Why has general stamp collecting died and how is it different from coin collecting?

Shamika

I took the family to visit my parents in the house I grew up and my mother gave me a shoe box full of stamps that I had been collecting as a kid (~30 years ago). I realize stamp collecting has lost favor, but what has kept coin values high?

Also, considering stamps are only slightly different that bank notes, one might think stamps could make a comeback as bank notes sell for record prices across the board.

CaptainRon

Email -- Kids do not know what stamps are anymore.

Smittys

two words -Self Adhesive

CaptainRon

And before anyone says well we have credit/debit cards now, well kids do not. They are still bribed the old fashion way, with real money.

Goober

<< <i>two words -Self Adhesive >>



^
What he said.

Cam40

coin collecting has been considered the hobby of kings for alot of years,
stamps did have a huge following for a long time but, i dont know why exactly
that hobby has all but disappeared. may be due to lack of genuine rarities
to go around? lots of reasons why not many collect as they(we) once did
not that long ago....

ChangeInHistory

I don't know for sure, but someone mentioned to me that it is very polorized---A very small percentage of worthwhile rare and scarce stamps, and the rest are common and cheap. I don't know for sure, but that's how it was explained to me at a coin show a few years ago.

Zoins

<< <i>two words -Self Adhesive >>

That plus email and metered postage. A lot of personal communication is via email now and a lot of business mail uses metered postage which means no stamps.

Zoins

<< <i>coin collecting has been considered the hobby of kings for alot of years,
stamps did have a huge following for a long time but, i dont know why exactly
that hobby has all but disappeared. may be due to lack of genuine rarities
to go around? lots of reasons why not many collect as they(we) once did
not that long ago.... >>

Genuine rarity isn't needed. You just need conditional rarity and marketing rarity like FS. Are there organizations creating conditional and marketing rarities that people are willing to buy into for stamps?

WoodenJefferson

They don't have

First Cancellation™

Shamika

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the possibility that the flood of commemorative stamps overwhelmed the average collector. I know I used to collect plate blocks, but all of a sudden it seemed the post office had a new stamp coming out every other day which made plate block collecting too expensive for me (keep in mind I was a kid).

If there is merit in this suggestion, could the numerous new designs in U.S. coinage eventually kill off coin collecting?

Zoins

<< <i>One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the possibility that the flood of commemorative stamps overwhelmed the average collector. I know I used to collect plate blocks, but all of a sudden it seemed the post office had a new stamp coming out every other day which made plate block collecting too expensive for me (keep in mind I was a kid).

If there is merit in this suggestion, could the numerous new designs in U.S. coinage eventually kill off coin collecting? >>

That makes sense. Everytime I walk into a post office they seem to have a gazillion plate blocks. I actually got one to give as a Christmas present but more as a novelty than anything. Is this sort of what happened to the baseball card industry?

I have some of the early, themed non-self-adhesive plate blocks (where the stamps are embedded in a picture) and think they're pretty cool.

Cam40

darn it the link aint working.
abc story of `jenny stamp`

Zoins

<< <i>darn it the link aint working.
abc story of `jenny stamp` >>

linky

Shamika

Oh dear!

SDSportsFan

I think it's a combination of all the ideas mentioned. I know for my dad, he lost interest in stamps in the early 1990's due to the flood of new US stamps being issued. He just could not keep up. The same thing happened to me and many others with baseball cards in the late '80s-early '90s. I also collected Star Trek memorabilia (including the action figures) and certain collector plates. I lost interest in them when the companies flooded the market with too much different product. It became way too expensive and difficult to keep up with everything.

I also think the fact that young people communicate so much by email now-a-days and rarely if ever set foot in a post office or have a need to mail anything definitely hurts. They just aren't introduced to stamps to see the different varieties.

The other main factor to me is the self-adhesive nature of stamps now. In previous years, a collector could go to a post office and buy one of each stamp they wanted for their collection. Now, you can't. You have to buy a sheet of ~20. At 39 cents each, that's $7.80 for each and every stamp issued. You'd have to be a millionaire to be able to do that, or at least have no other expenses competing for your money.

