all options will be done soon. I've written about the mint cutting off ordering based on run rate of orders for the last several weeks. I believe that they will do the same with this set.
The latest information from some friends who recently ordered large quantities of the 1/10 oz coin is that the US Mint was deluged with orders for the 1/10 oz platinum "w" mint and that they had to cut off sales since it will be VERY COMMON compared to the other three coins. The US Mint needed to re-balance the quantities ordered.
<< <i>Hey Full strike....could ebay sales drop values to bulion prices for other coins such as Buffalos in your opinion?? >>
I really believe the Proof Buffaloes will hold close to their issue price of $800.00. If you look at the 2001 Silver version and its 600,000 total mintage, then the Proof Gold Buffalo doesn't seem like it's overproduced.
As far as the MS Gold Buffaloes, the hyped up First Strikes and especially the First Strike MS70's will never see bullion levels but the regular PCGS MS69's are at bullion now, aren't they?
I take the contrarian view about the US Mint. They already baited us ( buying collector / speculator public ) with the 20th anniversary sets, so now they want more with this open issue of BU sets.
If they don't strike up 1000's of sets and offer them forever, I'd be very surprised. Think 1999 Susan B Anthonys ( offered for what? 5 years? ), 2001 Kennedy's ( still being offered ), 1999 Proof Sets ( brought back 3 years after sales supposedly closed ). And don't forget the State Quarter First Day Covers, Spoons, Folios and whatever else, that are offered until gone.
I think the mint may have other priorities than to keep on minting the uncirculated w plats beyond what they have already minted. Guess we will find out in 07 if these are still available from the mint. A small investment of $1300 dollars for the 10th, Quarter and Half won't break me to find out.
As soon as the first wave of these hit eBay, I'm certain they will bring over issue price. Don't you think the US Mint knows this? Do you think they won't sell tons of them when this happens? They've already stated that they will be selling these coins into 2007. I would think if they strike up less than 5,000 sets then they aren't doing their homework. Since these sets were dreamed up in the aftermath of the anniversary sets sell-out, I think they know darn well they are going to cash-in. They are not in the game to deliver extreme scarcity to the modern coin buyer.
Or am I wrong - is there really a Santa Coins-Claus living at the US mint?
<< <i>forget about striking up thousands of platinum sets,
maybe bison nickels and proof sets and mint sets......
but not $2600 platinum sets.
>>
The Mint struck 10,000 3-pc Gold Anniversary sets at an issue price of $2610.00 - they sold out in a few hours or a few days, depending on what you read. The 3-pc Silver Sets were struck to the tune of 250,000 @$100.00 per set. OK, it took longer to sell these, but they did sell-out. Both sets are now going for nice money on eBay.
What happens when the BU Platinums start selling on eBay? If the Mint announces a cut off of production, not saying how many it has on hand, orders will pour in. So what if they have 5,000 or 8,000sets on hand - they will go fast.
The Mint is out to make money. They don't make money with only a few thousand sets. They can sell 5,000 easy. I think they knew this going in.
Actually that’s a $1290 investment, and by doing that instead on the 4 coin set, you passed on the one ounce at $1295, a $95 discount! (And close to melt price!)
<< <i>As soon as the first wave of these hit eBay, I'm certain they will bring over issue price. Don't you think the US Mint knows this? Do you think they won't sell tons of them when this happens? They've already stated that they will be selling these coins into 2007. I would think if they strike up less than 5,000 sets then they aren't doing their homework. Since these sets were dreamed up in the aftermath of the anniversary sets sell-out, I think they know darn well they are going to cash-in. They are not in the game to deliver extreme scarcity to the modern coin buyer.
Or am I wrong - is there really a Santa Coins-Claus living at the US mint? >>
First off, If the Mint sees 1/10 oz plats selling on ebay, as if they look, they don't decide to fire up the presses. The Mintage, by now is probably pretty well set.
Second, they will sell into 2007, as they always do, if coins THAT HAVE BEEN MINTED are still available. They do not mint more coins.
Third, the 1/10 sell out indicates to some, not you, that they are not going overboard with these. This makes it a higher probability that it will be a low mintage, although know one knows for sure.
