These packs are out there. There is a very slim chance that this pack holds a card, and if it does hold a card, odds are it is of a fish or something other than a T206. I have heard of people pulling T206's out of these though.
great pack, take a chance, 1,000,000 to 1 odds it does not have a wagner but still a nice piece of history. Then again it is probably resealed u know u can't trust no one , and all the psa 9 & 10's are trimmed , and all the psa 7 & 8's are recolored it's all a ripoff !!!!!!!!!!! opps I thought this was a text message just for private eyes. NEVER MIND!
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected.
I would bid on this without hesitation. The nice thing about the way he sells is that no where in his description has he indicated the possibility of pulling the "Holy Grail" or another priceless t206 card.
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris
Chris My small collection Want List: '61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7 Cardinal T206 cards Adam Wainwright GU Jersey
<< <i>I would bid on this without hesitation. The nice thing about the way he sells is that no where in his description has he indicated the possibility of pulling the "Holy Grail" or another priceless t206 card. >>
That's right, the auction didn't state that as almost every auction I've seen on ebay for these types of packs will state something misleading and even fraudulent like that.....but again...in my opinion the auction "item specifics" still infers this possibility...and the seller should know better than to do this.
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
You're dam right it's rude - and when I see something like this then I'm gonna be rude.
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
And frankly - you gave no supporting evidence as to whether or not this pack could contain a T206 card - I'd like to get viewpoints from some experts on the board as to whether or not this pack could even contain a card or not. But again...even if it could, my statement although "rude" would still be accurate - the listing header should definitely be changed is all I'm basically saying.
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
And frankly - you gave no supporting evidence as to whether or not this pack could contain a T206 card - I'd like to get viewpoints from some experts on the board as to whether or not this pack could even contain a card or not. But again...even if it could, my statement although "rude" would still be accurate - the listing header should definitely be changed is all I'm basically saying. >>
And I realize without seeing the "seals/stamps" on the pack, that it "might be" impossible to tell whether or not the pack could contain a card.
<< <i>In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" >>
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
And frankly - you gave no supporting evidence as to whether or not this pack could contain a T206 card - I'd like to get viewpoints from some experts on the board as to whether or not this pack could even contain a card or not. But again...even if it could, my statement although "rude" would still be accurate - the listing header should definitely be changed is all I'm basically saying. >>
And I realize without seeing the "seals/stamps" on the pack, that it "might be" impossible to tell whether or not the pack could contain a card. >>
I guess my position is that you should actually check and see if the "seals/stamps" on the pack are of a time frame consistant w/ the possibility of containing a baseball card. Maybe do a little research before you call the man "disingenuous" and "fraudulent". I'm not trying to get into a forum pissing match w/ you, I'm just saying that maybe we should give him the benifit of the doubt since you have no evidence to the contrary.
Chris
Chris My small collection Want List: '61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7 Cardinal T206 cards Adam Wainwright GU Jersey
<< <i>In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" >>
are you serious? >>
You wanna give this seller a pass, then you go right ahead - I won't. To me it's weasel behavior, and BBCE who is supposed to have a good, trustworthy reputation...and they do, should know better than to list this item in this manner, and if you don't see it that way then that's your prerogative.
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
And frankly - you gave no supporting evidence as to whether or not this pack could contain a T206 card - I'd like to get viewpoints from some experts on the board as to whether or not this pack could even contain a card or not. But again...even if it could, my statement although "rude" would still be accurate - the listing header should definitely be changed is all I'm basically saying. >>
And I realize without seeing the "seals/stamps" on the pack, that it "might be" impossible to tell whether or not the pack could contain a card. >>
I guess my position is that you should actually check and see if the "seals/stamps" on the pack are of a time frame consistant w/ the possibility of containing a baseball card. Maybe do a little research before you call the man "disingenuous" and "fraudulent". I'm not trying to get into a forum pissing match w/ you, I'm just saying that maybe we should give him the benifit of the doubt since you have no evidence to the contrary.
Chris >>
I don't mind your comments at all - my problem is with the seller listing this item in this manner which in my opinion is deceptive - I've got no problem with any differences of opinion here.
