Why are there so many DMPL and PL Morgans but so few Peace?
direwolf1972
Posts: 2,076 ✭✭✭
Trying to understand more about the minting process.
I dont think I remember ever seeing a Peace designated DMPL by PCGS or NGC. I've only seen a handful of them with PL designation.
I dont think I remember ever seeing a Peace designated DMPL by PCGS or NGC. I've only seen a handful of them with PL designation.
I'll see your bunny with a pancake on his head and raise you a Siamese cat with a miniature pumpkin on his head.
You wouldn't believe how long it took to get him to sit still for this.
You wouldn't believe how long it took to get him to sit still for this.
0
Comments
in manufacturing, resulted in no true DM Cameos
in the Peace Dollar Series.
Camelot
It's matte.
<< <i>The first PL peace dollar was recently certified at NGC.
It's matte. >>
Is their a news story for this some where? or even better is it for sale
NGC auction
ANACS auction
You wouldn't believe how long it took to get him to sit still for this.
<< <i>There is also a distinct difference in how Peace Dollars tone. Some here have suggested that it is due to the washiing of the planchets a different way. >>
Yes, I've noticed the 1928, in particular, has an unusual toning pattern. It often displays a patchy, unevenly toned surface.
I cant find one.
<< <i>Thats one of the reasons I asked, I was looking at the two certified PL Peace Dollars on eBay.
NGC auction
ANACS auction >>
looking at those two links I can tell you they're both from the same die pair vam-9
<< <i>Thats one of the reasons I asked, I was looking at the two certified PL Peace Dollars on eBay.
NGC auction
ANACS auction >>
Huh. Then I guess the person who informed me of this wasn't telling the truth.
K S
On a Morgan Dollar, the die face is flat (or slightly domed). This allows easy polishing of the
die face (which corresponds to the fields on the struck coin).
On a Peace Dollar, there is a trench outlining parts of the portrait. This trench is especially
evident on the back (right side) of the neck. This trench, when clashed with a reverse die,
is what causes the apparent extra ray coming out of the Eagle's wing below the beak.
The trenches are thus raised ridges on the die, and it is hard to polish the die face without
wearing away the ridges.
You wouldn't believe how long it took to get him to sit still for this.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
…my answer is that the rounded fields did not lend itself for basining (polishing) of the dies.
Rick S. has one part of the answer. The new designs, beginning in 1907, were created by sculptors, not coin engravers. All of the original models had irregular radii of curvature of the fields. This means that the field in front of the portrait could have one curvature and a different curvature back of the portrait. Older designs, such as Morgan’s standard silver dollar, had a consistent radius of curvature across the field. This made it easy to lap the die to remove minor damage, or adjust the radius for optimum performance with the upset angle and diameter of planchets.
Peace dollars did not lend themselves to polishing in the old way, and the very few “PL” examples are not very impressive. Some coins show highly reflective polishing in small areas.
The second reason there are almost no PL Peace dollars is that mint procedure was to do as little touchup to working dies as possible. Working dies were mostly just as they came from the working hub. By WW-1 it was cheaper to make new dies than to spend time repairing old ones. Improvements in die steel also helped improve performance for small-diameter coins. However, Peace dollars never attained the die life of Morgans from the 1880s and 90s.
This is kind of long-winded, but hope it helps. There is additional info in the Whitman Guide Book of Peace Dollars 1921-1964, due out in November.
<< <i>direwolf (obviously a Dr. Who fan):
…my answer is that the rounded fields did not lend itself for basining (polishing) of the dies.
Rick has one part of the answer. The new designs, beginning in 1907, were created by sculptors, not coin engravers. All of the original models had irregular radii of curvature of the fields. This means that the fiend in front of the portrait could have one curvature and a different curvature back of the portrait. Older designs, such as Morgan’s standard silver dollar, had a consistent radius of curvature across the field. This made it easy to lap the die to remove minor damage, or adjust the radius for optimum performance with the upset angle and diameter of planchets.
Peace dollars did not lend themselves to polishing in the old way, and the very few “PL” examples are not very impressive. Some coins show highly reflective polishing in small areas.
The second reason there are almost no PL Peace dollars is that mint procedure was to do as little touchup to working dies as possible. Working dies were mostly just as they came from the working hub. By WW-1 it was cheaper to make new dies than to spend time repairing old ones. Improvements in die steel also helped improve performance for small-diameter coins. However, Peace dollars never attained the die life of Morgans from the 1880s and 90s.
This is kind of long-winded, but hope it helps. There is additional info in the Whitman Guide Book of Peace Dollars 1921-1964, due out in November. >>
Once again, I learn something great here. Thank you!
PS
Can't wait for the book!