1872 3cs versus 1909-S VDB

njcoincrank

In another thread someone compared these two and their current value.

1872 3cs. Last year of issue. Very low mintage and survival rate.

1909-S VDB. First year of issue. Very high percentage was saved as they were a new design. Has the romance that every "young" collector wants.

I personally like the 1872 much more than the S VDB...

What say you?

njcc

STONE

I'd rather own the 1872 3cs (BS) than the 09-S VDB for its rarity, but when it comes to history I see more of it in the 09-S VDB.

I'm still a toss-up either way.

OnlyGoldIsMoney

I would prefer to 1872 3cs - for me rarity trumps popularity.

COALPORTER

'72 3cn - hard on the heals of 9 other low mintage years. Almost no one is trying to do complete sets. It's a crazy idea.

09-s vdb - years and years of hype and countless Coin's Magazine articles. It will always be famous and has a catchy name with nice ring to it. "The trend is your friend" , as they say.

ambro51

heres my vote

GrumpyEd

Comparing of 2 opposites isn't easy.

There are a lot of S-VDBs out there but there's a lot of people that have it on their wish list. I like em

tightbudget

S-VDB just cause I need to keep my Lincoln set complete

lkenefic

This is so much comparing apples to oranges. Sure the 1872 3cs is a very low mintage coin but [arguably] the design isn't all that inspiring and the demand for type pieces is adequately supplied from other dates in the series. It looks like the market for a date/mm set has set the price accordingly... I suppose demand is pretty low. So if you put $1000 into one, it could be some time before you see your money back when you go to sell... unless there is some 3cs article in Coin World poised to whip collectors up into a frenzy in a down economy. On the other hand, the '09-S VDB is a wildly popular key date from a wildly popular series. Granted, these are not rare coins and if you go to any show or even dealer roller display, they'll probably have one.

I think to frame the discussion more widely, we can also look at the 1916 SLQ. First year of mintage, very popular series, somewhat low mintage (52k) and the price is 10 times an 09-S VDB at a comparable grade.

RYK

I would choose the 1872 3cs but admittedly have little enthusiasm for either.

MICHAELDIXON

For me, I'd take the 09 SVDB. That is because of the liquidity involved. The 09 SVDB is always in demand, whereas the 1872 3c would be harder to sell.

robkool

1872 3 CS regular strike... But just remember, the 09 SVDB is in the top 100 "Greatest US. Coins"...

Unknown

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keets

try this on for size, the absolute truth.......................

at the West Penn Coin Show this weekend the dealer next to us had approximately 60 1909-S VDB's at his table!!! i only saw the 20 or so slabbed examples he had out in a case(ranging from AU-63/4RB) but he had a double row box with the other coins which i assume were slabbed, although i don't know what grades. he also had at least 20 1916-D slabbed Merc's in another case and a billet of silver that was just shy of 1,000 ounces.

i'd take the 3CS over the 09-S VDB or 16-D Merc any day.

ambro51

From a quick look it seems there are a total of twenty seven 1872 circulation strike trimes in the PCGS pop. at AU58 and up.

Hardly enough to generate any kind of interest.

But...gotta love those contrarians.

MidLifeCrisis

I would take the 09-S VDB. I have no interest in Three Cent Silver pieces. I do have some interest in "popular key dates", even though the 09-S VDB is certainly not rare.

Prethen

This is a no-brainer. The 1872 3CS is the coin to have all the way. VERY few survive...it is a very rare coin unlike the very, very common SVDB.

thatboyaintright

Go for the one that's a challenge ! 09 s-vbd's are all over the place... It's no big deal trying to get one. Now finding a PQ 3c silver is tough unless your really willing to cough up some money. I've been looking for a 3 cent silver in my price range for months without success.

lkeigwin

I love the 3CS. It was my first true "collector's coin" when I got it from my grandmother's estate in the early '60s. She was alive when they were minted, too. My house was burgled in the '70's and I lost it. Friggin' low lifes.

Today I have a few 3CS's. They're special to me but kinda plain.

Still, I don't get it. There's nothing very special about the 1872 3CS, is there? Aren't all of the mid '60's to the end of the series pretty close in value? Sure, they're rare and valuable. But so are hundreds of other coins in dozens of other series.

But when it comes to the longest running series in our history, to the coin virtually everyone instantly recognizes, the coin everyone has some dumb story about, an issue so valued most folks won't stoop to pick one up...who wouldn't want the most famous and storied of all?

Gimme the '09 S-VDB! So I can flip it fast.

Lance.