Frankly, not somehow showing the stamp, if that can be done in a GAI slab, I don't know if the slab blocks the stamp or not, also tells me that the chances of there being a card in this pack is likely ZERO, or the seller would have emphasized the possibility of a card in the auction description to increase the auction price.
If any seller knows that there is no possibility of a card being in a pack, yet lists the pack under sports cards and baseball, then the matter isn't opinion any longer about being deceptive, it would then be a matter of fact.
<< <i>I don't mind your comments at all - my problem is with the seller listing this item in this manner which in my opinion is deceptive - I've got no problem with any differences of opinion here.
Frankly, not somehow showing the stamp, if that can be done in a GAI slab, I don't know if the slab blocks the stamp or not, also tells me that the chances of there being a card in this pack is likely ZERO, or the seller would have emphasized the possibility of a card in the auction description to increase the auction price.
If any seller knows that there is no possibility of a card being in a pack, yet lists the pack under sports cards and baseball, then the matter isn't opinion any longer about being deceptive, it would then be a matter of fact. >>
I know what you mean man!! Once I was looking for a pair of shoes on ebay and there was someone selling pants in there! PANTS!!! In the freaking shoes section!! THE NERVE!!
<< <i>If any seller knows that there is no possibility of a card being in a pack........ >>
Do you know for a fact that the seller knows this? No you don't, but you sure can call him and ask. 1-708-753-1040 Wait a minute, this is stevek we're talking about, I better give him the toll free number 1-800-598-8656
<< <i>If any seller knows that there is no possibility of a card being in a pack........ >>
Do you know for a fact that the seller knows this? No you don't, but you sure can call him and ask. 1-708-753-1040 Wait a minute, this is stevek we're talking about, I better give him the toll free number 1-800-598-8656 >>
Trust me, everyone on these boards knows that you were not going to be man enough to call Baseball Card Exchange about this. But dont worry, no keyboard warrior is.
<< <i>Trust me, everyone on these boards knows that you were not going to be man enough to call Baseball Card Exchange about this. But dont worry, no keyboard warrior is. >>
Just a little common sense if you don't mind. I have a pack of 100 year old cigarettes that has never been opened. Inside the pack could psosibly be a 100 year old baseball card along with some really dry and stale cigarettes. I want to sell the pack on eBay and get the most money possible for it. Selling tobacco products on eBay is a violation unless it is a collectible item and not intended for consumption (No really, that's what it says). How do I maximize my return? I know! I will list it in the only general category that will get any traffic or get any decent bids from serious collectors with deeper pockets than mine.
No, I think I will list it in the collectible artifacts section so no one will see it but at least no one will get mad at me for listing it in the sports memorabilia section. Money is for losers any way.
I kind of think 'stevek' is going to be the winning bidder of this auction, and he's just trying to place doubt in the minds of other potential bidders just to keep the price low.
<< <i>I kind of think 'stevek' is going to be the winning bidder of this auction, and he's just trying to place doubt in the minds of other potential bidders just to keep the price low. >>
Dam, ya caught me. LOL
The thing is though - it is a very nice looking pack and a very nice collectable. Maybe somebody buys it and pulls a T206 Wagner and then Nam would really let me have it for being so wrong. LOL
If there is a card in there... ANY card, I wonder what the condition would be. Would it have bad stains? I'm pretty sure it would be more collectible as-is, but if I owned it, the thing would be opened in like two seconds...
Do your best to get people not to bid. Keep telling them that it's fraudulent, deceptive, etc. I'm the current high bidder and will be more than happy to buy it at the price it's at now. $177.50.
I asked Steve Hart my questions via ebay "Ask a question" and I'm satisfied by his answers. 1) He's not guaranteeing that anything is in the pack 2) Maybe a card, maybe not, if a card, could be a fish, an actor/actress, ballplayer, etc. 3) Pack has the proper tax stamps on it that a 1910 pack would have 4) PSA does not have a holder it's size, thus it's authenticated by GAI instead (Steve should know as he is/was a PSA/DNA pack authenticator) 5) Again, NO GUARANTEE that anything is in the pack. He says that no one knows for sure what can be/should be in these packs.
