<< <i>I voted 21, so long as they are full-time students. Otherwise, 18. Anyone who has a real, full-time job (or c/w/should have a real, full-time job), does not deserve freebies and perks as a YN, IMO. >>
Shame because I've had a full time job since I was 16 and no coin knowledge before then .
I think the YN perks should be help/knowledge based more so than gift based. Gifts don't teach very much in themselves. Knowledge is power.
edit: I don't know about other states, but in FL you can sit in on many nudy bars when you're 18. Also holds true in New Orleans.
-Daniel
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."
-Aristotle
Dum loquimur fugerit invida aetas. Carpe diem quam minimum credula postero.
<< <i>I think this may be the only thread she hasn't posted to. >>
Just curious, is there a list of all the young people here with their age? Not YN's but young people, say under the age of 25. >>
No clue. There certainly doesn't need to be. I don't think a distinction should be made between young and old collectors. Everyone should be encouraged to indulge in the hobby via the help of others and the generosity of others in the form of sharing of reference materials. I tend to have more patience when dealing with YNs and teaching them about various numismatic topics, but I certainly don't give them unreal expectations by lowering prices. I'd rather teach them to enjoy coins they can afford themselves rather than make them think they need to go after coins they wouldn't otherwise be able to afford if not for them being given and/or discounted for them. Of course, I collect holed coins, so what do I know.
<< I'm really interested to hear Amanda's opinion on the whole topic. >>
I think I am sensing the purpose of this thread...
>>
It honestly wasn't direct at any particular individual, it is just a popular topic and I thought a current polling would be appropriate for reference. I am very interested in hearing current 'YNs' opinions on the matter though. They may just sway my opinion on the other direction, who knows. >>
I guess I'll jump in here then. I also voted for the 18 age limit.
When I first joined these message boards I had no problem entering the YN giveaways. I truly was a YN. I had no source of income, knew hardly anything about numismatics, and fit the age requirement at 15. However after a year and a half on these boards I no longer consider myself eligible for the YN giveaways even though I am technically young enough (I am 17 now for those who don't know). You see in the year and a half I have been a member I have learned immeasureable amounts and was even able to harness a source of income. Sure by ANA standards and the majority feeling on the boards I am still a YN, but I feel blessed to have what I do and so I pass on the generous giveaways so that someone less-fortunate (sorry if that isn't PC) can have the opportunity.
PS- I keep the sig line intact for age reference mainly.
I voted for 18. By then you should have a job and be making enough money that you should not longer get breaks because of age.
A case could be made for 16, but even though one might have a job, any kid (other than a super genius) is still in high school and probably not making that much money.
I've never been a big fan of giving a lot of expensive stuff to kids anyway. Many of them don't seem to appreciate it. A regional club I belonged to always hit up the dealers at the bourse for items that they give out to the kids in YN acutions. Most of the items donated were Proof sets and modern commemorative coins. The kids bid with playmoney (which has actually become a collectable item for the adults because old time members of the organization were shown in the portraits) that they were given and in a few cases won for answering quiz questions. Sure enough as soon as the YN meeting was over, the kids out trying to sell the stuff to the dealers on bourse to get money for it, which really piqued me off.
Easy come, easy go does not add up to creating more collectors IMO.
The "hand full of money" concept that the Baltimore show runs is a good concept. The stuff is often not worth that much, but it gets the kid to study the coins and perhaps learn something about them.
Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
this is an interesting question, I think 18 is reasonable, though a YN should seek to shed the label when they feel ready. even if the under 18 has lots of numismatic knowledge, they could be hamstrung by interpersonal experiences and business savvy (lack thereof)
myself ? Im a 30s aged-NN (newbie numismatist), but while I enjoy learning and like to get involved with some buying and selling on common things, I know enough from other parts in my life (Ive bought multiple vehicles and a house) how to avoid being (obviously) scammed and am cautious enough to back away when something just seems "wrong" about a situation. I know the value of research when it comes to my own money. does this protect me in all cases ? nope, but Im certainly in a position better than a 16 or 17 year old how to avoid more common pitfalls.
I dont think anyone should be annoyed by the fact a certain segment of the population is protected, even if they dont need protecting in certain cases. it really doesn't harm the other part of the populace.
