Why celebrate only one race barrier being broken?
Skinpinch
Posts: 1,531
I am amazed how certain races are hand picked to be celebrated because of past wrong doings done to them, while other races are completely ignored. Today Jackie Robinson is being celebrated for breaking the color barrier. I don't have a problem with that, he should be.
I do have a problem that other races are completely ignored...and not just in baseball mind you. Why are the Jewish people treated so delicate and given kid glove treatment, while nobody even knows that the Chinese people endured far worse during that same time period by the Japanese? Nazi's and their symbols have become taboo in many areas while the rising sun flag of Japan gets no scorn? I know why, and the reasons aren't fair, but I digress.
In the case of baseball and the North American continent Jackie Robinson is hailed by everybody, but why isn't Louis Sockalexis? Socka who? Yeah, that is what 99.99% of Americans will say. Well, he happens to be the first NATIVE AMERICAN to play Major League baseball. U.S. citizen ignorance will say "so," because all they know about Native Americans is what incorrect first grade textbooks and teachers taught them. They know about the first thanksgiving, and thats it(though mistakes are usually taught). The story ends there in 'our' minds. Very sad.
African American's are given special treatment, and they endured a lot of pain to get extra treatment, but their pain and injustice looks much smaller when compared to a race of people on this same continent....American Indians.
For those who don't know, American Indians were also pressed into slavery, though continued slavery of them didn't last as long as something else happened, they were systematically exterminated. The great Christopher Columbus did both, he landed, pressed them into slavery, and then murdered them. Nobody mentions this when talking about Columbus. The total degree of their extermination is staggering...beyond comprehension! Yet they are never talked about in the same light as other groups, and they still exist(some people probably don't realize this).
Louis Sockalexis, the first Native American Indian MLB player, was born in 1871 while the Indians West of the Mississippi were in a battle for their life and land. Sockalexis was born in Maine and attended College in the early 1890's, which was a few years after the Wounded Knee massacre. He excelled in baseball, football, and track(interesting parallell to Robinson). In 1897, while Geronimo was still living as a prisoner, he broke the race barrier with the Cleveland Spiders.
Sockalexis endured much of the same as Robinson, with taunting crowds for being an Indian. Much like Robinson he excercised restraint and dignity and soon won the favor of the fans. His career was short however, as he was a heavy drinker, and he hurt his leg jumping from the second story of a building. He died in 1913.
Hats off to Jackie Robinson, but it isn't fair to single out one race and not another....whether it is baseball or world affairs.
I do have a problem that other races are completely ignored...and not just in baseball mind you. Why are the Jewish people treated so delicate and given kid glove treatment, while nobody even knows that the Chinese people endured far worse during that same time period by the Japanese? Nazi's and their symbols have become taboo in many areas while the rising sun flag of Japan gets no scorn? I know why, and the reasons aren't fair, but I digress.
In the case of baseball and the North American continent Jackie Robinson is hailed by everybody, but why isn't Louis Sockalexis? Socka who? Yeah, that is what 99.99% of Americans will say. Well, he happens to be the first NATIVE AMERICAN to play Major League baseball. U.S. citizen ignorance will say "so," because all they know about Native Americans is what incorrect first grade textbooks and teachers taught them. They know about the first thanksgiving, and thats it(though mistakes are usually taught). The story ends there in 'our' minds. Very sad.
African American's are given special treatment, and they endured a lot of pain to get extra treatment, but their pain and injustice looks much smaller when compared to a race of people on this same continent....American Indians.
For those who don't know, American Indians were also pressed into slavery, though continued slavery of them didn't last as long as something else happened, they were systematically exterminated. The great Christopher Columbus did both, he landed, pressed them into slavery, and then murdered them. Nobody mentions this when talking about Columbus. The total degree of their extermination is staggering...beyond comprehension! Yet they are never talked about in the same light as other groups, and they still exist(some people probably don't realize this).
Louis Sockalexis, the first Native American Indian MLB player, was born in 1871 while the Indians West of the Mississippi were in a battle for their life and land. Sockalexis was born in Maine and attended College in the early 1890's, which was a few years after the Wounded Knee massacre. He excelled in baseball, football, and track(interesting parallell to Robinson). In 1897, while Geronimo was still living as a prisoner, he broke the race barrier with the Cleveland Spiders.
