I'm happy to have these in a series full of garbage....20 Centers.
relicsncoins
Posts: 8,044 ✭✭✭✭✭
With as many garbage cleaned and otherwise problem 20 cent pieces out there, I feel forturnate to have couple of nice problem free circulated examples. Even though they have totally different looks, they are both nice. One of these coins has been professionaly graded, the other I bought raw. What do you think they grade?
Need a Barber Half with ANACS photo certificate. If you have one for sale please PM me. Current Ebay auctions
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I agree, and they look like some nice coins.
Sean Reynolds
"Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
Each will grade EF-40. How they slab could be anywhere from VF-35 to EF-45 depending on the grader. For some reason, there is a lot of variability in the VF-EF range with the TPGs today.
The top coin is a solid EF-40. It's a great, original circulated coin.
The bottom coin technically grades higher, but has a bit of a weak strike (which is somewhat uncommon for the 75-S) in the upper part of the eagle's right wing which also shows up as a weakness in the last two letters of LIBERTY on the obverse. Because of the weakness, it will grade EF-40. Still another great example of a circulated double dime.
If you ever choose to part with them...drop me a line.
Lane
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Top coin is more appealing and more evenly struck. Bottom coin has more detail on the reverse, especially the feathers and talons on the eagle's left (viewer's right) leg and both wingtips. Whereas they'd both probably sell for the same, they'll probably be graded the same.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Coin # 2 is close to EF, but I hesitate to market grade it at that leve because of the weakness in the legend on the reverse. I'll call it VF-30.
The top coin is better struck, and this is especially clear on the top of the eagle's wing and serifs on the upper left of the reverse. The actual wear is about even on both, but the bottom coin shows more detail on the eagle's claws and on the obverse stars near Liberty's feet.
I'd call them both EF40.
Obscurum per obscurius
<< <i>I like them a lot, especially the top coin. >>
Ditto for me.
<< <i>I just sent the top coin to PCGS a few days ago. We shall see what they have to say. >>
Be sure to post the results.
Obscurum per obscurius
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
-Paul
I just got back 14 double dimes from PCGS (all 75-P, 75-S, 75-CC, or 76-P). All but 3 "upgraded" by either a 1/2 qualitative or a full qualitative grade (e.g. VF-20 to VF-30, or VF-20 to EF-40) compared with how I graded them 5 years ago or so. None graded lower. In my opinion, two of them would have "body-bagged" just a few years ago. I don't think that PCGS got them "wrong," but rather the standards for this series has loosened somewhat over the last 5 years and the current grading more correctly reflects what is market acceptable today. I think what many "novice" collectors are not realizing is that the current price guides do not reflect the "average" coin, but rather those that are solid for the grade with no problems. One might even refer to them as "CAC-able."
Lane
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
<< <i>Any word on the grades?
I just got back 14 double dimes from PCGS (all 75-P, 75-S, 75-CC, or 76-P). All but 3 "upgraded" by either a 1/2 qualitative or a full qualitative grade (e.g. VF-20 to VF-30, or VF-20 to EF-40) compared with how I graded them 5 years ago or so. None graded lower. In my opinion, two of them would have "body-bagged" just a few years ago. I don't think that PCGS got them "wrong," but rather the standards for this series has loosened somewhat over the last 5 years and the current grading more correctly reflects what is market acceptable today. I think what many "novice" collectors are not realizing is that the current price guides do not reflect the "average" coin, but rather those that are solid for the grade with no problems. One might even refer to them as "CAC-able."
Lane >>
I'm continually disappointed at the condition of double dimes I see at shows. They are generally whizzed, harshly cleaned, or dipped out until they resemble the raw aluminum we used in jr. high metal shop class. I haven't looked on eBay for 5 years or so.
Obscurum per obscurius
K S
The top coin: I walked into a coin shop in Longmont Colorado about 4 years ago, and asked if they had any decent raw type coins for a 7070 I was puting together. The owner said he just bought a 20 cent piece that was nice. He had it listed as an EF40 and wanted $180. I didn't even hagle. Based on the garbage I had seen on Ebay, I was happy to pay his asking price. I just sent this coin to PCGS about a week ago. Not so much because the coin warrents slabbing, but becaue I was curious as to how the TPG's were grading these, as I have seen these all over the board in these mid-range circulated grades. I will update when the grade is posted.
The Bottom coin: This was listed as an Anacs VF30 with very poor photos and no photo of the certificate. I bid $130 and won it. I was expecting to recieve a coin in an Anacs holder but intead recieved the coin with the certificate. This is the coin that started me down the road of collecting these Anacs Photo certificates. As you can see, Anacs graded the coin VF30/30. This was at a time when VF35 was not used. I believe the coin is EF40 by today's standards.
Based upon the hundreds or even thousands of these I have looke at on Ebay, my personal opinion is that 20 cent pieces in true problem free mid grades are under valued. It seems that for every true problem free example in the VF to EF range there are 10 that have been cleaned/dipped or have other problems.
JJ
<< <i>I'm continually disappointed at the condition of double dimes I see at shows. They are generally whizzed, harshly cleaned, or dipped out until they resemble the raw aluminum we used in jr. high metal shop class. I haven't looked on eBay for 5 years or so. >>
You are spot on...nice, original pieces are very difficult to find. And when you do find them, they are either priced strongly or they go quickly.
Lane
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
<< <i>The Bottom coin: This was listed as an Anacs VF30 with very poor photos and no photo of the certificate. I bid $130 and won it. I was expecting to recieve a coin in an Anacs holder but intead recieved the coin with the certificate. This is the coin that started me down the road of collecting these Anacs Photo certificates. As you can see, Anacs graded the coin VF30/30. This was at a time when VF35 was not used. I believe the coin is EF40 by today's standards.
JJ >>
Even from the small images, that coin looks like a nice EF-40. But that coin was also graded (in 1982) when a VF needed a full LIBERTY. This artificial and inconsistent marker does not hold today...even though many grading guides indicate it as "gospel." Finding a full LIBERTY double dime with the rest of the coin with "VF" detail is actually not as straight-forward as it may sound. Many of the coins were softly struck (especially the 75-CC) that a partial LIBERTY, even on AU pieces, is acceptable.
Lane
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
<< <i>
<< <i>I'm continually disappointed at the condition of double dimes I see at shows. They are generally whizzed, harshly cleaned, or dipped out until they resemble the raw aluminum we used in jr. high metal shop class. I haven't looked on eBay for 5 years or so. >>
You are spot on...nice, original pieces are very difficult to find. And when you do find them, they are either priced strongly or they go quickly.
Lane >>
The problem I've found is that decent coins in EF are dipped and listed as "AU55".
<< <i>Even from the small images, that coin looks like a nice EF-40. But that coin was also graded (in 1982) when a VF needed a full LIBERTY. This artificial and inconsistent marker does not hold today...even though many grading guides indicate it as "gospel." Finding a full LIBERTY double dime with the rest of the coin with "VF" detail is actually not as straight-forward as it may sound. Many of the coins were softly struck (especially the 75-CC) that a partial LIBERTY, even on AU pieces, is acceptable. >>
I've written this before, but I had an 1875-CC in an ANACS MS60 holder that only had two letters of "LIBERTY" (L and Y) visible. It was accurately graded, in my opinion, as it was a coin with no wear to speak of but that was struck as softly as mush.
You did well on both purchases.
Obscurum per obscurius