Forth, Do you really think someone in September thought up doing a "W" Unc Plat. I'm sure this was planned for a long time and is way more complex that just tossing a couple more burgers on the barbeQ. I mean this is the Govt minting Platinum coins. First you need blanks ordered, then you need dies, then you need boxes, etc, etc. They just don't strike up a few million dollars worth of Platinum on a whim.
That's fine if you don't want or like the coin, but most of your arguements are pretty weak.
The One oz Proof Gold Eagle has been marked "no longer available" early in the ordering period, for the past several years. Yet they could still be obtained as part of the 4-pc Set. Did the 4-pc set sell out after the single One Ounce Proof Eagle was gone? No, I don't think so. There were always plenty of 4-pc sets available.
Will the 4-pc Platinum BU Sets sell out? I doubt it. I'm still forcasting at least 5,000 sets being available - most likely up to 8,000. Has anyone noticed the Mint is no longer making the Ordering information available on the BU W-Mint Eagles?
I wonder why is that? Are they trying to conceal a boom in ordering? Wouldn't want to discourage speculative ordering now would they? At the very least they might want to dispose of the 1000's of sets in the early part of 2007. To hold those sets as long as they've had the 2001 Kennedy's would be bad business.
Think what you want all ye agents of the US Mint. In my humble opinion, the Mint wants to move tons of BU W-mint bullion. With your help, I'm sure they will succeed.
You can keep living in your dream world about 1000's of Platinum sets being minted and available well into 2007 while the other "knowledgable" members of this board are selling this set at high profits. This is the sleeper. Proof reverse dies, Unc W Platinum. The only issue is which coin in the set will be rarest.
Less for you, more for me.
Just like the dopes who passed on the 20th Anniv Gold Sets and then are bi#ching about "am I going to get mine" when they ordered 1 day late. Everyone I told to buy - bought multiple sets on the first day and most dumped before getting thier cc bills for about 2x thier money.
Ditto with 99 silver proof sets.
These platinums will go the same way as the 2002 Salt Lake $5 unc's and the 2004 Proof Platinum 4 coin sets. Have you seen any of those close to issue lately? Everyone thought those were minted in the 1000's and would be available.....wow what happened?
And after all is said and done, you have a 30 day money back policy......NO RISK!
I agree that the fractional gold is another sleeper of the series, but i'm still watching mintages. Latest numbers i've seen in NN (Mint Stats 11/14 ) are:
I agree that the fractional gold is another sleeper of the series, but i'm still watching mintages. Latest numbers i've seen in NN (Mint Stats 11/14 ) are:
I will not profess to understand what the US Mint's plan is, etc. After all, it is the US government.
However, I did see on NN website that the Mint is beginning to sell the 2007 bullion Eagle and Buffalo coins starting December 28th. (will this include fractional buffalos??).
So this tells me they probably are not minting more of the 2006 platinum coins. Yes, they will probably continue to sell/offer into 2007, but probably only the ones that have already been minted. So the question to me is.... how many have been minted up to this point?? That will be the determining factor on what these will be worth...
<< <i>So the question to me is.... how many have been minted up to this point?? That will be the determining factor on what these will be worth... >>
Tincup, that is exactly the question. What we have with the W-minted BU Coins is BULLion. Does the US Mint want to let slip an issue with only a few thousand minted? I doubt it. How many would like to order the Reverse Proof Gold Eagle now that they've seen it sell on eBay? I think if the BU issues ended up selling for similar big bucks, there would be many who would then like to order directly from the US Mint.
Surprise, surprise, surprise. The US Mint is set to make people happy. They do indeed have thousands of sets on hand(pure speculation on my part). And I'm willing to bet that the orders have poured in. Numismatic News has not published the ordering numbers for a couple weeks now. Why is that? Who is holding out, NN or the Mint? And why would they withhold the numbers?
I think the US Mint doesn't want to chase off any speculators.