P.S. This is my 500th post. Do I have to give away something? Please, not the S-VDB.

options26

I think I would have to say the 09-S VDB, although I know they are a dime a dozen, I started collecting Lincolns at 10 years of age in an old Whitman album and the lure of that coin always made me dream that one day I would own one. I now have 5 in different grades and I think I will sell them all to upgrade to an MS coin. The bad part is my dansco will always have a hole because this coin will always live in plastic.

LincolnCentMan

It all comes down to what you like/want.

I have three SVDB's because I both like them and want them. On the other hand, I have only a trivial desire to own a 1872 three cent. I dont even know what the market is on them. I'd have to look it up as it is out of my focal area of collecting.

-David

illini420

I think any proof coin pre-1936 and many many MS coins such as the 3cs mentioned are "rare" in comparison to the 1909-S VDB. However, I'm going with the folks and I'm sticking with the one that is wanted

coinlieutenant

I had the one on ebay right now in hand....and almost bought it. I love the date and the rarity and design of a 1872 trime. I think the lincoln cent is ugly, over hyped and really quite boring.

ziggy29

I take the trime if it's a business strike and the SVDB if the trime is a proof.

Prethen

That's funny...already a couple of pictures of the more common coin but none of the business strike 1872 trime.

ambro51

The more I think about it, the more I like the 3 cent

Anyone want to buy a MS66RD OGH svdb, cheap?

MidLifeCrisis

I think an even more interesting variation would be

1909-S VDB vs. 1955 Doubled Die

Similar prices up to about MS 63; both very popular among collectors.

Comparing any Lincoln Cent to any Three Cent Silver piece is truly like comparing apples to oranges because of the popularity levels.

Edited to reflect that we are discussing Three Cent Silver pieces, not Three Cent Nickels (oops.)

ambro51

The difference here is that the svdbs were put away fresh, while all the 55 ddos were picked from circulation.

actually, rather than apples vx. oranges

more like apples vs. northern java mangos

njcoincrank

First off, I ment the comparison to be between the three cent silver, not nickel, and the 1909-S VDB.

Second...yes I know it is like comparing apples to oranges. I was wanting to see how many people thought outside the box, as opposed to following current collecting trends.

While we will never know how much money is chasing what coins, I can say that not a major show goes by that I don't see 5-15 MS-64 or higher 1909-S vdb's, but years can go by before a GEM 1872 3cs is available. And that includes auctions.

njcc

njcoincrank

Prethen...Good point.

Where are the pictures of a GEM 1872 business strike 3cs? Anybody?

njcc

RYK

<< <i>First off, I ment the comparison to be between the three cent silver, not nickel, and the 1909-S VDB.

Second...yes I know it is like comparing apples to oranges. I was wanting to see how many people thought outside the box, as opposed to following current collecting trends.

While we will never know how much money is chasing what coins, I can say that not a major show goes by that I don't see 5-15 MS-64 or higher 1909-S vdb's, but years can go by before a GEM 1872 3cs is available. And that includes auctions.

njcc >>



While that's true, years can also go by before anyone wants to buy the GEM 1872 3cs.

MidLifeCrisis

<< <i>First off, I ment the comparison to be between the three cent silver, not nickel, and the 1909-S VDB. >>


Noted...I edited my original post.

ScarsdaleCoin

I had to laugh.... the 1909s vdb is a widget.... I could go to any coin show at any time and fine one

now the 1872 3c Silver.... business strike.... you folks out there dont realize just how rare this little guy is.... I can go a year or two before finding one...

They dont exist... regardless that the only thing rarer is the coin collector who wants one....

if there was any demand for the 3c silvers... the supply would be gone in a heartbeat and prices would and SHOULD be 5x the current level!

Overdate

Maybe one of the reasons business-strike 3 cent silver is unpopular as a set is *because* it is so hard to complete.

If I wanted to assemble a date-mintmark set of 3cs, I would consider proofs acceptable for the later dates. (That way, I would also get to include the proof-only 1873.)

ambro51

Thats the nice thing about coins. There are so many different ways to collect them that there is something for everybody. And of course, the person who collects MS lincolns can get wrapped up in the series, just as well as the person who collects Ike dollars can get equally as wrapped up. Same for the trimes. They are a sweet little coin, unique in many ways, but as with any series, much of the appeal is limited to those who see and appreciate their beauty and rarity.

Every coin series is different, and it is unfair to compare them on all levels.