Run off all the bidders. I'll be happy to add it to my collection. It's something different and more than likely, if I own it long enough, curiousity will get the best of me and I'll rip it for the board to see.
I'm kinda with stevek on this topic. I've read alot of threads on this board and get the feeling that most here think Steve Hart is some kind of deity. I've bought thousands of dollars of stuff from him and I've always been satisfied with his professionalism and the speed in which he replied to my incessant bartering over some of his packs. However, if Steve is the poster child for honesty and the epitome of truth in a hobby that's fraught with resealers, why did he not post the answers to the questions that "thenavarro" asked? Why did he not state these to begin with? I'm not throwing Steve under the bus here, but if I sold an April 1962 Life Magazine on Ebay in which the cover showed a Post Mantle/Maris baseball card but didn't say whether the insert was in the issue or not, I'd be harangued to no end.
SteveK I have no problem with the way SteveH listed the pack and in what category. I do though see what you mean. However, many people would like that pack as a tie in to the T206 set that they may be building and that is a reason why it was listed in that category.
I do understand where you are coming from though.
It should be listed in Tobacannia or however you spell it.
Do your best to get people not to bid. Keep telling them that it's fraudulent, deceptive, etc. I'm the current high bidder and will be more than happy to buy it at the price it's at now. $177.50.
I asked Steve Hart my questions via ebay "Ask a question" and I'm satisfied by his answers. 1) He's not guaranteeing that anything is in the pack 2) Maybe a card, maybe not, if a card, could be a fish, an actor/actress, ballplayer, etc. 3) Pack has the proper tax stamps on it that a 1910 pack would have 4) PSA does not have a holder it's size, thus it's authenticated by GAI instead (Steve should know as he is/was a PSA/DNA pack authenticator) 5) Again, NO GUARANTEE that anything is in the pack. He says that no one knows for sure what can be/should be in these packs.
Run off all the bidders. I'll be happy to add it to my collection. It's something different and more than likely, if I own it long enough, curiousity will get the best of me and I'll rip it for the board to see.
Mike >>
I respect Steve Hart as a businessman and as a person contributing to and advancing the hobby. But if anyone displays weasel behavior, I don't care who it is, then they deserve to be called out on it, and that's exactly what I did. WinPitcher got it exactly right when stating "It should be listed in Tobacannia or however you spell it", and not under sportscards/baseball cards which in my view is, what I already said it is - That's all.
<<< He says that no one knows for sure what can be/should be in these packs. >>>
Actually, that is incorrect - It is well known among most T206 collectors that with some of these tobacco packs, it is impossible for any insert to be in certain packs because no insert was ever placed in certain packs, which can be determined by the type of stamp and other factors.
Good luck - If you win the auction and bust it - I hope you find yourself a T206 Wagner in there and you can have the last laugh.
Gonblott
Posts: 1,951 ✭✭
Comments
<< <i>Looks like it could be resealed....... >>
Quite possibly the most unfounded statement ever. I'm gonna trust Steve Hart over you on this one.
>
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Just my opinion
>
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<< <i>I like Steve and I DO trust him but GAI has a tendency to grade resealed packs.
Just my opinion >>
And you think he didn't look it over carefully before listing it?
opps I thought this was a text message just for private eyes. NEVER MIND!
<< <i>
<< <i>I like Steve and I DO trust him but GAI has a tendency to grade resealed packs.
Just my opinion >>
And you think he didn't look it over carefully before listing it? >>
He probably looked over it carefully before purchasing it...
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<< <i>I want to smoke one of the cigarettes >>
Probably smell like those Clove cigarettes that the girls back in my college days would smoke.
<< <i>He probably looked over it carefully before purchasing it... >>
It is very possible that he does not even own this pack. It could be a consigned item.
Original/Reprint: -- Card Attributes: --
Product: Pack
Sport: Baseball-MLB Professionally Graded: --
Year/Season: --
Card Manufacturer: --
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected.
