UPDATE, 12-2-07 at 1:30pm: Buster Olney is reporting that the Sox will include Ellsbury in their offer, but pull Lester out of it. Basically the Twins can have one or the other. Olney doesn't say whether Buchholz/Ellsbury is possible, but I imagine it's not. The Twins are expected to choose an offer from Boston or New York soon.
so if the Sox trade Ellsbury, what are the chances they go ahead and trade Crisp elsewhere (for a quality catcher or middle relief) and pursue Rowand for CF? Why don't the Sox package Tavarez too, that's cool with me.
I think we should contract MLB to two teams, the Red Sox and Yankees, and demote the other 28 teams to a new quadruple-A classification. That's what it's coming to anyway.
Giving up Ellsbury would be worth it. His minor league stat are only marginally better than Crisp's from the same ages, my guess is next year they would be about equal, then 2009 on Ellsbury would give a few more walks and a few more homeruns. Everything went perfect for the Sox last year, and still had problems at the back end of their bullpen. Now think back to the year before when Clement, Wells, Snyder, Johnson, DiNardo combined for 40 bad starts. Giving those starts to Santana is a much bigger increase than giving 400 at bats from Crisp to Ellsbury
If Boston picks up Santana it automatically improves their bullpen
Lowrey, Lester and Masterson is a lot of talent, too, so I wouldn't consider Ellsbury and Bucholtz of limits either. The biggest downside I see is that I wonder if this is the sort of move that has destroyed the Yankees? Anyone remember Nick Johnson for Javier Vazquez? Having Kason Gabbard back would be nice
Perhaps if a backup catcher could be included. Adding Santana automatically improves the bullpen, middle relief especially
<< <i>so if the Sox trade Ellsbury, what are the chances they go ahead and trade Crisp elsewhere (for a quality catcher or middle relief) and pursue Rowand for CF? Why don't the Sox package Tavarez too, that's cool with me. >>
I would give Tavarez away for a bag of chips and a golf ball. That still might me asking too much....
if I understand this right, the Twins want Kennedy, Hughes, AND Cabrera from NYY. Really? The Twins are hitting the pipe a bit too hard if they think NYY will give away what could be the pitching core (and strength up the middle in Cabrera) of a solid playoff-caliber team for many years.
UPDATE, 12-4-07 at 1:46pm: According to Sean McAdam, the Twins will also meet with the Angels this afternoon to discuss Santana. The Twins would want Jered Weaver and Brandon Wood for starters. McAdam says the Red Sox and Twins haven't spoken since this morning. Meanwhile Joe Christensen says there's lobby buzz about the Red Sox/Twins deal becoming a 5-for-1. Peter Abraham chimes in, saying the Yankees have made their final offer and the Twins would have to approach them now.
UPDATE, 12-4-07 at 1:15pm: ESPN Peter Gammons says the Twins are trying to decide between a 3-for-1 (Ellsbury/Lowrie/Masterson) or a 4-for-1 (Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson). No contract negotiations with the Red Sox and Santana's agent have taken place yet.
UPDATE, 12-4-07 at 1:46pm: According to Sean McAdam, the Twins will also meet with the Angels this afternoon to discuss Santana. The Twins would want Jered Weaver and Brandon Wood for starters. McAdam says the Red Sox and Twins haven't spoken since this morning. Meanwhile Joe Christensen says there's lobby buzz about the Red Sox/Twins deal becoming a 5-for-1. Peter Abraham chimes in, saying the Yankees have made their final offer and the Twins would have to approach them now.
UPDATE, 12-4-07 at 1:15pm: ESPN Peter Gammons says the Twins are trying to decide between a 3-for-1 (Ellsbury/Lowrie/Masterson) or a 4-for-1 (Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson). No contract negotiations with the Red Sox and Santana's agent have taken place yet.
<< <i>At this point I'd still rather have Santana for 32 more starts than any of the stuff the Sox and Yanks have offered. >>
I am sure you would. I think Minn should offer him $20 mil per year to stay put, and give the fans a reason to fork over the expected ticket price increases at the new stadium.
<< <i>"If the Red Sox get Santana," said an executive of one NL team that's grateful to be in the other league, "they might be the best team in the history of the frigging universe." >>
Comments
If Boston picks up Santana it automatically improves their bullpen
Lowrey, Lester and Masterson is a lot of talent, too, so I wouldn't consider Ellsbury and Bucholtz of limits either. The biggest downside I see is that I wonder if this is the sort of move that has destroyed the Yankees? Anyone remember Nick Johnson for Javier Vazquez? Having Kason Gabbard back would be nice
Perhaps if a backup catcher could be included. Adding Santana automatically improves the bullpen, middle relief especially
<< <i>so if the Sox trade Ellsbury, what are the chances they go ahead and trade Crisp elsewhere (for a quality catcher or middle relief) and pursue Rowand for CF? Why don't the Sox package Tavarez too, that's cool with me. >>
I would give Tavarez away for a bag of chips and a golf ball. That still might me asking too much....
UPDATE, 12-4-07 at 1:46pm: According to Sean McAdam, the Twins will also meet with the Angels this afternoon to discuss Santana. The Twins would want Jered Weaver and Brandon Wood for starters. McAdam says the Red Sox and Twins haven't spoken since this morning. Meanwhile Joe Christensen says there's lobby buzz about the Red Sox/Twins deal becoming a 5-for-1. Peter Abraham chimes in, saying the Yankees have made their final offer and the Twins would have to approach them now.
UPDATE, 12-4-07 at 1:15pm: ESPN Peter Gammons says the Twins are trying to decide between a 3-for-1 (Ellsbury/Lowrie/Masterson) or a 4-for-1 (Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson). No contract negotiations with the Red Sox and Santana's agent have taken place yet.
UPDATE, 12-4-07 at 1:46pm: According to Sean McAdam, the Twins will also meet with the Angels this afternoon to discuss Santana. The Twins would want Jered Weaver and Brandon Wood for starters. McAdam says the Red Sox and Twins haven't spoken since this morning. Meanwhile Joe Christensen says there's lobby buzz about the Red Sox/Twins deal becoming a 5-for-1. Peter Abraham chimes in, saying the Yankees have made their final offer and the Twins would have to approach them now.
UPDATE, 12-4-07 at 1:15pm: ESPN Peter Gammons says the Twins are trying to decide between a 3-for-1 (Ellsbury/Lowrie/Masterson) or a 4-for-1 (Lester/Crisp/Lowrie/Masterson). No contract negotiations with the Red Sox and Santana's agent have taken place yet.
<< <i>Hey, don't the Angels know you can only have one Santana on your team!! >>
<< <i>At this point I'd still rather have Santana for 32 more starts than any of the stuff the Sox and Yanks have offered. >>
I am sure you would. I think Minn should offer him $20 mil per year to stay put, and give the fans a reason to fork over the expected ticket price increases at the new stadium.
<< <i>"If the Red Sox get Santana," said an executive of one NL team that's grateful to be in the other league, "they might be the best team in the history of the frigging universe." >>