PCGS price guide says a PO-1 is just as valuable as an AU-50?

wikyva

I was doing some research on the PCGS price guide and was looking Peace Dollars. The price guide has a PO-1 1922 Peace Dollar valued at $25.00. All of the prices for higher grades are lower until you reach AU-50 which is also valued at $25.00. I thought that was strange but I guess what I am seeing in that all of these low ball registry sets are pulling up the price of these low grade coins. Is this crazy or do I just not get it?

MidLifeCrisis

Sounds crazy to me.

kajdg657

you just don't get it.

dan383

I guess you guys just don't get it..............

It's called condition rarety . Check the pops for PO01's , you will find that true PO01's are

hard to come by . I have a 1964-D kennedy that I carried in my pocket for over 30 years ,

when I sent it in I wasn't positive it would come back PO01 , but it did ...........





Dan

dan383

Oh I forgot , if you buy that PO01 peace dollar for 25.00 . In PCGS plastic I'll give you 35.00

site unseen ...........





Dan

MadMarty

PCGS Morgan and Peace Dollars have been fetching close to $100 each! So I guess the price guide is off a bit!

JedPlanchet

1. Take 1922 Peace Dollar in Good condition
2. Wear down
3. Profit!

Colorfulcoins

$100 is more like, perhaps a bit less for a 22P, more for a 22D or S....scarcity.

BBQnBLUES

Hmmm... Maybe I should throw a few common date Morgans in a rock tumbler & see if I can "create" a P0-1 <eg>

sinin1

where does the PCGS price guide have prices for Po-01?


the lowest I see it is for G-4

ambro51

Isnt it actually they are all basically "melt" for common dates until a certain "collector value" takes over?

GoldenEyeNumismatics

I'd gladly pay a lot more than $25 for a PO01 peace. I'd be happy to get one for $40 or even $50.

MadMarty

I guess the price of a PO01 would depend if anyone is collecting them!

It is a condition rarity, and I know a tough PO01 can fetch MS money!

wikyva

<< <i>you just don't get it. >>



I knew it! I never seem to get stuff like this.

Colorfulcoins

Its actually quite challanging to find a PO01.......I've made 50-60 of them in all denominations and that includes probably 7-10 Peace $1's, many of which are now resident in the best (worst) Peace $1 set. Its like dumpster diving, you jump into the crap and try to find something that almost no one wants because its so bad. Pretty fun when you find something. If you really want to see a bunch of PO01's, check out my #1 ranled low ball 1792-1964 Type Set, PocketPiece at PocketPiece Set

ziggy29

This is exactly what I feared from the Low Ball Registry and the PO-1 craze. We're supposed to be stewards and protectors of our coins, and instead we're trying to wear them slick for profit. I don't see how that's much more admirable than whizzing in that regard. In both cases it's intentionally removing metal and degrading the surfaces to try to make a profit.

[Edit to add: Yes, I know it's different than whizzing in that the PO-1 folks aren't trying to deceive people or sell a coin as something it currently isn't. But the aspect of degrading the level of preservation for fun and profit isn't much different.]

Gemini

Its a strange world and getting stranger.

Billet7

<< <i>This is exactly what I feared from the Low Ball Registry and the PO-1 craze. We're supposed to be stewards and protectors of our coins, and instead we're trying to wear them slick for profit. I don't see how that's much more admirable than whizzing in that regard. In both cases it's intentionally removing metal and degrading the surfaces to try to make a profit.

[Edit to add: Yes, I know it's different than whizzing in that the PO-1 folks aren't trying to deceive people or sell a coin as something it currently isn't. But the aspect of degrading the level of preservation for fun and profit isn't much different.] >>



I understand what you are saying, and to an extent I fully agree with you. The thing is, people aren't usually taking coins that are market acceptable and trying to wear them to a lower grade. Most of the time, they take coins that are damaged, cleaned, and very low grades to begin with...and then turn them into PO-1's. IMHO I prefer a lower grade coin that looks original, than a coin that is a bit higher grade, but has problems. I don't know why anyone would wear a "nice" coin down to attain a PO-1, it would be stupid. Just a thought, but you are right, coins are being altered for profit.

dan383

<< <i>

<< <i>This is exactly what I feared from the Low Ball Registry and the PO-1 craze. We're supposed to be stewards and protectors of our coins, and instead we're trying to wear them slick for profit. I don't see how that's much more admirable than whizzing in that regard. In both cases it's intentionally removing metal and degrading the surfaces to try to make a profit.

