Price given at coin shop
buddygray
Posts: 58
I went to a coin shop in Memphis,TN close to where I live. I wanted to sell a coin I had but now I feel bad because I strongly believe I got ripped off. A nice 1925 Standing Liberty Quarter, PCGS MS65FH. Nice coin but I'm not a big time collector of these. They shop owner only offered me 80% of the Bluesheet price. Being in a financial tight at the time, didn't tell him that in advance, I took the offer. He wanted a 1928 St. Gaudens I had, but made the same pathetically low 80% offer. I did not sell him that one!
Learned a lot on that deal. Also bought a subscription to Bluesheet since.
Is that the way it usually works at "ethical" coin shops? You pay more than Bluesheet price on any coins you see in their store, but don't get Blueshseet price for what you being in?
I understand the guy wants to make a profit, but 20%...sheesh!
Learned a lot on that deal. Also bought a subscription to Bluesheet since.
Is that the way it usually works at "ethical" coin shops? You pay more than Bluesheet price on any coins you see in their store, but don't get Blueshseet price for what you being in?
I understand the guy wants to make a profit, but 20%...sheesh!
0
Comments
<< <i>I went to a coin shop in Memphis,TN close to where I live. I wanted to sell a coin I had but now I feel bad because I strongly believe I got ripped off. A nice 1925 Standing Liberty Quarter, PCGS MS65FH. Nice coin but I'm not a big time collector of these. They shop owner only offered me 80% of the Bluesheet price. Being in a financial tight at the time, didn't tell him that in advance, I took the offer. He wanted a 1928 St. Gaudens I had, but made the same pathetically low 80% offer. I did not sell him that one!
Learned a lot on that deal. Also bought a subscription to Bluesheet since.
Is that the way it usually works at "ethical" coin shops? You pay more than Bluesheet price on any coins you see in their store, but don't get Blueshseet price for what you being in?
I understand the guy wants to make a profit, but 20%...sheesh! >>
Here is the thing you have to consider.... This is how he puts food on the table.
He has... Rent or building payment, power bill, insurance incase you slip and fall, possible employees, store product that can sit on shelves for months or years, possible advertising, water bill, taxes, and many other expenses that go along with running a business.
The reason people get upset about dealers is they feel cheated when they try to sell their coins. But ths business is unique... and alot like car sales... another business where people sell or trade in their previous car(insert coin). People think they are always getting ripped no matter what...
<< <i>You can sell yourself on ebay >>
I tried that once but the eBay police shut down the auction
<< <i>They shop owner only offered me 80% of the Bluesheet price. >>
He must not be a market maker.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Luckily, there are a lot more options for selling these days. You can sell yourself on ebay, consign if you have enough nice quality items, or find a private individual to consign a few items with for ebay auction.... >>
The big boys (and girls) will always be around in the coin business. But for the small-time brick-and-mortar coin dealer, I think eBay is doing to them what the Internet did to travel agencies with respect to booking airline tickets.
Somebody has to pay then rent
My posts viewed
since 8/1/6
<< <i>20% back of bluesheet is harsh. 20% back of greysheet is getting closer to reasonableness. Bluesheet prices are *supposed* to be sight-unseen bids, i.e. an acceptable price for the worst-possible-case in a given grade. The difference can be pretty big on some coins, like 10-15% or more. So 20% back of bluesheet might mean >30% back of greysheet, which for an appealing, marketable, problem-free coin is pretty pathetic. >>
The worst-possible-case scenario has yet to be determined though, the dealer has to make sure that he has a profit involved with no risk of a downside. If the dealer cant find a customer for the coin then his only route might be to sell the coin sight unseen for bluesheet, and in this case there are still a lot of expenses involved. Figure the shipping, handling, packaging, and most importantly his time and the time it takes him to get paid. Buddygray probably should have shopped around hoping to find a dealer who might have had a customer at that time and who could realize a larger price for the coin, and whos to say the coin was nice for the grade. 20% back of Blue really isnt that unreasonable for a common type coin.
Next time find a decent and responsible dealer.
Ken
<< <i>the dealer has to make sure that he has a profit involved with no risk of a downside. >>
Any business owner who thinks there should never be any risk of downside should close up shop and go to work as a drone in a cube farm.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>I went to a coin shop in Memphis,TN close to where I live. I wanted to sell a coin I had but now I feel bad because I strongly believe I got ripped off. A nice 1925 Standing Liberty Quarter, PCGS MS65FH. Nice coin but I'm not a big time collector of these. They shop owner only offered me 80% of the Bluesheet price. Being in a financial tight at the time, didn't tell him that in advance, I took the offer. He wanted a 1928 St. Gaudens I had, but made the same pathetically low 80% offer. I did not sell him that one!
Learned a lot on that deal. Also bought a subscription to Bluesheet since.
Is that the way it usually works at "ethical" coin shops? You pay more than Bluesheet price on any coins you see in their store, but don't get Blueshseet price for what you being in?
I understand the guy wants to make a profit, but 20%...sheesh! >>
Depending on how much they "think you know"... there is:
Retail
Greysheet
Bluesheet
Edit: Widow/old lady offer
For a typical collector, you'll most likely never get the true "dealer price" unless maybe they just want the cash or they think you're a dealer (if you ask the right questions). 20% back of Bluesheet is relatively steep, but maybe he didn't need he coin, maybe it doesn't sell in his area, maybe payroll is due, etc. Typically when I buy, I'm offered 20-30% back of greysheet, but I offer 30% when I sell, so really it's a wash.
I wouldn't feel too bad, unless it's a very liquid coin, you're probably going to get dinged 20-50% if you don't find the right buyer.
There are many venues to sell, depending on when you need the cash... if you don't feel comfortable selling at auction, have a reputable board member carry out the auction for you (they will charge you juice though).
When you "have" to sell, it's going to go down bad.
~g
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ...
and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.
<< <i>20% back of Blue Sheet for a sight seen offer !! You got ripped "Big Time" on this. Man, SLQ's do not sell worth a damn so I suppose this Rip Artist just had to do this to you. My standing policy with dealers that pull out the Blue Sheet for sight seen deals is, " No more of my Business for You "
Next time find a decent and responsible dealer.
Ken >>
Question...Did you receive a check (or cash) in the amount that you accepted? Then you found a decent and responsible dealer. He completely fullfilled his responsibilities. You also got what the coin was worth...TO YOU AT THAT PARTICULAR POINT IN TIME!!! Otherwise, you would not have accepted the offer. I don't care if the dealer offered you face value. If you accept the offer than that is the value that YOU place upon it at that moment. Any so-called "market value" is irrelevant.
<< <i>
<< <i>20% back of Blue Sheet for a sight seen offer !! You got ripped "Big Time" on this. Man, SLQ's do not sell worth a damn so I suppose this Rip Artist just had to do this to you. My standing policy with dealers that pull out the Blue Sheet for sight seen deals is, " No more of my Business for You "
Next time find a decent and responsible dealer.
Ken >>
Question...Did you receive a check (or cash) in the amount that you accepted? Then you found a decent and responsible dealer. He completely fullfilled his responsibilities. You also got what the coin was worth...TO YOU AT THAT PARTICULAR POINT IN TIME!!! Otherwise, you would not have accepted the offer. I don't care if the dealer offered you face value. If you accept the offer than that is the value that YOU place upon it at that moment. Any so-called "market value" is irrelevant. >>
This reply is BS. Any honest dealer will not rip a person on a sight seen deal with blue sheet prices. This dealer is laying in wait for the Little Old Lady.
Get real Bust Chaser !
Ken
<< <i>
<< <i>the dealer has to make sure that he has a profit involved with no risk of a downside. >>
Any business owner who thinks there should never be any risk of downside should close up shop and go to work as a drone in a cube farm.
Russ, NCNE >>
There is always a downside risk in any business, but minimizing that risk is a key to being profitable. The dealer wouldn't be in business if he didnt understand the concept of profits and losses, and the importance of increasing the prior and minimizing the latter. Also remember that we're talking about a $500 coin, 20% back only leaves a $100 margin that isnt even itself garaunteed.