<< <i>Item Specifics - Sports Trading Cards
Original/Reprint: -- Card Attributes: --
Product: Pack
Sport: Baseball-MLB Professionally Graded: --
Year/Season: --
Card Manufacturer: --
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris
My small collection
Want List:
'61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7
Cardinal T206 cards
Adam Wainwright GU Jersey
<< <i>I would bid on this without hesitation. The nice thing about the way he sells is that no where in his description has he indicated the possibility of pulling the "Holy Grail" or another priceless t206 card. >>
That's right, the auction didn't state that as almost every auction I've seen on ebay for these types of packs will state something misleading and even fraudulent like that.....but again...in my opinion the auction "item specifics" still infers this possibility...and the seller should know better than to do this.
<< <i>
<< <i>Item Specifics - Sports Trading Cards
Original/Reprint: -- Card Attributes: --
Product: Pack
Sport: Baseball-MLB Professionally Graded: --
Year/Season: --
Card Manufacturer: --
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
You're dam right it's rude - and when I see something like this then I'm gonna be rude.
<< <i>
<< <i>He probably looked over it carefully before purchasing it... >>
It is very possible that he does not even own this pack. It could be a consigned item. >>
that even exacerbates the point...he is putting his name to the auctioned item...
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- uncut
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<< <i>
<< <i>Item Specifics - Sports Trading Cards
Original/Reprint: -- Card Attributes: --
Product: Pack
Sport: Baseball-MLB Professionally Graded: --
Year/Season: --
Card Manufacturer: --
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
And frankly - you gave no supporting evidence as to whether or not this pack could contain a T206 card - I'd like to get viewpoints from some experts on the board as to whether or not this pack could even contain a card or not. But again...even if it could, my statement although "rude" would still be accurate - the listing header should definitely be changed is all I'm basically saying.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Item Specifics - Sports Trading Cards
Original/Reprint: -- Card Attributes: --
Product: Pack
Sport: Baseball-MLB Professionally Graded: --
Year/Season: --
Card Manufacturer: --
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
And frankly - you gave no supporting evidence as to whether or not this pack could contain a T206 card - I'd like to get viewpoints from some experts on the board as to whether or not this pack could even contain a card or not. But again...even if it could, my statement although "rude" would still be accurate - the listing header should definitely be changed is all I'm basically saying. >>
And I realize without seeing the "seals/stamps" on the pack, that it "might be" impossible to tell whether or not the pack could contain a card.
<< <i>In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" >>
are you serious?
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Item Specifics - Sports Trading Cards
Original/Reprint: -- Card Attributes: --
Product: Pack
Sport: Baseball-MLB Professionally Graded: --
Year/Season: --
Card Manufacturer: --
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
And frankly - you gave no supporting evidence as to whether or not this pack could contain a T206 card - I'd like to get viewpoints from some experts on the board as to whether or not this pack could even contain a card or not. But again...even if it could, my statement although "rude" would still be accurate - the listing header should definitely be changed is all I'm basically saying. >>
And I realize without seeing the "seals/stamps" on the pack, that it "might be" impossible to tell whether or not the pack could contain a card. >>
I guess my position is that you should actually check and see if the "seals/stamps" on the pack are of a time frame consistant w/ the possibility of containing a baseball card. Maybe do a little research before you call the man "disingenuous" and "fraudulent". I'm not trying to get into a forum pissing match w/ you, I'm just saying that maybe we should give him the benifit of the doubt since you have no evidence to the contrary.
Chris
My small collection
Want List:
'61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7
Cardinal T206 cards
Adam Wainwright GU Jersey
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<< <i>In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" >>
are you serious? >>
You wanna give this seller a pass, then you go right ahead - I won't. To me it's weasel behavior, and BBCE who is supposed to have a good, trustworthy reputation...and they do, should know better than to list this item in this manner, and if you don't see it that way then that's your prerogative.
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<< <i>Item Specifics - Sports Trading Cards
Original/Reprint: -- Card Attributes: --
Product: Pack
Sport: Baseball-MLB Professionally Graded: --
Year/Season: --
Card Manufacturer: --
In my opinion it is very disingenuous if not close to fraudulent of the seller to list this item under "Sports Trading Cards" and "Sport: Baseball-MLB" when the seller should know that the chances of that pack containing a T206 baseball card or even a sports card, is very close to zero, and could even be zero - again...that's my opinion.