If it's a marketing gimmick, it's not to sell more 1/10 oz coins. The ploy - if it's a ploy - could be aimed at selling out the other denominations or, more likely, fueling interest in the 2007 issues.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
<< <i>Again I don't think the mint is that smart..... >>
LOL.
For the US Mint to sell Kennedy Halves and Sacagaweas by the bag and roll, when clearly the general population doesn't want them - I think makes them VERY smart.
I mean, this is crap that should be available at any bank at FACE value. And here they sell millions of dollars worth each year. It's like getting an interest free loan from whoever is buying this junk. No wait, it's more like you're opening an interest free savings account with them and giving THEM a free toaster on top of the deal.
<< <i>If it's a marketing gimmick, it's not to sell more 1/10 oz coins. The ploy - if it's a ploy - could be aimed at selling out the other denominations or, more likely, fueling interest in the 2007 issues. >>
Thanks for refocusing the thread MrEureke. I'm having a hard time understanding what the suspected conspiracy is in all these recent posts.
So in the inaugural year of the uncirc. "w" platinum series we have a sellout of the 1/10 oz. coin. Some people suspect that the 1/10 had a deliberately low mintage to drive sales of the 4 coin set. Is that the claim? This seems like a reasonable way for the mint to get people to collect the whole series rather than just going the cheap route and signing up for a delivery of a yearly 1/10th oz. coin.
you will be the sorry one when these sets are final at around 3000 sets. the magic number is sub 4000 sets. NN has published mintage figures as late as Nov 14 (Nov 28 Issue) - but I guess you dont get those?? so therefore you speculate?
why is everything a conspiracy theory with some forum members.
here is the factual story.
late sales start date (Sept 28) - just after a flurry of mint issues in Aug/Sept (SF Mint, Legacy Sets, 20th Anniv Sets), everyone (especially speculators) are "tapped out" of funds - even on plastic......., mintage "run rates" of around 100-150 sets of platinum per week for the 6 weeks through nov 14 (factual), 1/10 oz selling out at around 3000 coins (give or take a few hundred).
set delivery pushed back to Dec 11 from 11/8, then 11/22.
i wont call the rarest coin in the bunch, but it'll be either the 1/4 or 1/2. I cover them both with the 4 coin set.
i actually want all to stay away and not buy........maybe i should just agree with fullstrike, kind of reverse psychology
I really think the conspiracy believers.... give the US Mint too much credit.
They just plain do not have the time to mint more.... it is time for the 2007 coins to be focused on. In the case of these 2006 W coins, I really think they had an initial minting of these.... and intended to mint more if they really took off and sold quickly. However, they have not... sold very slowly, and now it is time to move on for the Mint. The 2006 allotment sold out (with some still being held for the 4 coin set), and they most likely will not mint more. If any more of the other denomination remain, they will sell into 2007 for how long it takes to dispose of them.
The REAL question.... just how many of each was minted during the run? This is where the quessing games come it. Sure, it's possible the 'evil' Mint purposely minted 10,000 of each and are quietly holding them to manipulate us.... but I think that scenario is very unlikely.
A good example to guestimate how many were minted.... may be to take a look at the 3 piece AGE 20th set. If I remember, these went out in what.... roughly 3 shipment dates? So had most likely 3 minting runs. When they had 2 or 3 thousand minted, they shipped out the first group. Then it was waiting time again until the Mint produced the next group to get sent out, and so on.
Using this as an example.... perhaps 2,000 to 3,500? And maybe less of the higher denominations?
Tincup, you present a very fanciful scenario. I hope you are correct in your assumptions. If this is indeed true, then everyone who gets in will be a winner many times over.
Does anyone out there have the latest order numbers from the Mint? I last saw figures from a couple weeks ago.
<< <i>Tincup, you present a very fanciful scenario. I hope you are correct in your assumptions. If this is indeed true, then everyone who gets in will be a winner many times over.
Does anyone out there have the latest order numbers from the Mint? I last saw figures from a couple weeks ago. >>
FullStrike, the last numbers that I have seen are from the Nov 28th issue of NN..... and are:
1 ounce--- 234 half ounce- 403 1/4 ounce- 402 1/10 ounce- 1,558 set of 4--- 951
Of course, these do not tell the full story; they are somewhat dated, and.... depend on the numbers that the Mint provides to NN. And, as previously pointed out, the numbers can be underreported by the Mint to help 'stir' up that demand and frenzy. We just plain don't know, and each of us has to make the best decision we can based on the rather limited and questionable info that we have.
While I tend to not give the Mint credit for being that devious in this case.... it would not overly suprise me if you do turn out to be right and the Mint has manipulated numbers/supply and high mintages turn out.
One thing I do have to give credit to the Mint for: and that is the situation with the 20th AGE reverse proofs. I really think that once the Mint saw how the gold sets sold in 24hrs, they were really tempted to mint the reverse proof singles, just like with the uncs with W mintmarks. It even looks like they were starting to lay the groundwork to allow it, they changed the wording on their web sites, etc. My gut feeling is that it very well might have happened, if it were not for the collector's reactions--- we cancelled orders for the 2 coin unc sets (myself included), wrote the Mint, called the Mint, etc., to express the disappointment on how they started minting the silver rev proofs as singles. I really think that's what stopped them from proceeding with minting gold rev proofs as singles also. We got their attention on that issue.
Surely the US Mint is not going to shoot themselves in the foot on this issue with the unc Platinums. But.... they are the US government....
<< <i>So, given the trend of the number sold so far of the Plat W-unc, isn't the 1-oz looking to be the least sold?
Are the 1/2 oz and 1/4 oz of the series forecast by some to be the rarest of the denominations simply because of past experience? >>
Again, it all comes down to how many have been minted to this point. They will probably keep selling until the number minted thus far are sold, even if into 2007. Although the one ounce has the lowest number, I suspect when they are all sold out on all options the number minted of the one ounce will be roughly equal to the half and quarter ounce, perhaps a few more.
It's a gamble and a guessing game. But at this point, looks like there are some good odds in our favor. We just don't know what cards the Mint is holding face down.
Anyone who looks at the numbers and believes there really IS a Santa Claus might convince themselves the US Mint ( part of the US Government - as was pointed out ) is all set to hand out $100 bills for $1.
I just don't see it. After all, the US Mint is out to make money. They do not give away opportunities unless they are seriously caught napping. With this open mintage issue of West Point BU Bullion Coins, I have to assume their eyes and ears are wide open.
Believe what you want. Mortgage the house and order till your eyes turn brown. If the dream is true, you are about to strike it rich. If it turns out to be a US Mint rip-off campaign, just pray the bullion markets hold up.
Has anyone noticed the States progressively starting up Lotteries and also joining in on Multi-State Lotteries over the years? Also, the Gambling Casino seems to be spreading as a revenue producer.
Well, the Federal Government seems to have turned the US Mint into a big gambling casino. Step right up folks, take a chance now. Feed your coins, bills, checks, and credit cards in. Take your prize in rare gold and platinum coins!
I really can't afford the platinum set, BUT if I sell my 2002 Proof Platinum 69 PCGS set that I doubled my money on, I can afford it. I don't think I can lose much since I am using the profit I already made and the platinum price is about the same with either set. Am I right or wrong?????? Puritan
For all you conspiracy theorists, note that the Mint is now posting on their website that they will continue to take orders for the SF Mint commems up until Dec. 15, but they cannot guarantee that orders taken after Dec. 1 will be filled.
Considering how slow the sales of these have been, doesn't this sound like a blatant attempt to stampede people into buying them? Back in marketing class, they taught us that if you were a supermarket with tons of canned rutabaga that was not selling, put up a sign "LIMIT TWO TO A CUSTOMER" and everybody that sees the sign will take two, just in case.
TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
<< <i>For all you conspiracy theorists, note that the Mint is now posting on their website that they will continue to take orders for the SF Mint commems up until Dec. 15, but they cannot guarantee that orders taken after Dec. 1 will be filled.
Considering how slow the sales of these have been, doesn't this sound like a blatant attempt to stampede people into buying them? Back in marketing class, they taught us that if you were a supermarket with tons of canned rutabaga that was not selling, put up a sign "LIMIT TWO TO A CUSTOMER" and everybody that sees the sign will take two, just in case.