That being said, someone with resources or an adult (FT job) trying to gain materially using the YN label ? I would consider them a loser, and they should be ashamed of themselves. I think there's a special place in purgatory if not hell for those who take advantage of the kindness of others, essentially stealing it from the truly deserving.
It's not an issue I would concern myself with in the least. I don't feel the need to establish or adhere to any kind of standard in this matter. If there's someone I want to give knowledge, a book, or a coin, or WHATEVER to, I'll do it because I want to do something for them. Not because they are a young or old numismatist, but because I wanted to share with them. I have done it for both, and ultimately it was simply because I wanted to and enjoyed doing it, for my reasons. It's as simple as that for me. By the way, I don't feel that anyone in the hobby is "entitled" to anything other than fair play and honesty, and certainly not dispensed on the basis of age.
To answer Thiggy's secondary question....I have had something sort of like that happen and it was very inexpensive (not that the price matters but rather the principle). Next time I give something away or offer something up to a "YN" I will make sure the recipient is indeed a juvenile if indeed my intention is to give something to someone that is not an adult.
Hey Thiggy... I go 18 on this one. I remember hangin with my best friend when his brother got called up for Nam--- we both swore that if your old enough to shoot at the yellow man your old enough to do anything...
<< <i>Whenever they graduate High School. If someone is out of High School at 17, for example, then they are old enough to be working. No more "YN" status. >>
I turned 18 a month ago and I won't compete anylonger with anything for youngsters. That time is over, and now the chance is for other youngsters. Were you people also knocking on doors with halloween when you are 19?
<< <i>I think we pretty much know what the majority of active participants in the forum believe concerning this matter now. >>
I think many people know who you're attacking with this thread, and the fact that you posted to it again bringing it to the top a full 9 days after the last post to the thread shows that yes, it's an attack and a shallow one too. WGAF? If you worry about this, you need better things with which to fill your time.
<< <i>I think we pretty much know what the majority of active participants in the forum believe concerning this matter now. >>
I think many people know who you're attacking with this thread, and the fact that you posted to it again bringing it to the top a full 9 days after the last post to the thread shows that yes, it's an attack and a shallow one too. WGAF? If you worry about this, you need better things with which to fill your time. >>
I was attacking absolutely nobody with this thread. It was a valid question at the time and one that was brought up for debate. Furthermore, I received two PMs today concerning it and was asked for a link to it. Why don't you give you actual input concerning the debate instead of reverting to petty attacks?
I am running my own YN giveaway as we speak. Originally I just said YN, and I think in the 1st 5 minutes I had 15 PMs telling me I should define YN. I never really thought too much about it. I think I told the 1st person who PMd me that if the ANA considers it 21 & under, who am I to argue.
My kids are 20, 18, & 13. They all act about 12 most of the time, so if it's based on maturity level, they're all YNs in my book.
I think YN programs are vital to the hobby. You need special programs, contests, events, etc just for them to get them and keep them interested. I'm going to guess around 90+% of all adult collectors had some connection to the hobby as a kid/young adult. We have to get them interested somehow (When will Nintendo make a coin collecting game?? ) How about a Pokemon/Yugioh type card game with coins and history on them - The more powerful cards are the rarer coins, etc (My son is standing over my shoulder laughing at me that he would play, but they would be in the clearance bin in 2 weeks).
But, much like a mama bird punting the young out of the nest when they're ready to fly, I think there comes a point in a YNs life, when they have to pass the YN torch to those under them. For some that is when they have "Snatched the pebble from the hand" so to speak and basically garnered enough knowledge through YN programs that they don't need special consideration. There have been a few who have passed through here in their late teens that were ready to be pushed out of the YN nest before the magical age limit hit. There are some that will possess YN-Level knowledge and traits forever (not necessarily a bad thing), but you need a cut-off somewhere. So I think it should be available to a certain point, but only if it's still needed. One of my biggest smiles I got here was watching one YN sign up for a giveaway in his little sisters name. That's passing the torch to me.
I don't consider a 16 year old, with thousands of dollars in inventory on eBay, who knows bid/ask on nearly everything, been around coins his whole life and travels a show circuit with his uncle a YN. (I made that up, my apologizes if it is close to home).
