72 topps fb wax pack..opened with results

ldferg

just received a gai 7.5...bust it at work or keep it????

it's killing me....i usually always bust 'em.

zef204

<< <i>just received a gai 7.5...bust it at work or keep it????

it's killing me....i usually always bust 'em. >>

As if you haven't already begun to take it out of the GAI case, I say...



BUST IT!

ldferg

haha...i keep looking at it trying to decide the best way to cut the slab without damaging the pack.

RonBurgundy

Let's do a wager. If the market value of the cards you pull does not equal the market value of the pack you just busted, you give me the cards and agree not to open any more packs that are more than 30 years old. Deal?



Stay classy,


Ron

ldferg

i think i see a staubach on the back.



NOT!!!!

this pack does not list a "series" per se, what does that mean? i thought most were designated.

ldferg

wow...MAJOR DISAPPOINTMENT.

no way was this pack "unopened". s/n 10249160

does GAI guarantee their product? i do have a witness that saw me cut the holder and remove/open the pack.

here's the pack starting with top card:

jim hart - well-centered, crease at the bottom left and all 4 corners dog-eared (you can actually see a fingerprint on the card)

norm snead - oc 90/10 t/b top 2 corners damaged, top edge damaged highly worn

john brodie pro action - oc 70/30 t/b and l/r - there is an "m" indention where it looks like someone was writing something on a piece of paper and using this card underneath - all 4 corners worn

roman gabriel pro action - oc 90/10 tb, all corners worn, 2 bad and a small surface crease

nfc rushing leaders - oc 70/30 t b, top edge has nick, 3 corners frayed

garo yepremian - centered well, diamond cut, major corner damage on all

nfc scoring leaders - oc 95/5 t/b and l/r, bottom edge nicked - 3 corners damaged (1 with minor crease), surface scratched

ken ellis - centered well, all corners bad (2 with creases)

claude humphrey - centered 90/10 tb, all corners bad, left edge nicked, gum stained on back (this is not the back card and the gum was on the front of the hart card with no gum residue on the hart card)

bob grim - centered well, all corners damaged top edge bad, bottom edge has nicks that look like what you see from the top card on rack packs at times.

when you look at the "stack" of cards they are warped in different directions. wouldn't the warp more than likely be in the same direction. very very disappointed...

yes, i was anticipating this to be an "unopened" pack and my hands being the first to touch them. however, this is not the case.

brianwintersfan

Well that really sucks!

ldferg

if i buy graded packs in the future i may have to stick with the ones that claim "from sealed case"... don't know if that would hold or not.

just frustrating when you put faith in a name (ie. GAI) and it comes back to bite you. i know there are several people that have experienced similar. i'm mainly venting.

Southerncards

Sorry to hear your results. I think the most telling sign that you stated was the gum stained card not near the gum! If it was me, I'd run the print and would want to arrest the person who did this. For that very reason, I think that unopened pack grading is a certain scam (for the most part).

zef204

I bought a 74 fb GAI 7.5 and was as disappointed.

That sucks.

zef204

When Ron comes with his "I told you so," I'll kick him in the knee for you

ldferg

i'll email GAI to let them know and see what they have to say. just want to let them know that "1 slipped thru".

...and i may need to send these to ron..he probably will not want them.

RonBurgundy

I'm sorry to hear about your results, but this reminds me of the old Woody Hayes saying about passing the football: ("There are 3 things that can happen when you pass, and two of them are bad.")

Well, there are three things that can happen when you open old packs and two of them are bad: 1) the pack has been tampered with; or 2) the pack is genuine but you get nothing of value.

I can understand the desire to open, I really can. But personally I like the odds that an old unopened pack is going to increase in value as opposed to the odds of what you get when you open it. This is especially the case when it's apparent that tampered packs slip through Global's grading system and they will probably do the same when PSA starts grading them as well.



Stay classy,


Ron

pandrews

damn, sorry to hear about the bum pack, LD..



<< <i>If it was me, I'd run the print and would want to arrest the person who did this. >>



lol..

SoFLPhillyFan

ld -

Where did you buy the graded pack?

alnavman

I will not send anything into GAI after I won an "authentic" LeBron James/Carmello Anthony photo autographed by both that they authenticated. Sent it in to PSA to get it slabbed.......guess what.....came back Questionable, not authentic, you get the idea....now I have a nice photo of the two not knowing who to believe....the experts at GAI or the experts at PSA....to top it off the auction house I won it from was Superior....needless to say I have a nice photo of the two now!!

ldferg

got the pack from here: 72 topps fb

don't know that the seller had any idea. i think he's posted on this board.

ssgunnip

Yakbigham is Dan Bigham. I have bought several things from him on and off the bay and he is a stand-up guy who I respect a lot. I assure you he is on the up-and-up.

gregm13

Sorry to hear about the bum pack. Another reason why I ONLY buy unopened material/entire sets from Steve Hart. I was talking to him this week about the 1974 Topps fb set on his web site, and he told me that the centering is brutal throughout the set and it would not be something that I'd like if I'm looking to grade.

He's a stand up guy - and is one of the few dealers I truly trust.

Regards,

Greg M.

jad22

That stinks. Where is the chump for gai who claims that he is 100 mistake proof. Second on steve hart.

ldferg

ssgunnip,
this was no knock on yak at all. he's just selling an authenticated product. i could easily unknowingly be in the same boat.

hopefully my comments are not being negative toward yak.

btw...still no response from GAI. i emailed earlier today. will keep you posted.

stevek

If reviewing the past threads here about GAI slabbed "unopened" packs...these GAI products border on fraud in my opinion.

zef204

I agree with ld, this is no knock on yak at all.

