What is the scam here?

williplett · July 23, 2005 12:28PM

There are 191 HIGH END 24 hour auctions that just started on Ebay from a seller called "investinginpaper" A lot of very nice PSA blazers in there. The guy has a feedback of 96 and is all of the sudden listing 191 awesome cards. I smell something fishy.

WinPitcher · July 23, 2005 12:31PM

link please

williplett · July 23, 2005 12:34PM

My computer skills aren't that hot...I'll see what I can do.

iamthegreatcornholio · July 23, 2005 12:36PM

linkie

i'm investigating...

williplett · July 23, 2005 12:41PM

You beat me to it, assuming I could have figured it out! Look at the guy's bidding history and the low end stuff he has sold before. He has been a member for almost 5 years with a feedback of 96 and all of the sudden dumps 191 blazers on the market in one night? It doesn't compute.

mcholke · July 23, 2005 12:42PM

I was looking to see if it appears the cards scans were from the same scanner. I detected white, grey, black and wood grain backgrounds on the scan and some scans with part of the scanner showing and most without. Usually you will see the same pattern over and over again with background, etc. I was trying to determine if they might be stolen scans. Just one angle at determining if something is up.

orion9578 · July 23, 2005 12:45PM

Something has to be up, if not I would be

WinPitcher · July 23, 2005 12:46PM

Yikes!! pvt auctions + 1 day listing = TROUBLE

With Brian looking into it IM sure he will get to the bottom of this.

My advice? run fast from this guys auctions.

SD

Gemmy10 · July 23, 2005 12:48PM

Man Oh Man

Boopotts · July 23, 2005 12:48PM

There's got to be something rotten here. The tip off is the vintage wax-- sorry, but no way this guy suddenly dumps that kind of product ungraded on the market.

Looks like someone got popped for delinquent child support payments, or perhaps scored a DUI on his latest drive home from the bowling alley.

Oh-- and the 'bidder id kept private' bit doesn't exactly install barrels of confidence either. Nor does the 'no paypal', or the tired line about having just 'bought out a big collection'.

iamthegreatcornholio · July 23, 2005 12:53PM

i have seen him bidding and winning high dollar stuff - including a 5k mantle jersey and a 10k ruth "cut" card

this 1 day private auction stuff is very queer if someone is truly legit... my logic is find 1 stolen scan - if you can, then doubt will be cast on all 190something auctions. i tried the psa 8 rose rc - found 5 scans, but none matched...

brian

phreakydancin · July 23, 2005 12:53PM

Stolen scans.

There is no consistency in picture quality, size or background color. No way were those all done by the same person.

earlycalguy · July 23, 2005 12:53PM

on his previous feedback as a seller the bidder's id's were not private and paypal was accepted. to do a one day and not have either a high start price or reserve on expensive cards...he'll probably take what he can get and then be nlaru. he is already saying that shipping is going to be delayed and to be patient.

mcholke · July 23, 2005 1:00PM

Recent purchases link

All of a sudden as well he has been on a buying spree. Some big dollar items here.

WinPitcher · July 23, 2005 1:03PM

in his description he states no checks, yet at the bottom in payment instructions he states he does.

he also claims 1 day auctions are the same as 5, 7 and 10. I agree if your scamming people what difference would the lenght of time the auction runs matter?

i see the high dollar items but have they been paid for yet? the one I looked at (ruth cut sig) ended tonite.

possibly to throw off anyone that investigates him b4 they bid?

ohh I see he buys 10k items he must be legit?

jeese I hate to be so skeptical but.............

iamthegreatcornholio · July 23, 2005 1:16PM

alright guys here we go...

i couldn't find any scans anywhere else on the internet. however, as many of you do, i do not believe these auctions are legit. that said, i obviously won't bid, but i can't call the guy out either...yet.

i believe these scans have been on ebay in the past and are in many cases very old scans - untraceable to finding them. the cards that stand out are the 2001 sp gehrig cut - i used to collect this set, and i believe i've seen it before as well as the 1933 goudey gehrig. perhaps our friend gg may know about the 1938 psa 8 dimaggio since that's a 5 figure card...

brian

Boopotts · July 23, 2005 1:23PM

<< in his description he states no checks, yet at the bottom in payment instructions he states he does.

he also claims 1 day auctions are the same as 5, 7 and 10. I agree if your scamming people what difference would the lenght of time the auction runs matter?

i see the high dollar items but have they been paid for yet? the one I looked at (ruth cut sig) ended tonite.