I also have no problem labeling a 20 year old, who didn't have the benefit of family/friends to get him interested in coins while he was younger, who shows up looking for someone to help him start out and get interested in the hobby a YN.
To each their own. My answer would be up to 21 if still needed
Comments
<< <i>I think this may be the only thread she hasn't posted to. >>
Just curious, is there a list of all the young people here with their age? Not YN's but young people, say under the age of 25.
<< <i>I voted 21, so long as they are full-time students. Otherwise, 18. Anyone who has a real, full-time job (or c/w/should have a real, full-time job), does not deserve freebies and perks as a YN, IMO. >>
Shame because I've had a full time job since I was 16 and no coin knowledge before then
I think the YN perks should be help/knowledge based more so than gift based. Gifts don't teach very much in themselves. Knowledge is power.
edit: I don't know about other states, but in FL you can sit in on many nudy bars when you're 18. Also holds true in New Orleans.
-Daniel
-Aristotle
Dum loquimur fugerit invida aetas. Carpe diem quam minimum credula postero.
-Horace
<< <i>
<< <i>I think this may be the only thread she hasn't posted to. >>
Just curious, is there a list of all the young people here with their age? Not YN's but young people, say under the age of 25. >>
No clue. There certainly doesn't need to be. I don't think a distinction should be made between young and old collectors. Everyone should be encouraged to indulge in the hobby via the help of others and the generosity of others in the form of sharing of reference materials. I tend to have more patience when dealing with YNs and teaching them about various numismatic topics, but I certainly don't give them unreal expectations by lowering prices. I'd rather teach them to enjoy coins they can afford themselves rather than make them think they need to go after coins they wouldn't otherwise be able to afford if not for them being given and/or discounted for them. Of course, I collect holed coins, so what do I know.
Self Indulgence | Holey Coins | Flickr Photostream
<< <i><<
<< I'm really interested to hear Amanda's opinion on the whole topic. >>
I think I am sensing the purpose of this thread...
>>
It honestly wasn't direct at any particular individual, it is just a popular topic and I thought a current polling would be appropriate for reference. I am very interested in hearing current 'YNs' opinions on the matter though. They may just sway my opinion on the other direction, who knows. >>
I guess I'll jump in here then. I also voted for the 18 age limit.
When I first joined these message boards I had no problem entering the YN giveaways. I truly was a YN. I had no source of income, knew hardly anything about numismatics, and fit the age requirement at 15. However after a year and a half on these boards I no longer consider myself eligible for the YN giveaways even though I am technically young enough (I am 17 now for those who don't know). You see in the year and a half I have been a member I have learned immeasureable amounts and was even able to harness a source of income. Sure by ANA standards and the majority feeling on the boards I am still a YN, but I feel blessed to have what I do and so I pass on the generous giveaways so that someone less-fortunate (sorry if that isn't PC) can have the opportunity.
PS- I keep the sig line intact for age reference mainly.
Self Indulgence | Holey Coins | Flickr Photostream
A case could be made for 16, but even though one might have a job, any kid (other than a super genius) is still in high school and probably not making that much money.
I've never been a big fan of giving a lot of expensive stuff to kids anyway. Many of them don't seem to appreciate it. A regional club I belonged to always hit up the dealers at the bourse for items that they give out to the kids in YN acutions. Most of the items donated were Proof sets and modern commemorative coins. The kids bid with playmoney (which has actually become a collectable item for the adults because old time members of the organization were shown in the portraits) that they were given and in a few cases won for answering quiz questions. Sure enough as soon as the YN meeting was over, the kids out trying to sell the stuff to the dealers on bourse to get money for it, which really piqued me off.
Easy come, easy go does not add up to creating more collectors IMO.
The "hand full of money" concept that the Baltimore show runs is a good concept. The stuff is often not worth that much, but it gets the kid to study the coins and perhaps learn something about them.
this is an interesting question, I think 18 is reasonable, though a YN should seek to shed the label when they feel ready. even if the under 18 has lots of numismatic knowledge, they could be hamstrung by interpersonal experiences and business savvy (lack thereof)
myself ? Im a 30s aged-NN (newbie numismatist), but while I enjoy learning and like to get involved with some buying and selling on common things, I know enough from other parts in my life (Ive bought multiple vehicles and a house) how to avoid being (obviously) scammed and am cautious enough to back away when something just seems "wrong" about a situation. I know the value of research when it comes to my own money. does this protect me in all cases ? nope, but Im certainly in a position better than a 16 or 17 year old how to avoid more common pitfalls.
I dont think anyone should be annoyed by the fact a certain segment of the population is protected, even if they dont need protecting in certain cases. it really doesn't harm the other part of the populace.
That being said, someone with resources or an adult (FT job) trying to gain materially using the YN label ? I would consider them a loser, and they should be ashamed of themselves. I think there's a special place in purgatory if not hell for those who take advantage of the kindness of others, essentially stealing it from the truly deserving.
To answer Thiggy's secondary question....I have had something sort of like that happen and it was very inexpensive (not that the price matters but rather the principle). Next time I give something away or offer something up to a "YN" I will make sure the recipient is indeed a juvenile if indeed my intention is to give something to someone that is not an adult.
I remember hangin with my best friend when his brother got called up for Nam--- we both swore that if your old enough to shoot at the yellow man your old enough to do anything...
<< <i>Whenever they graduate High School. If someone is out of High School at 17, for example, then they are old enough to be working. No more "YN" status.
coinpage.com
Dennis
Like VOC Numismatics on facebook
Self Indulgence | Holey Coins | Flickr Photostream
<< <i>I think we pretty much know what the majority of active participants in the forum believe concerning this matter now. >>
I think many people know who you're attacking with this thread, and the fact that you posted to it again bringing it to the top a full 9 days after the last post to the thread shows that yes, it's an attack and a shallow one too. WGAF? If you worry about this, you need better things with which to fill your time.
<< <i>
<< <i>I think we pretty much know what the majority of active participants in the forum believe concerning this matter now. >>
I think many people know who you're attacking with this thread, and the fact that you posted to it again bringing it to the top a full 9 days after the last post to the thread shows that yes, it's an attack and a shallow one too. WGAF? If you worry about this, you need better things with which to fill your time. >>
I was attacking absolutely nobody with this thread. It was a valid question at the time and one that was brought up for debate. Furthermore, I received two PMs today concerning it and was asked for a link to it. Why don't you give you actual input concerning the debate instead of reverting to petty attacks?
Self Indulgence | Holey Coins | Flickr Photostream
I am running my own YN giveaway as we speak. Originally I just said YN, and I think in the 1st 5 minutes I had 15 PMs telling me I should define YN. I never really thought too much about it. I think I told the 1st person who PMd me that if the ANA considers it 21 & under, who am I to argue.
My kids are 20, 18, & 13. They all act about 12 most of the time, so if it's based on maturity level, they're all YNs in my book.
I think YN programs are vital to the hobby. You need special programs, contests, events, etc just for them to get them and keep them interested. I'm going to guess around 90+% of all adult collectors had some connection to the hobby as a kid/young adult. We have to get them interested somehow (When will Nintendo make a coin collecting game??
But, much like a mama bird punting the young out of the nest when they're ready to fly, I think there comes a point in a YNs life, when they have to pass the YN torch to those under them. For some that is when they have "Snatched the pebble from the hand" so to speak and basically garnered enough knowledge through YN programs that they don't need special consideration. There have been a few who have passed through here in their late teens that were ready to be pushed out of the YN nest before the magical age limit hit. There are some that will possess YN-Level knowledge and traits forever (not necessarily a bad thing), but you need a cut-off somewhere. So I think it should be available to a certain point, but only if it's still needed. One of my biggest smiles I got here was watching one YN sign up for a giveaway in his little sisters name. That's passing the torch to me.
I don't consider a 16 year old, with thousands of dollars in inventory on eBay, who knows bid/ask on nearly everything, been around coins his whole life and travels a show circuit with his uncle a YN. (I made that up, my apologizes if it is close to home).
I also have no problem labeling a 20 year old, who didn't have the benefit of family/friends to get him interested in coins while he was younger, who shows up looking for someone to help him start out and get interested in the hobby a YN.
To each their own. My answer would be up to 21 if still needed
"You Suck Award" - February, 2015
Discoverer of 1919 Mercury Dime DDO - FS-101