Is it worth it getting the regular proof $50 plat slabbed?

claychaser

Given the high cost of slabbing the plats for 1st Strike and 10th Anniv, is it worth it to get the reguar 1/2 ounce proof slabbed? After all, there are alread 1st Strike coins available, and the coin will be a high mintage one to boot.

I'm considering opening up the sets I get, and only sending in the best reverse proofs for grading, and dumping the regular proof for bullion or whatever I can get.

Am I crazy?

Casman

Yes, you're crazy...

ahooka454

I think anyway you go on these sets will be ok. if you have multiples, open one. i am waiting till mid jan. then i will either send it in or open it. i still have to see what the value does.


good luck though.

nurmaler

IMO
Definitely send them both in. The regular proof will probably be less graded making it very valuable to those who wish to complete their revers2e proof anniversary set (0th gold, silver;10th plat)

JRocco

<< <i>IMO
Definitely send them both in. The regular proof will probably be less graded making it very valuable to those who wish to complete their revers2e proof anniversary set (0th gold, silver;10th plat) >>



Can't you complete the set in the original mint holders?

Or is this set completion you are referring to a registry set?
And no, I didn't say a weeny registry set, didn't even think that for a second......

nurmaler

<< <i>Or is this set completion you are referring to a registry set? >>



Yes

hrlaser

Hi..

as the 2007-W $50.00 Platinum Proof identical to the one in the special set was issued by itself earlier this year, there are already some in PCGS First Strike PR70 DCAM slabs.. (although none with the "Anniversay Set" designation yet.. i saw one get bid up close to $5000.00 on TeleTrade last night and it did not sell!.. God only knows how high people will bid up a First Strike PR70 Reverse Proof, (available, as you know, ONLY in the Anniversary set).. since none of them have been slabbed yet.. get a pair of First Strike 70s from this set out of PCGS and you could very well have a couple of slabs that might be worth over ten grand.. or not.. who knows..

Fedex just handed me my set.. it's gonna stay sealed until i get some clarification from PCGS, who is closed today.. and it has to do with this paragraph in the submissions instrutions for the Anniversary set linked on the front page of PCGS.com.. this paragraph:

"1. All coins must be submitted in the original, unopened Mint packaging as received from the Mint within 30 days of the original release date (to be announced) or sealed and postmarked within that 30 day period. Because the 2007-W $50 Regular Proof was already issued earlier this year, the packaging must remain unopened for these coins to qualify for these special inserts."

okay.. so The Mint started shipping these sets ten days early, on 12/21/2007, not 12/31/2007 as noted in red on their product page.. so there's something ambiguous here or i'm an idiot.. what is the "original release date" according to PCGS?.. is it 12/21/2007, when The Mint actually started shipping sets, meaning in order to get the "First Strike" designation.. PCGS has to have it in hand by 1/21/2007?.. or is it 12/31/2007, which was and still is The Mint's stated "product will be available for shipment by.." date?.. meaning one could get it to PCGS by 1/31/2007 and it'd still qualify for "First Strike"?..

Either way, handing it over to PCGS at the upcoming February Long Beach Show will be too late.. can it be walked in during PCGS' monthly walk-in day, and does anyone know what day in January that'll be?.. they're about an hour's drive from me.. i can't find it on their schedule, and i haven't gotten their emailed newsletter (which always states it) for a couple of months, even though i'm subscribed to it.. i just called them but they're closed today (Monday 12/24/2007).. taking a long Holiday..

guess if no one knows, i'll have to wait until Wednesday and call them and get clarification on this.. meantime, as much as i want to open this box and drool all over the coins, and even though there's absolutely NO guarantee of getting 70 70 slabs.. and for all i know, one or both of the capsules could have popped open and the coins could be bouncing around loose inside the wood case (i saw that happen with a $5.00 Gold Commemorative i bought from The Mint earlier this year.. opened the sealed box, and took out the blue slipcase, and the blue clamshell, and the capsule had popped out of its indentation, separated, and the coin was just sitting there loose.. luckily, because there's not a lot of room in that clamshell, the coin wasn't damaged in any way..)..

i'll just keep the Platinum set sealed until i can get the carved-in-stone word on exactly what date is the cut-off to get them to PCGS for the "First Strike" designation..

Thanks
Harv

JRocco

Hey Harv,
How are you?
Please do not take this in a negative way, but let me ask you a question.

Are you a coin collector? I mean a real coin collector? Have you ever tried to fill a penny board when you were a kid? (You may still be a kid for all I know and again-this is not meant to criticize).
I can see wanting to have these beautiful pieces protected in some kind of holder for their preservation and protection, but aren't they already protected and preserved in the mint packaging....and presented beautifully also may I add?

