The Chameleon 1794 Dollar no one wants to keep...
lloydmincy
Posts: 1,861 ✭
I call it the Chameleon, because it has changed colors so many times. I owned it, and wanted to keep it. Too many told me to get rid of it.
It is now for sale at the Stacks Franklinton Collection Part II. Lot 577. It is known as the "Walton" specimen, and can be spotted a mile away with its "microporous planchet flaw" hole on Liberty's nose, and under the left wing of the eagle on the reverse. Logies had it as coin #11 in his 1794 Flowing Hair Silver Dollar book. I wish I could link (Where's Shylock when I need him??) to show all the color changes (it's crazy), but here they are:
1) Heritage 2001 October Long Beach Sale #271, Lot 7118 - RAW AU50 details. Sold for $72,450.
2) Heritage 2004 May Signature Sale, Lot 7928 - AU58 SEGS. Sold for $115,000
3) Stack's Brooklyn Sale & John Ford, Jr. Collection, Baltimore, March 20-21 2007, Lot 1001 - RAW EX45 details. Sold for $103,500
4) Bowers & Merena, September 2007 Collectors Choice Auction, Lot 72 - PCGS GENUINE (no grade). Sold for $110,400.
5) and now at Stacks.
It is sad to see what has happened to such a (once) beautiful classic in such a short time.
You only need to look at the first pictures from Heritage in 2001. After that you will cry. 7 years ago, it had a nice dark natural brown tone look to it. Maybe it still had no chance at a PCGS or NGC holder, but at the time, it was its best chance. To me, it was still one of the SHARPEST detailed 1794 dollars I had seen. Most that go for $150,000+ today, you can barely read the date. I have two worth more than this one, but of course, I barely see the date. This one, 1794 looked like it was yesterday.
After that, I don't know what happened. It looked harshly cleaned (white almost and black near the detail of the design) up to the Stacks sale, and then someone bought it, got it rainbowed (It's look today), got it into a PCGS Genuine holder and sold it at B&M, and now it is up for sale AGAIN - someone wanting a quick $30,000 profit at a minimum.
I love how the catalogs show pedigree up to 1963, only. It has traded hands 7 times that I know of, since the turn of the century.
P.S. Don't get me wrong. I still love this one. It's just funny how she aged nicely for 206 years, and then straight downhill in less than 8.
P.S.S. If I had known I could have gotten it into a PCGS Genuine holder, I would have kept it. Only an option recently.
It is now for sale at the Stacks Franklinton Collection Part II. Lot 577. It is known as the "Walton" specimen, and can be spotted a mile away with its "microporous planchet flaw" hole on Liberty's nose, and under the left wing of the eagle on the reverse. Logies had it as coin #11 in his 1794 Flowing Hair Silver Dollar book. I wish I could link (Where's Shylock when I need him??) to show all the color changes (it's crazy), but here they are:
1) Heritage 2001 October Long Beach Sale #271, Lot 7118 - RAW AU50 details. Sold for $72,450.
2) Heritage 2004 May Signature Sale, Lot 7928 - AU58 SEGS. Sold for $115,000
3) Stack's Brooklyn Sale & John Ford, Jr. Collection, Baltimore, March 20-21 2007, Lot 1001 - RAW EX45 details. Sold for $103,500
4) Bowers & Merena, September 2007 Collectors Choice Auction, Lot 72 - PCGS GENUINE (no grade). Sold for $110,400.
5) and now at Stacks.
It is sad to see what has happened to such a (once) beautiful classic in such a short time.
You only need to look at the first pictures from Heritage in 2001. After that you will cry. 7 years ago, it had a nice dark natural brown tone look to it. Maybe it still had no chance at a PCGS or NGC holder, but at the time, it was its best chance. To me, it was still one of the SHARPEST detailed 1794 dollars I had seen. Most that go for $150,000+ today, you can barely read the date. I have two worth more than this one, but of course, I barely see the date. This one, 1794 looked like it was yesterday.
After that, I don't know what happened. It looked harshly cleaned (white almost and black near the detail of the design) up to the Stacks sale, and then someone bought it, got it rainbowed (It's look today), got it into a PCGS Genuine holder and sold it at B&M, and now it is up for sale AGAIN - someone wanting a quick $30,000 profit at a minimum.
