've unloaded a bunch of them on Shop at Home for an easy score like he did with the "never before seen" sets?

    Jordan #101 counterfeits are fairly easy to tell from the real deal as the legit Jordan's are always somewhat OC and the font is not as sharp as it is on the counterfeits. I think there's an article somewhere showing the differences but not sure where it is. >>



    Didn't you work for Shop at Home for a while Lee?
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    lsutigers1973lsutigers1973 Posts: 11,093 ✭
    My day is now complete thanks to a meaningful and educational post by Lee.
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    ndleondleo Posts: 4,078 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>it's virtually impossible to tell the diference between an original and a reprint. The reprints in question were thought to be printed from the original printing plates, hence, impossible to tell....this will always impact the value


    This is a common misconception. There were actually no Star cards reprinted using the original plates. There were however new sets made using printing plates that were created in the 90s by the Star CEO (Levine) for subsets that had never before existed and sold on Shop at Home. The ones I know about are the Arena Bulls set, Miller Lite set, and All Rookie Team set. I think there was also a Magic Johnson set and the 85 Crunch'n Munch. If reprints were made at any time, this card would be a lot more plentiful then it is. I've been collecting 80s basketball since 1989 and I've seen only a handful of this card in person (including going to large shows like the National) without there ever being a spike. If anybody did have the printing plates and could make this card at will, they probably left at least $500k on the table. Not to mention, if Levine did have the plates to reprint htis card, don't you think he would've unloaded a bunch of them on Shop at Home for an easy score like he did with the "never before seen" sets?

    Jordan #101 counterfeits are fairly easy to tell from the real deal as the legit Jordan's are always somewhat OC and the font is not as sharp as it is on the counterfeits. I think there's an article somewhere showing the differences but not sure where it is. >>



    Great info. However this does raise a question.....why did PSA stop grading Star basketball all together?
    Mike
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    CDsNutsCDsNuts Posts: 10,092 ✭
    Nick, it was actually the Home Shopping Network that I was a purchaser for. I got fired after making a poor purchase on some junk sets and an autographed football I thought was worth a bundle. They told me they were letting me go while we were eating wings at a Hooters. Not very professional at all.


    Great info. However this does raise a question.....why did PSA stop grading Star basketball all together?

    That's a good question. I think the rumors of counterfeits were enough for PSA to not want to risk their rep on grading them. I don't think they ever actually took the time to research the Star sets and just decided it would be best not to deal with it. Not a great business decision as they're leaving out some of the key NBA cards of all time, but it's their business and they can do what they want to do.
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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I have the entire set if anyone is interested in it PM.

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    nam812nam812 Posts: 10,539 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I have the entire set if anyone is interested in it PM. >>



    Im interested, but I'm in N.Y. How much is shipping from Sweden?
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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Im back. Wise guy
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    nam812nam812 Posts: 10,539 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Im back. Wise guy >>



    I apologize as I was not aware you had snuck back into the United States. With regard to the possible sale, can you provide any references to show your true character? Mickey71 perhaps?
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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Sure, last i heard I refunded his money and let him keep the cards for free. He also stated that there where no hard feelings. Maybe you should just worry about yourself. Yeah I did sneak back in to the states. If only I had taken the 30.00 from Mickey I would have been there for another year or so(living like a king) DANG IT.

    That issue was taken care of and was over a year ago. I said I was sorry and made good on the deal. I was a slow shipper and I made good on the deal.
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    nam812nam812 Posts: 10,539 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Really? He still seems pretty angry with you in this thread

    For those that don't want to click on the link, as recent as July 3, 2009 Mickey71 states:

    "I received 1971 football from the guy moving to sweden. HANDY***. There were multiple cards in card savers and they were almost all ruined. He had to be threatened by another board member just to make good on his deals. I kept the board updated all along the way. He thought he would send me ruined cards to rub it in my face. He did refund the money; but denied the multiple cards in card savers and said the cards were all NM-MT and mint. It was my worst deal ever on these boards. I can't believe he actually has the "stones" to still post here."

