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Will PCGS cross an NCS coin into a "Genuine" holder?

astroratastrorat Posts: 9,221 ✭✭✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum
The title pretty much asks the question. Any thoughts?

Okay...in case anyone is thinking why the %$&*$# would anyone do that...PCGS "Genuine" coins seem to have more "value" than NCS coins, in general. Plus, somebody could use the PCGS "Genuine" coins as a "test," say in an ANA problem coin course, and they look like they are in "normal" holders as opposed to the NCS coins.

Lane

Edited for spelling...
Numismatist Ordinaire
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces

Comments

  • JulianJulian Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭
    Why not?
    PNG member, numismatic dealer since 1965. Operates a retail store, also has exhibited at over 1000 shows.
    I firmly believe in numismatics as the world's greatest hobby, but recognize that this is a luxury and without collectors, we can all spend/melt our collections/inventories.

    eBaystore
  • relicsncoinsrelicsncoins Posts: 8,041 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>The title pretty much asks the question. Any thoughts.

    Okay...in case anyone is thinking why the %$&*$# would anyone do that...PCGS "Genuine" coins seem to have more "value" than NCS coins, in general. Plus, somebody could use the PCGS "Genuine" coins as a "test," say in an ANA problem coin course, and they look like they are in "normal" holders as opposed to the NCS coins.

    Lane

    Edited for spelling... >>



    I'm sure they would, but if you are going to send it in, why not crack it out first? You might get lucky and have it end up in a problem free holder, depending on what the perceived problem was.

    JJ
    Need a Barber Half with ANACS photo certificate. If you have one for sale please PM me. Current Ebay auctions
  • ambro51ambro51 Posts: 13,833 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Why do you feel the Genuine holder holds more value for the same coin than the NCS holder?

    I ask because the NCS holder has been on the market for a longer period of time and has the advantage of having a "details grade".
  • MillertimeMillertime Posts: 2,048 ✭✭
    You can use a "Genuine" holder in a registry set (at least I think you can). Depending on the set that would be reason enough for me.

    Millertime
    Mercury Dime Set (rattlers)
    Complete Dime Set

    image
  • HTubbsHTubbs Posts: 4,138 ✭✭✭


    << <i>I ask because the NCS holder has been on the market for a longer period of time and has the advantage of having a "details grade". >>



    Yes, but the PCGS name is more well known than NCS. In my opinion, NGC would be better off consolidating the NGC and NCS names and just using NGC. Brand recognition places a big key in purchases and through my own experiences with clients, everyone knows PCGS but not everyone knows NCS.
  • ambro51ambro51 Posts: 13,833 ✭✭✭✭✭
    There is word that both the PCGS gennie and the NCS holder will be allowed to be included in NGC registry sets. No timeframe on that though.

    There is a lot of room for improvement in the "genuine" holder in my opinion. I personally think these should be 'graded' somehow, and a coin that has a light, barely detectable cleaning should grade A, a harshly cleaned coin a B, and a severely damaged, plugged holed etc grade a C, and different levels of value be allowed for registry purposes.

    Just a theory, but one that I feel has a workable value.


    NCS has a name recognition....they are the 'accepted conservators', which is something NOT too frequently found in the coin world.
  • astroratastrorat Posts: 9,221 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Why do you feel the Genuine holder holds more value for the same coin than the NCS holder?

    I ask because the NCS holder has been on the market for a longer period of time and has the advantage of having a "details grade". >>



    In my experience, people are asking more for "similar" coins in PCGS Genuine holders as opposed to NCS holders. The same thing happened a few years ago with NCS holders when comparing to ANACS "Details" and "Net" coins.

    The reason they hold more value for me is that I prefer the holder since it can masquerade as a "real" holder if the labels are covered. Thus it is a better "test" coin for the classroom.

    Lane
    Numismatist Ordinaire
    See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
  • astroratastrorat Posts: 9,221 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>NCS has a name recognition....they are the 'accepted conservators', which is something NOT too frequently found in the coin world. >>



    "Accepted conservators" is just a euphemism for a commercial coin doctor. NCS may not AT, putty, or frost coins to make them "better," but they doctor them nonetheless...and openly get paid to do it...oh, and have the official endorsement of the ANA! Not a bad gig at all.

    Lane
    Numismatist Ordinaire
    See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,358 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yes. That way the label will no longer spell out the problem and you can sell it to a new collector for a good price.image

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • ambro51ambro51 Posts: 13,833 ✭✭✭✭✭
    ..WOW this must be better than a 70 cuz it grades a 91!!!!.......and its GENUWINE TOO! image


    dont let my satire get in the way, I realize the Genuine Holder has a value in the collectors world, I totally realize that.
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,358 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>..WOW this must be better than a 70 cuz it grades a 91!!!!.......and its GENUWINE TOO! image

    dont let my satire get in the way, I realize the Genuine Holder has a value in the collectors world, I totally realize that. >>



    The NCS holders also have value in the collectors world. Investors, on the other hand, would avoid both holders.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • MrEurekaMrEureka Posts: 24,316 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Why not just crack the coin and submit to PCGS?
    Andy Lustig

    Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.

    Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
  • BillJonesBillJones Posts: 34,243 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I don't know why PCGS won't cross an NCS coin to genuine, if it really is "genuine." But then again I don't know why you would bother. It's only worth 1 point on the PCGS registry.
    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,358 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I don't know why PCGS won't cross an NCS coin to genuine, if it really is "genuine." But then again I don't know why you would bother. It's only worth 1 point on the PCGS registry. >>



    Agree. It isn't worth the expense.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • abitofthisabitofthatabitofthisabitofthat Posts: 2,142 ✭✭✭
    I tried to go the other way. I have a 1795 Dollar in a genuine holder (cleaned reverse). I wanted it to go to NCS because I thought that the details grade (I expected AU details) would make it more marketable. They declined to cross it. Apparently, they did not want to authenticate it in the holder, so they never cracked it. I found it very odd. I will just resubmit it raw to them.

    merse

  • shottakershottaker Posts: 309
    I cant even believe someone asked this question.

    And I thought I put a few brews away today! Guess someone beat me.........
  • BECOKABECOKA Posts: 16,961 ✭✭✭
    Problem coins just look better in PCGS slabs and they blend with the collection better with the problems not thrown out in your face.

    I don't see why they would not and quite frankly I'd just call them, if they say no I would crack it out and send it in.
  • BochimanBochiman Posts: 25,446 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I cant even believe someone asked this question.

    And I thought I put a few brews away today! Guess someone beat me......... >>



    Then shouldn't you be "brewtaker" instead of "shottaker"? image

    I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,358 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i> they blend with the collection better with the problems not thrown out in your face. >>



    This statement makes absolutely no sense. Do they "throw out in your face" the grade, serial number, denomination, PCGS logo, etc?

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • BECOKABECOKA Posts: 16,961 ✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i> they blend with the collection better with the problems not thrown out in your face. >>



    This statement makes absolutely no sense. Do they "throw out in your face" the grade, serial number, denomination, PCGS logo, etc? >>



    My problem with the other TPG details holders is the labeling of the issue. If the coin is going to be in my collection I want to look at the coin and not so much what the holder says. To me keeping it vague with Genuine and nothing else and the same color label as my other PCGS holders makes it blend in.

    Hope it makes sense now.
  • DonWillisDonWillis Posts: 961 ✭✭✭
    PCGS will cross any coin - that's Genuine - from any holder into a PCGS Genuine holder.

    I personally recommend cracking the coin out and sending it in raw which allows the graders to get a better view of the coin.
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,358 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i> they blend with the collection better with the problems not thrown out in your face. >>



    This statement makes absolutely no sense. Do they "throw out in your face" the grade, serial number, denomination, PCGS logo, etc? >>



    My problem with the other TPG details holders is the labeling of the issue. If the coin is going to be in my collection I want to look at the coin and not so much what the holder says. To me keeping it vague with Genuine and nothing else and the same color label as my other PCGS holders makes it blend in.

    Hope it makes sense now. >>



    Yup. Makes sense now. You want to protend your "GENUINE" coins are free of problems.imageimage



    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • BECOKABECOKA Posts: 16,961 ✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i> they blend with the collection better with the problems not thrown out in your face. >>



    This statement makes absolutely no sense. Do they "throw out in your face" the grade, serial number, denomination, PCGS logo, etc? >>



    My problem with the other TPG details holders is the labeling of the issue. If the coin is going to be in my collection I want to look at the coin and not so much what the holder says. To me keeping it vague with Genuine and nothing else and the same color label as my other PCGS holders makes it blend in.

    Hope it makes sense now. >>



    Yup. Makes sense now. You want to protend your "GENUINE" coins are free of problems.imageimage >>



    Not quite, I know the problem is there but when I lay them out as a set, the problem is not noticable and some of my problem coins actually look better and more original than my non problem coins. So now that that is said I guess you are right I'm pretending they are problem free since they look so darn good. image
  • astroratastrorat Posts: 9,221 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>PCGS will cross any coin - that's Genuine - from any holder into a PCGS Genuine holder.

    I personally recommend cracking the coin out and sending it in raw which allows the graders to get a better view of the coin. >>



    Thanks, Don.

    Lane
    Numismatist Ordinaire
    See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
  • astroratastrorat Posts: 9,221 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I cant even believe someone asked this question.

    And I thought I put a few brews away today! Guess someone beat me......... >>



    Nice contribution. Obviously the brews you put away prevented you from actually understanding the OP.

    Oh...why did I ask the question? Because I didn't know the answer...imagine that.

    Lane
    Numismatist Ordinaire
    See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
  • astroratastrorat Posts: 9,221 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>You want to protend your "GENUINE" coins are free of problems.imageimage >>



    Actually Perry, you got it right. I want the students to pretend the problem coins are "normal" and let the students see if they can detect the problem. Mix in the Genuine holders with regular holders, cover the labels, and it's a great way to test their skills.

    Lane
    Numismatist Ordinaire
    See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
  • 19Lyds19Lyds Posts: 26,491 ✭✭✭✭
    image


    Longacre, where are you?
    I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.



    The name is LEE!
  • mozinmozin Posts: 8,755 ✭✭✭
    Like Don said, submit the coin raw so the graders can get a better look at it. You could get lucky and have it earn a grade.
    I collect Capped Bust series by variety in PCGS AU/MS grades.
  • BECOKABECOKA Posts: 16,961 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Like Don said, submit the coin raw so the graders can get a better look at it. You could get lucky and have it earn a grade. >>



    Not sure he implied the second part but you are right it would not be the first time. image

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