<< <i>
<< <i>20% back of Blue Sheet for a sight seen offer !! You got ripped "Big Time" on this. Man, SLQ's do not sell worth a damn so I suppose this Rip Artist just had to do this to you. My standing policy with dealers that pull out the Blue Sheet for sight seen deals is, " No more of my Business for You "
Next time find a decent and responsible dealer.
Ken >>
Question...Did you receive a check (or cash) in the amount that you accepted? Then you found a decent and responsible dealer. He completely fullfilled his responsibilities. You also got what the coin was worth...TO YOU AT THAT PARTICULAR POINT IN TIME!!! Otherwise, you would not have accepted the offer. I don't care if the dealer offered you face value. If you accept the offer than that is the value that YOU place upon it at that moment. Any so-called "market value" is irrelevant. >>
I couldn't agree more, the dealer only has a ready market to profit on the coin based on the 'Risks' that he has taken (setting up shop) and knowledge that he has obtained. (although not always true)
Ken
<< <i>Hey deansmint.....NewsMedia has the coin at $630 wholesale and PCGS has it at $900. Where did you get this $500 number ? I see you are also sticking up for the Slime Bag Dealer. So Lame.
Ken >>
I was approximating from memory, excuse me - Blue sheet is $475 for mint state type w/FH. Since that changes everything now, I must appoligize as I have erred greatly. And if you take PCGS priceguide with any seriousness then do I have some coins for you.
Since your so vocal about all the 'Slimebag' dealers, im sure you wouldn't mind stating what you do for a living. And when I say 'For a living', I mean how do you support yourself? You know ... mortage, car payments, food, friday night movies? Im sure you must get paid for your time, your services must be worth something? Unlike all the 'Slimebag' dealers, right? Give me a break pal.
My experience with coin dealers is that the shop owners are the lowest buyers. It is better to attend even a small coin show and work the bourse a little. Often there will be a certain dealer that other dealers recommend for special coin series. Try a couple table dealers that appear to stock what you are selling. When you refuse their offer, if they even make an offer, is the time to ask them about specialists in your series.
I think small coin shops are soon to be gone, replaced by Ebay, Teletrade, and other auction houses.
<< <i>
<< <i>Hey deansmint.....NewsMedia has the coin at $630 wholesale and PCGS has it at $900. Where did you get this $500 number ? I see you are also sticking up for the Slime Bag Dealer. So Lame.
Ken >>
I was approximating from memory, excuse me - Blue sheet is $475 for mint state type w/FH. Since that changes everything now, I must appoligize as I have erred greatly. And if you take PCGS priceguide with any seriousness then do I have some coins for you.
Since your so vocal about all the 'Slimebag' dealers, im sure you wouldn't mind stating what you do for a living. And when I say 'For a living', I mean how do you support yourself? You know ... mortage, car payments, food, friday night movies? Im sure you must get paid for your time, your services must be worth something? Unlike all the 'Slimebag' dealers, right? Give me a break pal. >>
Hey pal not all dealers are Slime Bags but when one comes forward you have to call a spade a spade. For your information I used the PCGS price as a guide and did not say the coin was worth 900. Atleast I was a whole lot closer than you.
What I do for a living.....Unemployed and damn sure enjoying it. I own my house and property, I own my cars, I do not go to Movie houses but I do have to eat. Any other dumb questions ?
By the way if you take the Blue Sheet or Gray Sheet seriously then just maybe I would love to buy from you. I know I can make some bucks at those prices.
Ken
<< <i>You were taken!
My experience with coin dealers is that the shop owners are the lowest buyers. It is better to attend even a small coin show and work the bourse a little. Often there will be a certain dealer that other dealers recommend for special coin series. Try a couple table dealers that appear to stock what you are selling. When you refuse their offer, if they even make an offer, is the time to ask them about specialists in your series.
I think small coin shops are soon to be gone, replaced by Ebay, Teletrade, and other auction houses. >>
You just went and proved my point! Instead of shopping around and going to local shows or even just putting the coin on ebay, he took the easy road - acceptedthe first offer, got paid in cash, and solved his current financial situation. He left it up to the dealer to do the work in finding a buyer, in waiting to get paid, and even taking a small amount of risk (what about stolen or counterfiet coins, the dealer would eat the cost) - there is a value in those services.
There are always exceptions to every rule, but its not like the dealer offered him half of sheet.