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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Really.
    Yeah and I made good on the deal. He kept the cards and I refunded his money.
    This issue is not an issue.
    Im sorry Im sorry Im sorry. Wait you just dont get it. Man I feel so bad about this deal that you had no part of. The way you wont let it go makes me wonder why I would make things right on this deal when you wont even forgive me no matter what I do.

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    nam812nam812 Posts: 10,539 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Your insincere apologies mean very little to me.

    Just for the record, once a member makes his transaction public, me and every other member here become a part of it. That is why I feel the need to alert anyone and everyone to the kind of person they may be getting into a deal with. If after that they still decide to deal with you, that is their business, but if I can steer a member of MY community away from a bad transaction, then I feel that helps EVERYONE here.

    Flight 666 to Sweden now boarding. Bon voyage.
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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Just know all the facts then. Good luck to you and Im glad there are people like you. I did the worst thing possible. I sh 4 card in one holder! Only God can forgive me i guess.
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    WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    Not only did you ship multiple cards in one holder if I remember correctly it took you
    weeks to complete the deal. And if my memory serves me Mickey was not the only person
    that was left waiting for his items.

    I understand that you may have had problems around that time but communication was lacking on your part.


    Steve
    Good for you.
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    WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    Only God can forgive me i guess.



    Lee do you forgive him?


    Steve
    Good for you.
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    CDsNutsCDsNuts Posts: 10,092 ✭
    No. No I do not.
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    2dueces2dueces Posts: 6,252 ✭✭✭✭✭
    image
    W.C.Fields
    "I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
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    handymanhandyman Posts: 5,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Only god
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    shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,566 ✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Great info. However this does raise a question.....why did PSA stop grading Star basketball all together? >>



    The story I heard is that PSA was found to have slabbed a Jordan 101 rookie that was later determined to be counterfeit, and that was enough to pull the plug on them grading Star cards. It really is a shame.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
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    JackWESQJackWESQ Posts: 2,133 ✭✭✭


    << <i>The story I heard is that PSA was found to have slabbed a Jordan 101 rookie that was later determined to be counterfeit ... >>


    I think you might be referring to the card pictured below. It's a horrible picture, but it's all I got.

    Also, the certification number, which appears to be 01555511, goes to a Charles Barkley card.

    /s/ JackWESQ

    image
    image
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    CDsNutsCDsNuts Posts: 10,092 ✭
    The story I heard is that PSA was found to have slabbed a Jordan 101 rookie that was later determined to be counterfeit, and that was enough to pull the plug on them grading Star cards. It really is a shame.

    That would make sense. Of course they could spend the time to do research and figure out how to tell counterfeits. Afterall, if the card was deemed counterfeit then somebody out there knows how to tell. God forbid they take the time to learn and train their graders.
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    ndleondleo Posts: 4,078 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Besides the Jordan XRC, it looks like the market is still trying to find the value for the BGS graded stars especially the sub-9 grades.

    I also think the value of a slabbed seal set is going to take a while to settle down. I think most people want graded singles.

    Mike
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    Bigjohn69Bigjohn69 Posts: 737
    Hi, i apologize for bring up an old thread but Im having a little trouble finding the answer to a question on this 101 card,,,, can anyone tell me what the dimensions are of this card top to bottom side to side,, also was there any variation in size or were they pretty much a standard size,, im looking at a 101 card and its off centered to a point where it looks cut down a little and I can not find any info on them,, does anyone have one that could measure theirs,, i sure appreciate it,, John
    imageimageimageimageimage
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    CDsNutsCDsNuts Posts: 10,092 ✭
    They were supposed to be standard size, but Star was all over the place with their cutting. Mine is cut a little short T/B but it came out of a team bag with the whole set cut a little short. Do you have a scan of yours? I might be able to help out.


