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prices crashing 20th ase sets
buyitwow
Posts: 83
raw sets down 350. and lower on ebay price cant stay this low http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-American-Silver-Eagle-20th-Anniversary-3-Coin-Set_W0QQitemZ130143416206QQihZ003QQcategoryZ39488QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemText
coins just get better with age !!
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Comments
<< <i>price cant stay this low >>
Why? The lowest mintage in the set 250K. That's a heck of a lot of NCLT.
Maybe $350 is the "right" price.
Moral of the story - Wait until 6 months after the product is released as opposed to buying immediately in the after-market.
Collector of Early 20th Century U.S. Coinage.
ANA Member R-3147111
Of course it is. And everybody is dumping because nobody can afford to hold until fall because the housing and equities market have backed off. It's obvious, isn't it?
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
<< <i>Milk spotting could also be a reason >>
I agree, that and the money crunch right now, people selling off there extra's to raise money, problem is traffic on ebay isn't buying. I've been picking up some key and semi-key's lately pretty cheap.
Fighting the Fight for 11 Years with the big "C" - Never Ever Give Up!
Member PCGS Open Forum board 2002 - 2006 (closed end of 2006) Current board since 2006 Successful trades with many members, over the past two decades, never a bad deal.
They are firming and starting to creep up.
-David
more traffic will start the ball rolling, yet deals are to be found NOW.
250K sets is a heck of a lot of sets
The Raw will, not graded.
It pays to own the casino
<< <i>they will stabilise between 300 and 400
The Raw will, not graded. >>
my pr70 rev proof has dropped at least $300 in the last few weeks
<< <i>they will stabilise between 300 and 400
The Raw will, not graded. >>
I thought NGC graded sets often traded below the price of raw sets, and PCGS 69 sets only a slight premium over raw. I'm not sure why anyone would have confidence in graded sets holding up in price. Both NGC and PCGS 69 sets have already traded below $400, and most likely will follow the raw sets lower.
<< <i>
Sunday July 08, 2007 7:55 PM
rage88:
How far will this set drop? I am considering buying a set, and am still hoping it will drop a little further. I would like to get into one around $350 or so. Any help would be appreciated. >>
thread
Non Collectable Long term?
<< <i>nclt what the #$% does that mean?
Non Collectable Long term? >>
Non Circulating Legal Tender = bullion
You know, like German States 1871 'Victory Thalers' or 1887-1900 British Crowns
Fighting the Fight for 11 Years with the big "C" - Never Ever Give Up!
Member PCGS Open Forum board 2002 - 2006 (closed end of 2006) Current board since 2006 Successful trades with many members, over the past two decades, never a bad deal.
Yawn.....what ever....
Well stated, I'm holding mine. Where will they be in 10 years?
<< <i><<the lemmings are backing away from the cliffs, and realizing that these are nothing more than pretty bullion NCLT>>
Well stated, I'm holding mine. Where will they be in 10 years? >>
Since this modern stuff has no real numismatic value I predict in ten years it will be worth the price of silver bullion, whatever that may be. With some dealers right now giving away ms 68 ASE coins as gifts to reward purchasers the high grades will be meaningless.
The mint is grinding out these products because of the current fad like atmosphere of this section of the market. Try looking at the market for Beanie Babies and think of the people who spent huge sums on them hoping to get rich. They are now worth the price of a handful of beans.
The mint has the technology to produce more and more perfect ms 70 coins and this technology should improve even further in years to come. The mint responded to public demand for beautiful, shiny bullion discs and has become the largest competition to the dealers selling true numismatic products.
The TPGS responded to public demand for grades on this medallic art and as always does quite well financially.
The end user; the collector/ investor will have to be patient and hold onto his treasured accumulation of bullion art until the price of silver rises to exceed his investment. Meanwhile They ARE pretty and they ARE silver which is somewhat more valuable than beans. Dave W
David J Weygant Rare Coins website: www.djwcoin.com
As much as some people like to criticize NCLT, there is a lot of CLT that has much lower or no collector premium, including many 19th century coins.
As for numismatic value, 19th century proof coins don't really have any more numismatic value than proof ASEs but have high collector premium. This is probably more due to mintage than numismatic value, or lack thereof.
<< <i>Since this modern stuff has no real numismatic value I predict in ten years it will be worth the price of silver bullion, whatever that may be. >>
Oh brother!!!!
<< <i>It's all about supply and demand. 250k is a lot. I think that has more to do with it relative to the number of collectors than the fact that it's NCLT.
As much as some people like to criticize NCLT, there is a lot of CLT that has much lower or no collector premium, including many 19th century coins.