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ...
and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.
<< <i>Any other dumb questions ? >>
yeah, you wouldn't happen to have a vagina would you???
<< <i>By the way if you take the Blue Sheet or Gray Sheet seriously then just maybe I would love to buy from you. I know I can make some bucks at those prices. >>
Hey Ken sweetheart, if you want to buy at sheet prices then you need to go and open a Brick & Mortar shop, so then you can worry about the overhead and expenses. Since you don't seem to factor in the value of somebodys time, Im sure you wouldn't mind attending to people for 10 hours a day or more without getting paid.
I am being real. The dealer places a value on a coin when he makes an offer. Whether it is face value for the coin or several multiples of any so-called "market value" has absolutely no bearing on his ethics as a dealer. It may have a bearing on his ability to make a living, though.
The person who owns the coin and is wanting to sell it also places a value on it. Again, it may be face value or it may be many multiples of its worth on the open market. However, if he accepts the valuation of the dealer by making the sale then by definition that is what it is worth to him at that moment.
Buying a coin at an agreed upon amount irregardless of one's ability to make a profit--or even a huge profit (which in this case doesn't apply)--has nothing at all to do with morality. Ethics only enter in if one does not fullfill his end of the sale.
<< <i>Go to a coin show where dealers can't get away with that crap.
That would have been too much work - valueless, unrewarding work. We should all expect the dealers to due this for us, free of cost of course.
That's the best oxymoron I've heard all year!
Sorry dude, but you got.....
<< <i>Hey Ken sweetheart, if you want to buy at sheet prices then you need to go and open a Brick & Mortar shop, so then you can worry about the overhead and expenses. Since you don't seem to factor in the value of somebodys time, Im sure you wouldn't mind attending to people for 10 hours a day or more without getting paid. >>
That would be no problem since you can see that I have no problems with idiots or slime bags. Now if you want to get into name calling I can do that also. If you want to disagree thats fine. We both have are opinions. Right ?
Bustchaser..... There is nothing wrong with the dealer making his money. Pulling out the Blue Sheet on a guy who obviously did not know what the darn thing is was my only complaint. This dealer was looking for a rip and found success. Some things in this business/hobby just stay the same. Cheers.
Ken
<< <i>That would be no problem since you can see that I have no problems with idiots or slime bags. Now if you want to get into name calling I can do that also. If you want to disagree thats fine. We both have are opinions. Right ? >>
Right, but my opinion is just ...
<< <i>So Lame. >>
The fact remains not that the seller didnt get the largest possible amount for his coins, but that he got a relatively reasonable amount considering the circumstances.
Had he of gone to a show and showed his coins around would he have gotten more? Yes
Had he of showed the coin to several different dealers and recieved competing offers would he have gotten more? Absolutely
Ebay? Of course
But those options invlove 'Work' and 'Time', both have a value that the dealer will now profit from.
If the had more time and was willing to expend more effort, he could have gotten a better price.
I once sold a car to one of those little dealers.
Same thing: received about 75% of what I could have gotten if I'd spent weeks advertising and showing the car.
my time was worth the money. Let the dealer work for his profit.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Ken
<< <i>why did the seller accept the low offer? the convenience of an on the spot offer and to be able to walk out with cash money.
If the had more time and was willing to expend more effort, he could have gotten a better price.
Let the dealer work for his profit. >>
Now as far as the dealer having to do the work of finding a buyer, making a profit, etc. I don't care about that or his bottom line. He's there to make bucks and I don't feel sorry for him if he has to do some phone or email work. This dealer in particular has no problem screwing over "newbies". In my opinion if HE accepts a coin from anyone, that is buys it at whatever price, he's paying for the privlidge of re-selling the coin at whatever price. If he did not want-need it- know of a possible buyer, why would he buy it at any price unless its for his private collection?
I've never seen or heard of coin dealers buying anything they won't make a profit on. I don't feel sorry for coin shops one second that do what was done, or sit salavating for the "old Lady deal". Isn't that taking advantage of someone? I believe so.
Now I am not happy with the price I got but you don't see me raising Hell either. Sure, more money would have been great, but at the moment I used the funds to take care of what I needed to on another issue.