TD >>
Not if they visit Ebay I brought a proof for $198 plus shipping. It's easy to get either coin for around $210 right now. No mint for me on these.
Comments
<< <i>Hey Full strike....could ebay sales drop values to bulion prices for other coins such as Buffalos in your opinion?? >>
I really believe the Proof Buffaloes will hold close to their issue price of $800.00. If you look at the 2001 Silver version and its 600,000 total mintage, then the Proof Gold Buffalo doesn't seem like it's overproduced.
As far as the MS Gold Buffaloes, the hyped up First Strikes and especially the First Strike MS70's will never see bullion levels but the regular PCGS MS69's are at bullion now, aren't they?
<< <i>
<< <i>Hey Full strike....could ebay sales drop values to bulion prices for other coins such as Buffalos in your opinion?? >>
Good point
run rate of sales did not project more than 2500 coins for 1/10 oz........which they now hit.....and closed the option,
I believe the 4 coin sets and 1 oz option are even less.
If you want one, better to buy it very soon or be closed out.
Think of the same situation when it happened with the 2002 salt lake $5 bu and the 2004 proof 4 coin set (plat)
Same deal,,,,,early shutdown of sales
If they don't strike up 1000's of sets and offer them forever, I'd be very surprised. Think 1999 Susan B Anthonys ( offered for what? 5 years? ), 2001 Kennedy's ( still being offered ), 1999 Proof Sets ( brought back 3 years after sales supposedly closed ). And don't forget the State Quarter First Day Covers, Spoons, Folios and whatever else, that are offered until gone.
Might order the 1/4 oz coin however.....
Finding any of the proof platinum coins is not all that easy.....
forget about striking up thousands of platinum sets,
maybe bison nickels and proof sets and mint sets......
but not $2600 platinum sets.
I'll be certain to pm you when i sell my plat sets for 3x issue soon after they are "no longer available"
Box of 20
Or am I wrong - is there really a Santa Coins-Claus living at the US mint?
<< <i>forget about striking up thousands of platinum sets,
maybe bison nickels and proof sets and mint sets......
but not $2600 platinum sets.
>>
The Mint struck 10,000 3-pc Gold Anniversary sets at an issue price of $2610.00 - they sold out in a few hours or a few days, depending on what you read. The 3-pc Silver Sets were struck to the tune of 250,000 @$100.00 per set. OK, it took longer to sell these, but they did sell-out. Both sets are now going for nice money on eBay.
What happens when the BU Platinums start selling on eBay? If the Mint announces a cut off of production, not saying how many it has on hand, orders will pour in. So what if they have 5,000 or 8,000sets on hand - they will go fast.
The Mint is out to make money. They don't make money with only a few thousand sets. They can sell 5,000 easy. I think they knew this going in.
how many gold sets did you buy and profit on?
Box of 20
You simply don't see these anyplace.....
The REAL rairty will be the frational gold "W"
<< <i>As soon as the first wave of these hit eBay, I'm certain they will bring over issue price. Don't you think the US Mint knows this? Do you think they won't sell tons of them when this happens? They've already stated that they will be selling these coins into 2007. I would think if they strike up less than 5,000 sets then they aren't doing their homework. Since these sets were dreamed up in the aftermath of the anniversary sets sell-out, I think they know darn well they are going to cash-in. They are not in the game to deliver extreme scarcity to the modern coin buyer.
Or am I wrong - is there really a Santa Coins-Claus living at the US mint?
First off, If the Mint sees 1/10 oz plats selling on ebay, as if they look, they don't decide to fire up the presses. The Mintage, by now is probably pretty well set.
Second, they will sell into 2007, as they always do, if coins THAT HAVE BEEN MINTED are still available. They do not mint more coins.
Third, the 1/10 sell out indicates to some, not you, that they are not going overboard with these. This makes it a higher probability that it will be a low mintage, although know one knows for sure.