To clarify - I'm not an expert on cigarette pack dating but I do know that even if it is a legit pack that could contain a T206 card, the chances are slim it will contain a sports card and even slimmer still that it would be a baseball card. And with many of these packs it is impossible for it to contain any card at all. If someone wants to counter my statement and prove me wrong, then I'll stand corrected. >>
I disagree. There is a chance that the pack contains a T206 card. It may be slim but it would go great in someone's set of T206 as an example of an unopened pack. At that point it doesn't matter if it contains a Wagner or a card of a fish, it's about completion for that person. To call it "fraudulent" and "disingenuous" is rather rude.
Chris >>
And frankly - you gave no supporting evidence as to whether or not this pack could contain a T206 card - I'd like to get viewpoints from some experts on the board as to whether or not this pack could even contain a card or not. But again...even if it could, my statement although "rude" would still be accurate - the listing header should definitely be changed is all I'm basically saying. >>
And I realize without seeing the "seals/stamps" on the pack, that it "might be" impossible to tell whether or not the pack could contain a card. >>
I guess my position is that you should actually check and see if the "seals/stamps" on the pack are of a time frame consistant w/ the possibility of containing a baseball card. Maybe do a little research before you call the man "disingenuous" and "fraudulent". I'm not trying to get into a forum pissing match w/ you, I'm just saying that maybe we should give him the benifit of the doubt since you have no evidence to the contrary.
Chris >>
I don't mind your comments at all - my problem is with the seller listing this item in this manner which in my opinion is deceptive - I've got no problem with any differences of opinion here.
Frankly, not somehow showing the stamp, if that can be done in a GAI slab, I don't know if the slab blocks the stamp or not, also tells me that the chances of there being a card in this pack is likely ZERO, or the seller would have emphasized the possibility of a card in the auction description to increase the auction price.
If any seller knows that there is no possibility of a card being in a pack, yet lists the pack under sports cards and baseball, then the matter isn't opinion any longer about being deceptive, it would then be a matter of fact.
<< <i>I don't mind your comments at all - my problem is with the seller listing this item in this manner which in my opinion is deceptive - I've got no problem with any differences of opinion here.
Frankly, not somehow showing the stamp, if that can be done in a GAI slab, I don't know if the slab blocks the stamp or not, also tells me that the chances of there being a card in this pack is likely ZERO, or the seller would have emphasized the possibility of a card in the auction description to increase the auction price.
If any seller knows that there is no possibility of a card being in a pack, yet lists the pack under sports cards and baseball, then the matter isn't opinion any longer about being deceptive, it would then be a matter of fact. >>
I know what you mean man!! Once I was looking for a pair of shoes on ebay and there was someone selling pants in there! PANTS!!! In the freaking shoes section!! THE NERVE!!
(get over it)
<< <i>If any seller knows that there is no possibility of a card being in a pack........ >>
Do you know for a fact that the seller knows this? No you don't, but you sure can call him and ask. 1-708-753-1040 Wait a minute, this is stevek we're talking about, I better give him the toll free number 1-800-598-8656
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<< <i>If any seller knows that there is no possibility of a card being in a pack........ >>
Do you know for a fact that the seller knows this? No you don't, but you sure can call him and ask. 1-708-753-1040 Wait a minute, this is stevek we're talking about, I better give him the toll free number 1-800-598-8656 >>
Nam, you need Axtell's phone number.
<< <i>Trust me, everyone on these boards knows that you were not going to be man enough to call Baseball Card Exchange about this. But dont worry, no keyboard warrior is. >>
Nam - I'm telling you again...You need Axtell.
No, I think I will list it in the collectible artifacts section so no one will see it but at least no one will get mad at me for listing it in the sports memorabilia section. Money is for losers any way.
<< <i>Another loud mouthed coward puts his tail between his legs and skulks away when told to put up or shut up. >>
Nam - You really are a funny guy. You should go on TV with your act - you'd get laughs galore.