As for numismatic value, 19th century proof coins don't really have any more numismatic value than proof ASEs but have high collector premium. This is probably more due to mintage than numismatic value, or lack thereof. >>
Indeed, any collecting is about supply and demand or the perception (the key in a lot of this) of supply and/or demand. 250K is a lot, especially with nearly zero attrition. A lot of people watch and vote American Idol and support its advertisers. While I may find it a huge waste of time and idiotic, that herd can do as it likes with its time and money. Same is true for NCLT collectors. I just can't imagine the gravytrain continuing upward for long. There is no basis for sustained growth to fuel it. If milk spotting becomes so rampant that only a minor fraction of some NCLT issue are unaffected, then we have a mechanism for attrition. That benefits a few and murders the assets of many. OTOH, the bullion content may itself have a very rosy future. Where is the collectibility of classic Franklin Mint material? NCLT may be heading right down the same path in time.
NSDR - Life Member
SSDC - Life Member
ANA - Pay As I Go Member
I could always walk the 20 miles to work.
roadrunner
<< <i>
<< <i>nclt what the #$% does that mean?
Non Collectable Long term? >>
Non Circulating Legal Tender = bullion >>
US mint products have sunk to the level of the Marshall Islands. It is a sad day.....
Why would unopened sets be priced high when about milk spots are a known problem?
<< <i>The real future for these sets will be the graded sets that have All three coins labeled with the anniversary labels.
<< <i>Non Circulating Legal Tender? >>
NCLT's also include Morgan dollars, Saints, classic commems, etc. For the most part, none of these coins really circulated as money yet they were legal tender. Contrary to popular opinion, not all NCLT sell for bullion related prices.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
<< <i>
<< <i>Non Circulating Legal Tender? >>
NCLT's also include Morgan dollars, Saints, classic commems, etc. For the most part, none of these coins really circulated as money yet they were legal tender. Contrary to popular opinion, not all NCLT sell for bullion related prices. >>
While it's true that classic commems were not issued for circulation, where in the world did you get the idea that Morgan dollars never circulated. Where did all the hundreds of thousands of circulated Morgans that are offered for sale every day in grades ranging from ag to au come from? In the west they were preferred over paper dollars for obvious reasons and they saw heavy circulation. If Saints never circulated there would be none for sale in circulated condition. Dave W
David J Weygant Rare Coins website: www.djwcoin.com
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<< <i>
<< <i>Non Circulating Legal Tender? >>
NCLT's also include Morgan dollars, Saints, classic commems, etc. For the most part, none of these coins really circulated as money yet they were legal tender. Contrary to popular opinion, not all NCLT sell for bullion related prices. >>
While it's true that classic commems were not issued for circulation, where in the world did you get the idea that Morgan dollars never circulated. Where did all the hundreds of thousands of circulated Morgans that are offered for sale every day in grades ranging from ag to au come from? In the west they were preferred over paper dollars for obvious reasons and they saw heavy circulation. If Saints never circulated there would be none for sale in circulated condition. Dave W >>
I think it's that many Morgans didn't circulate and many Morgans were never intended to circulate due the motivations of the people that passed the acts that authorized the coins. Morgans are the product of Congressional graft (Congressional pork by today's standards) coins. Not much different from Sacs today which are partially motivated by political correctness than big business and profits.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Non Circulating Legal Tender? >>
NCLT's also include Morgan dollars, Saints, classic commems, etc. For the most part, none of these coins really circulated as money yet they were legal tender. Contrary to popular opinion, not all NCLT sell for bullion related prices. >>
While it's true that classic commems were not issued for circulation, where in the world did you get the idea that Morgan dollars never circulated. Where did all the hundreds of thousands of circulated Morgans that are offered for sale every day in grades ranging from ag to au come from? In the west they were preferred over paper dollars for obvious reasons and they saw heavy circulation. If Saints never circulated there would be none for sale in circulated condition. Dave W >>
I think it's that many Morgans didn't circulate and many Morgans were never intended to circulate due the motivations of the people that passed the acts that authorized the coins. Morgans are the product of Congressional graft (Congressional pork by today's standards) coins. Not much different from Sacs today which are also partially motivated by politics. >>
The vast majority of Morgan dollars never circulated. Some circulated out west and some were used in casinos but the vast majority sat in banks and treasury vaults. Where do you think that GSA got those thousands of bags of uncirculated silver dollars that they sold to collectors in the 1960's?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
I wish I had prezzie dollars to sell but never did like them and don't know too many who do. I mean does anybody really care if these Chuck E. Cheese wannabees ever grade out at "70"?
Maybe the flipper trippers are getting upset that it looks to possibly not be as easy pickings with people getting a little bit nervous about the economy. Well, cheers to reason in the market.
Well, just Love coins, period.
I guess that now Sacagawea dollars, Kennedy halves, and soon, Presidential dollars can be considered NCLT?
Best Regards,
John
1947-P & D; 1948-D; 1949-P & S; 1950-D & S; and 1952-S.
Any help locating any of these OBW rolls would be gratefully appreciated!