I love how the catalogs show pedigree up to 1963, only. It has traded hands 7 times that I know of, since the turn of the century.
P.S. Don't get me wrong. I still love this one. It's just funny how she aged nicely for 206 years, and then straight downhill in less than 8.
P.S.S. If I had known I could have gotten it into a PCGS Genuine holder, I would have kept it. Only an option recently.
The Accumulator - Dark Lloyd of the Sith
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Comments
Merry Christmas.
I look forward to seeing those pics when they can be assembled.
Thanks for the insight.
Heritage 2001 October Long Beach Sale #271, Lot 7118 - RAW AU50 details. Sold for $72,450.
Heritage 2004 May Signature Sale, Lot 7928 - AU58 SEGS. Sold for $115,000
Stack's Brooklyn Sale & John Ford, Jr. Collection, Baltimore, March 20-21 2007, Lot 1001 - RAW EX45 details. Sold for $103,500
Stacks Franklinton Collection Part II. Lot 577
Edited to add captions to photos.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
It's just funny how she aged nicely for 206 years, and then straight downhill in less than 8.
The Walton catalog (Stacks, 1963) describes the coin as "lightly polished". Does it still look polished?
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
<< <i>Nice hole filler! >>
Nice edit!
I knew it would happen.
Last time I checked, retoning a retoned coin was not illegal. But I will defer to our legal experts.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
<< <i>Last time I checked, retoning a retoned coin was not illegal. But I will defer to our legal experts. >>
Perhaps not, but if someone doctors a coin and pumps up the price by claiming it's natural toning and "original surfaces," they are arguably engaging in outright fraud.
Could be, but I see no evidence that that has happened.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
<< <i>It sure looked better before they started trying to squeeze every last buck out of that coin. One might argue criminal intent. >>
If messing with a coin to improve its price at auction is a crime, we are going to have to build some more prisons.
Too bad about the 1794 dollar.
Nice thread, Lloyd.
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<< <i>This coin reminds me old Mrs. Wheeler who plucked her eyebrows out and then drew them back in. I think she used a Sharpie. As far as I know, no one ever tried to arrest her.
Nice thread, Lloyd. >>
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
K
<< <i>Help me out on this one. To me, the coin in this thread looks best in the earliest picture (Heritage 2001). Why does it look worse than that picture in every subsequent picture? >>
My guess is whoever first dipped it didn't find what was expected underneath and thus the sordid tale begins.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
<< <i> if someone doctors a coin and pumps up the price by claiming it's natural toning and "original surfaces," they are arguably engaging in outright fraud.
Could be, but I see no evidence that that has happened. >>
Certainly, nothing has been done to improve this coin.
Change, certainly, but improve, not at all.
TD
<< <i>Help me out on this one. To me, the coin in this thread looks best in the earliest picture (Heritage 2001). Why does it look worse than that picture in every subsequent picture? >>
Sometimes you get the bear, and sometimes the bear gets you.
TD
<< <i>Yet another expensive numismatic abortion. >>
And so eloquently put!!!
<< <i>Help me out on this one. To me, the coin in this thread looks best in the earliest picture (Heritage 2001). Why does it look worse than that picture in every subsequent picture? >>
Good question. That coin continues to look worse and worse. What a shame.
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One of the fastest, most dramatic changes in any rare coin can be seen on the Original 1827/3/2 Bust Quarter in the John Pittman sale of May 1998, lot 1283. Pittman bought it at the Farouk sale in 1954 and never did anything to it, even though it had been cleaned and laquered.
The same coin re-appeared in the February 1999 Suros sale, lot 141, sans pedigree, and was AT gold on the obverse and AT green on the reverse (there's a planchet defect near the rim at 5 o'clock). It used to be a nice dark color as well when it was owned by H O Granberg and displayed at, and plated in, the 1914 ANS exhibit.
So what's your favorite color?
<< <i>GACK!!!!!!!!! >>
Couldn't have said it better
<< <i>Didn't meet $130,000 reserve. What a surprise. >>
GOOD!!! Whoever screwed with this coin should lose a lot of money on this coin.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire