NGC vs PCGS PF70 coin prices

seateddime · July 14, 2006 2:26AM

If two coins are both perfect than why should there be a difference in price. Is the NGC coin "less perfect" or just overgraded?

Call me crazy but perfect is prefect, not almost perfect - thats a 69

airplanenut · July 14, 2006 2:28AM

Because PCGS refuses to holder all the 70s that come across their desk as such, and they keep the pops down.

My reason for stating this? I've seen a lot of 70s in both holders, and frankly, I've seen, with my naked eye, a problem with EVERY PCGS 70. NGC's 70s have been far more consistent, albeit also more plentiful.

I believe this is simply an issue of perception and plastic-buying.

Trinketts · July 14, 2006 2:31AM

I have seen coins in both holders that do and don't warrant the PF70 grade... All a game to me it seems..

Prethen · July 14, 2006 2:39AM

It's just a "Pops" game and Registry game. Enjoy the "fun" and open your wallet.

AgMe · July 14, 2006 3:21AM

<< If two coins are both perfect than why should there be a difference in price. Is the NGC coin "less perfect" or just overgraded?

Call me crazy but perfect is prefect, not almost perfect - thats a 69 >>

Because there are different definitions of "perfect".

Typically, I see NGC as accurately graded & PCGS as conservatively graded...

MORGANHUNTER2 · July 14, 2006 3:28AM

I personally feel there is no such thing as a "perfect" coin (70). It comes off a machine, and people handle it before it hits plastic or cellophane, or for that matter- a hopper which holds hundreds of thousands of that denomination.

At some point there is a bound to be a 'issue' and that coin can no longer be construed as "perfect".

if not in the obverse or reverse, then the 3rd side of the coin can have an issue- and that is where the 'perfect' coin should lose that point.

And sadly not all coins come out of the mint exactly the same, each and every time.

ABC123 · July 14, 2006 5:38AM

Always buy what you can afford---D.Trump

seateddime · July 14, 2006 5:41AM

<< Always buy what you can afford---D.Trump >>

in his case buy more than you can afford and find some bank sucker to loan you the money because he thinks you don't need it

braddick · July 14, 2006 5:42AM

As read in "Animal Farm":

All MS/PR70 coins are perfect. Some are just more perfect than others.

Coxe · July 14, 2006 7:51AM

I don't know why anyone wants to play that dangerously expensive game. If I randomly took 100 PR70 and PR69 coins of the same date and issue from PCGS, NGC and ICG and laid them side by side, I sincerely doubt anyone could consistently identify the grades any of the three would give them. The standards differentiating supposed perfection from one degree short of it warrant fair suspicion and doubt. Anyone who ever had to grade a class of a hundred or so students papers under any pressure of time knows, even with the best of intentions, variability is going to creep in. If PCGS is going to only have pops of a dozen or so of an issue in PR70, sure, they can concentrate on those chosen few in the grade finalization. Hopwever, the odds are great that many less scrutinized PR69 are just as good and would have passed in the finals.

VamGuy · July 14, 2006 8:19AM

7Jaguars · July 14, 2006 10:50AM

Let's not go there with "first strike" either. I think all these things could be said of the "69" grade too!

HighRelief · July 14, 2006 12:56PM

Look at this big price difference between the NGC MS70 Gold Buffalo and the PCGS MS70 Gold Buffalo from Gold Rarities NGC VS.PCGS

TWQG · July 14, 2006 1:03PM

<< JUST RELEASED! These are being sold for as much as $2500 which is an abosolute rip off. Are these worth a $700 premium to the NGC coins? In the end these are bullion coins so every buyer has to make his own decision. We base our prices on the current wholesale prices >>

bestclser1 · July 14, 2006 1:11PM

<< I don't know why anyone wants to play that dangerously expensive game. If I randomly took 100 PR70 and PR69 coins of the same date and issue from PCGS, NGC and ICG and laid them side by side, I sincerely doubt anyone could consistently identify the grades any of the three would give them. The standards differentiating supposed perfection from one degree short of it warrant fair suspicion and doubt. Anyone who ever had to grade a class of a hundred or so students papers under any pressure of time knows, even with the best of intentions, variability is going to creep in. If PCGS is going to only have pops of a dozen or so of an issue in PR70, sure, they can concentrate on those chosen few in the grade finalization. Hopwever, the odds are great that many less scrutinized PR69 are just as good and would have passed in the finals. >>

Coxe,You my friend are a VERY wise man.

CoinMaster1229 · July 14, 2006 1:26PM

The market decides what values are between NGC & PCGS. The results are in. the collectors have decided, PCGS is the premier grading service in the world!!!! That is that.

seateddime · July 14, 2006 1:47PM

when is perfect not perfect ?

there can only be 1 PF70

no room for a difference.

On a 65 coin sure but on a 70?

michael · July 14, 2006 2:32PM

if you break the pcgs proof ms 70 coin out of its respective holder what is it now worth cash value as compaired to when it was in the proof 70 holder pcgs??

aficionado · July 14, 2006 5:14PM

<< when is perfect not perfect ?

there can only be 1 PF70

no room for a difference.

On a 65 coin sure but on a 70? >>

I agree. any grade except 70 can be interpreted by the grader, but a grade of 70, EVERYONE should agree on. It's either absolutely prefect or not.

A 69 as defined by PCGS "Virtually as struck with minuscule imperfections, near full strike necessary "

I read this to be, if there is a minuscule imperfection, it can't be a 70, it's at best a 69.

seateddime · July 18, 2006 12:50AM

so if the pop game is rigged at PCGS the coins are not rare just the plastic.

Let's see these values in 20 years

DHeath · July 18, 2006 12:59AM

69 is supposed to be perfect to the naked eye. That's good enough for me. I think 70 should exist, but only to make the 69's I buy the undergrade.

xbob · July 18, 2006 1:00AM

It seems like NGC vs PCGS prices are simply a population game. PCGS just doesn't "give out" as many.

The system needs a test. I'm waiting for someone with a lot of money and balls to back it up to crack out a bunch of 70's and resubmit them. Then publish the results. What percentage would come back as 70's again?

More NGC than PCGS? The same? None? Well never know until they are put to a test that they are unaware of.

I could care less about ever owning a coin in a 70 holder. If my own submissions landed one, I'd sell it.

segoja · July 18, 2006 1:02AM

I agree with airplanenut!

Let's see the values in 20 years...and more importanly what the coin looks like.

Every MS70 coin I've owned, and I've owned about 50 of them have has some visible problem.

Prethen · July 18, 2006 1:48AM

There really is probably no such thing as a perfect 70....Proof or Mint State. 69's...sure...but no 70's. I've seem 69's with visible problems. In my eye, that should automatically put them no higher than 67.

The whole 69/70 grading system is basically a game. Submit enough or get lucky and you'll get doled out a 70.

Remember back to a time when NGC (and I'm willing to bet David Hall probably said this at one time) that they will NEVER grade a coin a 70 and only very rarely will a coin get a 69 grade?

Modern grading has given the services a major boon to their bottom line. I guess I can't blame them, but I don't have to play the same game.

NGC vs PCGS PF70 coin prices

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