    image
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    nam812nam812 Posts: 10,539 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Lee, are those the ones that were reprinted using the original plates?
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    Bigjohn69Bigjohn69 Posts: 737
    well heres whats going on, i sold this card last week, the guy bought it got it and said it was cut down, i took the photos to a local hobby shop here that says its not cut down but off centered, i relayed the info to the buyer and i really did not know card collectors could be so, well, for the sake of being nice, ill say life threatening,, i bought this years ago off a freind who at the time needed money so i helped him out, heres the card he says its 2- 7/16 inch tall, my question to him and anyone if it was cut down why the heck wouldnt they take out the chipping on them edges, i know its not a mint, i realize this , Beckett response via automated was to send it to them for grading is fine but still gave me no info on the dimensions,,, thanks guys,, John
    image
    imageimageimageimageimage
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    CDsNutsCDsNuts Posts: 10,092 ✭
    The card should be 3.5 inches tall and 2.5 inches wide, but not all Star are exactly the same. Are you sure he's saying it's 2 7/16 and not 3 7/16? If it's 2 7/16 tall then it's an inch short and it would be pretty obvious.

    Obviously somewhat of a beater, but looks legit and untrimmed from the scan. It was probably cut short by Star like mine.
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    Bigjohn69Bigjohn69 Posts: 737
    sorry this is got my gutt in a knot, yes 3- 7/16 in,, thank you,,john

    in trying to find out info i ran across a beckett article that claims only 3000 of these were made, can that be true, that to me seems to be a pretty low number if you figure in the pre collector craze back then and the cards we put in our bicycle spokes to here it ratta tat tat, lol,, would make this pretty scarce
    imageimageimageimageimage
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    shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,566 ✭✭✭✭
    It does not appear to be trimmed IMO. The edges show even wear.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
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    CDsNutsCDsNuts Posts: 10,092 ✭
    It's legit. You probably should send it to Beckett to get graded so you don't run into this problem again. It will probably get something like a 4, but you will still find a buyer who just wants a Jordan RC and doesn't care that much about condition. Your card is probably worth around $400 or so in that condition.
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    vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,077 ✭✭✭


    << <i>It's legit. You probably should send it to Beckett to get graded so you don't run into this problem again. It will probably get something like a 4, but you will still find a buyer who just wants a Jordan RC and doesn't care that much about condition. Your card is probably worth around $400 or so in that condition. >>


    +1
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    Bigjohn69Bigjohn69 Posts: 737
    Thank you all, you have no idea how this helps me out, john
    imageimageimageimageimage
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    hookemhookem Posts: 971 ✭✭


    << <i>well heres whats going on, i sold this card last week, the guy bought it got it and said it was cut down, i took the photos to a local hobby shop here that says its not cut down but off centered, i relayed the info to the buyer and i really did not know card collectors could be so, well, for the sake of being nice, ill say life threatening,, i bought this years ago off a freind who at the time needed money so i helped him out, heres the card he says its 2- 7/16 inch tall, my question to him and anyone if it was cut down why the heck wouldnt they take out the chipping on them edges, i know its not a mint, i realize this , Beckett response via automated was to send it to them for grading is fine but still gave me no info on the dimensions,,, thanks guys,, John
    image >>



    Send it in and put it on eBay and I would be a bidder if you ever remember this post and email me the item number. If you are just looking to sell quick and don't care to send it in, send me an email.

    eloy100@gmail.com

    Hook'em
    Eloy
    Hook'em
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    Dpeck100Dpeck100 Posts: 10,910 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This card looks really OC to be a in a 9 holder. Maybe it is standard but the 8.5 for centering seems really generous to me.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-85-Star-Basketball-Michael-Jordan-ROOKIE-RC-101-BGS-9-MINT/142399682454?_trksid=p2047675.c100009.m1982&amp;_trkparms=aid=888007&algo=DISC.MBE&ao=1&asc=41376&meid=52dd08f5fe3b44f9839150d9e8118f32&pid=100009&rk=1&rkt=2&sd=401340990269

    I came across it after viewing this listing.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-85-Star-BBall-Sealed-Bulls-Team-Bag-w-Michael-Jordan-101-ROOKIE-PWCC-/401340990269?hash=item5d71c9833d:g:~ZQAAOSw1WJZNG6x

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    erikthredderikthredd Posts: 8,235 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 8, 2017 1:35PM

    @bbcemporium said:
    Any ideas what a Star Jordan #101 graded 8.5 by GAI would be worth? Scan is shown below

