No big deal, remember when the guy bought the SEGS lincoln in a Heritage auction, crossed it to PCGS and made 10K. A lot of hoopin and hollerin went on in the Registry Forum.
I'll bet Heritage had listed the sales from previous auctions, regardless of the slab.
<< <i> Any dealer who uses the PCGS price guide for NON-PCGS graded coins is not being honest nor will I respect them. If you are selling a coin and use that guide, make it a PCGS coin. If you want to use some other guide # then use the REDBOOK. That is for ALL properly graded coins. Right? It may not be the most accurate, but neither is the PCGS guide.
Or, do a little work, get permission, and use greysheet.
Using the PCGS price guide for non-PCGS coins, particularly 3rd tier TPG, is pretty bad, imho. >>
Wow tough crowd indeed..!!..The price guide is posted a public info...It is true about using it for PCGS coins though...maybe better judgment but nothing dishonest.....
The prices listed in the PCGS Price Guide are the average dealer asking prices for properly graded United States coins. The prices are compiled from various sources including dealer ads in trade papers, dealer fixed price lists, significant auctions, and activity at major coin shows. Prices for the most actively traded coins are updated daily. Other issues are updated as needed. All prices are reviewed at least once a month. >>
It sounds like the price guide is for any properly graded coin without regard to whether it's slabbed or raw. Or am I misreading PCGS's statement?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
The prices listed in the PCGS Price Guide are the average dealer asking prices for properly graded United States coins. The prices are compiled from various sources including dealer ads in trade papers, dealer fixed price lists, significant auctions, and activity at major coin shows. Prices for the most actively traded coins are updated daily. Other issues are updated as needed. All prices are reviewed at least once a month. >>
It sounds like the price guide is for any properly graded coin without regard to whether it's slabbed or raw. Or am I misreading PCGS's statement? >>
I think you are correct, "properly graded" means a slabbed or raw coin graded by PCGS standards. The coin that started this thread would not receive a PR69DCAM grade from PCGS, because it doesn't meet PCGS standards for that grade.
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
I would not be inclined to degrade my inventory, the grading service, or a price guide offering a coin at 25 cents on the dollar vs Market Retail (assuming I agreed with the grade on the holder). Nor would I openly communicate the basis of my pricing whether CDN + x%, coin world trends, etc.(you subject yourself to nitpicking or some guy coming up to your table with a later version of the price guide than you have). For a show (and assuming I was using the PCGS price guide as a pricing tool) I would put a price sticker of $95 on the coin (PCGS retail is $110) and put it in my case (leaving room for negotiation say if I had only $25 in it). For an ebay store I would reflect a BIN of $95 and activate the "make offer" feature. In terms of retail pricing my inventory, it is the coin (plus where it falls in the grade range) and not who's holder it is in or if it is slabbed at all that determines asking price. For all we know, in a decade or two the whole grading service circus and its plethoria of services could be replaced by some other medium or method / grading scale altogether.
Even in a dealers case at $95 the coin is priced well below market retail and hardly a rip. Many dealers I have seen on the bourse use Coin World Value Trends or the PCGS Pricing Guide as a retail price tool irregardless of whether the coin is slabbed or not. They may mark their grade on a raw coin or leave the grade off and write the appropriate selling price. There are advantages and disadvantages to either practice. Some don't do either and simply have a cost and retail price code on the back of the holder.
What I have found more alarming on the bourse (or internet) are big ticket coins (from well known dealers) priced over $1000 in grading service slabs which are obviously overgraded upon closer examination leaving one to wonder how many times that dealer resubmited the coin or did that particular grading service grade the coin based on who's name was on the invoice. Also the huge premiums for MS / PR 70 coins people pay (these coins aren't even listed in CDN, LOL) who then spend good money (chasing the bigger fool?) slabbing modern coins. Sooner or later the situation is going to catch up with all those chasing the bigger fool if it has not started to happen already.
Comments
I'll bet Heritage had listed the sales from previous auctions, regardless of the slab.
<< <i>
Any dealer who uses the PCGS price guide for NON-PCGS graded coins is not being honest nor will I respect them.
If you are selling a coin and use that guide, make it a PCGS coin. If you want to use some other guide # then use the REDBOOK. That is for ALL properly graded coins. Right? It may not be the most accurate, but neither is the PCGS guide.
Or, do a little work, get permission, and use greysheet.
Using the PCGS price guide for non-PCGS coins, particularly 3rd tier TPG, is pretty bad, imho. >>
Wow tough crowd indeed..!!..The price guide is posted a public info...It is true about using it for PCGS coins though...maybe better judgment but nothing dishonest.....
<< <i>JbatDavidLawrence actually thanked you guys for the comments. He must be a nice guy. >>
This is one of the reasons they are one of my favorite dealers. They actually react to collector input, instead of simply ignoring us.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>I agree, all it says is:
The prices listed in the PCGS Price Guide are the average dealer asking prices for properly graded United States coins. The prices are compiled from various sources including dealer ads in trade papers, dealer fixed price lists, significant auctions, and activity at major coin shows. Prices for the most actively traded coins are updated daily. Other issues are updated as needed. All prices are reviewed at least once a month. >>
It sounds like the price guide is for any properly graded coin without regard to whether it's slabbed or raw. Or am I misreading PCGS's statement?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>
<< <i>I agree, all it says is:
The prices listed in the PCGS Price Guide are the average dealer asking prices for properly graded United States coins. The prices are compiled from various sources including dealer ads in trade papers, dealer fixed price lists, significant auctions, and activity at major coin shows. Prices for the most actively traded coins are updated daily. Other issues are updated as needed. All prices are reviewed at least once a month. >>
It sounds like the price guide is for any properly graded coin without regard to whether it's slabbed or raw. Or am I misreading PCGS's statement? >>
I think you are correct, "properly graded" means a slabbed or raw coin graded by PCGS standards. The coin that started this thread would not receive a PR69DCAM grade from PCGS, because it doesn't meet PCGS standards for that grade.
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
Even in a dealers case at $95 the coin is priced well below market retail and hardly a rip. Many dealers I have seen on the bourse use Coin World Value Trends or the PCGS Pricing Guide as a retail price tool irregardless of whether the coin is slabbed or not. They may mark their grade on a raw coin or leave the grade off and write the appropriate selling price. There are advantages and disadvantages to either practice. Some don't do either and simply have a cost and retail price code on the back of the holder.
What I have found more alarming on the bourse (or internet) are big ticket coins (from well known dealers) priced over $1000 in grading service slabs which are obviously overgraded upon closer examination leaving one to wonder how many times that dealer resubmited the coin or did that particular grading service grade the coin based on who's name was on the invoice. Also the huge premiums for MS / PR 70 coins people pay (these coins aren't even listed in CDN, LOL) who then spend good money (chasing the bigger fool?) slabbing modern coins. Sooner or later the situation is going to catch up with all those chasing the bigger fool if it has not started to happen already.
Parker
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
<< <i>Does not surprise me. Wait till the market softens some more. >>
Interesting comment, in a slowing market will bottom feeding slabbers have an increase in submissions