A serious annoyance at coin shows.

ANACONDA

You go up to a dealer's table, see a coin you like, ask one of the people behind the table to see the coin, you ask for a price and then you have to wait five minutes for a price because someone else (who is busy) has to study the back of the coin for codes, look the coin up on the computer, and then consult the greysheet before finally giving you a price.

I'd like it a lot better if they would just have a price written on the back or code it on the back so they don't have to go through such machinations before you can get a price.

RNCHSN

....or....you could just agree to pay the retail price I have listed on the sticker on the front.......

IGWT

It's a ruse. They need the time to study you -- not to find a price on a sheet or in a computer -- in order to set the "right" asking price.

StrikeOutXXX

I've only been to one show and did notice what you mentioned. It is annoying, but brings up a question Coinguy1 brought up a few months ago about do you sell based on fair market, or % markup from what you bought it.

Other than the 1 coin show, my only other dealings are with our coin club dealer. His prices are marked on the cardboard flip or on the few slabs he carries. He frequently tells you after the purchase something like "Good deal there, it's xx in the book now". I asked him what he meant, and he said the prices on the coins are his standard % markup from what he bought them for/has in it. Since he's been retired for many years from the brick-n-mortar days, he is still making his % and we get great deals.

I would love to see things a bit more like that. If dealer buys it for $100 and applies 20%, why isn't the coin always $120? The joys of a fluid/fluxuating market I suppose.

123cents

<< <i>It's a ruse. They need the time to study you -- not to find a price on a sheet or in a computer -- in order to set the "right" asking price. >>

I agree with that statement.

DNADave

Having sold at a show before, I can say that pricing is not just so easy.

I want to know:

what I paid for the coin.
what the price is in the guide I'm using.
what I think the coin should sell for relative to the price in the guide
what impression I have of the buyer (if I like you, you get a real good price)

It all takes some time to put together.


My most expensive sale has been $10,000 on the nose. Most, by far, are in the $50 to $300 range.

dizzyfoxx

<< <i>Having sold at a show before, I can say that pricing is not just so easy.

I want to know:

what I paid for the coin.
what the price is in the guide I'm using.
what I think the coin should sell for relative to the price in the guide

It all takes some time to put together. >>



Can't this all be figured out prior to putting the coin out on the table?

DNADave

<< <i>I would love to see things a bit more like that. If dealer buys it for $100 and applies 20%, why isn't the coin always $120? The joys of a fluid/fluxuating market I suppose. >>




If you come up to the table and start telling me why all my coins are crap overgraded/overpriced, you are not going to get it for $120.
If you tell me how nice the coin is and why you collect that series and why you'd like to buy that coin and others like it. You get it for $110.

DNADave

<< <i>Having sold at a show before, I can say that pricing is not just so easy.


Can't this all be figured out prior to putting the coin out on the table? >>




It depends on how fast the inventory is turned over, how big the inventory is, and how sharp the dealer is. It also depends on the which coin it is, if its one that hasn't been looked at for a year then no. If its the center piece of the showcase, yes.

dizzyfoxx

<< <i>

<< <i>Having sold at a show before, I can say that pricing is not just so easy.


Can't this all be figured out prior to putting the coin out on the table? >>




It depends on how fast the inventory is turned over, how big the inventory is, and how sharp the dealer is. It also depends on the which coin it is, if its one that hasn't been looked at for a year then no. If its the center piece of the showcase, yes. >>



Good points.

RNCHSN

I usually start looking up the data when I hand the coin over for the customer to look at.

pbfloyd

I If you come up to the table and start telling me why all my coins are crap overgraded/overpriced, you are not going to get it for $120.


Read my thread about dealers who will not be here 10 years from now

RedTiger

This thread confirms a suspicion of mine that some dealers charge different prices to different folks depending on their appearance assuming they are all new customers. There is another phrase for that, but not for polite company. The one that comes to mind, "for you my friend a special price [especially high]." Thank goodness for the Internet where no one can see what you look like and everyone's money carries the same weight.

BillJones

Two other show situations are worse:

#1. You buy a coin at the beginning of show and the dealer has come up with a computer generated invoice before they will deliver the coin. They can’t get the system to work, so you can’t take delivery on the coin until the next to last day of the show.

