Feedback for Overgraded Coin?
bhartman35
Posts: 1,398
Hi, Everyone.
I just posted a thread a little while ago about a coin which looks to be in AU53-58 condition. (a 1909 IHC). The auction stated (in the title) that the coin was MS67-BN. It's raw, and I didn't pay anywhere near MS67 price. What kind of feedback would you give? It's not an ugly coin, by any means, but should there be some blowback against the seller for making such a representation?
Auction In Question
I'm sort of inclined to leave it alone, because I don't want a retaliatory neg, but I do feel like the ethical thing to do would be to blow the whistle on this kind of thing.
I just posted a thread a little while ago about a coin which looks to be in AU53-58 condition. (a 1909 IHC). The auction stated (in the title) that the coin was MS67-BN. It's raw, and I didn't pay anywhere near MS67 price. What kind of feedback would you give? It's not an ugly coin, by any means, but should there be some blowback against the seller for making such a representation?
Auction In Question
I'm sort of inclined to leave it alone, because I don't want a retaliatory neg, but I do feel like the ethical thing to do would be to blow the whistle on this kind of thing.
If you haven't noticed, I'm single and miserable and I've got four albums of bitching about it that I would offer as proof.
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
0
Comments
no return option than I would leave a neutral feedback. You pretty much got what you paid for.
Bruce
<< <i>I'd leave a positive. You got what the auction was selling. So the seller overhyped it--you knew that when you bid. >>
I did know it wasn't an MS-67 (although I could've believed it was MS-63, at least), but isn't that beside the point? It was being sold as an MS-67. If I didn't know it wasn't MS-67, would it still be alright for the seller to overhype it like that? And isn't part of the function of feedback to warn other buyers/sellers of what they might be in for?
I'm on the fence about it right now. It's not a bad coin, but for what I paid, it's not what was represented.
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
If that is the case then don't leave any feedback.
<< <i>I would probably leave a positive. You do have the option of returning the coins if you don't like it. If there was
no return option than I would leave a neutral feedback. You pretty much got what you paid for.
Bruce >>
Well, technically, it's a return for store credit, rather than money back, but I get your point.
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
<< <i>I'd leave a positive. You got what the auction was selling. So the seller overhyped it--you knew that when you bid. >>
There is no way I'd leave positive feedback, due to the blatant over-grading, even if the winning bid did not begin to correspond to the seller's grade. I wouldn't want to reward hyping and over-grading. I'd either leave no feedback at all, or leave a neutral, though the latter would entail a risk.
<< <i>You took a shot, got what was shown (apparently in good time with no other problems) and it's not a bad coin, just not the grade advertised... which is typical for (supposed) mint state raw anything on eBay. Other than over paying a bit, you got out of it pretty well... I'd call it a positive if you're not going to return it. >>
Okay. I'm sold. A positive will be left. I'm used to overgrading, I guess. (There are multitudes of "Full Bands" Mercuries out there with nothing close to full bands.) I was just a bit taken aback by the difference here.
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
<< <i>
<< <i>I'd leave a positive. You got what the auction was selling. So the seller overhyped it--you knew that when you bid. >>
There is no way I'd leave positive feedback, due to the blatant over-grading, even if the winning bid did not begin to correspond to the seller's grade. I wouldn't want to reward hyping and over-grading. I'd either leave no feedback at all, or leave a neutral, though the latter would entail a risk. >>
Dammit. Now I'm torn again.
I guess I'll end up leaving no feedback (and get none in return, which is no skin off my back) or a neutral. Like Mark, I'm not comfortable rewarding that kind of thing. IMHO, a "rip" by a buyer (getting the coin for a low price in a fair auction) is not comparable to overhyping a coin. One involves deceit. The other does not.
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
Item must be returned within: 3 Days Refund will be given as: Merchandise Credit
Here is an option :
Send it back and tell him you want an MS67 and personally you don't think there is such a beast as a BROWN MS67 IHC
that's what I would do, or accept the coin and follow pharmer's advice.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>There is no way I'd leave positive feedback, due to the blatant over-grading, even if the winning bid did not begin to correspond to the seller's grade. I wouldn't want to reward hyping and over-grading. I'd either leave no feedback at all, or leave a neutral, though the latter would entail a risk. >>
I agree with Mark and would go with the no feedback option. Of course, I never would have bid with this slimeball seller in the first place. Did you even look at his feedback?
Russ, NCNE
It's clear from your bidding that you were determined to get the coin--I have a tendency to do that which is why I usually try to just put in my max and let it ride. When I don't I usually over pay.