[Edit to add: Yes, I know it's different than whizzing in that the PO-1 folks aren't trying to deceive people or sell a coin as something it currently isn't. But the aspect of degrading the level of preservation for fun and profit isn't much different.] >>



I understand what you are saying, and to an extent I fully agree with you. The thing is, people aren't usually taking coins that are market acceptable and trying to wear them to a lower grade. Most of the time, they take coins that are damaged, cleaned, and very low grades to begin with...and then turn them into PO-1's. IMHO I prefer a lower grade coin that looks original, than a coin that is a bit higher grade, but has problems. I don't know why anyone would wear a "nice" coin down to attain a PO-1, it would be stupid. Just a thought, but you are right, coins are being altered for profit. >>



I'll agree with both of you about defacing coins for profit . What you fail to understand is you

cannot just make a PO01 by throwing it in a rock tumbler . This has been discussed many times on this

board . I have bought low grade coins with honest wear off of ebay and carried them in my pocket for as

much as two more years , and still only recieved a FR02 . People have lucky pocket pieces that they carry

for years , but when they pass that lucky piece usually passes too . The bottom line is PO01's can't be

made in your garage workshop .

If you want to see some coins with stories , visit the low ball sets in the registry .





Dan

FatMan

When the registry sets started at PCGS and NGC I knew that they would greatly influence the market for premium coins. I never imagined though that the registry sets would make the TPGs so powerful that they would be able to redefine numismatic terms and get collectors to spend stupid money on labels with these redefined terms, and now also convince collectors that near basal state coins are worth much more than most MS coins.

You all are right. I don't get it. I really thought people were much smarter than this.

Well, except for the MadOne.

dan383

<< <i>When the registry sets started at PCGS and NGC I knew that they would greatly influence the market for premium coins. I never imagined though that the registry sets would make the TPGs so powerful that they would be able to redefine numismatic terms and get collectors to spend stupid money on labels with these redefined terms, and now also convince collectors that near basal state coins are worth much more than most MS coins.

You all are right. I don't get it. I really thought people were much smarter than this.

Well, except for the MadOne. >>




When the registry started I didn't get it . I have always collected what I like . I like my Gold , I like my

Classics , I even like my Moderns , and I like my PO01's . Because I never put any of my coins or sets in

registry never gave me the right to question somebody's intelligence !





Dan

TwoSides2aCoin

I don't believe anything I read and only half of what I see.

BECOKA

<< <i>This is exactly what I feared from the Low Ball Registry and the PO-1 craze. We're supposed to be stewards and protectors of our coins, and instead we're trying to wear them slick for profit. I don't see how that's much more admirable than whizzing in that regard. In both cases it's intentionally removing metal and degrading the surfaces to try to make a profit.

[Edit to add: Yes, I know it's different than whizzing in that the PO-1 folks aren't trying to deceive people or sell a coin as something it currently isn't. But the aspect of degrading the level of preservation for fun and profit isn't much different.] >>



The difference is this is usually done to a coin that has not been preserved that well to begin with. It might actually end up being a better coin than when it started out.

fc

i can see collecting low grade coins. they are neat in the sense
not everyone can have it.. just like high end MS in a lot of cases.

something about coins that allows a worn coin to stand out among
the XF examples works for it.

other collectible hobbies... not so much.

MikeInFL

So how long will it be before there are AW (artifically worn) examples?

Collect what you like!

ressikanflute

I love them... I've added a few more RAW Peace dollars that will likly grade close to PO.

Send me all your low balls...please!

This 1897o PO1 one will cost you alot more than $50

rld14

I was speaking to a collector with some lowball coins, several of which he carried in his pocket for years. One of which was some half (I seem to recall it was a seated) that had scratches and corrosion, a nasty looking VG coin. Now it's an attractive PO/FR/AG coin.

