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tradedollarnut
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Post by Oreville in the Box of 20 thread:
I have discussed with Jay Parrino his concept of box of twenty for hours and HOURS on end.
First of all, he never advocated that coin collectors collected only 20 coins and no more.
What he DID ADVOCATE was to try to limit your "serious" coins to just twenty or just forty if at all possible.
Why?
Four fold:
ONE:
QUANTITY MEANS RUNNING OUT OF MONEY TOO FAST
After having twenty SLABBED (or forty serious SLABBED coins) that is going to start to drain a lot of money from your budget. One should try to "limit" him or herself.
Now "serious" coins is relative to each collector or investor and can be as little as $20-100 valued coins for students, etc. They do NOT necessary mean the mega valued or even the $1000 valued coins we hear or talk about.
Every collector has some coins that are relatively more expensive (or what we call "serious") than the others. The serious coins should have a quantitative limit the "other coins" which are the fun coins do not have such limit. They are FUN coins!
TWO:
QUANTITY MEANS FORGETTING
The serious coins should be something the collector should remember instantaneously in his head. Once you start getting beyond 40 or 60 serious, you risk decreased enjoyment of such coins since they are locked away in a vault or a safe anyway and the sheer quantity means less time you can spend with each coin studying it, admiring it, attributing it, cataloguing it, learning its history, etc, .etc.
THREE
QUANTITY MEANS MISSING OUT ON THE COIN(S) YOU REALLY WANT
There is nothing more troubling to a collector than missing out on a coin he really wanted because he overextended himself on easily replaceable coins. It happens to all of us. The box of twenty is just a concept to remind us that we need to "control" and behave ourselves! Just don't buy everything that comes along.
FOUR
QUANTITY MEANS POSSIBLE LACK OF PATIENCE
If you want the right coin for your collection (could mean high end for the grade of a $50 valued coin) you need to be patient and wait for it to come along. You cannot always hurry things along or you will overpay or end up with low end coins for the grade or coins that don't match well in your set.
One last coimment:
Jay Parrino once displayed the Eliasberg 1913 Liberty nickel in his showcase back in 1999, long before Legend and TDN acquired this same nickel. What coins had the honor of sharing the limelight with that nickel? About 20 dateless buffalo nickels of which at least a half a dozen were 1913 buffalo nickels. Why? To show that one could be serious about coins and also have fun collecting inexpensive coins. When the kids looked at the display of the "exalted" 1913 nickel with the buffalo nickel, they wanted to see the buffalo nickels first and!
I have discussed with Jay Parrino his concept of box of twenty for hours and HOURS on end.
First of all, he never advocated that coin collectors collected only 20 coins and no more.
What he DID ADVOCATE was to try to limit your "serious" coins to just twenty or just forty if at all possible.
Why?
Four fold:
ONE:
QUANTITY MEANS RUNNING OUT OF MONEY TOO FAST
After having twenty SLABBED (or forty serious SLABBED coins) that is going to start to drain a lot of money from your budget. One should try to "limit" him or herself.
Now "serious" coins is relative to each collector or investor and can be as little as $20-100 valued coins for students, etc. They do NOT necessary mean the mega valued or even the $1000 valued coins we hear or talk about.
Every collector has some coins that are relatively more expensive (or what we call "serious") than the others. The serious coins should have a quantitative limit the "other coins" which are the fun coins do not have such limit. They are FUN coins!
TWO:
QUANTITY MEANS FORGETTING
The serious coins should be something the collector should remember instantaneously in his head. Once you start getting beyond 40 or 60 serious, you risk decreased enjoyment of such coins since they are locked away in a vault or a safe anyway and the sheer quantity means less time you can spend with each coin studying it, admiring it, attributing it, cataloguing it, learning its history, etc, .etc.
THREE
QUANTITY MEANS MISSING OUT ON THE COIN(S) YOU REALLY WANT
There is nothing more troubling to a collector than missing out on a coin he really wanted because he overextended himself on easily replaceable coins. It happens to all of us. The box of twenty is just a concept to remind us that we need to "control" and behave ourselves! Just don't buy everything that comes along.
FOUR
QUANTITY MEANS POSSIBLE LACK OF PATIENCE
If you want the right coin for your collection (could mean high end for the grade of a $50 valued coin) you need to be patient and wait for it to come along. You cannot always hurry things along or you will overpay or end up with low end coins for the grade or coins that don't match well in your set.
