T3 Turkey Red Thread
packman
Posts: 948
I have been working on both the T3 Turkey Red set of Hall of Fame players in PSA 4 and a complete 1933 Goudey set in PSA 5/6. I am around 30% complete on the Goudey and in the single digits on the T3 set. I am realizing that with my other projects, I will need to focus on one of the sets because I cannot afford both. I am leaning towards selling my Goudeys and my 1955 Topps partial set (60%) and focus on the T3's. I love the design of the T3s. Does anyone have any comments on which set they would focus on? Is anybody working on a T3 set? How difficult is it to find the T3? Does SGC grade T3? Does anybody have pictures of advertisments for the T3 set? Do any of the back variations have a price premium (like T206s) or is it not an issue with this set?
David
David
0
Comments
I vote for T3's.
Pick up a copy of Lew Lipset's Encyclopedia of Baseball Cards. There are three volumes; the one you want is devoted to tobacco issues with excellent coverage on T#'s. His website is www.oldjudge.com.
John
SGC just started grading T3's, but IMO the PSA holders are nicer- not as big, and a perfect fit. I"m very slowly working on the T3/T9 set, and think it is one of the nicest sets in the hobby.
I don't have scans of T3 ads, but I have seen the actual display. It pictures an ad, a T3, Silk and L1 leather. It's pretty incredible. Back premiums are not an issue with this set, at least not yet. There are variations, the ad backs are in the higher series, the lower has a variation on the # listed, but overall they are all the same.
Here's a picture of the pack that contained the coupon that could be redeemed for T3's, L1's or silks (S81's I think).
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
<< <i>Lipsets 3 books have been combined into 1 volume, and IMO is a must have reference for pre War cards. You can get it directly from him or from VCBC >>
Griffins,
Thanks for providing the link. I was just on Lew's site and couldn't find the book for sale.
John
and Hall Of Famers look like this...
The decision is quite clear what set I choose! ...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
Griffins: Thanks for the info. I would love to see a picture of that ad. It must be impressive. I agree regarding the ability to always pick up the Goudey's. There never seems to be an end in sight of Goudey's from the auction houses. However, the T3's seem to be hit or miss. The Cobb tends to show up often; however, the other HOFs tend to be a little more difficult to locate. I love the Turkey Red box. I have not seen one for sale. Do they come up often? Have you ever seen the coupon or packaging that contained the Turkey Red card? Those would be nice companion pieces.
Jay: I have followed your set of the T3 cards. I agree that they are stunning cards.
I have decided to go for the T3 HOF set. The hard part is to limit myself to the HOFs. Especially when I see the McIntyre that Jay posted.
David
Jay is the expert on these but basically as you chose which card you wanted when you sent in the coupons Cobb was chosen a lot more often than "a safe play at third" or a common player.
I"ve got a few of the coupons but can't seem to locate the scan. I'll look a bit more. Empty packs seem to come up occassionally. I haven't seen an envelope that any of the premiums (T3, silk, or leather) were shipped in. The leathers are really scarce, and usually found with a pinhole in them. I recently saw a large collection of them in pristine condition and it was incredible.
In your last scenario, I think PSA missed the paper loss. Not uncommon lately.
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
and there are more Cobbs that any other player for the reason you stated since he was
popular and also through the years 10, 20, 30 etc years later one may throw out a Slim Sallee
but hold onto a Ty Cobb.
PSA has graded 35 Cobb's, more then any other card. And unlike cards from a 1976 set where
submitters may submit superstars more often. Usually a T3 submitter will submit anyone they have
as long as the condition warrants. I have seen cards missing a large chunk in a corner or the entire
back is skinned since it was glued to a scrapbook and others that were varnished etc...
So these won't get a numerical grade from PSA and few would try to submit them.
So any card that looks OK will get submitted from Cobb to Harry Coveleski...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
10 from TURKEY RED or 25 from FEZ or OLD MILL
Here are the scans from the T.Red & Fez vouchers that I scanned
awhile ago.
I do have an Old Mill laying around as well, I'll see if I can dig it up...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
(1) Was there a subsequent coupon for the T3 cards not mentioned on the scanned coupons? For example, I do not notice Home Run Baker on the list of players. Or were these players added after the fact due to lack of available redemption cards?
(2) I notice that the PSA label refers to 1911 but the coupons state the cards will be ready to mail on April 1, 1910. Shouldn't this be a 1910 set or a 1910-11 set?
David
The set was issued in 1910, the offer ended in 1911.
BTW, any resemblance to the boxer depicted in this card and CU member "Basilone" is purely coincidental. But it definitely makes you believe in reincarnation.
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
<< <i>The set was issued in 1910, the offer ended in 1911 >>
Correct!
When I first rec'd my Turkey Red voucher I noticed they were good from May 1, 1910
to June 30, 1911. So it dawned on me as well that this was NOT a 1911 issue but rather
a 1910/1911 issue. The Standard Catalog Of Baseball Cards listed it as 1911 as well as
PSA & GAI on their certification flips.
I contacted The Standard Catalog's editor Bob Lemke and he responded
"Hello Jay,
Your coupon makes an excellent case for moving back the date of issue on T3 to 1910. Since the new edition of the catalog in now on press, I'll have time to work on this before next year. Thanks for your report.
Bob Lemke"
Many thought this was a 1911 issue since the T3 cards state the offer expires on June 30, 1911
on the checklist backs and few had access to the coupon vouchers.
The Standard Catalog did indeed change the info in their 2006 guide.