Is a coin collector more interested in their ranking on a TPG registry set board than they are interested in the viewing of the very coins that they are claiming to collect in the first place?

I could not buy a coin for my collection and not want to immediately see it once it arrived at my home, but that may just be me.....

SlangNRox

Everyone should slab the regular proof so I can pick one up cheap for my registry set.

claychaser

Thanks Harv for a very interesting post.

For myself, the only modern that I am collecting is a set of the 'Liberty" spouse gold coins. Unless you have Bill Gate's level of wealth, one just cannot afford to collect everything, but I do buy mint products and either slab or flip them to subsidize my other collecting endeavors.

7Jaguars

I think Rocco has it precisely; if you are trying to hold coins as a collector, the "labelling" fad will likely fade and this is not a certainty but is a probability. We are seeing already some signs of increased interest in OGP on this board already. I have now converted back to this and wish I could get some of the previous 1/2 oz proof plats in OGP (however the prices have gone up with bullion as you know).

Anyway, flippers love the shot at 70s and first strike occasionally - I think the First Strike designation is also getting stale and showing signs of drop-off in interest are beginning to show....

hrlaser

<< <i>Hey Harv,
How are you?
Please do not take this in a negative way, but let me ask you a question.

Are you a coin collector? I mean a real coin collector? Have you ever tried to fill a penny board when you were a kid? (You may still be a kid for all I know and again-this is not meant to criticize).
I can see wanting to have these beautiful pieces protected in some kind of holder for their preservation and protection, but aren't they already protected and preserved in the mint packaging....and presented beautifully also may I add?

Is a coin collector more interested in their ranking on a TPG registry set board than they are interested in the viewing of the very coins that they are claiming to collect in the first place?

I could not buy a coin for my collection and not want to immediately see it once it arrived at my home, but that may just be me..... >>



i don't take it in a negative way, and i could see where you might misconscrew my question.. yes of course i'm a "real" collector.. i have all my kidhood Whitman blue folders (Lincolns Buffalos, Liberty Nickels, Indian Cents, on and on.. ).. and coins i've was given since before i was old enough to ride a bicycle without training wheels.. boxes full of slabs that are "keepers".. many MANY Proof an Mint sets..

but.. i bought this set as a turnaround investment.. if i can turn two grand into ten grand by keeping it sealed and having it slabbed.. well that may be pocket change to some of the millionaires who populate these boards, but it sure isn't to me.. of course i want to see the coins, and no i don't have or have any intention of starting a Registry set of anything.. Registry sets are, to me, just an ego thing.

i collect by type.. a little of this, a little of that.. whatever appeals to me at the time.. i have NO complete books or albums of any given series except a full set (without varieties) of Red Lincoln Memorial Cents and a full album of circulated Franklin Halves..

but if some Registry set guy with deep pockets is willing to throw some serious money at me for a pair of Platinum First Strike 70s.. i'll gladly spend the hundred bucks or whatever it costs and spin the wheel of fortune and shoot for a pair of, or even one 70..

Edited to add: i am no kid.. i went to my fortieth High School Reunion this past October.. and if i could have afford to buy two of these Platinum sets, i would have. i couldn't, so i didn't.. to some of us, two grand IS a lot of money.. i could have one Helluva righteous big screen teevee for what these two coins cost me..

and i agree there is much to be said in favor of OGP.. as someone said in another thread, think "Antiques Road Show".. originality is very important in many collecting areas..

this set is the most money i have ever spent on a single (well double) coin purchase in my life.. they are not the most valuable coins i own, not raw, not yet anyway.. if they found their way into gimmicky First Strike 70 slabs.. they would be, by far.. yes, i think First Strike and Early Release and other such labels are a gimmick.. but others don't and they're willing to pay dearly for those labels, and if they have the deep pockets, who am i to tell them how to spend their money?..

JRocco

Thanks Harv,
I really appreciate your reply as it answered every one of my questions.
Let me add that everything you said makes perfect sense.
My respect for you just increased a few hundred percent and I hope I run into you someday so I can buy you dinner and show off to each other our boxes full of "stuff".
Thanks again Harv.
Best,
John

hrlaser

<< <i>Thanks Harv for a very interesting post.

For myself, the only modern that I am collecting is a set of the 'Liberty" spouse gold coins. Unless you have Bill Gate's level of wealth, one just cannot afford to collect everything, but I do buy mint products and either slab or flip them to subsidize my other collecting endeavors. >>



as do i.. i have ONE of the First Spouse coins.. the Unc. Jefferson's Liberty.. i opened it the day i got it, and i have NO intention of ever getting it slabbed..

ahooka454

First thing I must address is the First Strike. What a joke that these companies wouold even do this. There is no way from just times or numbers on a package, that says what coin is first. unless someone took it off the presses and marked it as such.another way to get a buck.

