Kenny Lofton: Hall of Famer?
SeatedCoin
Posts: 1,040
in Sports Talk
He has 2428 hits. If somehow Lofton hangs around and gets 3000 career hits does he have a shot at election to the Hall of Fame?
"The answer was in the Patriots eyes. Gone were the swagger and c0ck sure smirks, replaced by downcast eyes and heads in hands. For his poise and leadership Eli Manning was named the game's MVP. The 2007 Giants were never perfect nor meant to be. They were fighters, scrappers....now they could be called something else, World Champions."
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Peace
45% complete.
Kenny is in MY hall of fame though, which is all that matters!
Go Tribe!!!!
"The answer was in the Patriots eyes. Gone were the swagger and c0ck sure smirks, replaced by downcast eyes and heads in hands. For his poise and leadership Eli Manning was named the game's MVP. The 2007 Giants were never perfect nor meant to be. They were fighters, scrappers....now they could be called something else, World Champions."
"The answer was in the Patriots eyes. Gone were the swagger and c0ck sure smirks, replaced by downcast eyes and heads in hands. For his poise and leadership Eli Manning was named the game's MVP. The 2007 Giants were never perfect nor meant to be. They were fighters, scrappers....now they could be called something else, World Champions."
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Let's water down the hall of fame even more and put in guys who never led their league in any important stat...then he can go in.
If his career has not yet been at a Hall-of-Fame level, he needs to have more seasons of high quality to change anything
That is very true, but the reality, too, is that many of the writers vote strictly on stats, with no regard for true worthiness, and 3,000 hits is one of those stats that to this point has meant automatic induction to the Hall.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Ron
Buying Vintage, all sports.
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<< <i>many of the writers vote strictly on stats >>
Of course many vote strictly on stats. But they need to be good stats. Even with another half decade of mediocrity, the only comparison would be Brock. And with his World Series performance and being the all-time stolen base leader he was far ahead on the fame scale no matter what the hit total was
I think you missed my point. I was agreeing with you that Lofton is not now, and will not be, a HOF worthy player. However, to this point, reaching 3,000 hits has meant an automatic induction to the Hall (the only player with more than 3,000 hits who's not in the HOF is Pete Rose), so many writers/voters would say that 3,000 is about as "good" a stat as there is. That's just the reality of the situation.
Edit: As I also stated above, I don't think Lofton will reach 3,000 hits anyway, so this will be a moot point in that regard.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>he started out with the Tribe. >>
Actually, he started out with the Astros, who traded him for Ed Taubensee and Willy Blair.
but, if he gets in even with close to 3000, or even a few over 3000, and gets into the HOF.......
..........then in my opinion, there are a WHOLE bunch of others that should be in....and lets start with these two guys
Tony Oliva
Vada Pinson
OK, now, start cursing my name!
Tony
But heres the thing, he just had a season avg. of .296, 145 hits, 25 doubles, 6 triples and 23 stolen bases.
40 or not hes well above the avg outfielder. Those are VERY respectible numbers for anyone.
Lets just say he does about the same thing for the next 2 years, and why not. Hes not slowing down the way the average 40 year old player does. Batting .300 is tough enough. Hes still doing it all at this point.
If in 2 more years he is at or above .300 lifetime, 2750 hits, 425+ doubles, 120+ triples, 675+ on stolen bases, those a pretty awesome numbers! With or without 3000 hits I think. 4 Gold Gloves in there too!
Hes pretty close to Tim Raines ballpark. Not 800 stolen bases, but in the ballpark.
I just dont beleive that 3000 hits has to be reached to be a measure of Hall greatness.
Bottom line is he has had a great career, and has a shot to make it. Depends on the next 2 years or so.
2 more years like the last one, 1 more year around .280 avg, 125 hits, 20 doubles, 20 stolen bases. a few triples and hes knockin on that door of 3000 after all, pushin 700 stolen bases, 450 doubles, 130 triples, and a lifetime .290+ avg! Not to bad at all, not many can say they played over 2 decades with those numbers. Probable... maybe, possible....yes. Bet my life on it..... No. But who knows!
Lofton is nowhere near the player Raines was. Raines was arguably the second best player of the 1980s (behind Henderson). Lofton has never dominated or even been in the top 5 players in any given season. He has certainly compiled some pretty impressive numbers over the years, but a HOF he is not, IMO.
Lodton's OPS of .795 is just slightly higher than the league avg. of .771 while Raines' OPS of .810 is 80 pts higher than the league OPS of .730. Big difference there.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Power hitters won titles with 40 Homeruns. The magic numbers were .300. 30+ homers, 100 R.B.I.'s. That was triple crown stuff for the 80's.
Pujols had this and it's considered a slump by many who think hes always going to hit .335, 45, 140, for the next 10 years in a row.
Im just saying he was doing it and doing it well when many, many other were not.
Now with Suzuki, Reyes ect.... Its back again.
That is true, which makes the stats that Raines put up even more impressive, as it was a much tougher era in which to hit (just look at the Lg OPS+ and you'll see what I mean). Raines was arguably the second best player of the 1980s, can you honestly say that Kenny Lofton is even one of the top 10 players of the 1990s?
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Funny thing is I grew up in the 80's, high school ect...
I always hear and see the lack of attention given to guys like Raines, Baines, Clark, ect....
They ruled the decade, each in their own way.
By todays standards, they dont even get enough votes to stay on the ballot sometimes. Will Clark was below 5%. Hes gone. A lifetime .300 hitter, and considered Mr. Clutch back then.
I do think Baines came in just over 5% in voting, Im not saying put him in the Hall, but he was a "professional hitter". And one hell of a D.H. I think. To bad he didnt have another season and a half in him.
They ruled the decade, each in their own way.
I agree with you there completely. Many of the greater hitters from that era get shortchanged, IMO, because of the power-addled numbers that we've seen over the last 10-12 years or so. I do think Raines will get in to the HOF, at least I hope the voters will have half a brain and vote him in, but there are several players who have no business getting in that have and several more that should that haven't, so who knows.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Thanks for the feedback, many times evry conversation about baseball revolves around A-Rod, Jeter, Pujols, ect... or whose doing what off the field. No what I mean?
It gets old sometimes. Great players no doubt, but old none the less.
80's seems to be a forgotten decade sometimes, I miss Boggs! That was a ball player. 82-89 avg over .350!! Crazy! Thats ruling a decade! Gwynn, Ripken, Mattingly, Sandberg, Henderson, Raines, Strawman, Mcgriff, Dale Murphy, Molitor, what a crew!
Those days were great for me!
Like I say " Man I miss the 80's"
Lofton was always an excellent player, but somehow did not seem to live up to his full potential. Now that he is in the limelight again, its surprising how quietly he has amassed so many hits. He is in great physical shape and that matters more than chronological age. He does have an outside shot at 3000 hits, but odds are against him. I think it is still fun to see if he can make it because ultimately, we really don't know what happens in the end. If he gets 3000 hits, then he gets a place in the HOF, but that's a big IF.
I really didn't know he was still playing so well. Good for him!
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Ken Lofton over 2100 games is 107
Even when their stats appear close, remember that there were fewer runs scored when Raines was player, and when there are fewer runs, each one does more to help a team win
Compare Lofton's first and second half numbers. It could have been mere chance. Or it could have been because he is 40, or becuase he was able to play the first half in a much better hitters park