#2. The smart ass behind the counter won’t show the coin to you, because “You can’t afford it.” I guess my mistake was that I should have brought a CPA audited balance sheet that shows that it takes a 7-digit number to express my net worth.

greghansen

I guess my mistake was that I should have brought a CPA audited balance sheet that shows that it takes a 7-digit number to express my net worth.

Mine too...but only if you count the numbers after the decimal point.

ColonialCoinUnion

<< <i>This thread confirms a suspicion of mine that some dealers charge different prices to different folks depending on their appearance assuming they are all new customers. There is another phrase for that, but not for polite company. The one that comes to mind, "for you my friend a special price [especially high]." Thank goodness for the Internet where no one can see what you look like and everyone's money carries the same weight. >>



Good grief, you guys are reading way more into this than is there -

We have a price written on the back of every coin when the show starts and thats the price we quote. But then we buy new coins at the show, or pick up our auction purchases and suddenly there are 25 new things unpriced.

Its not some conspiracy or favoritism, its just hard to keep everything straight in what is typcially a hectic and fast moving environment.

elwood

Or... if a coin has been in inventory awhile and there has been some time between shows, a dealer might like to consult the sheets to make sure there haven't been any plus signs, since he/she originally priced/bought the coin.


Or....to check to see if there are any new auction appearances (prices realized) that would affect the current market value?

rkfish

Where's STMAN when you need him...................

messydesk

You forgot the part where the dealer ignores you for a while and the part where he has to get on the phone after studying the codes, the inventory, the greysheet, etc.

UncleWiggly

Tell all moron dealers to shut their face holes. Plain and simply.



Jerry

Coxe

How about, you sit down and look over the coins for 15 minutes and then the person behind the table tells you they are just watching the table and the owner is in the Heritage auction or walking the floor?

I like prices on the coins. I buy regularly from one guy at the shows who does this, even though they are slightly high and nonnegotiable.

ColonialCoinUnion

<< <i>Tell all moron dealers to shut their face holes. Plain and simply.

Jerry >>



Good contribution, Jerry.

vega1

I blame it on the internet and microwaves. They have made us so used to getting information and results immediately that we (me included) have absolutely no patience. To stand and wait for someone to give a price on what (seems to us) should be clearly marked already rubs the wrong way. There are lots of examples I think.

Don't they know we don't have all minute?!

CaptHenway

I have almost all of my good coins coded on the back with an opening day wholesale price and a late in the show wholesale price. Takes two seconds to read.
TD

WTCG

<< <i>You go up to a dealer's table, see a coin you like, ask one of the people behind the table to see the coin, you ask for a price and then you have to wait five minutes for a price because someone else (who is busy) has to study the back of the coin for codes, look the coin up on the computer, and then consult the greysheet before finally giving you a price.

I'd like it a lot better if they would just have a price written on the back or code it on the back so they don't have to go through such machinations before you can get a price. >>



I agree that is annoying. However it's more annoying when after minutes of looking up information the dealer gives you a story about how they're financially buried in that coin and how he thinks he may be able to sell it for a strong price in an auction etc., and ends up not giving you a price afterall.

stman

<< <i>Where's STMAN when you need him................... >>



Here I is! I can understand some of the reasons dealers have stated in this thread. Sometimes the reason is they truly want to "size you up" and see what they can shank you for. And of course they might be getting ready for the famous "stories" to tell. Haha


<< <i>Or... if a coin has been in inventory awhile and there has been some time between shows, a dealer might like to consult the sheets to make sure there haven't been any plus signs, since he/she originally priced/bought the coin. >>



And here I thought they would be looking for minus signs in the sheet to quote me their best price and be fair. Silly me.

Coxe

<< <i>I agree that is annoying. However it's more annoying when after minutes of looking up information the dealer gives you a story about how they're financially buried in that coin and how he thinks he may be able to sell it for a strong price in an auction etc., and ends up not giving you a price afterall. >>



Known cherrypickers get that sometimes. You know the coin isn't going anywhere and the dealer has this "that guy knows something I missed" aura. It was front and center in his case and is now not for sale.

On the dealer's side though, just imagine all of the buyer annoyances they put up with at shows. Some nimrod takes up a half hour of his time looking at coins and ends up passing on all of them as an example.

MrBreeze

When I went to Baltimore, I tried to look at every table. There could not have been more than one or two dealers with the prices on the coin, on the front of the slab or 2X2. It shocked me so much to see it, that I bought three coins from Jade that I did not need, or had intended to buy at the show. When I saw the prices, I basically decided, then and there, that I would buy something from Jade, period. Of course, we had a good conversation and introduced ourselves, but I was buying something whether we talked or not, just because it was such a no-brainer to not ask for twenty different prices.

bikenut

I'd like to add to that a bit. I collect PCGS cert wheats for my registry set. I need about 25 more to complete it. I like to spend $500-$1,000 on a coin (especially since the few I have left to collect are usually very rare in any grade...). My knowledge of the individual prices are good however, I'm usually armed with some sort of data at shows that will tell me if a certain coin is out (or in), my price range.
But some times I'll be looking at an NGC piece to cross and I don't have the info on that particular piece. Or at times, I won't have my literature on me and I'll go to a show with just my checkbook. When the coin is not priced, or its priced only with the dealers code, I'm at times a bit shy to ask to look at a piece.
I feel foolish when I ask to look at a wheat that I 'think' is a premium piece.....but I'm not sure of just how premium it is and at what cost. And when I finally ask to see it and the nice gentleman looks me over.....hands it to me....then tells me the price of that piece is $6,500 well........
OOOPS!
I know it's a chore for dealers to price or reprice things for every show. But it would be nice if they stuck a 'retail' price on the piece to give the buyer some idea of what he's looking at.
I have a good bit of knowledge of the series but their's 140 different dates. I don't know the value of every piece, in every grade, in all the different holders....
Thank you....

robertpr

If a dealer tells you "you can't afford" a certain coin, ask them how they came to that conclusion. It usually shuts them up fairly quickly. If they do give me a price after such an exchange, I politely tell them "oh, that's all? Well, I certainly can afford that. But now that I've looked at it a while, I have come to the conclusion that the coin sucks worse than your attitude." usually fairly loudly so that everyone nearby can hear me. I have found that embarasses the hell out of people

UncleWiggly

<< <i>

<< <i>Tell all moron dealers to shut their face holes. Plain and simply.

Jerry >>



Good contribution, Jerry. >>




I'm dead serious! You want me to sugar coat it? Well, I'm not going to. So, shut your facehole too. And I don't care what you think about it. Not today. Not tomorrow.



Jerry

Leiana

<< <i>If a dealer tells you "you can't afford" a certain coin, ask them how they came to that conclusion. It usually shuts them up fairly quickly. If they do give me a price after such an exchange, I politely tell them "oh, that's all? Well, I certainly can afford that. But now that I've looked at it a while, I have come to the conclusion that the coin sucks worse than your attitude." usually fairly loudly so that everyone nearby can hear me. I have found that embarasses the hell out of people >>





That's good.

But they are usually right about me.

I don't like dealers who ignore me because I'm young though.

It has happened. I just left and spent my money elsewhere.

I also find it good to mention a nifty fact or two about a coin I am looking at. That gets dealer's attentions.

There are wonderful dealers out there that will let me drool over their expensive stuff. I get their cards and keep them in mind for the future.

-Amanda

AgMe

<< <i>

<< <i>

<< <i>Tell all moron dealers to shut their face holes. Plain and simply.

Jerry >>



Good contribution, Jerry. >>




I'm dead serious! You want me to sugar coat it? Well, I'm not going to. So, shut your facehole too. And I don't care what you think about it. Not today. Not tomorrow.



Jerry >>





EDIT: I see those Dale Carnegie courses came in handy.

Conder101

<< <i>Or... if a coin has been in inventory awhile and there has been some time between shows, a dealer might like to consult the sheets to make sure there haven't been any plus signs, since he/she originally priced/bought the coin. >>


Well if it has been in inventory awhile then maybe he has it overpriced and should discount it to keep his money turning over.

stman

And don't forget when you ask for a price, after they look at you and the coin a few times (and of course give the story) they then might need to do the usual grunt, moan, perhaps pass gas, belch, before they finally do you the honor of giving a price.

ColonialCoinUnion

<< <i>I'm dead serious! You want me to sugar coat it? Well, I'm not going to. So, shut your facehole too. And I don't care what you think about it. Not today. Not tomorrow.

Jerry >>



I was serious too, Jerry. Your posts are terrific.

goose3

<< <i>Where's STMAN when you need him................... >>



probably working over some of his own clients.

FullStrike

Interesting read - this thread. It's helped me make up my mind to NEVER go to a big Coin Show. I'll continue to save my gas money and once in a while click on a Coin from Legend's inventory. I also like Pinnacle and Albanese. ANR is a good one also.

CoinResource

Coin prices change a lot... gotta check most recent trends. Don't see this changing anytime soon.

BigD5

I think it depends on the coin.

If you're pricing a Gobrecht, well, I'm going to do some double checking of some numbers. If it's something more common, the price is the price.

I think there is way less "customer evaluation" going on when quoting a price than many of you think. Either that, or you're stopping at the wrong tables.

Coxe

<< <i>If a dealer tells you "you can't afford" a certain coin, ask them how they came to that conclusion. It usually shuts them up fairly quickly. If they do give me a price after such an exchange, I politely tell them "oh, that's all? Well, I certainly can afford that. But now that I've looked at it a while, I have come to the conclusion that the coin sucks worse than your attitude." usually fairly loudly so that everyone nearby can hear me. I have found that embarasses the hell out of people >>



That's a good approach. It drives me nuts occasionally too. I have the $$$ but also have enough sense not drive park a Rolls in the garage and dress in an Armani suit for the bourse. I am going to be comfortable and not a thief magnet. My experience has been given a cold shoulder, even by dealers wtih whom I have done considerable business but was not recognized by them. Though possible, I don't believe any has come outright and told me I cannot afford his coins. If he did,I might just go to the next table and buy the top double eagle with cash in front of the sucker.

Another thing that gets my beef is this attitude when I go to sell to a dealer on a bourse and it's like I am a criminal fencing the stuff and he's a pawn broker. I'll take a check from him over cash (unless I have exhausted the roll I came with and am still buying) and expect a receipt (as I do pay my fair taxes).

roadrunner

I've made mistakes costing me hundreds of dollars at times. I'd rather be slow and careful than regretting quoting too low a price.
Sometimes the price guides change before shows and one doesn't always have the luxury of checking everything before hand....esp if this is not your full time job.

roadrunner

tmot99

I hate going to a coin show and showing a dealer a coin that I want to sell. The couple of guys at the table have a 15 minute conversation on what the value of the coin might be and they may even ask the dealer at the table next to them. Then when a price can't be met (in other words the dealer can't make a rip), the dealer comes up with some excuse that the coin is suddenly ugly.

roadrunner

If you take your coins to a show you should be prepared to price them, assuming you know how to come to a somewhat accurate price. Just leaving the pricing to dealers is not a strong move.
Dealers do not want to offer great prices up front for fear of leaving money on the table.

Pricing can be quite difficult at times, esp if your coin is thinly traded, extremely nice for the grade, or it has been many years since you bought it and have no accurate frame of reference to start from.
Collectors as a rule over-estimate their problem to average coins and under-estimate their great coins. Dealers often fear the same thing (leaving $$ on the table) when pricing their coin and will often try to delay this until they get more information from you (or other dealers) on where to start.

roadrunner

elwood

<< <i>And here I thought they would be looking for minus signs in the sheet to quote me their best price and be fair. Silly me. >>



no, that's your job silly





<< <i>Well if it has been in inventory awhile then maybe he has it overpriced and should discount it to keep his money turning over. >>



I can only speak for myself but I would only do the major shows, so I would sometimes have long stretches in between shows and it had nothing to do with overpriced merchandise.

And we all know what a terrible market we've been through to have had to sit on inventory

I wished I would have kept more coins in inventory longer. I would have been much further ahead. Who could have known

stman

<< <i>no, that's your job silly >>



Like I said silly me. why is it my job though? You mentioned......


<< <i>Or... if a coin has been in inventory awhile and there has been some time between shows, a dealer might like to consult the sheets to make sure there haven't been any plus signs >>



Why does he only check for plus signs? Oh, I see, turn-about ain't fair play in the coin game. Only if it goes up, silly me.

Derek2100

I have everything in my cases priced - mostly on the front. Unless its a large lump sum deal u either pay the price or take a hike. Counter offers are considered but you gotta lay yer money on the table.