Now give Axtell a call - he's waitin' for ya for a nice argument.
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<< <i>Another loud mouthed coward puts his tail between his legs and skulks away when told to put up or shut up. >>
Nam - You really are a funny guy. You should go on TV with your act - you'd get laughs galore.
Now give Axtell a call - he's waitin' for ya for a nice argument. >>
and don't forget to bring along your book of high school insults - you and Axtell have a good time now ya hear.
<< <i>I think he is just mature enough to walk away and not reply to himself 3 times. >>
Good point. But I needed to increaase my post count.
We'd still like to hear from some "experts" on these unopened cigarette packs if they care to comment.
<< <i>I kind of think 'stevek' is going to be the winning bidder of this auction, and he's just trying to place doubt in the minds of other potential bidders just to keep the price low. >>
Dam, ya caught me. LOL
The thing is though - it is a very nice looking pack and a very nice collectable. Maybe somebody buys it and pulls a T206 Wagner and then Nam would really let me have it for being so wrong. LOL
Do your best to get people not to bid. Keep telling them that it's fraudulent, deceptive, etc. I'm the current high bidder and will be more than happy to buy it at the price it's at now. $177.50.
I asked Steve Hart my questions via ebay "Ask a question" and I'm satisfied by his answers.
1) He's not guaranteeing that anything is in the pack
2) Maybe a card, maybe not, if a card, could be a fish, an actor/actress, ballplayer, etc.
3) Pack has the proper tax stamps on it that a 1910 pack would have
4) PSA does not have a holder it's size, thus it's authenticated by GAI instead (Steve should know as he is/was a PSA/DNA pack authenticator)
5) Again, NO GUARANTEE that anything is in the pack. He says that no one knows for sure what can be/should be in these packs.
Run off all the bidders. I'll be happy to add it to my collection. It's something different and more than likely, if I own it long enough, curiousity will get the best of me and I'll rip it for the board to see.
Mike
<< <i>Wow.......big bucks for this pack.......maybe the economy is really not that bad. >>
Yep, my delusions of winning it are over
Mike
CU Ancient Members badge member.
Collection: https://flickr.com/photos/185200668@N06/albums
I do though see what you mean. However, many people would like that pack as a tie in to the T206 set that they may be building and that is a reason
why it was listed in that category.
I do understand where you are coming from though.
It should be listed in Tobacannia or however you spell it.
SteveD
<< <i>Stevek,
Do your best to get people not to bid. Keep telling them that it's fraudulent, deceptive, etc. I'm the current high bidder and will be more than happy to buy it at the price it's at now. $177.50.
I asked Steve Hart my questions via ebay "Ask a question" and I'm satisfied by his answers.
1) He's not guaranteeing that anything is in the pack
2) Maybe a card, maybe not, if a card, could be a fish, an actor/actress, ballplayer, etc.
3) Pack has the proper tax stamps on it that a 1910 pack would have
4) PSA does not have a holder it's size, thus it's authenticated by GAI instead (Steve should know as he is/was a PSA/DNA pack authenticator)
5) Again, NO GUARANTEE that anything is in the pack. He says that no one knows for sure what can be/should be in these packs.
Run off all the bidders. I'll be happy to add it to my collection. It's something different and more than likely, if I own it long enough, curiousity will get the best of me and I'll rip it for the board to see.
Mike >>
I respect Steve Hart as a businessman and as a person contributing to and advancing the hobby. But if anyone displays weasel behavior, I don't care who it is, then they deserve to be called out on it, and that's exactly what I did. WinPitcher got it exactly right when stating "It should be listed in Tobacannia or however you spell it", and not under sportscards/baseball cards which in my view is, what I already said it is - That's all.
<<< He says that no one knows for sure what can be/should be in these packs. >>>
Actually, that is incorrect - It is well known among most T206 collectors that with some of these tobacco packs, it is impossible for any insert to be in certain packs because no insert was ever placed in certain packs, which can be determined by the type of stamp and other factors.
Good luck - If you win the auction and bust it - I hope you find yourself a T206 Wagner in there and you can have the last laugh.