I know which one I would rather own!

pocketpiececommems

Collectors that collect PO01 coins ARE being good stewards and protectors of coins with history or stories behind them just like collectors of MS coins. I just happen to find them alot more interesting. I would venture to say that PO01 collectors have saved more interesting coins from the melting pot than MS collectors. The PCGS Lowball catagory has saved coins not destroyed them.

MadMarty

Someone has to save these jems from the melt bucket! This is the quote from my registry set. Most of the coins in my set I found digging through melt buckets! Silvertowne has been a great source for "CC" dollars in low grade. But most of them have come from the cull buckets at coin shows.

Now if I could just find a 97-P like that. Every show, I keep looking! You guys that collect MS67 coins just have to call Laura or look at the large auction houses. We have to look everywhere to find our lowball Jems!!!

garsmith

<< PCGS price guide says a PO-1 is just as valuable as an AU-50? >>

sounds bass ackwards don't it; but with the low ball sets out there the value is based on demand.

wikyva

I am just pleased that I started a post that had some lively debate attached to it. I have been here for a long time and have never had anything really thought provoking to say! I have just taken my first step to becoming the next Longacre!

fc

<< <i>I am just pleased that I started a post that had some lively debate attached to it. I have been here for a long time and have never had anything really thought provoking to say! I have just taken my first step to becoming the next Longacre! >>



the next step to fame and fortune is bring up a topic that gets past 100
posts.

Treeman

I don't get the whole "Low Ball" thing, but if i were "into" it, I think I would want the HIGHEST grade allowed to be VG. It seems ridiculous to have MS66 coins in a Low Ball set. Maybe some are forgetting that age old advice...
ALWAYS BUY THE LOWEST GRADE YOU CAN AFFORD! :-)

Stooge

My Girlfriend Wanda made both of these and she wouldn't sell them 10x's PCGS price guide values. These coins are rare in this grade, and if anyone makes another date/MM in the peace dollar series, she is a buyer. She also wants to thank MadMarty for helping her with her set. She tried to catch you in person down in Orlando, but missed you 3x's.





Later, Paul.

pocketpiececommems

When I was asking about lowgrade commems at the St Louis show I showed a dealer a Pilgrim that I had in my pocket and he said if he gets anything that low it goes in the melting pot. I told him he was missing the boat.

fcloud

Although the problem free low grade coins are neat, it is not for me. I'd rather have a mid range grade coin. F, VF would work for me.

Now, what is happening is the registry. Competition is a funny thing.

Mowgli

I think PCGS and NGC did a very clever thing to increase their business - its up there with pet rocks, invisible dogs and dot.com companies that had no profits.

JRocco

A fool and his money usually end up as a fool without money.

Nuff said.

CarsonCityGold

I collected low ball coins before there was a registry for them. It gave/gives me something to look for at shows while looking for CC Gold. The pick of the litter/toughest is the 28 P in PO1 that I slabbed about a year ago. They will bodybag them constantly when they get down to a low grade because they can't tell if its a 28S with the mintmark worn off. Check em out at the link below. You either get it or you don't!

Treeman

<< <i>I think PCGS and NGC did a very clever thing to increase their business - its up there with pet rocks, invisible dogs and dot.com companies that had no profits. >>



I don't think NGC has any "Low Ball" categories in their Registry. I believe, and I may be wrong, that PCGS was against it in the beginning....

wikyva

<< <i>

<< <i>I am just pleased that I started a post that had some lively debate attached to it. I have been here for a long time and have never had anything really thought provoking to say! I have just taken my first step to becoming the next Longacre! >>



the next step to fame and fortune is bring up a topic that gets past 100
posts. >>



Ok ... I see a real chance for me to reach fame and fortune here. This topic has been debated for three days now and is still has first page status. Let's keep the debate going and help me become the next Longacre! I will pour a little gas on to the fire that is this topic ... people who collect PO-1s are as smart as stamp collectors. Discuss.

Treeman

"people who collect PO-1s are as smart as stamp collectors. Discuss"

That's a DANGEROUS statement around here! :-)
Probably will reach the "100" mark now...

rec78

This is exactly what I feared from the Low Ball Registry and the PO-1 craze. We're supposed to be stewards and protectors of our coins, and instead we're trying to wear them slick for profit. I don't see how that's much more admirable than whizzing in that regard. In both cases it's intentionally removing metal and degrading the surfaces to try to make a profit.