Sockalexis endured much of the same as Robinson, with taunting crowds for being an Indian. Much like Robinson he excercised restraint and dignity and soon won the favor of the fans. His career was short however, as he was a heavy drinker, and he hurt his leg jumping from the second story of a building. He died in 1913.
Hats off to Jackie Robinson, but it isn't fair to single out one race and not another....whether it is baseball or world affairs.
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Comments
So what - life isn't fair. To recognize the significance of what Jackie Robinson did takes nothing away from anyone else. Is it a shame that we don't recognize the achievements of some other great people? Absolutely! But that still doesn't diminish JR's contribution. And I don't know why you think it should.
<< <i> So what - life isn't fair. ........ But that still doesn't diminish JR's contribution. And I don't know why you think it should. >>
So what - life isn't fair? Poor reason. That reason could be used as a denial for Jackie Robinson in the beginning, and it would fit with your reasoning, and therefor be o.k.
I didn't say Robinson should be diminished. And yes, it isn't just a man being singled out...a race is too. And no, it isn't a representation of all races. It is clearly for one, and that is the pattern I am talking about.
BTW - I am of Native American descent, among others.
The polarization continues.
We have to recognize some player and date to address the issue. Jackie Robinson's achievement has gained that recognition. I feel that it is representative of all struggles before him and has given motivation to all after him.
Celebrate victories over all racism and ethnic discrimination on a day like today instead of asking "why not this race?" or "why not this ethnicity?"
When you have achieved that goal then make an attempt to do it every day.
Edited for spelling.
Portugal employeed MILLIONS more slaves in Brazil than the US ever did. in fact, believe it or not, they STARTED the slave trade. There is no problem with race in Brazil, just curious why it is so prevelant in the US
OK. So it isn't about YOU. And you feel slighted. Tough.
And BTW, it is about the man. Jackie Robinson was chosen at the time not because he was the only black man that was capable of playing major league baseball. He was chosen because of the man that he was. He had to agree to certain restrictions on his behavior. He had to agree to withstand insults, slurs, thrown objects, death threats, etc, and continue to be a gentleman. He was chosen because it was thought he was an individual who was capable of withstanding the onslaught. It had to take a terrible toll on the man. That is what I honor today - the man that was Jackie Robinson.
Now go rain on someone else's parade...
The reason why is because the "Ministry of Truth "--ie--The PC shakers-- believes that to think otherwise makes one guilty of thought crime and therefore evil.
Black history month -GOOD- anyother **** history month -evil. All history should be looked at as it all has value. We can learn from the great things that history teaches (even though pretent history is a bit hard) as well as the lessons that the bad times teach us.
Jackie Robinson was a great player that deserves to be applauded as well as his peers. What happened to the history of the blacks that played before him, ie, fleetwood walker or Armando Marsens and any of the many others that came before Jackie ? To bring this up is evil. Who was the first Italian or Latino or Jew players ? To celebrate any of these histories , brings false charges of raceism to stifle the celebration. To question why, is even worse as now you have become guilty of thought crime.
The "Ministry of Truth " by their actions deems ( the celebration of other histories ) not very important. It must not be celebrated. One of the many lies about celebrating diversity is to be asked to celebrate the differences but not to notice or bring up any of them. Differences are there and need to be discussed. Things that good or great need to be copied or replicated.
Why do we only celebrate one race barrier being broken ? Lets let the supporters of the "Ministry of Truth " line up and tell us why its good for society to think a certain way and not another.Remember to them freedom of thought or expression or celebration is only good when they say it is.
I've heard it said that " Whoo onto them that call evil good and good evil ". All history needs to be celebrated !!!
Someone needs to read Orwell's "Aminal Farm".
Loves me some shiny!
<< <i>The reason why is because the "Ministry of Truth "--ie--The PC shakers-- believes that to think otherwise makes one guilty of thought crime and therefore evil. >>
Ooohh, do you have your tin-foil hat on now?
Why only celebrate only one race barrier being broken?
Have a great day.
Sockalexis played only 3 big league seasons, with skill nowhere near Robinson's. Jackie Robinson was a true star of the game, several times a league leader and was MVP once, Unheralded Louis' OB% was actually below the league average. One might unjustly feel that his short tenure shows American Indians are not equal to others in baseball ability.