Slabbing is wonderful i think, and a major factor when spending big money on a coin.
the only reason i bought a set to begin with is to flip. plain and simple. i will do one of two things with the set; either send it to PCGS, or keep it sealed and sell for a premium. I would put all the money back into my core collection.

these first strikes have me in an uproar because they mislead people. Look at the early gold with raised hairlines. they sell for a discount but have more die detail than anyother coin. why are these not first strikes? these lines wear off the die before anything else. those are the true first strikes.


any opinions on this are welcome...

hrlaser

i agree - in my opinion, the only "First Strike" is the first coin struck off freshly installed dies and that's it.. ONE coin.. and who knows which one that is unless its immediately preserved and labelled as such?.. how can a whole bunch of, hundreds, thousands of coins be "First"?..

that's like the way people, even highly-paid journalists, modify the word "unique". unique is unique. nothing can be "the most unique" or "more unique" yet you hear it every day on teevee by people who make obscene salaries.. who are just pretty faces reading copy handed to them by Editors who should know better.. call me a grammar nazi, but it just grinds my gears every time i hear someone qualify "unique".. and again, to me, there can only be one "First".. just like in a car race or a foot race.. someone takes First.. everyone else is a runner-up..

if these sets had serial numbers on them in order of their Minting, then yeah, you could have a genuine "First Strike" since it'd be serial number 00000001.. but then the Mint would have to switch to sealed capsules.. not these capsules that you can pry open with your fingernails and put any other similarly-sized coin into..

Casman

<< <i>Hi..

as the 2007-W $50.00 Platinum Proof identical to the one in the special set was issued by itself earlier this year, there are already some in PCGS First Strike PR70 DCAM slabs.. (although none with the "Anniversay Set" designation yet.. i saw one get bid up close to $5000.00 on TeleTrade last night and it did not sell!.. God only knows how high people will bid up a First Strike PR70 Reverse Proof, (available, as you know, ONLY in the Anniversary set).. since none of them have been slabbed yet.. get a pair of First Strike 70s from this set out of PCGS and you could very well have a couple of slabs that might be worth over ten grand.. or not.. who knows..

Fedex just handed me my set.. it's gonna stay sealed until i get some clarification from PCGS, who is closed today.. and it has to do with this paragraph in the submissions instrutions for the Anniversary set linked on the front page of PCGS.com.. this paragraph:

"1. All coins must be submitted in the original, unopened Mint packaging as received from the Mint within 30 days of the original release date (to be announced) or sealed and postmarked within that 30 day period. Because the 2007-W $50 Regular Proof was already issued earlier this year, the packaging must remain unopened for these coins to qualify for these special inserts."

okay.. so The Mint started shipping these sets ten days early, on 12/21/2007, not 12/31/2007 as noted in red on their product page.. so there's something ambiguous here or i'm an idiot.. what is the "original release date" according to PCGS?.. is it 12/21/2007, when The Mint actually started shipping sets, meaning in order to get the "First Strike" designation.. PCGS has to have it in hand by 1/21/2007?.. or is it 12/31/2007, which was and still is The Mint's stated "product will be available for shipment by.." date?.. meaning one could get it to PCGS by 1/31/2007 and it'd still qualify for "First Strike"?..

Either way, handing it over to PCGS at the upcoming February Long Beach Show will be too late.. can it be walked in during PCGS' monthly walk-in day, and does anyone know what day in January that'll be?.. they're about an hour's drive from me.. i can't find it on their schedule, and i haven't gotten their emailed newsletter (which always states it) for a couple of months, even though i'm subscribed to it.. i just called them but they're closed today (Monday 12/24/2007).. taking a long Holiday..

guess if no one knows, i'll have to wait until Wednesday and call them and get clarification on this.. meantime, as much as i want to open this box and drool all over the coins, and even though there's absolutely NO guarantee of getting 70 70 slabs.. and for all i know, one or both of the capsules could have popped open and the coins could be bouncing around loose inside the wood case (i saw that happen with a $5.00 Gold Commemorative i bought from The Mint earlier this year.. opened the sealed box, and took out the blue slipcase, and the blue clamshell, and the capsule had popped out of its indentation, separated, and the coin was just sitting there loose.. luckily, because there's not a lot of room in that clamshell, the coin wasn't damaged in any way..)..

i'll just keep the Platinum set sealed until i can get the carved-in-stone word on exactly what date is the cut-off to get them to PCGS for the "First Strike" designation..

Thanks
Harv >>




As long as you keep the set sealed, you can send it in whenever as it is postmarked within the window which will be updated to 12/21, date of first shipping. If you open it, only the RP would get the anniv designation, first strike desig the rp would have to get there within the window, cause you opened it....