Forth, Do you really think someone in September thought up doing a "W" Unc Plat. I'm sure this was planned for a long time and is way more complex that just tossing a couple more burgers on the barbeQ. I mean this is the Govt minting Platinum coins. First you need blanks ordered, then you need dies, then you need boxes, etc, etc. They just don't strike up a few million dollars worth of Platinum on a whim.
That's fine if you don't want or like the coin, but most of your arguements are pretty weak.
Will the 4-pc Platinum BU Sets sell out? I doubt it. I'm still forcasting at least 5,000 sets being available - most likely up to 8,000. Has anyone noticed the Mint is no longer making the Ordering information available on the BU W-Mint Eagles?
I wonder why is that? Are they trying to conceal a boom in ordering? Wouldn't want to discourage speculative ordering now would they? At the very least they might want to dispose of the 1000's of sets in the early part of 2007. To hold those sets as long as they've had the 2001 Kennedy's would be bad business.
Think what you want all ye agents of the US Mint. In my humble opinion, the Mint wants to move tons of BU W-mint bullion. With your help, I'm sure they will succeed.
You can keep living in your dream world about 1000's of Platinum sets being minted and available well into 2007 while the other "knowledgable" members of this board are selling this set at high profits. This is the sleeper. Proof reverse dies, Unc W Platinum. The only issue is which coin in the set will be rarest.
Less for you, more for me.
Just like the dopes who passed on the 20th Anniv Gold Sets and then are bi#ching about "am I going to get mine" when they ordered 1 day late. Everyone I told to buy - bought multiple sets on the first day and most dumped before getting thier cc bills for about 2x thier money.
Ditto with 99 silver proof sets.
These platinums will go the same way as the 2002 Salt Lake $5 unc's and the 2004 Proof Platinum 4 coin sets. Have you seen any of those close to issue lately? Everyone thought those were minted in the 1000's and would be available.....wow what happened?
And after all is said and done, you have a 30 day money back policy......NO RISK!
Wake up and smell the coffee.
I agree that the fractional gold is another sleeper of the series, but i'm still watching mintages. Latest numbers i've seen in NN (Mint Stats 11/14 ) are:
Ounce 3,758 + 30,000 = 33,758 (20th Anniv, 4 pc Sets, Single)
1/2 3,100
1/4 3,236
1/10 7,685
4pc 1,616 Included in the above figures
<< <i>Florida Bill -
I agree that the fractional gold is another sleeper of the series, but i'm still watching mintages. Latest numbers i've seen in NN (Mint Stats 11/14 ) are:
Ounce 3,758 + 30,000 = 33,758 (20th Anniv, 4 pc Sets, Single)
1/2 3,100
1/4 3,236
1/10 7,685
4pc 1,616 Included in the above figures >>
Of the gold eagles, which are the more popular. I'm guessing the 1oz, right?
You get the people with money to nab the 1 oz coins and the people without money to nab the 1/10 oz coins (that is me
However, I did see on NN website that the Mint is beginning to sell the 2007 bullion Eagle and Buffalo coins starting December 28th. (will this include fractional buffalos??).
So this tells me they probably are not minting more of the 2006 platinum coins. Yes, they will probably continue to sell/offer into 2007, but probably only the ones that have already been minted. So the question to me is.... how many have been minted up to this point?? That will be the determining factor on what these will be worth...
<< <i>The 1 oz and 1/10 oz coins in the gold and platinum series are always the most popular.....
You get the people with money to nab the 1 oz coins and the people without money to nab the 1/10 oz coins (that is me
That's what I thought.
(I'm in the poor club too)
Look at all the 2007 stuff out already (foreign).....
<< <i>So the question to me is.... how many have been minted up to this point?? That will be the determining factor on what these will be worth... >>
Tincup, that is exactly the question. What we have with the W-minted BU Coins is BULLion. Does the US Mint want to let slip an issue with only a few thousand minted? I doubt it. How many would like to order the Reverse Proof Gold Eagle now that they've seen it sell on eBay? I think if the BU issues ended up selling for similar big bucks, there would be many who would then like to order directly from the US Mint.
