Oh, you're not going to get away with that. You made the childish threat, now back it up by referring to, and quoting directly, what I said in this thread to make you respond so.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
<< <i>They would be wise to read these comments with an eye towards fixing perceived problems, but they didn't listen when they got 3 months of free pre-rollout feedback here, so why would they now? They're not that kind of folks. Besides, the problems are inherent in the concept itself, and aren't amenable to fixing. Only now are the little, specific things, like this stickered Buffalo, becoming apparent additional problems. Not looking good. >>
Well said. You think that's what set him off?
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
Pharmer, satire is subject to misinterpretation, as is the case now. I perceived a discourteous comment toward you, and I noted your response, and a follow -up comment. Whether the intent of the comment toward you was true or not, the choice of language used toward you was 'childish'. I was emphasizing this point. I was obviously to subtle. However, the point now may be mute, as you have come to a conclusion that my comments are made in a non-sober state. This is unfortunate, because I don't imbibe. I will however, accept your choice of language as satirical, and not personal. Regards and Respectfully, John Curlis
Oh. Do I feel foolish. I didn't know Mike had responded, much less like that. Dudes gonna bust an aorta one of these days. Yes, it went over my head, John. Sorry.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
Thus, it is settled. A cyberspace handshake is proffered in good faith, and the Festivus can now be re-directed toward the original point of the Thread. I will make a conscious effort to be more precise and less subtle. Regards and Respectfully, John Curlis
I'm not going to try and judge the coins completely since I haven't seen it in person nor can I really saying anything about CAC...I take an agnostic view...I don't know and I don't care. However, based on the photo the spots make this coin a loser in my book (again..that based on the photo).
Also, assuming the market did show that this coin went above normal in the auction (I'm not sure it did) and this supposedly proves it's PQ then why do I need a sticker to tell me this? Isn't the slab enough?
I'm just going to stick with what has always thought about the grading issue: All of the discussion (the definitions, the arguments, the companies, AT vs NT etc etc) of the grading of coins is so WAY overblown it actually makes the discussion of actually COLLECTING the coins pale in comparison. That's pretty dumb if you ask me.
<< <i>Also, assuming the market did show that this coin went above normal in the auction (I'm not sure it did) and this supposedly proves it's PQ then why do I need a sticker to tell me this? Isn't the slab enough? >>
I don't think price always reflects whether a coin is PQ or not. For my example I'll use a rather ugly, but original, AU, 1913-S Barber quarter. Plenty of folks are working on AU sets of Barber quarters, but there are only a handfull of AU, 1913-S certified examples out there. In auction, supply and demand could easily bring up the price of an ugly 13-S, to well above "normal" prices.
jom, respectfully, while I think I understand your comments, it seems to me that discussion of the various subjects you mention IS coin collecting, in that most of the time, the subject of the discussion has,at its' heart, the ETHIC of collecting, and the betterment of knowledge for all collectors. I am not certain a person can have an agnostic position on the various subjects of collecting, and be a collector. I certainly don't think that individuals that discuss grading are discussing a dumb subject that over shadows discussion of collecting. I welcome the wonderful knowledge shared in this Forum, because ,without same, Ethic, Integrity and Purpose would disappear from Collecting, and that would mean we are all simply Hoarders(or misers?) Regards and Respectfully, John Curlis
There was a post ats by someone saying that one of the big problems is that no one in the venture ever says anything, relying instead on those with no or some tenuous, vague connection.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
We need to cut through all the CAC in the Coin Industry.
How about you just sell your coins at 30% of "list" price and buy at 170% of list and accept that you are getting a fair deal. This will ensure a great profit for coin dealers - no one ever said collectors had any rights to making any money.
Only buy Coins if you plan to keep em forever. Let's get away from the bigger fool concept. You know the one - I may be a fool to pay $4,000,000.00 for this Nickel but one day, an even bigger fool will come along and pay me $5,000,000.00 for it.
An easy fix for improperly graded coins isn't with a sticker on the outside or a star on the inside, but a decimal at the end of the grade. Let EYE APPEAL be the buyer's decision and not the grader. Grading companies should grade it, not price it. The market will price it and hype will sell it. Up here in Canada I see gas is advertised at 98.3, 99.5 , etc per litre. And at home it's POINT 9. If we can do it down to the tenths of cents with gas, why can't we do in between grades with coins ?