It should be simple to see that there are many more black Afro-Americans in the US today , both in baseball and the general population, than there are Chinese or American Indians. The economic powers of our country realize much more attention and revenue would be generated by a celebration of Jackie Robinson than Louis Sockalexis. Is that really fair ? perhaps not, but that is reality.
It would be great if all races were treated equal, or even if all races were completely ignored, so that we would judge people by their ability and character only, unfortunately that is probably a generation or two away.
Again, I honor jackie Robinson the MAN, because he was chosen to be the "sacrificial lamb" that would start a positive trend for all races. I also believe the success of the actions of both Rickey and Robinson is due to their character as MEN. (Without regard to the color of their skin).
<< <i>African American's are given special treatment, and they endured a lot of pain to get extra treatment,
Portugal employeed MILLIONS more slaves in Brazil than the US ever did. in fact, believe it or not, they STARTED the slave trade. There is no problem with race in Brazil, just curious why it is so prevelant in the US >>
There's $ to be made in the race trade in the U.S.
Edward Carl "Eddie" Gaedel (June 8, 1925 - June 18, 1961), born in Chicago, Illinois, was an American dwarf who became famous for participating in a Major League Baseball game.
Just 3 feet 7 inches (109 cm) tall and weighing 65 pounds (29.5 kg), Gaedel gained immortality in the second game of a doubleheader on Sunday, August 19, 1951. He was secretly signed by the St. Louis Browns and put in uniform (complete with number "1/8" on the back)
I agree 100%. I hated the fact that this years super bowl was huge for being the first with african american coaches, etc...
Even whites, for years were indentured slaves in the middle east, impressed into service during wars by the british navy during the revolutionary war and after.
Im still waiting for my apology and restitution
As for me, I judge people on the content of their character and the quality of their actions. It's a shame that Jesse and Al didn't hear that part of MLK's "I have a dream" speech.
Collecting:
1909-11 T206's
1955 Topps AA Football
Nate Colbert (Padres)
Racism and ignorance are still alive and well.
Whether it be the blowhards on the right spewing their religous ideology, or the mouth pieces on the left with their race baiting.
Sharpton, Jackson, Imus, Coulter, O'Reiley... all need a good b@tchslap!
Your questions are ones I've often pondered. I suppose the answer has something to do with the percentage of the population blacks compromise (10-13% I think) and, more significantly, how loud of a voice (power) they possess. Countless ethnicities, cultures, etc. have endured injustice, but they simply represent too small a percentage of the total to be heard. And no, that certainly doesn't make it right. I'm half Dutch-Indonesian, a few of my ancestors endured brutality in the Japanese concentration camps, but most probably don't know such camps existed. Heck, most probably can't locate Indonesia (fourth largest country by population) on a map. Boo hoo? No way, as my culture represents a smidgin of America.
There are media and agenda limitations as who is heard. That's why religious differences are often relegated to Christianity, Islam, and Judaism, but not Zoroastrianism. Minorities lumped into African Americans (black), Latino (brown) and Asians (yellow.) As the population make-up changes, so does the focus. In California, the Latino segment is usually broken out into Mexican, Spanish, Latin American, South American, etc. In Idaho, it's not.
So we honor Robinson for a variety of good reasons, but one is because he is part of a "group" that is not only prominent in our society, but one that has had to overcome extreme injustice. Find another demograhic with a large population base, defininite wrongs that have been committed to them, and the power to be heard, and you'll have another Jackie.
Someone finally said it.
How many are actually paying attention to this?
There are African Americans, Mexican Americans,
Asian Americans, Arab Americans, Native Americans, etc.
And then there are just Americans.
You pass me on the street and sneer in my direction.
You Call me "White boy," "Cracker," "Honkey,"
"Whitey," "Caveman" . And that's OK.
But when I call you, Ni66er, Kike, Towel head, Sand-ni66er,
Camel Jockey, Beaner, Gook, or Chink ... You call me a racist.
You say that whites commit a lot of violence against you,
So why are the ghettos the most dangerous places to live?
You have the United Negro College Fund. You have Martin Luther King
Day. You have Black History Month. You have Cesar Chavez Day. You
Have Yom Hashoah You have Ma'uled Al-Nabi You have the NAACP.
You have BET.
If we had WET (White Entertainment Television) . We'd be racists.
If we had a White Pride Day .. You would call us racists.
If we had White History Month . We'd be racists.
If we had any organization for only whites to "advance" OUR lives
We'd be racists.