57loaded

at first i wasn't going to slab the proof.

FS can mean something...maybe it can stand for "first submissions" in the future, either way it can/does increase a coin's value...short term..

hrlaser

<< <i>
As long as you keep the set sealed, you can send it in whenever as it is postmarked within the window which will be updated to 12/21, date of first shipping. If you open it, only the RP would get the anniv designation, first strike desig the rp would have to get there within the window, cause you opened it.... >>



so if i'm reading you correctly.. as long as i keep it sealed, i could submit it next July and it would still get "First Strike" on the slab labels?.. sorry if the answer to this question is obvious in your reply.. but i'm still a little hazy as it doesn't seem to jive with PCGS' submission parameters posting.. if "whenever" means i don't have to do it in the next 30 days, then i'd just as soon hand it to them at the February Long Beach show, pay the price, they'd open the package right there, take out the two capsules, and hand me back the wood box, right?.. and at this price level.. i'd probably even go for same-day walk-through and just loiter around the show, rather than wait for them to mail the slabs back to me..

i'm REAL hesitant to put this set in the mail and have it subjected to more jostling at the hands of the USPS.. (as i mentioned somewhere, i have received a sealed box $5.00 Gold Commemorative, opened the outer box, opened the slip-case and clamshell, and found the capsule had some how popped out of its recess, popped open.. (not broken, just separated).. and the coin was sitting naked inside the clamshell case.. luckily, unscathed.. without an x-ray machine, it's impossible to know what's going on inside a sealed box that has been bounced around in transit across a few thousand miles.. because Mint capsules are just pressed together and only friction is holding them together.).. nevermind the possibility of loss or damage, even though it'd be Insured, of course.. because if i waited a while, by that time, these sets WILL sell out.. some have opined that they already HAVE sold out.. so the chance of getting another one at issue price would be basically nil..

i don't know what's going to happen to sealed, un-slabbed sets or even opened sets, price-wise, after they sell out.. i don't think anyone honestly knows.. or CAN know..

Thanks
Harv

Coinlearner

I would (did). If a 70 in results, no question about it. If a 69 it will/does get a certain % above none slabbed coins. Think those intending to keep long term, like a attractive holder and printings on label. Also think down the road, the buyer may think the FS has an easier time selling than non FS. Will these "special" labels loose interest, by collectors, going forward? I am in the camp that thinks these will continue to GAIN in popularity......

BAJJERFAN

Well lets see, you spent almost $2K for the set and yer worried about another $40 to slab it? If you get a PR70 10th Anniv you will most surely recoup your slabbing fees in a flash. To me it would be a no brainer esp since you will be selling into an aftermarket that is teeming with gullibles.

hrlaser

<< <i>Well lets see, you spent almost $2K for the set and yer worried about another $40 to slab it? If you get a PR70 10th Anniv you will most surely recoup your slabbing fees in a flash. to me it would be a no brainer esp since you will be selling into an aftermarket that is teeming with gullibles. >>



heh.. as long as WE'RE not the gullibles for paying $2000.00 for $1500.00 worth of Platinum .. hmm.. just checked Kitco.com.. while Gold is bouncing around above and below $800.00, Platinum is over $1525.00 and still climbing.. if it ever hits $1949.95/oz, then we bought this set for just the price of the raw metal..

now please find me a Sugar Daddy who is SO gullible he'll both pay me $10,000.00 for the set, and let me keep it too..

BAJJERFAN

There is a certain amount of artistic/collector value in the sets and I know that the mint didn't get all the packaging and everything that goes with making the coins for free. The metal and and plastic value of your car is but a few hundred dollars to a junk/scrap dealer yet you pay a $20,000 premium to GM or whatever to transform it into its current shape. Yes its bullion, but if were talkin true bullion, lets just abolish the boards and go with rounds n bars. Pennies are made out of bullion copper, but people here go ape$hit cuz smoeone dropped the hammer on sum 55's twice cuz he warn't payin attention or some dude with VD tried to divert attention away from his medical problem by adding an extra letter to sum coinz in 1909.

hrlaser

and SOME people {{coff}} will pay the price of a car for one oz. of Silver in the form of a MorgEn DollEr just because it says "1893-S" on it instead of "1921".. {{coff}}.. they all look the same to me .. and before anyone asks why i always misspell it as "MorgEn DollEr".. it's a joke of a habit i picked up due to some eBay sellers with the IQ of a fence post spelling it that way.. try doing an eBay search for either or both words misspelled.. one can sometimes pick up a bargain coin on eBay because the seller misspelled something in his aukshun tytle.. so people doing correctly-spelled keyword searches miss it..