I bought my 74 gai 7.5 wax pack from Steve Hart. It was just as bad as ld's. You cannot fault the guy selling it but the "3rd party grader/authenticator" should be faulted.

spazzy

I believe that persons name is Ryan Rutter. Funny, no one has heard from him at all on the boards or in print in SCD. There was supposed to be an unopened price guide out in Feb. and it still isnt here yet. Maybe they will have a guide for resealed gai graded packs too.!!!!

digicat

There were some threads a while back about Ryan Rutter getting sacked from GAI because of fraud.

Thread

spazzy

That thread about Ryan was interesting digicat. Does this also imply that he was selling bad stuff unopened but not graded from his site or at shows? Does anyone have a bad experience receiving bad non graded packs or wax boxes?

ldferg

respone received from GAI:

...Thanks for the email. I understand your concern with the pack and we definitely would buy back any pack in a holder that would be deemed resealed. However, once the pack was opened by you, there is no way for us to determine that the pack that was opened was resealed unless this was done in our presence. If you would like to give me a call to discuss this further please call our office at (949) 474-1557...

i replied nicely: Why would i question a pack being resealed if it was already in a holder?

I know nothing about pack grading other than GAI is the only one that does it. I purchased the pack with full intentions to grade any card that would yield an 8 or better imo.

what are your opinions on their "buy back" options? at least they have a procedure, it just seems to be useless. it seems like one of those statements just to cover themselves in a situation like this. i'm sure if they didn't have this disclaimer, every tom, dick and harry would be trying to scheme them out of money daily.

ldferg

another GAI reply...they've asked me to send in my pack.

yakbigham

I appreciate you not throwing me under the bus on this one, I bought a large vintage lot at an auction and these packs were already graded in the lot. I've never had any packs ever graded from Gai, I normally only deal in with Football Rookies. I'm sorry about your luck and if you ever buy anything from me ever again I will waive the shipping fees, Its not much but it is something. Thanks Dan , you will have to remind me!!!

ldferg

dan,
not a problem. as i asked GAI, how can you hold a seller accountable when they are basically selling something a 3rd party authenticated???

zef204

<< <i>dan,
not a problem. as i asked GAI, how can you hold a seller accountable when they are basically selling something a 3rd party authenticated??? >>

I agree and yak I would think you are by no means accountable.

stevek

"...Thanks for the email. I understand your concern with the pack and we definitely would buy back any pack in a holder that would be deemed resealed. However, once the pack was opened by you, there is no way for us to determine that the pack that was opened was resealed unless this was done in our presence. If you would like to give me a call to discuss this further please call our office at (949) 474-1557..."

F*** them! What a pathetic statement. How the f*** are you gonna know about a fraudulent pack in a slab unless it is busted and the pack opened to view the cards. I guess you would need to literally videotape opening the pack - I'm not kidding! So why doesn't GAI suggest videotaping busting a pack instead of playing games? These packs sell for a lot of money. GAI should really be ashamed of themselves for in my opinion perpetrating a fraud.

Boopotts

<< <i>another GAI reply...they've asked me to send in my pack. >>



I don't want to sound inflammatory, but what do you want them to do? They can't reimurse you for the pack since they have no idea if you're lying or not. And imagine the kind of precedent that would set. You'd have 80 year old ladies busting 1952 Topps wax and then sending in a handful of EX-MT commons with the wrapper, saying 'the pack was obviously tampered'.

GAI offers an opinion; not a guarantee. The only thing you or anyone else can draw from this is that GAI's opinion can be flawed, and adjust your future bidding to reflect your decrease in confidence in their services.

stevek

<< <i>

<< <i>another GAI reply...they've asked me to send in my pack. >>



I don't want to sound inflammatory, but what do you want them to do? They can't reimurse you for the pack since they have no idea if you're lying or not. And imagine the kind of precedent that would set. You'd have 80 year old ladies busting 1952 Topps wax and then sending in a handful of EX-MT commons with the wrapper, saying 'the pack was obviously tampered'.

GAI offers an opinion; not a guarantee. The only thing you or anyone else can draw from this is that GAI's opinion can be flawed, and adjust your future bidding to reflect your decrease in confidence in their services. >>




Valid point and that is realized. Considering the number of posts here about resealed packs in GAI slabs, and considering that this is probably the tip of the iceberg, this is why in my opinion GAI should be in the forefront of suggesting videotaping the packs while opening, or possibly opening the packs in front of a legal witness such as a notary public, so that these claims can be substantiated. For them in my view to be seemingly unsuggestive about this, as though it is an isolated incident, again in my opinion borders on fraud, if not is fraud on their part.

stevek

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The above was pasted from the GAI website. I'm not a lawyer, but I've been in the business world a long time and understand basic business law quite well. When setting yourself up as an expert, and making profit off of your "opinions" about certain things, you can be successfully sued if proven that you were intentionally producing fraudulent products and people were buying these products based on trust in your opinions. GAI I'm sure understands this and that could be why they appear in my view to be evasive, which to me is not only shameful but also is bad business.

rana

Can anyone post the details of the transaction that lead to Ryan Rutter being removed from his position at GAI?

ldferg

boo,
i wasn't expecting GAI to do anything except listen to what i had to say and make them more aware that some stuff is getting thru. i realize their policy is in place to protect them. they've asked me to return the pack to them and i'm planning to do that. will go from there. at this point, i've got nothing to lose. actually, i'm glad they are listening and being responsive.

stevek,
if i ever purchase another gai pack, i WILL video tape opening it (assuming the value is worthy).

guys, i appreciate the comments. will keep you all posted on GAI's responses.

baseballfanatic

I thought Mike Gutierrez was doing GAI's autographs, not Ken Struss? I need a scorecard to keep up with whats going on with all the companies......