Such a simple fix on something that ought not be controversial at all.
<< <i>An easy fix for improperly graded coins isn't with a sticker on the outside or a star on the inside, but a decimal at the end of the grade. Let EYE APPEAL be the buyer's decision and not the grader. Grading companies should grade it, not price it. The market will price it and hype will sell it. Up here in Canada I see gas is advertised at 98.3, 99.5 , etc per litre. And at home it's POINT 9. If we can do it down to the tenths of cents with gas, why can't we do in between grades with coins ?
Such a simple fix on something that ought not be controversial at all. >>
C'mon, they can't even get whole number grades right. What do you think they would do with tenths???
BTW, this thread is cracking me up. A lot of you guys are acting like the CAC actually has any impact on your collecting habits. Frankly, all this animosity is quite puzzling.
TwoSides2aCoin, this is a Concept that has been discussed by noteworthy Numismatists, and I think the idea, in its' basic presentation, has merit. I am curious if this Concept should have, as a predominant basis, Ethic or Investment, and what "Grade" would be used to denote one or the other, or both? Would this Concept be the basis of establishing a new "Market"? Respectfully, John Curlis
It is my opinion that a great deal of trouble could be prevented and a lot of attitudes changed with regard to numismatics if those who are power players, those who are knowledgeable and those who are CEOs of grading companies could and would have the time, desire and INTEGRITY to assemble. It requires each to lay down his own ego and think of the WHOLE. This could be the start of it. I believe in the GOOD of this hobby. And I believe in my heart that there are enough honest men who want to keep it that way. It's clear that mistakes have been made, but every day is an opportunity to become better, in my humble opinion.
Thank You, TwoSides, it happens very frequently, and certainly is not as disappointing as an individual that responded to me as Dear Mr. Silruc. I still remain puzzled-intentional or medical. Re. your Post response- I was brief in my answer because I think you surmised where I was heading. Regards and Respectfully, John CURLIS
<< <i>An easy fix for improperly graded coins isn't with a sticker on the outside or a star on the inside, but a decimal at the end of the grade. >>
Dare I say this is a step towards the 100 point scale? Besides having superior eye-appeal, if PQ can be considered a coin near the next higher grade and the "sticker" differentiates coins that are PQ from those that are just average, the sicker simply acts as hypothetical number after a decimal point.
And now. Shamika, we may have come to the EXACT point of the wonderful thread you started, is the business model that has started the better mousetrap idea of grading really a better mousetrap. With Respect, John Curlis
As soon as I saw the misformatted thread title I immediately knew it was an ancient thread and cougar had made some random inane comment on it for no reason at all.
@lermish said:
As soon as I saw the misformatted thread title I immediately knew it was an ancient thread and cougar had made some random inane comment on it for no reason at all.
Comments
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
<< <i>They would be wise to read these comments with an eye towards fixing perceived problems, but they didn't listen when they got 3 months of free pre-rollout feedback here, so why would they now? They're not that kind of folks. Besides, the problems are inherent in the concept itself, and aren't amenable to fixing. Only now are the little, specific things, like this stickered Buffalo, becoming apparent additional problems. Not looking good. >>
Well said. You think that's what set him off?
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
If it is, then we need the airing of
grievances before the test of strength.
Camelot
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
Also, assuming the market did show that this coin went above normal in the auction (I'm not sure it did) and this supposedly proves it's PQ then why do I need a sticker to tell me this? Isn't the slab enough?
I'm just going to stick with what has always thought about the grading issue: All of the discussion (the definitions, the arguments, the companies, AT vs NT etc etc) of the grading of coins is so WAY overblown it actually makes the discussion of actually COLLECTING the coins pale in comparison. That's pretty dumb if you ask me.
jom
<< <i>Also, assuming the market did show that this coin went above normal in the auction (I'm not sure it did) and this supposedly proves it's PQ then why do I need a sticker to tell me this? Isn't the slab enough? >>
I don't think price always reflects whether a coin is PQ or not. For my example I'll use a rather ugly, but original, AU, 1913-S Barber quarter. Plenty of folks are working on AU sets of Barber quarters, but there are only a handfull of AU, 1913-S certified examples out there. In auction, supply and demand could easily bring up the price of an ugly 13-S, to well above "normal" prices.