possibly to throw off anyone that investigates him b4 they bid?

ohh I see he buys 10k items he must be legit?

jeese I hate to be so skeptical but............. >>

I don't think you should hate being skeptical at all, Steve. How many times have we seen this before, where some hobby four-flusher comes screaming out of the gate with a ton of A list material? And how often has it turned out to be legit? IMO you have every right to wonder about the legitimacy of these auctions.

jrdolan · July 23, 2005 1:44PM

I reported a bunch of the most obvious scams to eBay. Hopefully somebody is on duty and can shut these down before they end and anybody sends any money to this scummy person. I didn't notice at first just how many huge cards he was scamming, including the mandatory '52 Mantle. This is designed as the score of a lifetime, and selling the 2005 pack rips was just the prep, to build up a little feedback. Here are some of the numbers, if you want to just copy and paste into eBay's reporting box here. If a bunch of people report this, eBay just may take notice.

5222848758, 5222849522, 5222849454, 5222849345, 5222849340, 5222849657, 5222849674, 5222849763

kuntryboy · July 23, 2005 1:47PM

TOTAL FRAUD. NO QUESTION ABOUT IT. EVERY SINGLE SCAN IS STOLEN.

EXAMPLE:

BMW'S 1952 MANTLE SGC 20

INVESTINGINPAPER'S FRAUDULENT AUCTION

iamthegreatcornholio · July 23, 2005 1:49PM

first lead...

his 1981 joe montana psa 10 link

the same montana on here posted be knuckles - go to the bottom of the thread - where did knuckles get it? link

brian

edit to add - great job kb! all it takes is one... they are all indeed fraud....will ebay act in time - 1 day auction on the weekend and no one can warn the bidders

mcholke · July 23, 2005 1:54PM

Good detective work guys. Hopefully Ebay will listen and get these yanked.

WinPitcher · July 23, 2005 1:56PM

You know just the fact that someone would steal a scan and try to sell an item w/o having it should be a fraud worththe authorities time to prosecute. with that said my Bros in law is a lawyer with the justice dept and last week I was speaking to him about ebay and all the fraud and he acted as if it was nothing. his exact words were "the basball memrobila market is fraud from top to bottom etc. like, that is just the way it is. I don't get it. ebay is becoming a cesspool for every fraudster to make a quick buck flagrantly. Ebay should be held accountable in some way. They claim they are only a venue, yet they allow this crap to go on. Its bad eniff when we have guys like nedsk that commit fraud in a way that is hard to prove but here we have a guy that in no way shape or form has the item in question yet he will not get into any trouble. unbelevable.

end of rant

sd

Boopotts · July 23, 2005 1:59PM

"I didn't notice at first just how many huge cards he was scamming, including the mandatory '52 Mantle."

Just what is it about the fifty-two Mantle that arouses these scammers? There are, after all, other high end cards out there. But it's almost like a rite of passage for sleazy ebay sellers-- like you haven't really stuck it to someone in the shorts until you've gotten over with the 52 Mantle.

If I was ever in the market for a '52 Mantle-- and I may be at some point, especially if the online poker games stay as juicy as they've been for the past eight months (feel free, stevek, to post a witty retort at your leisure) I think at this stage I'd just snag one of Mastro. Everytime I see this card for sale on Ebay I have to fight off this urge to go grab the Vaseline...

iamthegreatcornholio · July 23, 2005 2:00PM

i totally agree steve.

what's even sadder is that he spent over a thousand dollars to list these scams (191 auctions with bold and circled, etc.) and ebay will make 10's of thousands on final value fees. of course they won't get this, but i guarantee the possibility will weigh in on their decision whether or not to pull it.

jrdolan · July 23, 2005 2:04PM

I don't think the link I posted above is the correct one for reporting fraudulent auctions, it's for keyword violations. But I can't find the right eBay page for fraud reporting, it seems to have moved to someplace I can't see.

iamthegreatcornholio · July 23, 2005 2:08PM

report fraud

WinPitcher · July 23, 2005 2:10PM

just a thought...does ebay claim all the final value fees that they do not collect to the bottom line? as recievables? then after when the smoke clears they do some sort of chargeback? interesting thought to ponder.

sd

Carew29 · July 23, 2005 2:10PM

Before you guys go all Clint Eastwood on him--- I made a bid on one of his auctions so i could get his contact information---something nobody on this board figured out. If you think he is a scammer, call him on it.

User ID: investinginpaper
Name: Steve Wright
Company:
City: Cranston
State: RI
Country: United States
Phone: (401) 524-3541
Registered Since: Tuesday, Nov 14, 2000 16:08:06 PST

kuntryboy · July 23, 2005 2:14PM

<< You know just the fact that someone would steal a scan and try to sell an item w/o having it should be a fraud worththe authorities time to prosecute. >>

INTENT TO DEFRAUD - the specific intent to deceive or cheat, ordinarily for the purpose of causing some financial loss to another, or bringing about some financial gain to one's self. It is not necessary, however, to prove that the United States or anyone else was in fact defrauded so long as it is established that the person acted "with intent to defraud."

kuntryboy · July 23, 2005 2:19PM

<< Before you guys go all Clint Eastwood on him--- I made a bid on one of his auctions so i could get his contact information---something nobody on this board figured out. If you think he is a scammer, call him on it. >>

THERE WAS NO NEED TO GET HIS CONTACT INFO. AND THERE IS NO NEED TO CALL HIM. HE IS A SCAMMER.

AND WHAT WOULD BE THE POINT OF CALLING HIM? TO ASK HIM IF HE'S A SCAMMER? GEE I'M SURE HE'LL TELL YOU THE TRUTH.

Carew29 · July 23, 2005 2:22PM

"Just because you have a big mouth country boy- that don't make you a man"---John Wayne

Somebody ought to teach you bout' slander, and liable kuntry

jrdolan · July 23, 2005 2:27PM

cornholio -- your Report Fraud link takes me to a page that says

Instant help!: The following help page(s) may give you the answer you're looking for:

But the fields that formerly contained the list of choices is empty. There is nothing to choose.

carew29 -- I am not interested in calling him on it, in hearing his lies or excuses or abuse, or in trying to preach that crime does not pay. If he was someone who could be simply talked out of ripping off people, would he have put up these huge scams in the first place? This isn't penny-ante. He is running a bigtime scam for many hundreds of thousands of dollars, and anybody at eBay would see that if they looked into it for a minute and a half. I want to report his ass and get these scams stopped, not chat with him. Anyone else wants to have a conversation with Mr. #1 Auction House, feel free.

ctsoxfan · July 23, 2005 2:29PM

Carew29, I'm not taking sides here, but you are the one who posted the mans personal info on a public message board. That could have legal repercussions against you if he turns out to be a legit seller.

pandrews · July 23, 2005 2:29PM

<< Somebody ought to teach you bout' slander, and liable kuntry >>

libel?

iamthegreatcornholio · July 23, 2005 2:31PM

jr, when i click the link, right below "instant help" is "Customer Support Option(s):" and email is the only choice

Carew29 · July 23, 2005 2:32PM

Ahhh i get it now. We can act all tough on these message boards, but when it comes down right to it , you just want to leave it to everyone else to solve. That's why nothing ever gets done!!

WinPitcher · July 23, 2005 2:36PM

Carew you have his number, you bid on his auction.............call him
ask him if you win will he ship it or just keep your money?

sd

ctsoxfan · July 23, 2005 2:37PM

<< Ahhh i get it now. We can act all tough on these message boards, but when it comes down right to it , you just want to leave it to everyone else to solve. That's why nothing ever gets done!! >>

Whoa - what was that?

The good people of this message board have been pointing out scams, and calling people on them for a good long time. If you were here long enough, you would know that. Your above comment is insulting, and unnecessary.

Carew29 · July 23, 2005 2:37PM

Won't fly "ct". It is public info provided by ebay. Here is the qoute in my e-mail from ebay---"This contact information should only be used for resolving matters related to eBay". Now i will take a wild stab here that this is related to ebay.

iamthegreatcornholio · July 23, 2005 2:38PM

what his old auctions looked like

note they are 5 days, non private, and he takes paypal, and most important they are junk

let's hope ebay acts this is so obvious

i have to admit though that a little part of me is getting tired helping stupid people and saving ebay's ass from liability on these scams, but this crap still makes me sick

kuntryboy · July 23, 2005 2:40PM

JR I THINK THIS IS THE LINK YOU WANT

http://pages.ebay.com/help/contact_us/_base/index.html

THERE ARE SEVERAL DIFFERENT WAYS TO REPORT STUFF AT THAT LINK.