One last coimment:
Jay Parrino once displayed the Eliasberg 1913 Liberty nickel in his showcase back in 1999, long before Legend and TDN acquired this same nickel. What coins had the honor of sharing the limelight with that nickel? About 20 dateless buffalo nickels of which at least a half a dozen were 1913 buffalo nickels. Why? To show that one could be serious about coins and also have fun collecting inexpensive coins. When the kids looked at the display of the "exalted" 1913 nickel with the buffalo nickel, they wanted to see the buffalo nickels first and!
0
Comments
As mentioned in other threads, this concept does not mean buy only 20 coins and quit collecting. In fact, true collectors simply need a fix now and then. It's fun to pick up inexpensive coins that are just fun to own. In fact, you may even run across an inexpensive coin that is "special" and deserves to be in your box of 20....meaning you don't want to trade or sell it.
But limiting your core collection to 20 or even 40 coins helps you to weed out coins that are not that meaningful to you and sort of "forces" you to make a hard decision about which coins are worth keeping and which ones you're willing to part with.
Newcomers need to learn. They need to see comparisons, in their hands. They need to get an idea of what floats their boats.
That is for COLLECTORS. Now, if someone is an INVESTOR, then fine. Limit it, get the best of the best and hope for the best.
For experienced collectors, fine, go for it. Get the keydates in the highest grades, of the series that interest you...why bother with the "common" coins...though, if you stick to that philosophy, you will not collect them, ever, so why worry about them?
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>I completely agree with this approach to collecting as a way to focus your efforts and make each coin in your core collection "special". I have done just that with my collection, so that it currently contains only 15 coins. But each one tells its own story.
As mentioned in other threads, this concept does not mean buy only 20 coins and quit collecting. In fact, true collectors simply need a fix now and then. It's fun to pick up inexpensive coins that are just fun to own. In fact, you may even run across an inexpensive coin that is "special" and deserves to be in your box of 20....meaning you don't want to trade or sell it.
But limiting your core collection to 20 or even 40 coins helps you to weed out coins that are not that meaningful to you and sort of "forces" you to make a hard decision about which coins are worth keeping and which ones you're willing to part with. >>
MidLifeCrisis,
How do you reconcile that philosophy with the large number of coins required for your Registry Set?
Do you just use the set to kind of Park a limited number of pieces?
Just askin'.
TDN...brother, I seriously hope you're an old man, because thats too much wisdom for a young man to have.
As I posted in another thread, I had accumulated a pile of coins just from surfing the net. One day I sat down and looked at them and they made absolutely no sense to me. It wasn't fun anymore, so I sold off everything except what I truly love which is MPLs and proof 20th century IHCs. Now, I am more focused and I am enjoying it immensely! When I am through, I will have a collection of 19 coins. Coin collecting has become fun again.
<< <i>MidLifeCrisis,
How do you reconcile that philosophy with the large number of coins required for your Registry Set?
Do you just use the set to kind of Park a limited number of pieces?
Just askin'. >>
Swampboy
That's an excellent question. Seems contradictory doesn't it?
I once popped every coin out of their folders many years ago and piled them all together in a huge heap on my bed just to enjoy looking at a big pile of collectable coins (I left the coins in 2X2s and mint holders intact). When I was done, it looked like one of those adds of "huge hoards found in some old general store" complete with a water pump in front. A huge pile of thousands of better date (s-mint and pre-1935) wheat cents, common silver, merc dimes, barber dimes, barber quarters, barber halfs, seated dimes, quarters, halfs, large cents, liberty nickels, half cents, bust halfs, bust dimes, Morgans, Peace dollars, Proof sets....everything! It looked so juicy and appealing on some sort of primal coin collector level! I felt so fricking wealthy even though the entire collection wasn't worth more than $5000.
I still have all those coins. I will probably start getting rid of them in order to "travel light" and focus on the sets I'm interested in. But it sure was fun amassing all of the odds and ends that I have!
Geez TDN you have more than twenty.....
Ken
Later, Paul.
Later, Paul.
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
Either way, coins are fun and it won't matter if it takes years to fill the box of "20".... when it's done, they'll be worth having as a little nest egg, aside from the "SERIOUS COLLECTION"
<< <i>People really should stop denegrating the concept as an investment vehicle only. I can easily make a beautiful coin collection consisting of only 20 fantastic and pride inspiring coins. >>
I agree completely. Do you have to own several hundred pieces of art to have a nice art collection, and otherwise, you are just an investor in art?