That is exactly what it is- a Craze. Like the roll craze of the 1960's or the silver bar craze a little later. When the dust settles a higher grade coin(with rare exception) will be of higher value-you can wear a coin down but you can not add details. More Po1 coins can be made. I will take the higher grade coin any day for the same cost. (I guess i don;t get it either). Just trying to look at things realistically.

Treeman

I guess I can sort of understand how it would be cool to own the worst coin, but I still don't understand MS65's and MS66's in a "Low Ball" set...

Billet7

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>I am just pleased that I started a post that had some lively debate attached to it. I have been here for a long time and have never had anything really thought provoking to say! I have just taken my first step to becoming the next Longacre! >>



the next step to fame and fortune is bring up a topic that gets past 100
posts. >>



Ok ... I see a real chance for me to reach fame and fortune here. This topic has been debated for three days now and is still has first page status. Let's keep the debate going and help me become the next Longacre! I will pour a little gas on to the fire that is this topic ... people who collect PO-1s are as smart as stamp collectors. Discuss. >>



I like the ambiguity of your statement. The real question...how smart are stamp collectors?

Stooge

I would bet that if someone such as Carsoncitygold, MadMarty or Wanda gets a set of peace dollars complete in PO01 it would have an offer from someone to be bought for a good price. PCGS might even want to display it.

Later, Paul.

AndyMac

It's like taking a supermodel and running a cheese grater over her face. What's the point?

norwegianguy

I really s*ck in football. I guess I am a PO-1 in that area. People as poorly skilled as me are really hard to come by. Possibly even rarer than those playing in the national league.

When I read about low ball sets, I wonder if I should aim for a professional contract in football. I could earn some real money there, I think, 'cause let's face it: I'm a really rare specimen.

Coaches all over the country will go: Wow, I've got to have this one. I havent seen such a bad player for decades...



The only thing I fear, is that some contractless mediocre players will degrade themselves (alcohol, drugs, stare into the sunlight, banging their heads into walls etc..) until they ultimately get as low ball as me. It just wouldn't be fair, because I am the only true s*cker in this game.

wikyva

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>I am just pleased that I started a post that had some lively debate attached to it. I have been here for a long time and have never had anything really thought provoking to say! I have just taken my first step to becoming the next Longacre! >>



the next step to fame and fortune is bring up a topic that gets past 100
posts. >>



Ok ... I see a real chance for me to reach fame and fortune here. This topic has been debated for three days now and is still has first page status. Let's keep the debate going and help me become the next Longacre! I will pour a little gas on to the fire that is this topic ... people who collect PO-1s are as smart as stamp collectors. Discuss. >>



I like the ambiguity of your statement. The real question...how smart are stamp collectors? >>



The ambiguity of the statement is what makes this a debate which will surely get this thread to exceed 100 posts and launch me into the elite of this board. So you tell me ... how smart are they?

CarsonCityGold

OK, I'll add 1 more post toward your shot at fame.

I can only speak for why I collect low grades - I enjoy it and have fun doing it.
This is a hobby for me and everyones hobby should be something they enjoy.
I've never intentionally defaced or artificially worn a coin in my life. To me the hunt is the fun!
You should see the look on dealers faces when I dig through the junk Morgans/Peace Dollars and then ask "OH, by the way, do you have any Carson City Gold?"
The monetary aspect of someone trying to wear down a coin for what a PO1 is worth is absulutely ridiculous. FR2's are barely worth more than the slabbing fee in most cases and trust me, you will get way more FR2's than PO1's.
Now, with that being said, do I think that there are some folks out there artificially wearing down coins and getting them slabbed??????

InternetJunky

<< <i>
Now, with that being said, do I think that there are some folks out there artificially wearing down coins and getting them slabbed?????? >>



I've thought the same, but wouldn't this be kind of hard without leaving evidence behind? I mean, pocket wear and a belt sander probably leave two different effects to the coin. Anyone have any thoughts on how someone might artificially wear a coin?