I kind of wonder if BrokenArrow really has a PCI coin or a MS 65 (etc.)...
Worlds of difference in the details...
I listen to your voice like it was music, [ y o u ' r e ] the song I want to know.
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ... and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.
If any of us are around 50 years from now we might be surprised at what's rare. I happen to believe that a great many 50 and early 60s silver coins ended up in the melting pot during the great silver rush of the 80s.
I listen to your voice like it was music, [ y o u ' r e ] the song I want to know.
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ... and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.
Gemineye - your popcorn eating smiley is killing me, ......oh the drama............ must be past my bed time because every time I see that I LOL and the rest of the house is sleeping. Also, this story changing along the way has me wondering?
Thank you ..twister2..........it sure is a dramatic and eventful evening .............Plenty of action on the board...................compliments to the group..............no name callin'.........just opinions...............
Those who think a ton more of these will be found and slabbed are NOT the ones who search for them. Those who think it is indeed a rare coin worth a lot of money, ARE the ones who search for them.
So do you believe the people who know what they are talking about, or the people who don't know what they're talking about?
And yet we hear time after time after time on this forum how somebody got killed on their grades because they were soooo certain that a submission had top pops in it. So which is it? Are they really tough or is it just the whim of the services? Are the top pops truly wonder coins or are there scads of just missed it coins in the underpop?
<< <i>Are the top pops truly wonder coins or are there scads of just missed it coins in the underpop? >>
Only old people use the word "scads".
Russ, NCNE >>
Hey! I like tradedollarnut... wait I don't think that's helping him....
I listen to your voice like it was music, [ y o u ' r e ] the song I want to know.
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ... and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.
And yet we hear time after time after time on this forum how somebody got killed on their grades because they were soooo certain that a submission had top pops in it. So which is it? Are they really tough or is it just the whim of the services? Are the top pops truly wonder coins or are there scads of just missed it coins in the underpop? >>
It depends. Some are very much more available in the just missed grades and some are not.
The GA's come fairly nice (at least up to MS-65) but the PA's do not. Sometimes the top grades are head and shoulders above the second best with little in between.
Most changes are made at the beginning of a year or series so they tend to be very distinct but with a wide range and nature of quality.
Wayne Herdon is right--Selling this coin at Baltimore is like "trying to sell a car at a grocery store"-- But at least I might find "scads" of nice moderns for free at my grocery.
<< <i>My $3,200 offer stands for the coin. Considering BrokenArrow was looking for a mere $1,000 yesterday at the show (and couldn't get it???) and can get $3,200 today.... I'd say he is sure lucky no one bought his coin yesterday. Wondercoin. >>
That kind of blows a hole in the no market makers argument.
Listen- we know that you like the sound of the wind coming out of your mouth but do everyone a favor. If you're going to keep repeating the same lame jokes and ignorant comments, then just one post will do. We already know that you have no idea what you're talking about- we've gotten the message!
My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable !
Listen- we know that you like the sound of the wind coming out of your mouth but do everyone a favor. If you're going to keep repeating the same lame jokes and ignorant comments, then just one post will do. We already know that you have no idea what you're talking about- we've gotten the message!
Quite a thread. The poster has a poptop state quarter, and a 95-W that have both been discussed at length in Legend's threads. The poster meets one of the good dealers from the message board at the show, and mentions him by name in the market report he posts here. When he is offered fair money for both coins, he pushes away the buyer even though the offer is 4 times yesterday's selling price, and the SQ changes mintmarks. An amazing set of coincidences.
Developing theory is what we are meant to do as academic researchers and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
<< <i>When he is offered fair money for both coins, he pushes away the buyer even though the offer is 4 times yesterday's selling price, and the SQ changes mintmarks. >>
<< <i>The difference between a PQ MS-67 and a MS-68, a PQ MS-68 and a MS-69
and a PQ 69 and a MS-70, are all very slight. Add to this mix, the subtle loosening
and tightning of grading standards and we have a great big confusing mish mosh,
where no one is sure of anything anymore. You pay the big bucks and you take the
big risks. >>
So why do people pay huge premiums for gem Morgans or large cents? Why is a hundred or two hundred thousand dollar premium for these taken in stride while a $4,000 premium for a modern always raises a threads like this.