Surprise, surprise, surprise. The US Mint is set to make people happy. They do indeed have thousands of sets on hand(pure speculation on my part). And I'm willing to bet that the orders have poured in. Numismatic News has not published the ordering numbers for a couple weeks now. Why is that? Who is holding out, NN or the Mint? And why would they withhold the numbers?
I think the US Mint doesn't want to chase off any speculators.
I agree with some of what you say, if they start selling the 1/10 oz coins again..... Could the not available be a marketing point any only that.....
Then again this is the government we are talking about and are they that smart?
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Again I don't think the mint is that smart.....
<< <i>Again I don't think the mint is that smart..... >>
LOL.
For the US Mint to sell Kennedy Halves and Sacagaweas by the bag and roll, when clearly the general population doesn't want them - I think makes them VERY smart.
I mean, this is crap that should be available at any bank at FACE value. And here they sell millions of dollars worth each year. It's like getting an interest free loan from whoever is buying this junk. No wait, it's more like you're opening an interest free savings account with them and giving THEM a free toaster on top of the deal.
<< <i>If it's a marketing gimmick, it's not to sell more 1/10 oz coins. The ploy - if it's a ploy - could be aimed at selling out the other denominations or, more likely, fueling interest in the 2007 issues. >>
Thanks for refocusing the thread MrEureke. I'm having a hard time understanding what the suspected conspiracy is in all these recent posts.
So in the inaugural year of the uncirc. "w" platinum series we have a sellout of the 1/10 oz. coin. Some people suspect that the 1/10 had a deliberately low mintage to drive sales of the 4 coin set. Is that the claim? This seems like a reasonable way for the mint to get people to collect the whole series rather than just going the cheap route and signing up for a delivery of a yearly 1/10th oz. coin.
What else is included in the controversy?
you will be the sorry one when these sets are final at around 3000 sets. the magic number is sub 4000 sets. NN has published mintage figures as late as Nov 14 (Nov 28 Issue) - but I guess you dont get those?? so therefore you speculate?
why is everything a conspiracy theory with some forum members.
here is the factual story.
late sales start date (Sept 28) - just after a flurry of mint issues in Aug/Sept (SF Mint, Legacy Sets, 20th Anniv Sets), everyone (especially speculators) are "tapped out" of funds - even on plastic......., mintage "run rates" of around 100-150 sets of platinum per week for the 6 weeks through nov 14 (factual), 1/10 oz selling out at around 3000 coins (give or take a few hundred).
set delivery pushed back to Dec 11 from 11/8, then 11/22.
i wont call the rarest coin in the bunch, but it'll be either the 1/4 or 1/2. I cover them both with the 4 coin set.
i actually want all to stay away and not buy........maybe i should just agree with fullstrike, kind of reverse psychology
They just plain do not have the time to mint more.... it is time for the 2007 coins to be focused on. In the case of these 2006 W coins, I really think they had an initial minting of these.... and intended to mint more if they really took off and sold quickly. However, they have not... sold very slowly, and now it is time to move on for the Mint. The 2006 allotment sold out (with some still being held for the 4 coin set), and they most likely will not mint more. If any more of the other denomination remain, they will sell into 2007 for how long it takes to dispose of them.
The REAL question.... just how many of each was minted during the run? This is where the quessing games come it. Sure, it's possible the 'evil' Mint purposely minted 10,000 of each and are quietly holding them to manipulate us.... but I think that scenario is very unlikely.
Using this as an example.... perhaps 2,000 to 3,500? And maybe less of the higher denominations?
Does anyone out there have the latest order numbers from the Mint? I last saw figures from a couple weeks ago.
Here's another senario.
What if the Mint makes a couple 'rare' coins. AGE Rev. Pr. and maybe the ASE Rev. Pr.
Then they produce low mintage "W" coins.
The general public sees this and wants in on the action. Mint sales go UP because everyone wants the big score.
What if the Mint is so smart they are creating more demand by making a couple/few winners ??
Hmmmm.
<< <i>Tincup, you present a very fanciful scenario. I hope you are correct in your assumptions. If this is indeed true, then everyone who gets in will be a winner many times over.