I once knew a professional photographer who had a unique 'niche'. She photographed exotic African insects. One huge beetle she showed me, (dead, in a bottle) was her pride and joy. Seven Thousand Dollars....and she felt it was worth every cent of it. My opinion.....just a revolting dead huge bug.

jesbroken

Separating the coins from their "Set" status as far as collectibility is concerned, leaves the coins to fend for themselves as to desirability. I feel that when comparing apples to oranges if one keeps both the items in like condition, then it is far easier to select the most desirable of the two. I've uploaded a sample of each coin, both MS66 PCGS and now you may make a more informed decision as to which suits your taste moreso than the other. My selection would be the 1872 3CS as it is a beautifully aged example of a silver coin. Others may select the 1909 S VDB slightly aged with streaks of toning as a great copper coin example. But regardless, our decision will be made with examples to select from. JMO
Jim

coolest

I want both.
the 09-S VDB is easy
the silver 1872 3c is a serious challenge.

astrorat

Strictly thinking as a "refined" numismatist, I would have to go with the 1872 3cs due to it's genuine rarity and infrequent opportunity to purchase one.

Thinking as collector who would like to share a fun coin with other collectors, especially the young ones, I would have to go with the S-VDB as even the most casual collector can identify with the coin. I remember well as a kid paging through an early Red Book looking for those dream coins and the S-VDB was always up there. Funny though how I never have owned one.

Lane

ambro51

? dont have one ?

They're as common as fleas on an alley cat.

heck, one dealer had SIXTY of them on his table!

Of course 'common' and 'price' don't always go hand in hand.

I just dumped seventy three rolls of these off at the bank, if I knew ya wanted one, Id a saved ya few.

rld14

I think it was I that posed this question

I have been thinking of putting a set of Trimes together, largely because I not only like them, but because they are about the only set of truly rare U.S. coins I can think of that don't cost like Ferraris.

I always found it laughable when people call these key date coins "Rare", S-VDBs are far from rare, but they cost a lot because LOTS of people collect Lincolns and it is the lowest mintage Lincoln, so it makes sense.

Supply/Demand. I have a VG 27-S SLQ, it's got a much lower mintage than the S-VDB and I bet an AWFUL lot less exist. I think I paid $33 for it.

originalisbest

To think that the silver 3-cent design is somehow superior to that of the Lincoln cent wheatie of 1909 shows a remarkable lack of aesthetic aptitude. But then, you know what they say about opinions. And that's not even bringing up the indisputable "small coin (anti)bias."

ambro51

As a fan of the Confederate cent, I follow these and watch for my opportunity to own one. PCGS has slabbed a total of 8 of the Haseltine copper restrikes, and heritage auctions archive list TWO. One sold for 31K, and the other for 32K.

A true esoteric item, with a limited collector base, these are as rare as hens teeth but in relation to the prices of many other american coins, they are cheap.

If we would transpose that population to the Lincoln cent, perhaps theorizing that the original prototype 1909 cents were saved, instead of melted...it would be easy to understand how the value would be well over six figures, maybe up to a half million each.

Popularity of the series, and the coin, really is what controls the value.

thelawnet

<< <i>For me, I'd take the 09 SVDB. That is because of the liquidity involved. The 09 SVDB is always in demand, whereas the 1872 3c would be harder to sell. >>



Pcgs



<< <i>
Often, a coin will seem more desirable if it has recently increased in price or seems to be scheduled to do so. In the 1950s and early 1960s I often refrained from listing 1909-S V.D.B. Lincoln cents in catalogues and price lists, for this key Lincoln cent variety was on just about everyone's want list, was rising steadily in value each year, and as I never had more than a few in stock, I did not want to send out dozens of "sold out" letters. The 1909-S V.D.B. was eminently desirable, and as a dealer I would have been delighted to have purchased as many as possible. Today in the 1990s the same specimens of 1909-S V.D.B. cents are in various collections and dealers' stocks, but they are largely forgotten, for the market price has declined and they are no longer on the "most active" list. To be sure, the student of numismatic history and the specialist in Lincoln cents each know that the 1909-S V.D.B. is rare and important, but the typical newcomer to the hobby could not care less. Thus, a 1909-S V.D.B. is now viewed by many as a stock in trade item, something to be bought and sold, but not a coin with a special aura as a guaranteed blue chip investment scheduled for a rise in price each year.
>>



(Dated 1993)

ambro51

In reference to those words of wisdom from 1993

http://www.us-coin-values-advisor.com/Lincoln-cent.html#1909-S VDB

In 1995 a MS66 SVDB was listed at 3400$

The same coin today lists at 18000$

(I love facts, there are so many ways they can be interperted/misinterperted)