I USED:

BOX 1 -- "REPORT PROBLEMS WITH OTHER EBAY MEMBERS"

BOX 2 -- "FRAUD CONCERNS FOR BUYERS"

BOX 3 -- "THE PROBLEM YOU'RE HAVING WITH FRAUD ISN'T LISTED"

(CLICK "CONTINUE" AND THEN CLICK "EMAIL" ON THE NEXT PAGE)

DOING IT THAT WAY, YOU CAN REPORT HIS ID AND TYPE OUT AN EXPLANATION. DOING IT OTHER WAYS, YOU CAN ONLY REPORT AUCTION NUMBERS.

MESSAGE FOR CAREW -- I REPORTED THIS SCAMMER TO EBAY BEFORE I EVEN LOGGED IN HERE TONIGHT.

mcholke · July 23, 2005 2:41PM

Do you thing it is possible someone hijacked this account? Given the large number of high dollar items bid on this week and the fact the seller only wants to contact the bidder and not the other way around. Just a thought.

WinPitcher · July 23, 2005 2:43PM

very possible, good thought MC

iamthegreatcornholio · July 23, 2005 2:44PM

from one of his old, junk auctions,

<< Please view all of our auctions, as over the next month we will be selling millions of $$ worth of cards... >>

sounds premeditated

side note: no one posts more #20, #40, etc. posts then me lol

edit - is this the biggest scam in the hobby's history?

williplett · July 23, 2005 3:24PM

That Bradshaw rookie looks real suspicious, like I saw it on there awhile back. Actually, the whole thing looks suspicious, so what am I talking about! This guy is well into felony theft charges with all of these high buck cards. Heck, the collective bids now are probably approaching 6 figures.

stevek · July 23, 2005 4:26PM

I agree with everybody here - definitely a scam for the reasons already stated. I Googled "sun shine auction house" every which way but loose - no surprise of course...nothing. Also Googled that phone number and did a reverse phone number lookup...no hits - either a new phone number, or a cellphone number...probably also new. Some of the spelling and grammar errors in the auction description border on childlike. Also Googled Steve Wright Cranston Rhode Island in many different ways - nothing. That, what appears to be a cellphone number, is a Rhode Island phone number. Seems to me that this is some high school punk with a few computer skills who spent his summer vacation conjuring up this scam.

BUT...then I saw mcholke's post and decided to check his recent bids - WOW - a lot of money there and not just bidding window dressing but he actually won a lot of these auctions. Still apprears to be a scam, and could be a hijacked account from a foreigner using a language translation guide which would account for the poor spelling and grammar. This seller's buying history does make this intriguing. Some rich New England kid buying and selling cards?

WinPitcher · July 23, 2005 4:32PM

SteveK he won a 10k ruth auto just this very night. has yet of course to pay for it.

Steve D

Onlypsahockey · July 23, 2005 4:39PM

$51,000.00 in bids. Not bad for a days work. What kills me is the poor b*stards bidding are probably happening upon a card thru a search and not realizing the magnitude of this scam.

I'm off to Rhode Island tomorrow to check on that address and I'm stopping at the State police barracks while I'm there. This crap has to end its going to kill the hobby. It's almost at the point where you can't bid on high end items unless you know the seller.

I'll post my results tomorrow.

Bob

EDIT: Crap! I thought there was a street address posted. Oh well maybe the staties will have an internet crime division which may do something about this scumbag.

stevek · July 23, 2005 4:50PM

Steve D - Yea it's crazy...look at the stuff this guy's been bidding on...and buying!

LINK

Everything about this seller normally tells me this is just a huge scam, but I'm thinking, and I doubt it though, that maybe this is just some rich New England kid? With some of these New England families...$100,000 or so is pocket change. Going to be very interesting to see what Bob uncovers.

Onlypsahockey · July 23, 2005 5:02PM

If the address was Greenwich Ct. I'd agree but not Cranston, R.I. Mostly low to middle income in Cranston.

I'm hoping this is some wise guy who spends most of his time at Foxwoods or Mohegan Sun. He probably hits big every now and then and goes on a spending spree and this huge sell off could just be the result of some real bad luck at the tables.

That scenario would be great as the bidders would actually receive their items. The one day auction, private bidders and no Paypal leads me to believe that these are just scans he ripped off to round up a quick $100K.

I wish I had a street address.

stevek · July 23, 2005 5:03PM

Taking another look at it...the seller feedback dollar totals are only for maybe a few thousand bucks. Seems like he maybe didn't pay yet for any of those super high end items he has bought, and perhaps he never will. Gotta call this a huge, HUGE scam at this point until there is any new information otherwise.

Steve

What is the scam here?

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