    Here is a snapshot of Beckett's Real Time Pricing for this card graded. Hope it helps.
    EDIT: WOW I didn't look at the date on your comment,little late to the party lol

    Eric
    Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
    Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486

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    erikthredderikthredd Posts: 8,235 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @CDsNuts said:
    "it's virtually impossible to tell the diference between an original and a reprint. The reprints in question were thought to be printed from the original printing plates, hence, impossible to tell....this will always impact the value

    This is a common misconception. There were actually no Star cards reprinted using the original plates. There were however new sets made using printing plates that were created in the 90s by the Star CEO (Levine) for subsets that had never before existed and sold on Shop at Home. The ones I know about are the Arena Bulls set, Miller Lite set, and All Rookie Team set. "

    I have Jordan's 10 card red border 1984 Star 84 Gold medalists set from the HSN as well as a 10 card blue border 1984 Star 84 Gold Medalists set that has 1 jordan in it. I bought both of these sets in the past few months not knowing the HSN story and sent the Jordans to BGS but they wouldn't touch them. Jordan's HSN stuff is hard to find and the only cards on ebay the seller has for crazy prices.

    Eric
    Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
    Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486

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    bbcemporiumbbcemporium Posts: 684 ✭✭✭

    I never actually purchased that card, which appears to be a mistake in hindsight...

    Registry Sets

    "Common sense is the best distributed commodity in the world, for every man is convinced that he is well supplied with it"
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    sushihotwingssushihotwings Posts: 452 ✭✭✭
    edited June 8, 2017 8:39PM

    @Dpeck100 said:

    This card looks really OC to be a in a 9 holder. Maybe it is standard but the 8.5 for centering seems really generous to me.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-85-Star-Basketball-Michael-Jordan-ROOKIE-RC-101-BGS-9-MINT/142399682454?_trksid=p2047675.c100009.m1982&amp;_trkparms=aid=888007&algo=DISC.MBE&ao=1&asc=41376&meid=52dd08f5fe3b44f9839150d9e8118f32&pid=100009&rk=1&rkt=2&sd=401340990269

    I came across it after viewing this listing.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-85-Star-BBall-Sealed-Bulls-Team-Bag-w-Michael-Jordan-101-ROOKIE-PWCC-/401340990269?hash=item5d71c9833d:g:~ZQAAOSw1WJZNG6x

    I totally agree. The centering on that Jordan #101 doesn't justify 8.5 subgrade. Centering is off both sided to side and top to bottom. There are much nicer 9s out there and you might even get three grade 8.5s that have the same or better eye appeal for that price.

    Here is my Jordan #101 which I think has better eye appeal and is graded 8.5 overall

    On the hunt high grade Star Basketball.
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    sushihotwingssushihotwings Posts: 452 ✭✭✭

    @erikthredd said:

    @CDsNuts said:
    "it's virtually impossible to tell the diference between an original and a reprint. The reprints in question were thought to be printed from the original printing plates, hence, impossible to tell....this will always impact the value

    This is a common misconception. There were actually no Star cards reprinted using the original plates. There were however new sets made using printing plates that were created in the 90s by the Star CEO (Levine) for subsets that had never before existed and sold on Shop at Home. The ones I know about are the Arena Bulls set, Miller Lite set, and All Rookie Team set. "

    I have Jordan's 10 card red border 1984 Star 84 Gold medalists set from the HSN as well as a 10 card blue border 1984 Star 84 Gold Medalists set that has 1 jordan in it. I bought both of these sets in the past few months not knowing the HSN story and sent the Jordans to BGS but they wouldn't touch them. Jordan's HSN stuff is hard to find and the only cards on ebay the seller has for crazy prices.

    Erik. Sorry to hear you got swindled on the HSN set. The information available now about Star cards is so much improved from years ago. With a little bit of study and knowledge it is actually easier to tell authentic from fake Star imo compared to say the 1986 Fleer Jordan but you have to know where to look. Here is a link to a website started by a die hard Star basketball collector which is just super educational. I am hope this helps.

    www.basektballgold.com

    On the hunt high grade Star Basketball.
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