Does anyone out there have the latest order numbers from the Mint? I last saw figures from a couple weeks ago. >>
FullStrike, the last numbers that I have seen are from the Nov 28th issue of NN..... and are:
1 ounce--- 234
half ounce- 403
1/4 ounce- 402
1/10 ounce- 1,558
set of 4--- 951
Of course, these do not tell the full story; they are somewhat dated, and.... depend on the numbers that the Mint provides to NN. And, as previously pointed out, the numbers can be underreported by the Mint to help 'stir' up that demand and frenzy. We just plain don't know, and each of us has to make the best decision we can based on the rather limited and questionable info that we have.
While I tend to not give the Mint credit for being that devious in this case.... it would not overly suprise me if you do turn out to be right and the Mint has manipulated numbers/supply and high mintages turn out.
One thing I do have to give credit to the Mint for: and that is the situation with the 20th AGE reverse proofs. I really think that once the Mint saw how the gold sets sold in 24hrs, they were really tempted to mint the reverse proof singles, just like with the uncs with W mintmarks. It even looks like they were starting to lay the groundwork to allow it, they changed the wording on their web sites, etc. My gut feeling is that it very well might have happened, if it were not for the collector's reactions--- we cancelled orders for the 2 coin unc sets (myself included), wrote the Mint, called the Mint, etc., to express the disappointment on how they started minting the silver rev proofs as singles. I really think that's what stopped them from proceeding with minting gold rev proofs as singles also. We got their attention on that issue.
Surely the US Mint is not going to shoot themselves in the foot on this issue with the unc Platinums. But.... they are the US government....
isn't the 1-oz looking to be the least sold?
Are the 1/2 oz and 1/4 oz of the series forecast by some to be the rarest
of the denominations simply because of past experience?
<< <i>So, given the trend of the number sold so far of the Plat W-unc,
isn't the 1-oz looking to be the least sold?
Are the 1/2 oz and 1/4 oz of the series forecast by some to be the rarest
of the denominations simply because of past experience? >>
Again, it all comes down to how many have been minted to this point. They will probably keep selling until the number minted thus far are sold, even if into 2007. Although the one ounce has the lowest number, I suspect when they are all sold out on all options the number minted of the one ounce will be roughly equal to the half and quarter ounce, perhaps a few more.
It's a gamble and a guessing game. But at this point, looks like there are some good odds in our favor. We just don't know what cards the Mint is holding face down.
Those are the ones I purchase because that is what I can afford, plain and simple.....
That is still an expensive coin.....
I just don't see it. After all, the US Mint is out to make money. They do not give away opportunities unless they are seriously caught napping. With this open mintage issue of West Point BU Bullion Coins, I have to assume their eyes and ears are wide open.
Believe what you want. Mortgage the house and order till your eyes turn brown. If the dream is true, you are about to strike it rich. If it turns out to be a US Mint rip-off campaign, just pray the bullion markets hold up.
Well, the Federal Government seems to have turned the US Mint into a big gambling casino. Step right up folks, take a chance now. Feed your coins, bills, checks, and credit cards in. Take your prize in rare gold and platinum coins!
Considering how slow the sales of these have been, doesn't this sound like a blatant attempt to stampede people into buying them? Back in marketing class, they taught us that if you were a supermarket with tons of canned rutabaga that was not selling, put up a sign "LIMIT TWO TO A CUSTOMER" and everybody that sees the sign will take two, just in case.
TD
<< <i>For all you conspiracy theorists, note that the Mint is now posting on their website that they will continue to take orders for the SF Mint commems up until Dec. 15, but they cannot guarantee that orders taken after Dec. 1 will be filled.
Considering how slow the sales of these have been, doesn't this sound like a blatant attempt to stampede people into buying them? Back in marketing class, they taught us that if you were a supermarket with tons of canned rutabaga that was not selling, put up a sign "LIMIT TWO TO A CUSTOMER" and everybody that sees the sign will take two, just in case.
TD >>
Not if they visit Ebay I brought a proof for $198 plus shipping. It's easy to get either coin for around $210 right now. No mint for me on these.