DAVID - I don't have any vouchers for sale, but there not that tough nor expensive.
$15 to $25 should land you one on eBay unless the seller has a higher Buy It Now price...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
Jay: That was interesting regarding your e-mail correspondence with Bob Lemke. Do you know if PSA will correct their flips? I went to your website. Thank you for taking time to scan the T3. I really enjoyed looking at them. It must be amazing to see the grouping in person. You have an amazing collection of T3s.
David
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
To me the T9 boxers are part of the set since their numbers fall in between thew 1-126
the T9's are #51 to 76.
There were no T9 pricing in the smr up till a year ago and I sent a grid to Joe Orlando
and he used my info to price them.
Even though 14 of the 26 boxers are HOFers, most are considered commons except
for Jack Johnson, Abe Attell, Sam Langford, Jim Jeffries & Stanley Ketchell
the others will sell for a chunk below the common baseball player prices.
There's less boxers around and less collectors so it evens out a bit.
I have a dupe T9 boxer that Anthony posted in a PSA-3, if your interested
please PM or Email.
And remember....once you join the Turkey Red world, theres no going back ...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
<< <i>Just to add more temptation-the boxers are the same pose as their T218's, so both together look really cool as well >>
Same can be said w/ the T3 baseball players as 1/3 are identical/similar shots to T206's
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
Does every T3 match a T206?
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
If anybody sees a Turkey Red box for sale, please let me know. I will be keeping on eye out for one.
Thanks
David
RayB
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
<< <i>Does every T3 match a T206? >>
About 1/3 of the set does.
I'll play around with my attachments and show off a few T3's w/ T206's
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
so at least you'll see the similarities...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
David
be it 1 guy that did them all or a group that collaborated on them.
They always had respect in our hobby, they were never a secret
or anyone's second cousin.
3 things have helped their exposure
1)PSA/GAI/SGC now all grade & slab them
2)Topps last year and this year have made Turkey Red modern sets incl Football
3)and my article in SMR last October helped fuel the collecting fire of this set.
I'm just kidding about #3
although I was happy to share my findings & information w/ all that would listen.
Lord knows my wife could care less about a Wild Bill Donovan or a Bugs Raymond.
And finds it odd that I care about them.
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
Jay, that Overall is amazing! Is that the nicest card in your set? Stunning.
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
He was quite a good pitcher too!
In the 1908 World Series he won 2 games including a 3 hitter to win the final game.
The Cubbies haven't won a World Series since!
I wonder if Sweet Lou can bring a championship to the Cubs nation!
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
<< <i>The boxing cards in general are WAY under valued across the board and not just in the T9 series but ALL the early boxing cards in my opinion >>
I would've agreed with you up until about 6 months ago- have you seen T218 prices lately?
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
Here's a scan of the slabbed pair...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
I have a question about the T3 Mathewson. I was following the PSA 4 Mathewson in the recent Mastro auction. I decided not to bid because I assumed that it would sell in the $15,000 range (36% of the PSA 6 sale). I came up with this range based on two prior Mastro sales this year. A PSA 6 sold for approx. $44,000 and a PSA 2 sold for approx. $5,000. I was shocked to see the PSA 4 sell for approx. $6,700 (includes juice). I am kicking myself for not going after it. Do you guys think that $6,700 is fmv for this card or did the winner get a steal?
David
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
David
Jay has a good way of storing them, I'll let him describe the specifics.
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
Those are quite impressive. Congrats! You can store them at my house if you like!
RayB
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
Thanks for posting all the great scans Jay and Griff.
Shane
Recognize this one Ray?
Now collecting:
Topps Heritage
1957 Topps BB Ex+-NM
All Yaz Items 7+
Various Red Sox
Did I leave anything out?
Shane: I agree. I am really impressed by the T3s. I have collected many different sets (pre and post war). However, none of them compare to these cards. They remind me of minature paintings. I am trying to focus on the HOF and select commons and then branch out from there. I am also working on the T9s. Thanks to Jay, I have my first T9.
David
David
<< <i>Even the common players are magnificent >>
DAVID - I agree!
Many have vibrant colors that are awesome.
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
Ad backs are only in the high series and in many of those cards like Walter Johnson
PSA has graded more ad backs then checklist backs. So a Walter Johnson checklist back
card should be worth a premium.
I bid/buy T3's I need and if it has an ad back so be it. I will not pay a premium for it...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
Great cards. Anthony mentioned that you had a good way of storing the graded T3's. Would you please let me know how you store them. Thanks.
David
and many pop #'s have changed and I've learned a bit more about
the set as well. So perhaps another article can be written down the
road.
DAVID - Anthony is correct, I have a perfect (for me anyway) storage
solution. First I put each Turkey Red slab in a comic book sleeve, it
fits perfectly as if this was its main function. It is paramount to keep
the slab from scratching & scuffing as it will appear that the card has
the scratches on it.
These slabs are very heavy so its a good precautionary method.
Then I place the slabs in a plastic storage unit I picked up at Staples.
Its made for files, but fits about 45 cards perfectly, all standing up and braced well.
You will need 3 of these plastic units to house an entire set. Although I'm
still a few short on the 126 card set, I have series 1 Baseball subjects in 1 box,
series II in another and the 26 T9 boxers in the last.
The boxes cost about $10 each and are heavy duty and called "Tote & Go"
There are probably a couple other brands that would work as well, so bring a slab
to Staples, Office Depot etc... and see what can work for you...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com