Some may claim it's the percentage difference but the simple fact is if there are only two of these coins in existence then the most anyone can ever lose on them is $8,000. So, who wants to take an $8,000 risk on a great collector coin or a hundred thousand dollar risk on a coin with speculators and market makers?
Me, I'd rather buy the coin that fits my collection and can't understand why this concept is so incomprehensible to so many people.
The simple fact is that most old timers simply don't believe these coins are collectible. It stands to reason that since they aren't real coins and aren't really collectible that those who'd pay any real premium for one is buying a piece of plastic and someone paying huge premiums for a Morgan is an advanced collector. Give me a break.
<< <i>So why do people pay huge premiums for gem Morgans or large cents? .......The simple fact is that most old timers simply don't believe these coins are collectible >>
Not quite but close. The real reason is that wtih Morgans and large cents we are not spending the undergrades.
<< <i>So why do people pay huge premiums for gem Morgans or large cents? .......The simple fact is that most old timers simply don't believe these coins are collectible >>
Not quite but close. The real reason is that wtih Morgans and large cents we are not spending the undergrades.
CG >>
People aren't spending the undergrade 1964 clad quarters either, but moderns are always lumped together as common coins in high grade.
<< <i>So why do people pay huge premiums for gem Morgans or large cents? .......The simple fact is that most old timers simply don't believe these coins are collectible >>
Not quite but close. The real reason is that wtih Morgans and large cents we are not spending the undergrades.
CG >>
Another thing I would like to note. I have a lot of beautiful modern proofs in the original holders. They may be 70's or 69's or 68's ????, but no matter what they are- they are staying in their very nice original holders. I have regular proof sets, silver proof sets, modern commems, Platinum coins etc--- and they are all staying where they are---- And I do not think I am alone in this practice. If I have a nice 65 bust quarter in a holder, I think it would be safe to say that there are probably not a few hundred thousand grading 64 in un-opened original cases that collectors are holding onto----GET IT ???
<< <i>but moderns are always lumped together as common coins in high grade >>
That's only when the discussion is about common coins in high grade. No one thinks the 1955 DDO, 1958DDO 1C or 1969-s DDO Lincolns are common. Clearly a 1964 clad would not be common. Nor would a 1964 Peace Dollar if you could find one (legal or otherwise). I'd add to that but not with the same scarcity the Wisconsin extra leaf varieties and the Cherios Sacs which are interesting varieties. But when you start to talk about a Georgia state quarter in 68, well, that's a different matter.
<< <i>but moderns are always lumped together as common coins in high grade >>
That's only when the discussion is about common coins in high grade. No one thinks the 1955 DDO, 1958DDO 1C or 1969-s DDO Lincolns are common. Clearly a 1964 clad would not be common. Nor would a 1964 Peace Dollar if you could find one (legal or otherwise). I'd add to that but not with the same scarcity the Wisconsin extra leaf varieties and the Cherios Sacs which are interesting varieties. But when you start to talk about a Georgia state quarter in 68, well, that's a different matter.
CG >>
So. If a collectors believes these rarities are collectible and puts a collection together should he simply omit all the common coins? One rarely sees collections of Morgans with all the common coins omitted. How about Lincoln cents? Almost all of these had mintages over a million.
If you put together a set of states quarters with the varieties wouldn't you also want either the GA P or D? If you're adding these to the set then what grade is acceptable to the sellers, the buyers, and the market? Are these collectors not allowed to seek the finest specimens? As they seek these coins isn't it logical to assume that supply and demand will set the prices rather than the many people who don't understand why they collect this crap?
Isn't it possible that some people won't even care about the special issues and other rarities and collect only the regular issues in the best condition they can afford? These coins are collectible. They can be collected from circulation at face value and with luck you might even find some vari- eties or condition rarities. You can collect them in many different ways and there are millions of people who do. It's not fair to suggest any of them are doing it wrong unless they aren't having fun.
The reason being IMO that there are no multitude of high grade classics is due to novice collector ignorance. A new collector probably would shine the hell out of the coin and think it was wonderful.!!! Well....guess what..!!!!!!!...Less high grade coins..........JMO.......... I could see where we are going...........Nuturally.............
There sure are a lot of "holes" in this "story". It's gotta make one question the validity of this thread's initiator's intentions, not to mention his facts...
Comments
Worlds of difference in the details...
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ...
and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I will offer $1,000 for the PCGS MS68 Georgia quarter. >>
Heck, I thought the $9 offer was high!