<< <i>The fact that you bid on an auction that was littered with red flags, and then received an item that most folks could have anticipated, precludes leaving a negative in my opinion. The types of bidders who will bid on these auctions are also likely the types of bidders who will not utilize the various ebay methods of protection when bidding. Therefore, your feedback will likely have no effect. >>
Granted, it was a bad item to bid on. (I think everyone agreed on that when I first posted about it on the 23rd.) But why should the fact that I made a mistake penalize someone else?
To be clear: If the auction hadn't said a grade, or had said a grade in the MS-63 range, there wouldn't be an issue, as far as I'm concerned. I bid on the coin, and I got the coin. Others who looked at the coin pegged the grade as anywhere from AU-53 to MS-63. My problem is that he made a representation that wasn't close to what the real grade of the coin was. There's a whole lot of daylight between this coin and MS-67.
I'm most likely either going to leave no feedback, or something like, "Coin arrived safely. Thanks." I don't feel the usual "Great Ebayer, A+++" that I'd give to a properly graded coin that arrives safely as the result of a well laid-out auction is warranted.
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>vinrare is not a reputable seller, regardless of what you do this time you should choose to do the right thing again when enticed by one of his auctions -- stay away! >>
No joke there. Lesson learned!
On the plus side, there's actually one interesting feature of the cent (which is either post-mint damage or a die problem of some kind):
I don't know what's going on with that 9, but it's certainly intriguing.
-- Adam Duritz, of Counting Crows
My Ebay Auctions
<< <i>Therefore, your angst over the feedback is essentially meaningless. >>
Yes, and no. You're correct that a neg or neutral won't have any impact with this seller since those bidding in his auctions clearly aren't paying attention to his crappy reputation. On the other hand, some angst is warranted when considering a neg or neutral in the face of a retaliatory. And, he WILL get one if he posts anything less than a positive. The seller has done so in every case.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Did you bother to look at the sellers feedback before buying?? It is about as bad as it gets. Pretty good indication of what you are going to get. >>
I assure you, feedback can get a lot worse than that. And, based upon that feedback, while the buyer justifiably didn't expect an MS67, he had no good reason to think he'd get an AU coin, either.
You have already rewarded the seller by bidding on his auction-you knew it wasn’t going to be the grade stated-there’s almost 4,000 IHC listed on eBay and you bid on one of the 3,900 that isn’t graded by PCGS or NGC-you already know what you’re gonna get-the seller shipped promptly….
IF it was me, and I know IF doesn’t mean much because IF a frog had wings he wouldn’t bump his ass every time he hopped, my feedback would say: POSITIVE: Fast & proper shipping on OVERGRADED coin.
At least that way you would warning everybody his coin wasn't graded as stated instead of saying nothing at all.
At least that way you would warning everybody his coin wasn't graded as stated instead of saying nothing at all.>>
Dog, if you do that, you are adding to the positive feedback total for the seller. Also, many potential bidders don't bother to read the precise feedback comments, so you might not be warning others, anyway. Furthermore, you would be risking a negative in retaliation.
Coinguy1- feedback smeedback, people like bhartman35 bidding on these sleazebag dealer’s auctions is what keeps them in business. The seller already has an atrocious feedback history rating with 37 negs =96% and yet it didn’t stop bhartman35 from doing biz with him.
Leaving no feedback at all is as just as condescending of the dealer’s misrepresentation of the grade of the IHC. Remember that a week ago bhartman35 posted this auction telling us that he knew it wouldn’t be the grade stated and that he put in a lowball bid assuming that somebody else would win it and he wouldn’t actually have to pay for & take possession if the thing. He knows the pitfalls of buying raw coins on eBay. He’s been on this board for a while, he knows the deal. He got what he was expecting at the price he was willing to pay.
<<< Furthermore, you would be risking a negative in retaliation.>>>
Retaliation Negative-that’s the thing that strikes fear in to the hearts of eBayers leaving them shaking in their boots! Having a retaliation neg is not going to ruin bhartman35’s life or reputation. In all truthfulness the sleazebag dealer deserves a neg for blantant and fraudlant overgrading and bhartman35 should man up to it, leave a neg and take his medicine in return.
Knowingly bidding on a fraudulent auction then worrying about feedback is not high on our list of “Important Things To Worry About” in life.
You should leave a negative, and take the retaliatory that will come.
He deserves the negative, and you do too.
Ray
<< <i>Personally I would either return the coin and leave a positive with a comment that he accepted the return of an overggraded coin or leave a neutral with a comment that the coin arrived safely but was overgraded. Either way it appears to be a waist of time. He has A LOT of Neg's and neutrals already. >>
DRG---Many times when a buyer leaves a neutral, the seller will retaliate with a neg.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>DRG---Many times when a buyer leaves a neutral, the seller will retaliate with a neg. >>
In the case of this seller, every time.
Russ, NCNE