We have a Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, a Black Chamber of
Commerce, and then we just have the plain Chamber of Commerce.
Wonder who pays for that?
If we had a college fund that only gave white students scholarships
... You know we'd be racists. There are over 60 openly proclaimed
Black Colleges in the US , yet if there were "White colleges" .
THAT would be a racist college.
In the Million Man March, you believed that you were marching
For your race and rights. If we marched for our race and rights,
You would call us racists.
You are proud to be black, brown, yellow and orange, and you're
Not afraid to announce it. But when we announce our white pride ..
You call us racists.
You rob us, carjack us, and shoot at us. But, when a white police officer
Shoots a black gang member or beats up a black drug-dealer running
From the law and posing a threat to society .. You call him a racist.
I am proud.
But, you call me a racist.
Why is it that only whites can be racists?
In my opinion without Ruth bringing the spotlight on the game, Robinson's achievement is not as big a deal.
That is all I have to say about that. You just lit the match to the powder keg, sad but true
You know what's funny though? You want to see discrimination? Put on a badge and uniform.
Every day without fail, I stop at a local convenience store in uniform for coffee. As I walk into the store, my attention is usually drawn to something like a car with loud music (breaking the noise ordinance). The car usually has at least 2 things wrong with it that would justify a traffic ticket (bad inspection, lights out, improper registration etc). The driver will park and get out. They are usually wearing some gang colors, a shirt with a marijuana leaf or clothing promoting some rap gangster that has a song about killing cops and doing drugs. The driver will invariably come out of the store after buying a pack of blunts. As they drive away, they look at me like I'm some convicted child molestor just because of the uniform.....
its sad who our heroes are sometimes...
<< <i>Publius - my intention is not to light the match. I just got that yesterday in an email and thought it was appropriate to the topic.
You know what's funny though? You want to see discrimination? Put on a badge and uniform.
Every day without fail, I stop at a local convenience store in uniform for coffee. As I walk into the store, my attention is usually drawn to something like a car with loud music (breaking the noise ordinance). The car usually has at least 2 things wrong with it that would justify a traffic ticket (bad inspection, lights out, improper registration etc). The driver will park and get out. They are usually wearing some gang colors, a shirt with a marijuana leaf or clothing promoting some rap gangster that has a song about killing cops and doing drugs. The driver will invariably come out of the store after buying a pack of blunts. As they drive away, they look at me like I'm some convicted child molestor just because of the uniform.....
its sad who our heroes are sometimes... >>
Can't you cite them if they're breaking the noise ordinance? (I'm assuming you meant you are a cop)
I agree my brother. I dont know when cops became the enemy instead of the freind. Watch old Andy Griffith reruns, the local cop in there is someone they trust, someone they go to when there is a problem, (officer johnson, I just got Suzy pregnant)
Now, police officers are the adversaries, you behave around them, they can bust you, violate your civil rights, frisk you with their nightstick. My 3rd ammendment is very important to me, I plan on keeping it intact.
PM sent btw
joe
<< <i>
Can't you cite them if they're breaking the noise ordinance? >>
yes they can be cited. My point was just that a law enforcement officer should be looked upon by society with respect. If I disrepected a citizen, they'd file a complaint in a minute but let someone on the street treat me like a turd because of my job and that's ok.
Turn a blind eye to it, and the line in the sand keeps getting deeper and deeper into your own territory
# 42
On the subject of certain groups having their own clubs, beauty pageants, holidays, etc., just remember that the non-minority-disenfranchised-protected groups have their own club: it's called the majority. And with this membership comes a host of unearned benefits. That is, in this culture there is an advantage of being a white male, In China, a Chinese male, in some South Pacific island, probably a brown female. There is always someone on top of the anthill, and most are trying to be king of that hill, rather than wanting true equality. So for all those who clamor that things aren't fair, it's my contention that they would like to be the beneficiaries of inequality, rather than having an equal playing field.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>I'm just wondering how a thread about honoring Jackie Robinson for breaking the color line evolved into a discussion on police brutality. >>
Thats just the way things happen 'round these parts.
I reckon you're right about that.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
in charge of primary policy-making chores can be termed
"racist."
I know alot about ethnic-prejudice, and I oppose it in any form.
The fact remains that if our "founding fathers" had not formally adopted
the policies of exclusion - which lasted for more than two-centuries -
the current discussion would not be happening.
Some folks are good, and some folks are bad. As long as we recruit
law enforcement officers from that pool of folks, we will get what we
get. BUT, anybody who thinks they are victims of racist cops should
try to envision what their victimhood would be like if there we no cops.
JR was a great baseball-player. He "broke" a barrier and paved the
way for everybody to get a shot based on merit. That can only be a
good thing.
<< <i>I reckon I am >>
Spoken like a white law enforcement officer from the South.
I almost started a thread about this (what I'm about to say). I agree that Jackie Robinson should be applauded and honored for what he went through. He was an amazing man, and I respect him greatly. My question is - why isn't Branch Rickey being honored just as much? I can hear it now - "Oh my gosh! Branch Rickey is a white man! How dare we honor him." The fact is that Branch Rickey had as much to do with breaking the color barrier as Jackie Robinson did. I am not saying to take away from Jackie Robinson. What I am saying is that Branch Rickey should have some recognition too. He made it possible. Not to mention Commissioner A. B. "Happy" Chandler. These three men should all be applauded for breaking the color barrier together. Granted, Jackie Robinson had to go through SO MUCH. I can't imagine what he went through, but he went through it like a champion. However, Mr Rickey and Mr Chandler made it possible.
I know what I just said isn't politically correct, but the truth is the truth.
Shane
<< <i>
<< <i>I reckon I am >>
Spoken like a white law enforcement officer from the South. >>
That was the most racist thing said so far on this thread. That sickens me.
joe
In virtually every article or story I've read about Jackie Robinson breaking into MLB in 1947, Branch Rickey is invariably also mentioned, so your claim that he is not being credited or acknowledged for his part is false. Also, Branch Rickey did not not have to endure nearly as much hatred and abuse that Robinson did when he played during that time. To suggest that he did, is just being ignorant of the facts.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
He made it possible. Not to mention Commissioner A. B. "Happy" Chandler."
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////
BR usually gets LOTS of the credit. Not so much in today's celebration,
but in ALL of the history books and articles. Chandler is often overlooked,
except at the highest levels of MLB academic-discussions.
The fact remains that if our "founding fathers" had not formally adopted
the policies of exclusion - which lasted for more than two-centuries -
the current discussion would not be happening.
The majority of our founding fathers, including the ones from the south were anti slavery. What you had was a region, the south, whose entire existence depended on the horrible instituion of slavery. The constitution our founding fathers wrote had a moritorium on slavery, including the south, which came due in 1808.
Its fascinating to read the notes on the constitutional convention, written by good old Jimmy Madison, a slave owner. 1/3 of the convention was an ongoing argument over slavery. The country would have imploded upon itself, the constituion never would have been written, we would still be running on the articles of the confederation if there would not have been a compromise.
Througout american history, slavery has been a compromise, the missouri compromise, dred scott v sandford, plessy v ferguson and brown v board of education.
I think if anyone, any group of people in america has a gripe, it should be women. Blacks had the right to vote (13th-15th ammendment) about 60 years before women (19th ammendment).
joe
including the south, which came due in 1808. "
//////////////////////////////////////////////////
And, mighty generous of them, too.
Where folks stand on any issue usually has everything to
do with where they sit. Pretty hard for rich-men of the
majority race - north or south - to upset a system that
served them so well.
It is certainly true that "compromise" brought us to where
we are.
should be women. Blacks had the right to vote (13th-15th ammendment)
about 60 years before women (19th ammendment). "
//////////////////////////////////////////////////
Women had a little less trouble enforcing that right.
If it had been up to me, EVERYBODY would have had the
vote - from the get-go -, provided they were citizens AND
owned real-property in America.
<< <i>I think if anyone, any group of people in america has a gripe, it should be women. Blacks had the right to vote (13th-15th ammendment) about 60 years before women (19th ammendment).
joe >>
I think this country's veterans have gotten the biggest shaft.
$0.02
Arthur
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From day-one, that has been the case.
The military - in most countries - is built on working-class
folks who often feel they lack other options. Even when
there was a draft - during much of US history - kids of
rich folks could either legally buy-out, or become students.
Folks who want the draft returned are kidding themselves
if they think the pols are going to allow their offspring to
participate in any war. Draft or no draft, it will always be
"rich man's war, poor man's fight," ---- and NOT MUCH
thanks when the discharge comes.
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No; I think we have already drowned just about everybody.
Gosh, ain't that the truth.