As I said " Anyone who buys such coins is the exemplififcation of the Bigger Fool Theory IMO!". >>
It looks like a contender for the ultimate buyer is emerging. IMO.
Are you sure you're up to it. >>
Yowch! The quiet CladKing strikes.....quickly and for the jugular!
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>Next post, it will be an S
Nah....next post will say it is a CC
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>
<< <i>Next post, it will be an S
Nah....next post will say it is a CC
buy for $100 USD...
(j/k) BrokenArrow.
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ...
and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
2. whats the serial number on the slab
3. whats with all the back peddling... take the money and run.
Those who think it is indeed a rare coin worth a lot of money, ARE the ones who search for them.
So do you believe the people who know what they are talking about, or the people who don't know what they're talking about?
And yet we hear time after time after time on this forum how somebody got killed on their grades because they were soooo certain that a submission had top pops in it. So which is it? Are they really tough or is it just the whim of the services? Are the top pops truly wonder coins or are there scads of just missed it coins in the underpop?
<< <i>Are the top pops truly wonder coins or are there scads of just missed it coins in the underpop? >>
Only old people use the word "scads".
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>Are the top pops truly wonder coins or are there scads of just missed it coins in the underpop? >>
Only old people use the word "scads".
Russ, NCNE >>
Hey! I like tradedollarnut... wait I don't think that's helping him....
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ...
and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.
<< <i>
And yet we hear time after time after time on this forum how somebody got killed on their grades because they were soooo certain that a submission had top pops in it. So which is it? Are they really tough or is it just the whim of the services? Are the top pops truly wonder coins or are there scads of just missed it coins in the underpop? >>
It depends. Some are very much more available in the just missed grades and some are not.
The GA's come fairly nice (at least up to MS-65) but the PA's do not. Sometimes the top grades
are head and shoulders above the second best with little in between.
Most changes are made at the beginning of a year or series so they tend to be very distinct but
with a wide range and nature of quality.
<< <i>
<< <i>i think that quarter is worth a quarter. >>
I agree wholehartedly!!!
<< <i>
<< <i>My $3,200 offer stands for the coin. Considering BrokenArrow was looking for a mere $1,000 yesterday at the show (and couldn't get it???) and can get $3,200 today.... I'd say he is sure lucky no one bought his coin yesterday. Wondercoin. >>
That kind of blows a hole in the no market makers argument.
Russ, NCNE >>
Yes, but enforces the Bigger Fool theory!!
Listen- we know that you like the sound of the wind coming out of your mouth but do everyone a favor. If you're going to keep repeating the same lame jokes and ignorant comments, then just one post will do. We already know that you have no idea what you're talking about- we've gotten the message!
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
<< <i>When he is offered fair money for both coins, he pushes away the buyer even though the offer is 4 times yesterday's selling price, and the SQ changes mintmarks. >>
Man, I love this place!
Russ, NCNE
Does BrokenArrow have any social/financial relationship with XXXXXXX, or is he just a forum fan? Is the coin real?
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
<< <i>TO BE CONTINUED?????
and a PQ 69 and a MS-70, are all very slight. Add to this mix, the subtle loosening
and tightning of grading standards and we have a great big confusing mish mosh,
where no one is sure of anything anymore. You pay the big bucks and you take the
big risks.
Camelot
<< <i>The difference between a PQ MS-67 and a MS-68, a PQ MS-68 and a MS-69
and a PQ 69 and a MS-70, are all very slight. Add to this mix, the subtle loosening
and tightning of grading standards and we have a great big confusing mish mosh,
where no one is sure of anything anymore. You pay the big bucks and you take the
big risks. >>
Even more so when you are not sure what mint your coin came from!
<< <i>The difference between a PQ MS-67 and a MS-68, a PQ MS-68 and a MS-69
and a PQ 69 and a MS-70, are all very slight. Add to this mix, the subtle loosening
and tightning of grading standards and we have a great big confusing mish mosh,
where no one is sure of anything anymore. You pay the big bucks and you take the
big risks. >>
So why do people pay huge premiums for gem Morgans or large cents? Why is a
hundred or two hundred thousand dollar premium for these taken in stride while
a $4,000 premium for a modern always raises a threads like this.
Some may claim it's the percentage difference but the simple fact is if there are only
two of these coins in existence then the most anyone can ever lose on them is $8,000.