I get concerned sometimes that coin collecting might be heading down that road of saturation, with the government issuing too many coins for people to keep up. I think one thing that might save the hobby is that even with the presidential dollars, it's what, 5-6 coins a year at $1 each. Pretty much anyone can afford that. So kids can still be easily introduced to coin collecting and can afford to collect circulation issues from their weekly allowance. Then when they get older and get a job, they can graduate to older coins and the silver commemoratives, and perhaps even some gold commemoratives.


Steve

billboat

I collected stamps in the fifties as a kid--they used to look like stamps, historical, interesting, etc. I still have my old album from those days. US Stamps today look more like the stickers that they give kids in school--the Mint is on the fast track in that same direction.

Coinosaurus

Just read an article about stamp collecting in a regional French newspaper for my French lesson.

Many of the same concerns were expressed - too many issues coming out, no kids involved, no real investment potential, etc. Most of the club members were retirees working on very focused collections, like "lighthouses", etc.

xphobe

<< <i>I collected stamps in the fifties as a kid--they used to look like stamps, historical, interesting, etc. I still have my old album from those days. US Stamps today look more like the stickers that they give kids in school--the Mint is on the fast track in that same direction. >>



Yep, modern commems all look like the stuff the Krewes toss off the Mardi Gras floats into the crowds. In fact some of those actually have some artistic merit.

MikeKing

I collected stamps when I was a kid, and I collect stamps now, but 19th century imperforates and provisionals only. For some of them, particularly the real rarities, I think, the market is hot. There's a significant market also for most of the 19th century US stamps. The later Grill and August issues are extremely attractive, not just visually, but in terms of return on investment, so I think, at least for those stamps, the market is good. If it were as hot as the coin market, these stamps would be totally unaffordable. As far as other US stamps, I really couldn't comment, since I don't track them.

I find stamp collectors 'in the know' as extremely discerning, particularly when it comes to grading. The price differentials are amazing, and even an EF (extremely fine) which is gem quality, can skyrocket when you enter the Superb EF arena. Since most real stamp collectors want nothing to do with grading services, there was still a remnant of artistry in studying them. There are certain individuals however that wish to incorporate third party grading into the hobby. Personally, it makes me sad, like something is being taken away from me, as a collector. However, it might prove helpful in stimulating the hobby in the end, I think, because a lot of people are just lazy and lack the self confidence that used to make a great collection.

I only have about 10 stamps in my collection by the way, and it took me years to find those stamps.

Nic

Great posts Mike and Shamika. Agree. I have 8 stamps and want only 2 or 3 more. K

Zoins

I actually had a discussion about stamp collecting a while back which involved the collectibles company Escala. It was pretty interesting. We decided it was a short candidate but it happened before we could take advantage of it. Check out that stock chart.

StampAlarm

It's all Smittys fault. For almost 2 years he held a non-stop...24/7...giveaway in the Stamps Forum! Now we all have enough stamps. Besides that, I ain't saying nothing except I'm going to knock David Hall out of his NR. 1 spot!



Jerry

nucklehead

<< <i>They don't have

First Cancellation™ >>

Conder101

<< <i>They don't have

First Cancellation™ >>


Are you kidding? They invented it. First day covers. (Which in some cases the Post Office will continue cancelling as the first day for 30 days.)



<< <i>One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the possibility that the flood of commemorative stamps overwhelmed the average collector. I know I used to collect plate blocks, but all of a sudden it seemed the post office had a new stamp coming out every other day which made plate block collecting too expensive for me (keep in mind I was a kid). >>


That has been a BIG part of it. A few years back I was in the post office and I counted all of the different designs being issued for that year, 103 designs. Then when you consider that some stamp collectors, like some coin collectors, try to get one of everything the post office issues. First day cover, plate block, full sheet, coils, and booklets. (Each of these forms results in differences in the perferations on the edges etc.) And then in some cases the same design is printed by more than one firm which results in another slight variation to buy.



<< <i> collected stamps in the fifties as a kid--they used to look like stamps, historical, interesting, etc. I still have my old album from those days. US Stamps today look more like the stickers that they give kids in school >>


This is also true. Stamps used to be printed by the intalligo (sp) method just as our paper money is, with plates engraved by highly skilled steel plate engavers. Today they are printed with four pass color dot matrix presses similar to what they use for printing the Sunday comics.

291fifth

E-mail, self-sticks, too many new issues and a general lack of interest in older hobbies by the youth of today.

Shamika

<< <i>A few years back I was in the post office and I counted all of the different designs being issued for that year, 103 designs. >>


Geez! Who's designing all this stuff?

secondrepublic

Stamps are just little pieces of paper with sticky gum on the back.... coins are usually bigger and are made of some very cool and innately valuable metals

Shamika

<< <i>coins are usually bigger and are made of some very cool and innately valuable metals >>


I pay STUPID money for Buffalo nickels and they don't have much intrinsic value at all. Furthermore, they're smaller than many (most) stamps as is the case for many other coins (dimes, half dimes, trimes, small cents, territorial gold, gold dollars, quarter eagles, etc).

flaminio

<< <i>

<< <i>darn it the link aint working.
abc story of `jenny stamp` >>

linky >>

This story turned out to be not true. The stamp in question was a 2001 reissue of a 1901 invert that an overzealous election worker misinterpreted.

ModernDollarNut

<< <i>One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the possibility that the flood of commemorative stamps overwhelmed the average collector. I know I used to collect plate blocks, but all of a sudden it seemed the post office had a new stamp coming out every other day which made plate block collecting too expensive for me (keep in mind I was a kid).

If there is merit in this suggestion, could the numerous new designs in U.S. coinage eventually kill off coin collecting? >>



BINGO! Also the reason I hate to see the Mint churn out more and more US coins. The State Quarters have been a big boost to collecting but overdone this trend could kill off many the newbies coming into the hobby and maybe some of us, too. Rob

Shamika

<< <i>This story turned out to be not true. The stamp in question was a 2001 reissue of a 1901 invert that an overzealous election worker misinterpreted. >>


I guess you can't believe everything you read.

WoodenJefferson

Collecting stamps has a niche where there was absolutly no value placed on the item, the value placed on the stamp was to collect as in "Postage Due" but yet now you have to pay someone else in order to have and collect them.

Postage Dues also came in 1/2 cent denomination...I often wondered just how the Postman collected 1/2 cent?

now it's coin related

Shamika

<< <i>BINGO! Also the reason I hate to see the Mint churn out more and more US coins. >>


I'm an avid Buffalo nickel collector, but the modern Buffalo thing has GOT TO STOP!!!

BillyMadison

I am by no means an expert on the subject of stamps, but with auctions seeing realized prices in the thousands
Stamp Collection

Its hard to believe that the hobby is dead.

Now the question is, for someone who know stamps, is this auction a good deal?

WoodenJefferson

That is a reliable company out of NY they have been around for years...one of the "players"

Most of the penciled in prices are right from a catalog without reguard to centering, thins (places in the stamp where the thickness is not consistant) and other anomalies that might occur.

Yes, that is a good auction amount so far...reasonable (most collections selling under valued right now, it's a buyers market)

Like buying raw coins...these stamps (the most important ones of high value) are not graded. Now it's coin related again.

Shamika

<< <i>Its hard to believe that the hobby is dead. >>


Have you visited the Stamp Forum lately?

StampAlarm

<< <i>I am by no means an expert on the subject of stamps, but with auctions seeing realized prices in the thousands
Stamp Collection

Its hard to believe that the hobby is dead.

Now the question is, for someone who know stamps, is this auction a good deal? >>



When it boils down to it I really don't know what's going on. I just know anyone venturing into U.S. stamps both classic and now the PSE 70J's moderns are in for a shock. Especially if they were into stamps 10-30 years ago. Heck, 40-50 years ago. Just look at the auctions on SAN and this eBay auction. Very strong demand with the prices.

I don't believe the hobby is dead. But there is a big difference in the hobby now and the many years ago that the people on the coin forum are thinking. If I had never ventured back into stamps about 3 years ago, I wouldn't know either though. I believe that most of the resurgence in the hobby is coming from people like me coming back in as my main collecting focus. There still aren't many brand new young people entering the hobby. But shows and auctions are doing well.



Jerry

291fifth

The very high end of the stamp market is actually very healthy. The rest of it is not. Have you tried to sell any first day covers lately?

covers

There are segments of the stamp market that may be weak - generally what I call the "souvenir" section of the hobby (like first day covers). I judge the strength of any collector market as being inverse to the number of "investor" types present.