Yes, whoppie...I had to "pay to play" on that one. Bet I never take a beating like that again!
I have a strong idea to go see that dealer and tell him how I think he took advantage of me. Not that he'd give a damn, but I'd let him know I didn't appreciate it. But then again, the money grubbing, souless dealer did pay me what I accepted that day.
Time to go the auction route with some others someday.
* Can anyone tell me a good publication I can use to get a good idea of the true value of my coins I want to sell? I've got graded and un-graded. I thought Bluesheet was specifically for graded coins. I had no idea those prices were for sight-unseen dogs- worse condition. I knew the PCGS prices were setup by someone in fantasy land. Those numbers are incredibly high! *
mirabela had the answer i was considering. the dealer referred to a sight unseen sheet when he had the coin in his hand---sight seen. he should have used the GreySheet, so in that regard he put the screws to you. for your own part, it always helps to know what you're doing and to have a realistic price to be expecting, so it was your fault in the end. perhaps you should consider finding another dealer or selling at a show where you can get at least two offers and not feel pinched.
selling coins when you need the money to a dealer you aren't familiar to/with based on pricing that you're ignorant of is the surest way to take a free ride on the lowball express. sadly, the guy is probably telling all his diehard customers and dealer buddies about the unethical rip he made.
And on and on and on and o.....................
Depending on the rarity....eBay is a good guide. Higher end? Any of the auction sites.
<< <i>This sure stirred up some responses. Okay, since I learned a few things dealing with that damnable coin shop, I'll less than proudly admit I was paid $550 cash for the coin. >>
Looks to me like your mistaken (Or colorblind), Greysheet (Monthly supplement) lists this coin at $700, 20% back of that would be ... you guessed it ... approx. $550. Looks to me like you were paid fair market value considering the circumstances
<< <i>is the $550 price 20% back of bid or ask?? if it's 20% back of bid he still got hosed. >>
Really??? Were talking sight seen bid now. This coin would have to be approved in hand by the one bidder whos offering $700, doesn't sound like too solid a deal to me. Saying that this is getting 'Hosed' is quite an overstatement.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>This sure stirred up some responses. Okay, since I learned a few things dealing with that damnable coin shop, I'll less than proudly admit I was paid $550 cash for the coin.
Now as far as the dealer having to do the work of finding a buyer, making a profit, etc. I don't care about that or his bottom line. He's there to make bucks and I don't feel sorry for him if he has to do some phone or email work. >>
Are you really listening to what you are saying? How is this a reasonable comment?
<< <i> In my opinion if HE accepts a coin from anyone, that is buys it at whatever price, he's paying for the privlidge of re-selling the coin at whatever price. If he did not want-need it- know of a possible buyer, why would he buy it at any price unless its for his private collection? >>
Because that's how a coin shop operates, you didn't get "retail" for your coin, so what, you don't have knowledge of the market
<< <i>... I have a strong idea to go see that dealer and tell him how I think he took advantage of me. ... >>
He didn't rob you, he gave you a cash offer, you accepted... End of story. If anything, you should be mad at yourself for not spending a little time to get the best price
<< <i>* Can anyone tell me a good publication I can use to get a good idea of the true value of my coins I want to sell? I've got graded and un-graded. I thought Bluesheet was specifically for graded coins. I had no idea those prices were for sight-unseen dogs- worse condition. I knew the PCGS prices were setup by someone in fantasy land. Those numbers are incredibly high! * >>
The PCGS guide is a guide for average retail prices, I've seen coins go for more, I've seen them go for less. If you're not a savvy collector or dealer, you'll probably never get greysheet, typically you sell for some % less and buy for some % more. The best guide for what a coin is selling for is the same answer it has always been... spend some time and research auctions, national ads and visit stores... there's no free ride here. Many of the members here look at thousands of coins per year...
There are significant risks in being a dealer, you should appreciate that. (I am not a dealer btw)
Edit: For spelling.
I'd give you the world, just because...
Speak to me of loved ones, favorite places and things, loves lost and gained, tears shed for joy and sorrow, of when I see the sparkle in your eye ...
and the blackness when the dream dies, of lovers, fools, adventurers and kings while I sip my wine and contemplate the Chi.