So, who wants to take an $8,000 risk on a great collector coin or a hundred thousand
dollar risk on a coin with speculators and market makers?
Me, I'd rather buy the coin that fits my collection and can't understand why this concept
is so incomprehensible to so many people.
The simple fact is that most old timers simply don't believe these coins are collectible. It
stands to reason that since they aren't real coins and aren't really collectible that those
who'd pay any real premium for one is buying a piece of plastic and someone paying huge
premiums for a Morgan is an advanced collector. Give me a break.
<< <i>So why do people pay huge premiums for gem Morgans or large cents? .......The simple fact is that most old timers simply don't believe these coins are collectible >>
Not quite but close. The real reason is that wtih Morgans and large cents we are not spending the undergrades.
CG
<< <i>[
Man, I love this place!
Russ, NCNE >>
Yeah, kinda' reminds me of an airport!
....if AHs could fly,.........
<< <i>
<< <i>So why do people pay huge premiums for gem Morgans or large cents? .......The simple fact is that most old timers simply don't believe these coins are collectible >>
Not quite but close. The real reason is that wtih Morgans and large cents we are not spending the undergrades.
CG >>
People aren't spending the undergrade 1964 clad quarters either, but moderns are always lumped together as common coins in high grade.
<< <i>
<< <i>So why do people pay huge premiums for gem Morgans or large cents? .......The simple fact is that most old timers simply don't believe these coins are collectible >>
Not quite but close. The real reason is that wtih Morgans and large cents we are not spending the undergrades.
CG >>
Another thing I would like to note. I have a lot of beautiful modern proofs in the original holders. They may be 70's or 69's or 68's ????, but no matter what they are- they are staying in their very nice original holders. I have regular proof sets, silver proof sets, modern commems, Platinum coins etc--- and they are all staying where they are---- And I do not think I am alone in this practice.
If I have a nice 65 bust quarter in a holder, I think it would be safe to say that there are probably not a few hundred thousand grading 64 in un-opened original cases that collectors are holding onto----GET IT ???
<< <i>
Yeah, kinda' reminds me of an airport!
....if AHs could fly,......... >>
I'm not touching this one with a ten foot pole.
<< <i>but moderns are always lumped together as common coins in high grade >>
That's only when the discussion is about common coins in high grade. No one thinks the 1955 DDO, 1958DDO 1C or 1969-s DDO Lincolns are common. Clearly a 1964 clad would not be common. Nor would a 1964 Peace Dollar if you could find one (legal or otherwise). I'd add to that but not with the same scarcity the Wisconsin extra leaf varieties and the Cherios Sacs which are interesting varieties. But when you start to talk about a Georgia state quarter in 68, well, that's a different matter.
CG
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>
<< <i>but moderns are always lumped together as common coins in high grade >>
That's only when the discussion is about common coins in high grade. No one thinks the 1955 DDO, 1958DDO 1C or 1969-s DDO Lincolns are common. Clearly a 1964 clad would not be common. Nor would a 1964 Peace Dollar if you could find one (legal or otherwise). I'd add to that but not with the same scarcity the Wisconsin extra leaf varieties and the Cherios Sacs which are interesting varieties. But when you start to talk about a Georgia state quarter in 68, well, that's a different matter.
CG >>
So. If a collectors believes these rarities are collectible and puts a collection together should
he simply omit all the common coins? One rarely sees collections of Morgans with all the common
coins omitted. How about Lincoln cents? Almost all of these had mintages over a million.
If you put together a set of states quarters with the varieties wouldn't you also want either the
GA P or D? If you're adding these to the set then what grade is acceptable to the sellers, the
buyers, and the market? Are these collectors not allowed to seek the finest specimens? As they
seek these coins isn't it logical to assume that supply and demand will set the prices rather than
the many people who don't understand why they collect this crap?
Isn't it possible that some people won't even care about the special issues and other rarities and
collect only the regular issues in the best condition they can afford? These coins are collectible.
They can be collected from circulation at face value and with luck you might even find some vari-
eties or condition rarities. You can collect them in many different ways and there are millions of
people who do. It's not fair to suggest any of them are doing it wrong unless they aren't having fun.
I could see where we are going...........Nuturally.............
Apropos of the coin posse/aka caca: "The longer he spoke of his honor, the tighter I held to my purse."
line
sinker
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor