Off Subject...Xmas Harrasement?...any layers out there with advise?
spazzy
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I work for a large retail chain. On Xmas eve another associate received a 3 foot large blow up adult doll of a woman with my face plastered on her face (as if I was wearing the panties and bra) from another employee. Two management people knew first hand of the gift and did nothing to stop the employee of giving this secret santa gift to another person. Nothing was done after the fact. I thought it was cruel. I was thinking of calling this problem out to our Harrasement hotline but I believe that they are only working for themselves. In this world of ours when only a smile can be mistaken for harrasement, Should I just shrugg it off and move on as if it was a joke? I have been pi##ed off for a few days now. I cant even concentrate on my card collecting... How can I get the company to understand this is wrong for anyone?I bring this problem to this board because I believe we are progressive. Do I have a case?
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Just hearing that this has bothered you for days and affected your general well being shows you have been wronged.
If it were a situation where people were all inolved in a joking way ( yourself included ) than I might say it is up in the air, but it appears from what you said that this was totally unexpected and out of the norm.
Only you can decide how you want to pursue the matter, but if you choose to take action I would say you have a legitimate gripe.
-- Yogi Berra
That is the case in my home state. You may have more options.
You obviously are freindly with the guy that got the gift because the giver was trying to insinuate you are really "friendly" with him.
Do you and the giver get along or just not friendly with each other?
If you guys are freindly and it was a prank then taking him to court would be ridiculous. Just pay him back, better.
If you guys dont get along then maybe court would be an option. Im sure you would have to prove some serious mental anguish over it though.
I say just get him back
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<< <i>... Unless you're handicapped, homosexual, female or non-caucasian your only option is a vengeful prank, get going on it. >>
That's a ridiculous statement, and does absolutely nothing to help the board member that asked a serious question.
I am a lawyer, and I'd suggest you go speak with an attorney in your hometown. The initial consultation should be free, and he or she will be able to give you a good idea of your options.
Good luck.
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But the question is, do you want your job?
You are (likely) an employee at will, and your employer has no need to keep you employed there, and it isn't the most difficult thing in the world to make it look like something other than a retalitory firing.
So, without getting too deep into the ethics, I guess the question is whether or not you have something lined up. Even if you weren't fired, if you stayed there and sued, how "fun" do you think it would be for you to go to work every day? At best, you would be seriously black-balled, no pun intended.
~ms
that way you avoid lawyer fees, get a nice workout, and vent your frustrations?
julen
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<< <i>why don't you lay a beat down on whoever cracked the joke on you?
that way you avoid lawyer fees, get a nice workout, and vent your frustrations?
julen >>
I'm not so sure they would be avoiding lawyer fees with that one.
Arthur
I wonder what your damages are? That is in MONETARY terms what has this incident cost you? Unless you start going to the psychatrist I am not sure I see how monetary damages could possibly be quantified. For example, with car accidents you go to the emergency room, to doctors, etc... add it all up and then maybe do a 5x multiplier to come up with a fair settlement. However, if your medical bills are zero (presuming you aren't upset enough to go see a shrink about it), you haven't lost anything (monetarily speaking) at work, you haven't spent any money because of it, etc... so what are your damages? Will this incident cause you to be passed over for a promotion? Maybe, but tough to prove I would think!? Additionally, if you are a white male you probably have no special protection that some other groups might have (I say "might" because that's another area of law I know nothing about).
Again, I know NOTHING about employment law or personal injury cases so you should talk to a professional in those areas but I just don't see the damages.
I think my personal advice would be to find out why people wanted to make fun of you, improve on that trait so people don't want to make fun of you in the future, and get on with your life. Just use this as a reason to improve yourself. Just my personal advice.
Good luck to you.
P.S. If someone wants to talk about California probate or estate planning then I will know an answer!
you are correct my friend...
i would first follow protocol at your work (that way your providing a written HISTORY of your complain), i would also document as much as you can ...
to be disrespected by anybody.
fuq that place if they wont help you also, make them fire you, draw unemployment, then find a better place to work.
gl
julen
RIP GURU
by pursuing this, it will only add to your cumulative stress....very bad idea
my advice, by some cards and think of them when you lay down to sleep, much less stress that way...
The first part of harassment is making sure that the harasser knows that what was done is not welcome and can not now or ever repeat itself without grave consequences.
You have the right -
- to work in an environment free of sexual harrassment, violence, and hostile behavior.
- to report your concerns to your superiors without fear of retribution (including loss of employment).
Your employer has the responsibility to educate all employees about ethical behavior, sexual harassment, and violence in the work place. If they fail to do so they are negligent. In some cases if they properly educate employees and ignore violations then they are again negligent.
If it was me I would -
- report the incident immediately to my superior in writing and request that the incident be investigated. Make sure to document in writing how you feel about this treatment. Sexual harassment exists in many forms and begins when one person feels harassed and expresses their concern. Make sure this is also reviewed by any Equal Rights/Ethics/Dispute Resolution department in your company. In the retail market this probably means contacting someone outside of your store. If you do not report this now and it happens again then you have little or no recourse for the first incident.
- consult a lawyer.
- make sure that your employment record is clean and stays that way.
- follow up. Do not let it go if you feel strongly about it.
Good luck.
I am not a lawyer and feel that sexual harrasement cases are WAY OUT of control in this country of lawsuit happy people and 'sensitive' types. But something as in your face as this should be brought to the attention of the higher ups!!!
Consult a local and also contact the proper department in your company to report it.
Good luck
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You do need to leave a paper trail.
I can imagine how you must feel and being in a hostile work environment is really draining. The damages that larry73 was referring to are pain and suffering in nature--that's the damage IMO. I think that is legitimate and the law recognizes that.
Even after all is said and done, do you really want to work there for long? Maybe the person who offended you could move somewhere else. Poeple shift work places so often now that I would not be surprised if you were surrounded by a different group of people in the next few months.
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example-->you tell some little hotty that you have a good working relationship/friendship who is wearing a nice outfit that you would like to see what is underneath that skirt of hers. she is not offended and is actually takes it as a compliment. however some 280 lb. woman with a moustache who orders $35 worth of food at taco bell and then gets a diet pepsi overhears your conversation and claims to be offended and you are in trouble. you really have to know your audience.
i can recall when i started in an office work place with a big company (40000 employees in 1985). i was just out of college and this nice looking blonde who was in great shape bent over right in front of my desk and i grabbed her behind. she wasn't happy but she came back and smacked my behind. today i would have been fired on the spot. ah the good old days.
i don't there is a normal guy alive who hasn't seen a good looking woman in an office setting and at least had lustful thoughts about her. i can recall in a different job going into the office of one of the h.r. directors who got to work early to look out into the parking lot and see the different woman walking in. we would discuss which ones we would to like to do. the real debate came on those tweeners.
my question is what motivated these employees to pick on you?
<< <i>the problem with sexual harrassment is often it is not the person who may receive the joke that is offended it is some person that overhears it that claims to be offended.
example-->you tell some little hotty that you have a good working relationship/friendship who is wearing a nice outfit that you would like to see what is underneath that skirt of hers. she is not offended and is actually takes it as a compliment. however some 280 lb. woman with a moustache who orders $35 worth of food at taco bell and then gets a diet pepsi overhears your conversation and claims to be offended and you are in trouble. you really have to know your audience.
i can recall when i started in an office work place with a big company (40000 employees in 1985). i was just out of college and this nice looking blonde who was in great shape bent over right in front of my desk and i grabbed her behind. she wasn't happy but she came back and smacked my behind. today i would have been fired on the spot. ah the good old days.
i don't there is a normal guy alive who hasn't seen a good looking woman in an office setting and at least had lustful thoughts about her. i can recall in a different job going into the office of one of the h.r. directors who got to work early to look out into the parking lot and see the different woman walking in. we would discuss which ones we would to like to do. the real debate came on those tweeners.
my question is what motivated these employees to pick on you? >>
Czar, if you performed any of that behavior to either one of my two sisters you would be blowing your nose with your prostate.
Arthur
The worst thing you can do is let it bother you, and a thing like this could possibly screw up your whole world for a long time if you do. And no action other than shrugging it off will really help.
The truth is, I wouldn't be very good at taking a joke like that. But I would definatly and anonymously return the favor 10 fold. If someone did that to me, I'd probably play mean jokes on them til it near drove em nuts. Then you would definatly feel better. But through it all, you would have to watch your back, making sure their pranks don't catch you off gaurd.
Your probably not the kind of guy to play this game, but Christmas is no time for the kind of joke they pulled on you.
Take er easy guy, Trent.
arthur,
if i read you correctly your advice to any would be harrasser is to make sure they don't have a thug for a brother because they only way to stop inappropriate behavior is violence?
as mentioned times have changed since that over 20 years ago. i have daughters in the workplace and i have a different attitude. if they were harrassed i wouldn't be pleased but i am sure i would take a more civilized approach.
File your complaint for your paper trail, then make the fockers work late/weekends. If they are hourly and you can't pay the overtime, give them the crap jobs. There are ways of getting your point across without having to go through all the hassle. Just make sure it doesn't backfire and they're claiming harrasment on you.
If all else fails, poop in his lunch box.
Arthur
I appreciate everyones comments so far because it isnt a sports subject. A paper trail sounds good . You have all uplifted my day....Spazzy
<< <i>Czar, if you performed any of that behavior to either one of my two sisters you would be blowing your nose with your prostate.
arthur,
if i read you correctly your advice to any would be harrasser is to make sure they don't have a thug for a brother because they only way to stop inappropriate behavior is violence?
as mentioned times have changed since that over 20 years ago. i have daughters in the workplace and i have a different attitude. if they were harrassed i wouldn't be pleased but i am sure i would take a more civilized approach. >>
Say that when one of your daughters bends over and some perv like you grabs her ass without her consent.
-- Yogi Berra
<< <i>When the "Gift" was opened, there were at least 10 people looking on to see what was in the big box. That group included two of the other managers. Another employee video taped the opening. My reaction was shock but my body defence told me to smile at the time. When I realized that it was an adult doll about a few minutes later, it hit me about how bad the gift was.
I appreciate everyones comments so far because it isnt a sports subject. A paper trail sounds good . You have all uplifted my day....Spazzy >>
You set your own boundaries as we all do. What may bother some may not bother others.
Case in point - my wife has worked in law enforcement for 17 years. She began her career at 18. In that stressful male dominant field you're going to hear your share of off color jokes and comments about women. She is not bothered by it and in fact has a really great sense of humor. It's one reason why I love her so much. We talk like drunken sailors and crack very sick disgusting jokes. However, if she decided to suddenly become more virtuous and voiced her concern to her superiors then things would have to change when coworkers interacted with or around her. The same would go for a male.
It's all relative and really depends on the person being harassed. Are there many false claims or those who are too sensitive? Certainly. That's why there are people who handle such claims and laws that protect workers.
Will you get a monetary judgement? Most likely not. What will happen though is the person will be counseled, educated and warned about future incidents. Your company probably has a progressive discipline policy with provisions to skip to any step at will, including termination.
JMHO....to paraphrase another post here, the world is getting weary of offenders.
"All evil needs to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
This is sad and I can understand how you feel.
1. After a few days - the intensity will wane immensely.
2. I'm with those who would want you to "examine" why this person sent the gift.
3. I would see how this impacts the subordinate who works directly for you.
4. Consideration - I assume you have a chain of command - if you have a good working relationship with the person immediately above you - it may be advised to have a sitdown with him/her and this offending individual - remain calm and non-confrontational - but be firm of how you feel about it and be "assured that this will never, ever happen again." It may even be better if your subordinate, this person and your immediate boss are together - that way you can re-establish your authority and allow the take home message to be: "I have a sense of humor - but sometimes jokes undermine the authority of a supervisor and this can't be and will not be tolerated by the Company or yourself."
5. If you get no where - and still upset - and don't love your job - I would imagine the state employment board will be happy to mediate a grievance that you file. I - personally - believe this is a last resort.
6. Suing? Last resort - more than likely this is an inconvenience and nothing more - the person can always say - "they love you to death - this was just a joke - where's your sense of humor?"
Good luck and let us know how it goes
mike
What a totalling inappropiate and ignorant thing to type on this forum.
Mark
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julen
RIP GURU
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<< <i>Just when u think things can get no worse! Don't worry, they can!
Wow!
rd
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<< <i>I work for a large retail chain. On Xmas eve another associate received a 3 foot large blow up adult doll of a woman with my face plastered on her face (as if I was wearing the panties and bra) from another employee. Two management people knew first hand of the gift and did nothing to stop the employee of giving this secret santa gift to another person. Nothing was done after the fact. I thought it was cruel. I was thinking of calling this problem out to our Harrasement hotline but I believe that they are only working for themselves. In this world of ours when only a smile can be mistaken for harrasement, Should I just shrugg it off and move on as if it was a joke? I have been pi##ed off for a few days now. I cant even concentrate on my card collecting... How can I get the company to understand this is wrong for anyone?I bring this problem to this board because I believe we are progressive. Do I have a case? >>
I am not a lawyer and don't ever wish to be one (LOL). And I am not anti-lawyer by any means, I actually have a lot of respect for certain types of attorneys, but I am anti-"scumbag lawyer" and frankly if any attorney would take a case such as this, which is unlikely in my opinion, this attorney probably would be classified as a "scumbag" attorney who basically makes their living extorting money from the legal system.
So who knows, you might be able to dig a lawyer's name out of the phonebook who might take the case on a contingency basis and write the defendant a letter and see what happens. Under no circumstances should you pay any attorney a retainer for a case such as this...this would basically "automatically" mean that you do not have a winning case, but some scumbag lawyer could suck you dry with legal fees anyway. Repeat...if you pursue legal action, only do it with an attorney willing to take it on a contingency (no fee) basis - do not pay a lawyer not one penny, not even a small fee to take this case.
I've been to numerous holiday office parties and haven't seen a gift exactly like that, but I've seen gifts similar to that. Frankly, how was the supervisor to know what gift was in a box? Are supervisors at work going to now start having to inspect all holiday gifts exchanged amongst employees?
But it's basically impossible for someone else to exactly feel someone else's pain, especially mental anguish such as this...I would have laughed at the gift, made a few quick snide remarks to the giver, and it would have been over with, but that's me. Evidentally, something about the gift really bothered you for whatever reason. Those who stated you need a paper trail are exactly right...in my opinion this one incident wouldn't even come close to representing harrassment in the workplace, even though to you it appears that it was. I could go on and on with my further opinion but what good would that do...really...there's no way a judge would take this case...it wouldn't make it past the judge's clerk.
Either file a complaint with your supervisors, if the supervisors don't respond to your satisfaction then you can pursue an attorney as noted, or my view is the better option is to let it go and try to forget about it...the choice is yours.
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