The great things in the stamp / postal history field are mostly NOT held by people who would sell if the value of their material increases. This makes for very good long term growth in value. With coins, a very large percentage of items are held by people who would sell if the value increased substantially - that makes for a more volatile market.

Richard Frajola (full time in philately since 1968)
www.rfrajola.com

covers

Wooden Jefferson - If you want to learn about how postage was paid - you might enjoy my presentation Paying The Postage

Richard Frajola
www.rfrajola.com

Baley

Greed by the issuing authorities kills the market interest many collectibles when a flood of new issues occurs.

Generally, truly rare old pieces remain desirable.

Michigan

I'm not a stamp collector but I like to get different designs everytime I go to the post office to buy the 39 cents ones.

Just bought a sheet of 20 that feature various makes of motorcycles through the years. Rather neat looking.

quarterlvr

Shamika, you are right about the flooding of the market with commemoratives limiting how much people can collect. I stopped collecting every new issue about 1990, these days I only buy those issues that really interest me. Also the USPS policy changes that no longer allow collectors to buy just one or two of a certain stamp(now they come in panes)discourages younger collectors with limited budgets. And the lack of availability of certain stamps at one's local post office is a sticking point as well. Some of the stamps are available only through "the Cave" in Kansas City. People no longer use commemoratives on their mail like they once did, therefore someone who wants to collect used on mail has a hard time finding stamps anymore. Lots of reasons why. I still collect but have changed the way I do it considerably.

fastrudy

When I post on the stamp forum, I swear I can hear an echo!

ibzman350

I would think old age...................................don't all generals die when they get old??



Herb

roadrunner

Stamps surged in the 1970's with inflation coming on. But I don't believe they ever recovered from the 1980-1982 recession. I think that killed the market. It was hard enough for coins (with gold and silver in them) to come back to life in 1982-1984. And that was even harder in the 1990-1995 windown. Stamps just couldn't cut it imo.

Coins are perceived as investments by the investment crowd, but not stamps. The new investor likes the feel of a Trade dollar or a $20 Saint or even an old silver half dollar from 1806. But how does a stamp feel in your hand? The size is a problem too imo. Just too small an item, no metal value (at least a nickel has nearly 5c in nickel these days). Coins are spent. You use them daily. They represent money and wealth. Not so with stamps. Stamps from the 1940's are so common in mint condition that they trade for under face value and are used as postage. You don't see BU rolls of 1944 Wash quarters trading for face value.

Things have a way of changing. If enough of those stamps get used and destroyed, just maybe, they'll be worth something down the road. The rare and high grade stamps from the 1850-1930 period will always be desireable. But that represents a tiny fraction of the stamp market.

roadrunner

pf70collector

someone trying to breathe life into the hobby.rare fake inverted Jenny
I collected stamps in my early teens up to my mid 20's. I don't think the hobby is dead and some segments are still very strong, but I haven't collected since. I use to collect the entire sheets also. Have about 200 of them in mint condition and still have them. Most are worth face, but haven't checked lately what they are worth.

Michigan

Coins are perceived as investments by the investment crowd, but not stamps. The new investor likes the feel of a Trade dollar or a $20 Saint or even an old silver half dollar from 1806. But how does a stamp feel in your hand? The size is a problem too imo. Just too small an item.


Fine art has coins beat hands down in the "size" dept. Size is not everything of couse but I have to admit that a lot fine art that
I have seen is a lot more impressive than any morgan dollar for instance.

Shamika

<< <i>The great things in the stamp / postal history field are mostly NOT held by people who would sell if the value of their material increases. This makes for very good long term growth in value. With coins, a very large percentage of items are held by people who would sell if the value increased substantially - that makes for a more volatile market. >>


So very true! The coin market has surged in the past few years and so many coin have come out of the woodwork that at times it seems hard for the market to absorb them.

Shamika

<< <i>Also the USPS policy changes that no longer allow collectors to buy just one or two of a certain stamp (now they come in panes)discourages younger collectors with limited budgets. >>



Quarterlvr - Is there really a policy like this? Can the post office not be bothered with $0.39 transactions?