Connor Numismatics Website
<< <i>In auction, supply and demand could easily bring up the price of an ugly 13-S, to well above "normal" prices. >>
What you say could very well be true but I'd guess that particular coin, would probably not get a sticker.
jom
<< <i>I'm not going to try and judge the coins completely since I haven't seen it in person >>
you don't NEED to see it in person! why, all you need to know is that it closed at at auction, & that it has a sticker!!!
(this, according to tradedollarnut, john albanese, etc)
K S
<< <i>If the coin in the original pic was a plain vanilla 37-P, would it deserve to be called a PQ 64? >>
Very good question.
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
How about you just sell your coins at 30% of "list" price and buy at 170% of list and accept that you are getting a fair deal. This will ensure a great profit for coin dealers - no one ever said collectors had any rights to making any money.
Only buy Coins if you plan to keep em forever. Let's get away from the bigger fool concept. You know the one - I may be a fool to pay $4,000,000.00 for this Nickel but one day, an even bigger fool will come along and pay me $5,000,000.00 for it.
You want to "invest" - go to Wall St.
Up here in Canada I see gas is advertised at 98.3, 99.5 , etc per litre. And at home it's POINT 9.
If we can do it down to the tenths of cents with gas, why can't we do in between grades with coins ?
Such a simple fix on something that ought not be controversial at all.
Russ, NCNE
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>An easy fix for improperly graded coins isn't with a sticker on the outside or a star on the inside, but a decimal at the end of the grade. Let EYE APPEAL be the buyer's decision and not the grader. Grading companies should grade it, not price it. The market will price it and hype will sell it.
Up here in Canada I see gas is advertised at 98.3, 99.5 , etc per litre. And at home it's POINT 9.
If we can do it down to the tenths of cents with gas, why can't we do in between grades with coins ?
Such a simple fix on something that ought not be controversial at all. >>
C'mon, they can't even get whole number grades right. What do you think they would do with tenths???
-Paul
Russ, NCNE
. And Ken, it's just food for thought, man.
<< <i>OOPS! That may have been premature.
Russ, NCNE >>
Thought you had 200, or that it's going to go there?
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
<< <i>OOPS! That may have been premature.
Russ, NCNE >>
That's what she said.
It is my opinion that a great deal of trouble could be prevented and a lot of attitudes changed with regard to numismatics if those who are power players, those who are knowledgeable and those who are CEOs of grading companies could and would have the time, desire and INTEGRITY to assemble.
It requires each to lay down his own ego and think of the WHOLE.
This could be the start of it. I believe in the GOOD of this hobby. And I believe in my heart that there are enough honest men who want to keep it that way. It's clear that mistakes have been made, but every day is an opportunity to become better, in my humble opinion.
<< <i>Thank You, TwoSides. Regards and Respectfully, John Curlis >>
Sorry, I wrote Curtis before
people mess up my last name a lot, too.
<< <i>An easy fix for improperly graded coins isn't with a sticker on the outside or a star on the inside, but a decimal at the end of the grade. >>
Dare I say this is a step towards the 100 point scale? Besides having superior eye-appeal, if PQ can be considered a coin near the next higher grade and the "sticker" differentiates coins that are PQ from those that are just average, the sicker simply acts as hypothetical number after a decimal point.
i.e. grade + sticker = new grade
Or as in this case 64 + 0.8 = 64.8
<< <i>Shamika, or maybe as QDB has mentioned in the past, 4 different grades for the same coin. Respectfully, John Curlis >>
EXACTLY!!!
I used to be a fan of the 100 point scale idea. But I'm beginning to change my mind.
So rip or snooker?
Resurrecting a 17-year old thread for that reply? Reads like you took a nip and a hookah.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Cougar doesn't need no stinking calendar.
As soon as I saw the misformatted thread title I immediately knew it was an ancient thread and cougar had made some random inane comment on it for no reason at all.
Chopmarked Trade Dollar Registry Set --- US & World Gold Showcase --- World Chopmark Showcase
Though somewhat amusing.
There’s a method to his madness.
Founder- Peak Rarities
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Typical zombie thread revival by him, basically the equivalent of planting a fresh booger on a dusty old chair.
10-4,
My Instagram picturesErik
My registry sets
Resurrecting old threads does make me chuckle. lol
After reading this entire thread, I still stand behind my statements from 17 years ago.