<< <i>
<< <i>Non Circulating Legal Tender? >>
I guess that now Sacagawea dollars, Kennedy halves, and soon, Presidential dollars can be considered NCLT? >>
Just look at how many they are making and how many are circulating, being sold to collectors or sitting in vaults. Then make a decision on whether they were intended to circulate and apply your definition of NCLT. If a lot more coins are being made than circulated, you can choose between intentional non-circulation or forecasting incompetence. You'll have to decide how likely each is
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Non Circulating Legal Tender? >>
NCLT's also include Morgan dollars, Saints, classic commems, etc. For the most part, none of these coins really circulated as money yet they were legal tender. Contrary to popular opinion, not all NCLT sell for bullion related prices. >>
While it's true that classic commems were not issued for circulation, where in the world did you get the idea that Morgan dollars never circulated. Where did all the hundreds of thousands of circulated Morgans that are offered for sale every day in grades ranging from ag to au come from? In the west they were preferred over paper dollars for obvious reasons and they saw heavy circulation. If Saints never circulated there would be none for sale in circulated condition. Dave W >>
I think it's that many Morgans didn't circulate and many Morgans were never intended to circulate due the motivations of the people that passed the acts that authorized the coins. Morgans are the product of Congressional graft (Congressional pork by today's standards) coins. Not much different from Sacs today which are also partially motivated by politics. >>
The vast majority of Morgan dollars never circulated. Some circulated out west and some were used in casinos but the vast majority sat in banks and treasury vaults. Where do you think that GSA got those thousands of bags of uncirculated silver dollars that they sold to collectors in the 1960's? >>
The GSA coins were mostly Carson City issues that languished nearly forgotten in the vaults for many years. At the same time the vaults were full of circulated Morgans in order to honor the proviso on all bills at that time to be"payable to the bearer on demand" an equivalant amount of silver.
When I served in the National Guard( 1948 - 1955) we were often paid in silver dollars both Morgan and Peace to impress the local community with the presence and buying power of our local Guardsmen. Of course I spent them like everyone else. These circulated dollars were always available for $1 at any bank. Dave W
David J Weygant Rare Coins website: www.djwcoin.com
Collector of Early 20th Century U.S. Coinage.
ANA Member R-3147111
<< <i>When I served in the National Guard( 1948 - 1955) we were often paid in silver dollars both Morgan and Peace to impress the local community with the presence and buying power of our local Guardsmen. Of course I spent them like everyone else. These circulated dollars were always available for $1 at any bank. Dave W >>
This is similar to how you can get change in Sackies at the USPS and people spend them. Sackies and Prexy bux are also available at many banks.
For Morgans, Sackies and Prexy bux, some will see circulation but the reason for producing so many is not to satisfy circulation needs but for business profit, government profit and political correctness.
<< <i>Modern material falling in price? Can't happen as the demand is just too huge. It's all about demographics. A whopping 300 million buyers in the US to absorb these small mintages. I know if my mortgage or lifestyle were threatened due to the credit crunch, my ASE's and Prez dollars would be the last to go. My car would go first!
I could always walk the 20 miles to work.
roadrunner >>
I still say that the three months it took for this 250k mintage to sell out -- for a mere $100 for three eagles, and at up to ten sets in each order -- says that there are far less than 250k interested collectors out there. My interest is casual, as I'm uninterested in collecting ASEs as a series but I love having a single set as a type. The $400 I paid a few months back for a personally inspected raw set was IMO just reasonable, and only a $100 or so price would qualify as a bargain.
I think that the collector interest that (we) flippers rely on is headed south as people get jaded with instant sellouts, initial 100% markups enjoyed by speculators followed by dramatic price drops belying the hype about rarity and investment potential. Unattractive issues like the Prezzies and their one-and-onlys are going to hurt enthusiasm for appealing pieces like the reverse proof and the platinum commems. While the secondary market will make sure-fire profits again eventually, the present day in the sun won't last forever.
<< <i>Non Circulating Legal Tender?
You know, like German States 1871 'Victory Thalers' or 1887-1900 British Crowns >>
if you knew much about world coinage, you'd know that they circulated widely and weren't intended for use as a bullion reserve. whens the last time you spent one of your ASE "coins" in public, smart alec?
<< <i>I would say without question that Presidential Dollars are NCLT. Probably less than 1% actually circulate and my guess would be that these coins will eventually (soon) have mintages relative to the collector population.
I think the key is this: true NCLTs are not intended for circulation, whereas the Kennedy halves, pres. dollars, etc.....ARE intended (although their mintages are too large to guarantee that more than 25% ever will). when was the last time anyone saw an ASE in circulation??! who is moronic enough to spend a coin worth approx. 12 dollars for it's 1 dollar face value? The same goes for Spouse Gold, AGE and the platinum things.
BTW, a lot of Sac dollars are now in active circulation in Ecuador and other South American countries. The Treasure shipped them down there in huge bags as part of the US relief effort to those countries.
<< <i>The real future for these sets will be the graded sets that have All three coins labeled with the anniversary labels.
whatever future that is.
the sealed brown boxes will be big question marks with regards to any spotting.
250k is a lot of sets, but how many are intact? sealed or graded?
all except for my a few to keep will be gone for me by the end of the year.