<< <i>The box of twenty was dumb when I first heard the term here and it still is a dumb concept. >>
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
I would repent, but not now. jws
Just wouldn't work with the way I collect.....
Hell, I don't need to exercise.....I get enough just pushing my luck.
<< <i>Look beyond the artificial limit of 20 coins and focus on the broader lessons contained in the post! >>
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
How often are "box of 20" collections made up of the same series?
Freddie Scholl(?) was the dealer in Syracuse we bought them from.
Dad still has that coin. I don't have mine
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
I do not know if any "box of 20" collections even exist. I could easily make an argument for a 20-coin Dahlonega set that would be challenging and interesting. I could pick my favorite 20 classic commems and buy the nicest examples I could find and have a nice collection. Same with seated, Barbers, Morgans, or just about anything else. Alas, it's just a "dumb" idea, so I will go back to flipping mint products and buying anything that catches my eye. That's what is "smart".
<< <i>Look beyond the artificial limit of 20 coins and focus on the broader lessons contained in the post! >>
I can't. People here keep saying it's dumb.
<< <i>People really should stop denegrating the concept as an investment vehicle only. I can easily make a beautiful coin collection consisting of only 20 fantastic and pride inspiring coins. >>
I agree with TDN - and I still don't understand the CON view.
The number of coins you own has utterly nothing to do with whether it is a collection or an investment vehicle IMHO*.
* It's 6:29 Am in Long Beach and I've been up for 2 hours.
I intend to sell my early half dollar variety collection in 10-20 years (keep a year set) and use the money for non-numismatic purposes. This would leave me with a "box of 31" and 5 complete series - year sets of flowing hair halves, 1801-1807 draped bust halves, 1807-1812 $5 gold, and year and MM sets for $2.5 and $5 classic head gold. Add to that some "fun coins" of favorite dupes and a few types that I will keep.
I read the other thread that started this and there is a lot to be said of the "box of 20" concept.
TDN, why don't you put "Laura" in the thread title. (might I suggest: "what would Laura do"
.
Even as a collector, the box of 20 is intriquing, but I cannot help being excited about the "investment" idea.
Not so much the "return on investment" as the "holdings".
<< <i>
<< <i>The box of twenty was dumb when I first heard the term here and it still is a dumb concept. >>
Why ?
Here is my view from a modern collector's standpoint.
I am a simple minded guy and a novice modern collector. I like Sacagawea Dollars in MS 67.
So I decide to build a set . Now along the way, I come across a Cheerios Sacagawea in MS 68. I don't care if it is in a registry set.... it is better in that "box of 20" alongside a 1929 Half Eagle in , let's say "MS65", for instance. Okay, now assume for a minute that I was the guy who ended up with a Bi-metallic Commemorative in MS 70. I am not a commemorative collector, but that is one coin, even outside of MS70 Plastic that would be a good coin for me in a blue box of "20''
As a collector, some coins would be well suited to "THAT" blue box. I think the concept has validity from my perspective. I don't think it's "DUMB" at all.
Opinion
I was the one who originally came up with this post that TDN kindly re-posted and I must say the following:
While I truly believe in Jay's concept, I must confess that I probably own over 50,000 coins; mostly raw. However, I have tried to keep my most "serious" coins to just 20-40-60 groups.
It is not an absolute concept but just a reminder that we too often fall into the trap of:
"Coins, coins everywhere but no money to spend!"
And while I don't believe in the concept, I must confess that I own only 40 coins or so. Go figure.
<< <i>-- "While I truly believe in Jay's concept, I must confess that I probably own over 50,000 coins" --
And while I don't believe in the concept, I must confess that I own only 40 coins or so. Go figure.
The irony!
I would agree that's a smart approach if your in it to make money but you won't have a set of anything. There coins I buy the best I can afford but it isn't what I collect as a set since most coins run over 20 to 40. I rather buy a nice set one coin at a time over the year than have one coin costing ten thousand dollars or more but I'm just a lowly collector.
"Bongo hurtles along the rain soaked highway of life on underinflated bald retread tires."
~Wayne
<< <i>While I don't think constraining a collection to 20 makes sense if you are collecting a series of WLH, Lincolns, Barbers or Morgans, the idea of concentrating efforts, time, money and attention to a specific area of numismatics does make sense. Being a collector rather than a hoarder is more enjoyable from the educational, historical and numismatic standpoint. >>
Well said. And I think that's the main point of this concept anyway.